Top Pick Relic?

[Faithwing]

Hey, bros.

 

I'm a SoB player, who is looking to add some Knights to my force. (Ordered 20 PAGK, and 10 TDA). Figured a combat squaded 10-man Interceptor squad with Incinerators could go well with a scouting Dominion melta team.

 

I was browsing through the new book, and was cool with the selection of relics, but unlike other books, none really jumped out at me. Not that I wanted any auto-includes or anything. I mean when you look at Space Marines, it's the Shield Eternal. When you look at Chaos, the Axe, or Mace tend to jump out. For such a specialized army, I would have expected at least an effective, AP2 weapon, or something.

 

In any case, I'm not here to bash, or lament. Just want to see what the veteran Knight players think. The Cuirass seems like an auto-pick, but what about the others? The Glaive is so-so, and the Buff Book seems interesting.

 

By the way, as I was lurking, I saw the birth and death of a troll outbreak here on the Knights forum. Swift justice was administered. Another reason why this community is second to NONE. Love it.

 

Thanks, guys!

[BloodTzar]

For me it is Buff Book than cuirass, those to should be an auto pick.I am taking these two now on while I be using Libby and GM But I guess depends on your list.

[Gaz1858]

It is dependant on how you run your list as while theres no particular stand out theyre all fairly cheap.

 

I for example really want GOI on my libby so by taking the book i increase the chance of that happening. And as he will be in the thick of some purifiers rerolling 1s is very beneficial.

 

If youve got a BC or GM that you want to tank with then the cuirass is good. The bolter isnt bad if you think you can select where 3 wounds are placed in a unit could be useful

[Reclusiarch Darius]

There are three out of the five which are actually useful. 

 

Cuirass is your standard choice on a Grandmaster. It fits with what he does incredibly well, and given he's a scary Warlord to try and kill, it makes it that much harder for your opponents. FNP and IWND are amazing bonuses, its a free 'Endurance'. 

 

Soul Glaive is a bit of a situational choice. On the one hand, its absurdly powerful if you don't fight anything in 2+ armour (re-roll force activation, once force is up you re-roll to hit and wound/break AV), especially on a Grandmaster with 4A base. On the other hand, the hammer is cheaper and has AP2, plus S8. Don't get me wrong, its only second to the Titansword on Draigo in terms of lethality, but the AP3 could be a problem. 

 

Dominus Liber is situational, as its mainly designed for letting us use our Sanctic powers more reliably. Re-rolling 1's to cast is helpful in getting off 'Hammerhand', and against a Daemon list multiple 'Banishment' stacking is very handy for defeating ScreamerStar, Bloodthirsters and so on. 

 

The slightly better storm bolter is atrocious (a psycannon is always a better choice), and the Bone of Solor is only if you're fighting mono-Khorne Daemon lists. 

[Gentlemanloser]

If you're running a Libby as your only HQ, and for some reason don't want the Cuirass, I'd consider the Relic Bolter, as the Libby can't purchase a Psycannon.

[BloodTzar]

If you have just one HQ and that happens to be libby i would go for the Buff book and cuirass, on the other hand GM can be nice with glaive and cuirass combo, still under assumption u have 1 HQ.

[Reclusiarch Darius]

If you're running a Libby as your only HQ, and for some reason don't want the Cuirass, I'd consider the Relic Bolter, as the Libby can't purchase a Psycannon.

 

 

But a combi-melta, or even a regular storm bolter, is still better. It's literally just Assault 3 instead of Assault 2 and a range increase. Meh. 

[Captain Coolpants]

I'll be keeping my librarians naked. Only used as a squad buffer, bargain for the price!

 

They will be My replacement from the old squad buffing inquisitors I used with nades and divination (I'm gonna miss those rad nades)

 

But for grand masters it's obvious gonna always have to be the cuirass, it's our closest thing to the shield Eternal/gorgons chain.

I probably won't bother with anything else other than maybe possibly the glaive

[Faithwing]

Thanks for the speedy replies.

 

This would be my casual-knight breakdown:

 

The Glaive is cool. AP3 isn't the end of the world, I'm used to not having access to AP2. Dont really run into much 2+ armor anyway.

 

Cuirass is of course amazing. Pity it wasn't Artificier Armor though.

 

Deimos Bolter is pretty underwhelming, but it really was to be expected unfortunately. Seems like all the Marines are losing a precious relic slot to a mediocre bolter.

 

Bone Shard is sort of odd. Fluffy, I guess this is the mandatory "different, but ultimately not useful" relic.

 

Buff Book, I can see how it really helps a unit fire off some useful powers in the clutch. I actually prefer equipment like this. A lot of folks are planning to give it to the Libby. He's the expert, so I get it. But does anyone intend to give it to a GM?

