IndigoJack Posted August 23, 2014 Share Posted August 23, 2014 Now, I know that I've been on a bit of a soap box recently about premature tacticas/primers, but this isn't really a new concept. It was one of those tactics that was used a lot in 5th edition when facing an army where you were outgunned. With the new detachment that GKs got, it's once again possible to null deploy.I've chosen to format this tactica as a FAQ, where questions and answers can be added as they come up in the discussion of this tactic. What is a 'null deployment'? A null deployment is where you place no models (with the exception of fortifications which can't arrive from reserve) on the board turn 1. Why would I want to do it? The idea behind a null deployment is to rob your opponent of their ability to affect you turn 1. If everything is in reserve, the best your opponent can hope to do to you is modify your reserve roll (through something like a warlord trait, psychic power, special ability, etc). Also, it grants you the ability to (sort of) counter deploy to your opponent, even though you deployed first. You have the benefit of shooting first, while keeping the advantage of attempting to contest objectives last turn. What armies would I want to use it against? The null deployment is best used against strong shooting armies that might cripple you before you have a chance to get in range and deliver blows back. Basically armies like AM, eldar (both flavors), tau, necrons, just about every flavor of space marine (heretical or non) are all good candidates for null deployment. I wouldn't recommend using it against armies that are looking to close range to you for assault (orks, tyranids, daemons, etc), as these armies are already coming to you, you may as well spend as many turns as possible gunning them down before they get to you. How, specifically, do I pull this neat trick off? First, you need to win the roll-off and choose to deploy first. If you choose second (or, if your opponent won the roll of and choose you to deploy second), this concept will fail spectacularly as your opponent may very well decide that your going first. While this may not be a bad thing, it defeats the purpose of the null deployment, as you're not taking away any of your opponents ability to affect you. After choosing to go first, the next think you need to do is nothing (because that's what you're deploying). After your opponent deploys, graciously give him first turn. Other than the obvious deep strikers, what units should I take for this? You really want durable units that can operate independently. That means units that don't need to be X inches away from another unit to work (since you're still subject to the vagrancies of scatter). We're looking at units like terminators, paladins, dreadknights, and various ICs such as brother captains and grand masters, and any special character in terminator armor. Do all of my units have to attempt to arrive turn 1? Not at all. I think the turn one deep strikers are going to work best when utilized as surgical strike units, used to cripple the enemy units that are going to give you the most problems. The rest of your army can arrive through normal reserves. Good candidates for this are cheap (or relatively, anyways) units that aren't going to contribute much to the battle. Their primary goal is to take objectives. As you may have guess, I think this is a job for strikes. A 5 man unit in a rhino is going to have the speed to get to the objective. After they get there, they can just sit around and fire the psycannons. If allies is your thing, cheap inquisitorial squads, astra militarum veterans or platoons, and even space marine units can fulfill this role. Are there any other units I might want to put into regular reserve? Sure, you can basically put whatever you want here. These are the units you want to stay alive the longest. One of the tactics I tried out when 7th hit, was to use my reserves as WC replenishment. While you may not start with a whole lot of WCs, You're generally going to have some where around the same number for the first half of the game. I also like the idea of interceptors here, as their ability to shunt from reserve gives them the ability to shunt from reserve, essentially giving them a shorter-ranged, precise deep strike. Oh wow! This is the most winningest idea ever! There can't possibly be any drawbacks! ...right? Hold on there Merriam-Webster, there are a few drawbacks. For one, outside of a warlord trait (that you can't re-roll for), there is no way to manipulate your reserves. Your subject to the whims of the dice gods as to whether or not your units come in. Obviously, the more units that you have desiring to come in turn 1, the less likely none of them will come in turn 1 (but keep in mind it's always a possibility). By extension, if too few of your units come in and your opponent vaporizes them, it's game over. Other than issues of accidentally tabling yourself turn 1, you have to worry about your opponent castling (or turtling) up. There isn't really an easy solution to this problem other than counting on your run move to get you some shots you otherwise wouldn't be able to make. So that's basically null deployment in a nut shell. I hope you guys enjoyed this tactica, and I hope it sparked some ideas. Questions or comments? