What to do if I want to play chaos?

[sunspear]

I have about 1k in CSM stuff laying around, I have always liked them and my regular gaming opponent is wanting to play GK, so it is just too tempting to try and throw them together along with some demaons and duke it out with him. I would like to go out to the LGS and get some games in on occasion too. I am not too competitive so I am not worried about the tournament scene so much. Just some enjoyable games, with a couple of drinks :)

My biggest issue is this, I like to game with models I think look cool. I like the chaos lord model, terminators, land raiders and basic CSM troops. all of which don't seem too popular in army lists these days. I have read through the very helpful Guide by insane psychopath, so I know that all hope isn't lost. (Thanks for that guide it is very informative).

My question is with the aforementioned models, what codex should I use? the standard CSM, the BL, or the CS? What one would best suit the models I think are cool?

Thanks for taking the time to read this and any advise.

[Teetengee]

Rule of fluff says hordes of power armour and terminators should use black legion, unfortunately, that involves the votlw tax. Generally speaking crimson slaughter is a little better on those units since it gives them fear and allows for a sorc to be a daemon for malefic shenanigans. However, since you are just going for friendly games, I suggest you choose whichever ruleset gives you the relics you want. Also, allied daemons can be a huge shot in the arm for chaos.

[Dark_Apostle_XVII]

I would personally say CSM or BL as you can/have to take veterans of the long war in these and that will help you get one up on the Grey Knights as they are a type of Space Marines so the benefits apply. CS supplement says you cannot take this so it would not really help you much - although getting a divination psyker is cool but daemons can do that too if you're allying so not a big deal.

 

I would be inclined to suggest you use BL with what you have, even though my preference is for the regular codex (I'm more of a fluff gamer so that codex is best to represent what I want) as one thing you could do though is use the BL codex to run your lord as a counts as Abaddon, upgrade the terminators to the bringers of despair for plus 1 bs/ws and run your normal CSM as chosen troops. You'll get a very small, elite army but compulsory vets and good stats/combat ability plus being able to take up to 5 plasma guns per squad should give you a decent edge against the Grey Knights so you're not getting hammered every game - not even seen their new codex so not sure how they are as opponents now but you'll have fun.

 

I guess the final thing to consider is what army do you want to play and how fluffy are you? As that would definitely help you choose - say you want to paint your models black legion, might as well use the supplement, but if you want Night Lords you could just as easily use the normal rules and no supplement as they gain no extra fluff dimension from the supplements.

 

Good luck anyway and all the best.

 

*Definitely agree with the above though in that for friendly games, go with what artefacts you like the look of most as that adds to the fun.

[sunspear]

Thanks for the advise, it really helps. I am just getting back into the game after being out most of the last edition. To be honest all of the new supplements and psychic powers are a lot to get my head around right now. I like fluff, but I am not sure yet which legion I will use or if I will go with an offshoot warband. So I may look at the relics as mentioned and see what they have to offer.

Although the BL sounds cool, I don't often use special characters but if Abaddon is basically an army buffer instead of some uber kliiy character, that may be the way to go.

[Kilofix]

Want to play Chaos? No problem - first you need a suitable sacrifice. I'd suggestion 1,000....

 

Really its easy. The beauty of Chaos is that it has lots of different esoteric models that are cool to use and paint.

 

But, you can still stick to the basics and do well.

 

I've run the following at 2K with decent success - which looks very much just like a loyalist list:

• Chaos Lord in Terminator Armor
• 10 Terminators with Combi Bolter and Power Axe (one with Power Sword, one with Chainfist)
• 4 x Squads of 10 Tactical Marines (i.e. Chaos Marines) - Sgt with Power Axe, one with Missile Launcher, one with Melta + Icon of Vengeance
• 10 Assault Marines (i.e. Raptors) - two with Flamer
• 1 x Predator
• 1 x Vindicator
• 1 x Land Raider
• 1 Aegis Defense Line

 

Bottom line is - you can start with a very loyalist looking list (which I'm assuming - you may be more familiar with) - then slowly substitute components with the more esoteric Chaos units.

 

Like smaller units of Cult Troops (e.g. Plague or Noise Marines) instead ot the Tactical Marines or a Maulerfiend instead of the Vindicator or Obliterators instead of Terminators, etc.

[the jeske]

lay down. roll to the side.see models on the paint station.  try to not cry. roll to the other side. see 3.5 standing on the book shelf. cry anyway.