 

On that note, where do you guys usually put the GM? Has the new codex changed that? I've been playing for a few years now, but I feel like with SoB, HQ placement is pretty simple, given how limited the options are. GKs seem fairly limited now as well, but I feel like there is more to consider like psychic disciplines interacting with mixed Nemesis weapons, specialized ranged weapons, and pricey assault transports to help protect and enable.

 

Or maybe I'm just over complicating how the Knights do work?

[Reclusiarch Darius]

Cuirass is of course amazing. Pity it wasn't Artificier Armor though.

 

Why? TDA is better in every way. I'm glad it wasn't, it would've brought down its value on our HQ's, who kinda need TDA to be useful (ie attaching to our other Deepstrikers). 

Buff Book, I can see how it really helps a unit fire off some useful powers in the clutch. I actually prefer equipment like this. A lot of folks are planning to give it to the Libby. He's the expert, so I get it. But does anyone intend to give it to a GM?

 

It's still only re-roll 1's (I would've preferred the 3+ to cast they gave the Brotherhood Formation), so its not like you really need it. A Grandmaster is already expensive, that's why the Book goes on the Libby (as even with Mastery 3 and Book he's still cheaper than a bare-bones Grandmaster). 

On that note, where do you guys usually put the GM? Has the new codex changed that? I've been playing for a few years now, but I feel like with SoB, HQ placement is pretty simple, given how limited the options are. GKs seem fairly limited now as well, but I feel like there is more to consider like psychic disciplines interacting with mixed Nemesis weapons, specialized ranged weapons, and pricey assault transports to help protect and enable. 

 

He belongs with Terminators, although mine has done alright with Purifiers. 

[Shadrach03]

Got a question on the book. If I were to out it on s librarian and roll all 3 of his powers on say telepathy then get a roll on the sanctic from the book do I still get the primaris from telepathy?

[Faithwing]

RD,

 

Arty armor because I mainly like the way fancied up power armor looks. Sweeping Advances are possibilities in my group, because there aren't many Marine players. Losing DS is a bummer, but speaking of that, is that how you roll the GM? If with termies, do you usually DS, rather than assault transport?

 

If that's the case, then Ministorum Priests aren't really an option. GKs can probably do without them, but their buffs are useful for any CC unit.

[BladeGaurd]

Got a question on the book. If I were to out it on s librarian and roll all 3 of his powers on say telepathy then get a roll on the sanctic from the book do I still get the primaris from telepathy?

The rule book covers the gaining of a 2nd discipline power as an event that causes the lost of discipline focus and you immediately loose your bonus primaris power, which stinks but that is the clearest answer there is.

 

if you plan on going santic the book and warlord trait are great, if not reroll. or you can give the book to a secondary character, like a techmarine or a brotherhood champion.

 

 

I like the Armor the most fallowed by the Glaive, can you have both on one model?

[Reclusiarch Darius]

 

Got a question on the book. If I were to out it on s librarian and roll all 3 of his powers on say telepathy then get a roll on the sanctic from the book do I still get the primaris from telepathy? 

 

 

No, you lose your free Primaris. You can still swap a bad power for the Primaris though, if you are so inclined. 

Arty armor because I mainly like the way fancied up power armor looks. Sweeping Advances are possibilities in my group, because there aren't many Marine players. Losing DS is a bummer, but speaking of that, is that how you roll the GM? If with termies, do you usually DS, rather than assault transport?

 

Well yeah, he's always in TDA. I do walk him with Purifier sometimes, it depends on the matchup. 

 

I like the Armor the most fallowed by the Glaive, can you have both on one model?

 

 

Yeah you can have as many relics as you like on one guy, provided they're still 1 per army and you follow the other limitations ie replace their melee weapon etc. 

[FL5]

Per the codex, page 59, under "Relics of Titan":

 

"Only one of each Relic of Titan may be taken per army.  A model can take one of the following:"

 

The way that reads to me is that not only are the relics limited to one per army, but also one per character.  It's the same limit that applies in the new Ork book, too.

[Reclusiarch Darius]

"Only one of each Relic of Titan may be taken per army.  A model can take one of the following:"

 

 

Oh come on...great. So, vanilla Marines can put Burning Blade and Shield Eternal on their Chapter Master, but our three decent relics, we can only pick one per character. 

 

Guess that makes things real simple. Thanks Jarvis. Cuirass all day ery day. 

[Rommel44]

I usually run a Grand Master in my lists and I always run him as such:

Grandmaster:

-w/Halberd, Psycannon, Cuirass of Sacrifice, Melta Bombs

Overall in the 3x games I have played him so far, he has done very well as he is very universial, S7 with Hammerhand, and can harrass opponents with his Psycannon, but I have tried him once with a Psilencer and he did really good with that as he mowed down 5x Thunderwolf Cavalry in two turns of shooting. Goes with either Paladins or Terminators and it's worked so far as I am currently 3-0 with the new Grey Knights (Once against Daemons, Twice against Space Pups) !