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295675-null-deployment-a-gk-tactica/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted August 23, 2014 Share Posted August 23, 2014 How do you stop auto losing end of turn 1 when you have nothing on the board? If it's a fortification, all your opponent has to do is kill that turn 1 to auto win. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295675-null-deployment-a-gk-tactica/#findComment-3787197 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Coolpants Posted August 23, 2014 Share Posted August 23, 2014 I was thinking the same thing haha Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295675-null-deployment-a-gk-tactica/#findComment-3787203 Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndigoJack Posted August 23, 2014 Author Share Posted August 23, 2014 How do you stop auto losing end of turn 1 when you have nothing on the board? If it's a fortification, all your opponent has to do is kill that turn 1 to auto win. "If at the end of any game turn, one player has no models on the battlefield his opponent automatically wins" BRB p.133 (emphasis mine). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295675-null-deployment-a-gk-tactica/#findComment-3787204 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted August 23, 2014 Share Posted August 23, 2014 You made your opponent go first. End of your first turn you lose with nothing on the board. Nemesis Strikeforce with only a 3+ (you've no one on Comms Relay, or you've given your opponent a round with only that for thier entire army to attack) is *very* risky. Especially with our low number of units. Even then, if you get 1/2 units coming down, your opponent then has the whole of thier second turn to kill just those, and ea the rest peicemeal, as they come in from reserves. Sadly, without auto turn 1 DS, Null Deployment died a death when 6th hit. Edit: You also give your opponent their first turn to move/redeploy to deny you spaces to DS into. We have limited Scatter reduction / Mishap Protection. It's asking for trouble. Edit: This also denies you Homer/Locator Beacon support for your DS. Which seems to be the only synergy GW have given us. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295675-null-deployment-a-gk-tactica/#findComment-3787205 Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndigoJack Posted August 23, 2014 Author Share Posted August 23, 2014 To start with, I'm thinking something like 2x 5 man units of terminators and 2 dreadknights. That's 800-900 pts, of decent survivability. And as I mentioned, bad reserve rolls can mess you over. As far as mishaps go, we don't have as much to worry about. 24" guns means that we shouldn't even attempt to DS within 12" of the enemy. 2+ saves are going to protect us from dangerous terrain (which the NDK is immune to anyways), and a teleporter armed dreadknight can scatter back a decent amount and still have the movement to assault if he needs it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295675-null-deployment-a-gk-tactica/#findComment-3787217 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted August 23, 2014 Share Posted August 23, 2014 Thing is, you give your opponent a full turns movement to spread out. If they don't push forward, and run, to deny you spaces, they're doing it wrong. Especially if they have Bikes/Jump Packs etc. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295675-null-deployment-a-gk-tactica/#findComment-3787219 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest arbitor marduk Posted August 23, 2014 Share Posted August 23, 2014 Or if you go up against infiltrators, (kroot are the best at this) all your opponent needs to do if cover the whole board with his guys, this would stop or at least limit to a great deal where you could deepstrike meaning you'd instantly lose Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295675-null-deployment-a-gk-tactica/#findComment-3787225 Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndigoJack Posted August 23, 2014 Author Share Posted August 23, 2014 They're not going to be able to spread out that much though. Few armies are going to get much farther than just past midfield. You're going to have plenty of room for deep striking. And if they've spread out too much, your reserves entering the board are going to refuse flank, which will help balance out the piece-meal problem. And I thought this went without saying, but this isn't meant to be one and one-way-only to play GKs. This is meant to be just one tool in your toolbox of tactics. If think your opponents list is too risk to try it against, then don't do it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295675-null-deployment-a-gk-tactica/#findComment-3787227 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted August 23, 2014 Share Posted August 23, 2014 :) I just played against the original Daemon too many times! You really need something like that or the Dangels (or a Drop Pod army) to play null deployment. It is viable, we just don't get (outside of allying in SW Pod) enough support for it. :( I can totally see us using it, with a combination of Strikeforce, Allied Dangels and SW Pods though. And it being very effective. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295675-null-deployment-a-gk-tactica/#findComment-3787229 Share on other sites More sharing options...