[Xin Ceithan]

In the other hand, maybe that's the idea behind the current dex:

Develop a pain threshold. Get's you up all rage-y in an Let the Galaxy burn mood and keeps an nihilistic, bitter undercurrent to get you in a proper Veteran of the Long War mindset.

[sunspear]

Thanks kilofix! that list is definately along the lines of what I am looking for. I will use that as a template to build from. Much appreciated!

[Kilofix]

Thanks kilofix! that list is definately along the lines of what I am looking for. I will use that as a template to build from. Much appreciated!

 

Btw, you probably don't want 40 Tacs (Chaos Marines) - I just used that as an example (and that's my Death Guard HH list). 20 is probably already plenty for 40K CSM. You can fill out your other Troops with Cultists.

 

Other units that are great:

Heldrake

Oblits

Bikes

Chaos Spawn

Plague Marines

Noise Marines

Chosen with 4-5 Special Weapons

Maulerfiends

 

Units that are not so great:

Mutilators

Warp Talons

Defilers (unless you really need the Battle Cannon)

Possessed (still too expensive - but fluffy with Crimson Slaughter)

Thousand Sons (too expensive)

Beserkers (equip regular Chaos Marines with MoK and 2 CC weapons instead)

[Gaius Atticus]

If your friend isn't a huge cheeseball just stick to the Chaos Codex. My most played against opponent is Chaos. Neither of us use flyers, and I build fluffy lists as opposed to what wins so we always have close games.

[incinerator950]

You can take vets for cult units in CS, and units who already come with vets don't handwaive them.

[sunspear]

Thanks again for all the info. I am currently looking into everything to see how I want to go. This helps a lot. My regular opponent isn't a cheese all. We like to play narrative games and campaigns. Just hang out , have a good laugh and a good game.

[the jeske]

Well what ruling do you guys use on chaos detachment vs chaos codex rules vs self ally rule ? Chaos is kind of a mess if you want to use multiple detachments from different books.

[Zeller]

Word Bearers are also big on infantry heavy attrition approaches and of course plenty of terminators.

[sunspear]

Jeske- I will probably just stick with one codex or supplement. To be honest I don't know enough about the supplements to know if I want to use them or if they have restricted troops. I didn't play much at all in the last edition and I am still trying to wrap my head around all the supplements and psycher rules. I am sure he wouldn't mind mixing the supplements/codex but I don't want to confuse myself right now,lol.

Zeller- I am kinda torn between WB and IW right now. I can't decide which I like better.

[Slayer le Boucher]

What to do if you wanna play chaos?, like to been hurt, physicaly and psychologicly, be ready to learn to love what you hate and hate what you love, and Patience LOTS of it, like a :cussbucket load metric cubic ton of it...

 

Oh and dellusions also, very important, always that slim hope that one day you will have rules to back up your army the way it should be and then realise that you are the poor parent of the Space marines fammily.

[the jeske]

Jeske- I will probably just stick with one codex or supplement. To be honest I don't know enough about the supplements to know if I want to use them or if they have restricted troops. I didn't play much at all in the last edition and I am still trying to wrap my head around all the supplements and psycher rules. I am sure he wouldn't mind mixing the supplements/codex but I don't want to confuse myself right now,lol.

Zeller- I am kinda torn between WB and IW right now. I can't decide which I like better.

The difference between a CS and normal codex is that the normal codex is the relics and that is all.

 

As far as psykers goes, If you want to use them you need 2 sorc that have a good chance to get the 1 spell you want and 11 or more power dice per turn base[as in before you roll the d6].

 

The problem with chaos is that CS, BL and CSM codex count as one faction.Which is awesome when you want to self ally until you realise that some rules contradict each other between the different books[as what unit upgrades have to/can not be taken].

If you want to stick to one book the GW is trolling you hard, as you have to buy 2 books anyway. As you want to use the CS book, but the rules for the troops are in the csm book.

 

For terminators , do not try to make them a melee unit or deathstars. They are too slow for that. They are +2/+5 shoty platforms and use them as such.

 

As csm goes my condolances, if you want to use a lot of them. As the good way to run power armor dudes out of any chaos codex is to have them mounted on bikes.

[sunspear]

Jeske- Thanks for the advise, i apprecaite it. I will b playing against GK nost of the time so I imagine I will need all the psychic help I can get. I would like to ally eventually with some demons.