[Valerian]

Per the codex, page 59, under "Relics of Titan":

 

"Only one of each Relic of Titan may be taken per army.  A model can take one of the following:"

 

The way that reads to me is that not only are the relics limited to one per army, but also one per character.  It's the same limit that applies in the new Ork book, too.

 

Same for Space Wolves in that new codex, too, but interesting enough there is no such limit in the Champions of Fenris supplement.

 

If you're running a Libby as your only HQ, and for some reason don't want the Cuirass, I'd consider the Relic Bolter, as the Libby can't purchase a Psycannon.

 

 

But a combi-melta, or even a regular storm bolter, is still better. It's literally just Assault 3 instead of Assault 2 and a range increase. Meh. 

 

 

Well, it does also offer Precision Shots and is Master-crafted, so it isn't just the extra shot and range increase.  But it is still meh.

[Reclusiarch Darius]

Well, it does also offer Precision Shots and is Master-crafted, so it isn't just the extra shot and range increase.  But it is still meh.

 

 

Its still just 2 bolter shots. They didn't even give it Rending. I mean, seriously...

[Rommel44]

The Relic Bolter is nice and fluffy, but not really anything I would consider taking unless I had 10 points left over and decided to give it to a Justicar. Librarian will be much more beneficial with either a Combi-Melta or a Combi-Plasma.

[Valerian]

Justicars can't take Relics, just certain ICs.

[Brovius]

Am I the only person that doesn't like giving the Buffbook to Librarians? They are our only access to ML3 for disciplines that aren't Sanctic and I'd rather not lose the free Primaris just because I have to make a single roll on the Sanctic chart. I usually take Divination and even it's primaris power is fantastic. If you really, really love Sanctic though, taking the book on an ML3 Librarian that gets the Loremaster trait means you have 6 out of the 7 powers in the Sanctic table. Good luck *not* getting GOI with that!

[Reclusiarch Darius]

 Am I the only person that doesn't like giving the Buffbook to Librarians? They are our only access to ML3 for disciplines that aren't Sanctic and I'd rather not lose the free Primaris just because I have to make a single roll on the Sanctic chart. I usually take Divination and even it's primaris power is fantastic. If you really, really love Sanctic though, taking the book on an ML3 Librarian that gets the Loremaster trait means you have 6 out of the 7 powers in the Sanctic table. Good luck *not* getting GOI with that!

 

I wouldn't normally take the Dominus Liber unless you were fighting Daemons specifically (where its bonuses to 'Banishment' can be crucial). I agree with you about Libby's, they generally want Telepathy or Divination (its actually quite hard to choose between them). 

[Brovius]

I fell in love with Divinarians ever since my first 1000pt game using one in early 6th. Rolled Perfect Timing, Forewarning and swapped something else to get the Primaris. Orks got wiped out before they made it anywhere near me, since their KFF meant absolutely nothing to one of my squads.

 

Telepathy is awesome because Invisibility is broken, but I honestly don't find the other powers in the discipline very memorable (meaning I can't remember anything other than Invisibility and the gimmicky 'force a leadership test' one).

 

The Deimos Storm Bolter isn't bad though, and I't rate it above a combi-weapon purely because I don't like the thought of paying points for something that only works once on a 3+. I'd rather him sit with a block of GKTs in the midfield on an objective sniping away at the heavy/special weapons of enemy squads. That's just my playstyle though.

[Gaz1858]

Quote

 Am I the only person that doesn't like giving the Buffbook to Librarians? They are our only access to ML3 for disciplines that aren't Sanctic and I'd rather not lose the free Primaris just because I have to make a single roll on the Sanctic chart. I usually take Divination and even it's primaris power is fantastic. If you really, really love Sanctic though, taking the book on an ML3 Librarian that gets the Loremaster trait means you have 6 out of the 7 powers in the Sanctic table. Good luck *not* getting GOI with that!

 

I wouldn't normally take the Dominus Liber unless you were fighting Daemons specifically (where its bonuses to 'Banishment' can be crucial). I agree with you about Libby's, they generally want Telepathy or Divination (its actually quite hard to choose between them). 

 

 

 

It depends on your playstyle. My Libby will be in a unit of purifiers. I want GOI so I can gate over to my DP with Locator Beacon which another Combat Squadded 10 man Purifier squad just came out of.

 

The Book gives me one more chance to roll GOI if the other three fail while the re-rolling 1s is incredibly useful for getting off all the Cleansing Flames I will be using. And hell if i happen to roll VoD then rerolling 1s to make sure that sucker goes off is great.

 

However if your list doesnt revolve around this then I can see why you wouldnt.