knife&fork Posted August 23, 2014 Share Posted August 23, 2014 Thing is, you give your opponent a full turns movement to spread out. That's what you want him to do, spreading out means less units to support each other and it becomes easier for you to pick them off one at the time. Castling is a lot harder to deal with for pure GK as you have no real way of punishing a mechanized castling enemy. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295675-null-deployment-a-gk-tactica/#findComment-3787241 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted August 23, 2014 Share Posted August 23, 2014 Depends on your enemies army to be honest. If it's fast and mobile, they can afford to spread out and still support each other. Especially as you have *no* guaranteed Deep Strikers, and your offensive units are coming down peicemeal. Again, it's totally different if you have say 1/2 your army guaranteed to DS on a specific turn. We don't. :( Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295675-null-deployment-a-gk-tactica/#findComment-3787244 Share on other sites More sharing options...
knife&fork Posted August 23, 2014 Share Posted August 23, 2014 Oh, so it's still reserve rolls for all those turn 1 DS units? Better have a lot of them then or ally in some drop pods. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295675-null-deployment-a-gk-tactica/#findComment-3787245 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted August 23, 2014 Share Posted August 23, 2014 Basically, all the Nemesis Strikeforce allows you to do is roll Reserves for your units starting turn 1, not turn 2. 3+ a unit comes in. 1-2 it doesn't. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295675-null-deployment-a-gk-tactica/#findComment-3787252 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest arbitor marduk Posted August 23, 2014 Share Posted August 23, 2014 Yes Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295675-null-deployment-a-gk-tactica/#findComment-3787265 Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndigoJack Posted August 23, 2014 Author Share Posted August 23, 2014 I think you guys are getting a little too hung up on the rolling for reserve issue. It is a bit of a risk, but there are things that can be done to mitigate it. I have a sample list that I think can utilize a null deployment well: OMI ML1, PA, servo-skulls (Warlord) Librarian w/ ML3 5man purifers 3x halberds, 2x psycannons, rhino 10man strikes w/ 2x psycannons, rhino (combat squads, 2x psycannons in rhino, other squad deep striking) 10man strikes w/ 2x psycannons, rhino (combat squads, 2x psycannons in rhino, other squad deep striking) 10man terminators w/ 2x psycannon, 2x hammer (combat squads) dreadknight w/ heavy psycannon, heavy incinerator, great sword, PT dreadknight w/ heavy psycannon, gatling psilencer, great sword, PT Total: 1798 This leaves you with 50pts to spare for wargear and upgrades. For deployment, I'd place the the servo-skull on the edge of my deployment zone (maybe pull them back a bit if your opponent is a real mover) and utilize them to deep strike midfield. I would combat squad everything, and have both terminator squads, two strike squad halves and two dreadknights deep strike turn one. That's 6 units that could come in. The reason the inquisitor is the warlord is for the 'Reader of the Tarot' WL trait, which lets you roll two dice and choose the result you want for reserves. If you didn't get that WL trait and don't feel comfortable null deploying, then don't do it.' This is by no means the definitive null deployment list. I'm just showing how I might go about doing it. And as I said before, this isn't supposed to be some one-trick-gimmick, but rather a tool for us to utlize as we need to. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295675-null-deployment-a-gk-tactica/#findComment-3787674 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted August 23, 2014 Share Posted August 23, 2014 What would you do with the Rhinos and the squads inside them? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295675-null-deployment-a-gk-tactica/#findComment-3787678 Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndigoJack Posted August 23, 2014 Author Share Posted August 23, 2014 They would roll on from reserve as a mid-game fire support relief I'd probably move them flat-out the turn they arrive to get them midfield so they can start contributing next turn. While their effectiveness is going to be directly proportional to how much my opponent commits to middle of the board, it's one of the things I'm looking to try out. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295675-null-deployment-a-gk-tactica/#findComment-3787715 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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