Vorenus Posted August 25, 2014 Share Posted August 25, 2014 Greetings, Brother Captains: I've seen several threads wherein the utility of Teleport Homers comes up, usually in discussions about first-turn alpha strikes using the Nemesis Strike Force Detachment, but also in the context of pairing it with the Sanctic Daemonology psychic power Gate of Infinity. Here's the problem: I don't think the latter combination will work. If you read the rule for the Teleport Homer, it says that a Teleport Homer only works for units that are all in TDA or have Personal Teleporters (so, Strike Squads, Purifiers, and Purgators accompanied by a Librarian/Draigo with Gate of Infinity are already ineligible). But that's as far as the discussion seems to have gone so far. The rule also states that the Teleport Homer only works on models "...arriving from Deep Strike Reserve..." CODEX GREY KNIGHTS, p. 91. Gate of Infinity, however, doesn't appear to interact with the Teleport Homer. Gate of Infinity is a blessing that targets the Psyker. If you cast it successfully, "remove the target and his unit from the board. It then immediately arrives anywhere on the board using the rules for Deep Strike." CODEX GREY KNIGHTS, p. 93. The Gate of Infinity power does not place the unit into Deep Strike Reserve, which is the only way to benefit from the Teleport Homer. In an attempt to be thorough I also re-read the rules for Reserves and Deep Strike on pages 135-136 and 162, respectively, from the WARHAMMER 40,000 THE RULES. I will not repeat those three pages verbatim here. I regret to say that nothing in those three pages changes the analysis above. Some may attempt to find some wiggle room here and argue RAI, but I tend to take a conservative approach in interpreting rules. If you intend to implement a "house rule" workaround, you will of course wish to discuss this with your opponent first. Very respectfully, --Vorenus Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted August 25, 2014 Share Posted August 25, 2014 Ah. If TH's work on units arrinve from DS Reserves, then no. Won't work with GoI. /sigh Another synergy lost. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3790184 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz1858 Posted August 25, 2014 Share Posted August 25, 2014 Space wolves Drop pod plus Locator Beacon would solve it Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3790240 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted August 26, 2014 Share Posted August 26, 2014 Ravens have locator beacons, you could use those instead. I think teleport homers are mainly designed for helping out the Nemesis Strikeforce or normal Deepstriking in a CAD. GW hate fun so 'Gate' isn't meant to work with it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3790340 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted August 26, 2014 Share Posted August 26, 2014 Space wolves Drop pod plus Locator Beacon would solve it Space Wolf Drop Pods solve a bunch of things. ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3790602 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodTzar Posted August 26, 2014 Share Posted August 26, 2014 I think (not having BrB at work) that to make TH work it needs to be on table at the beginning of the turn, meaning DP will not do the trick. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3790639 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted August 26, 2014 Share Posted August 26, 2014 Yup. The Drop Pods comes in turn 1, you can use it's LB turn 2 onwards. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3790660 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffersonian000 Posted August 26, 2014 Share Posted August 26, 2014 TH does work with GoI in their current versions because removing a deep striking unit from the board automatically places them into Deep Strike reserve. You will note that Deep Strike always occurs from Deep Strike reserve, On-Going reserves will place a Deep Striking unit into Deep Strike reserve, and Mishap can place a unit back into Deep Strike reserve. As GoI requires the removal of the unit from the board followed by a normal Deep Strike that occurs immediately, the only part of the Deep Strike process that is bypassed is the requirement of a reserve roll to enter play. With the further restriction on TDA and PT units only, GoI works fine with GK Teleport Homers. However, if Gating non-TDA, non-PT units, use allied Locator Beacons, because our TH is crap outside of Gate and our Nemesis deployment special rule. SJ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3790774 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted August 26, 2014 Share Posted August 26, 2014 That's not correct. You remove a unit form the board, and place it using the Deep Strike Rules. Deep Strike *Reserves* happens before the game starts, and you declare a unit is entering reserves. When using Deep Strike rules, you don't enter Reserves again. As not only does that trigger a redeployment (allowing Coteaz to I've Been Exepcting You again, among others), you'd then have to roll for Reserves. And Deploy in your Movement Phase. Etc. And you only 'Deploy' a unit once. GoI uses the rules for Deep Strike (placement, Scatter, no assault, etc), but does not place a unit back into ongoing Reserves (unlike a Deep Strike Mishap). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3790785 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted August 26, 2014 Share Posted August 26, 2014 ^This. GW explicity don't want you to have fun. They want forged narrative and as much randumb as you can roll for. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3790865 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vorenus Posted August 26, 2014 Author Share Posted August 26, 2014 Of course, if the unit ends up suffering a Deep Strike mishap with the Gate of Infinity teleport, the unit could end up going into Ongoing Reserve. Then the Teleport Homer will work for the unit when they come back from Ongoing Reserves via Deep Strike. (Provided all the models are in TDA or have personal teleporters, of course.) At least, I think that's how it would work: Provided that going into "Ongoing Reserves" and returning via "Deep Strike" would count as "Deep Strike Reserve". Anyway, that seems like a pretty big waste of a Gate of Infinity. And, yes, the Locator Beacon will work, including the one we can take on our Storm Ravens. But of course the Locator Beacon has to be on the table at the beginning of the turn (just like the Teleport Homer), meaning that it won't work on your Drop Pod or Storm Raven that just entered play that turn. I think it is pretty terrible that the only unit in our army that can take a Locator Beacon is a Storm Raven. I would absolutely love to take one on a Land Raider. Or a teleporting Dreadknight for that matter... v/r --Vorenus Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3791509 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Coolpants Posted August 26, 2014 Share Posted August 26, 2014 I thought ongoing reserves had to come in from your board edge? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3791522 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted August 26, 2014 Share Posted August 26, 2014 Not if you enter play via Deep Strike. Would be funny though. DS a Drop Pod, it mishaps and is returned to reserves. Then has to walk on from a board edge. ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3791525 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted August 27, 2014 Share Posted August 27, 2014 Hold on... Isn't the locator beacon technically on the board at the Start of the turn. Can a gate of Infinity squad use itself as a beacon to prevent scatter? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3791895 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz1858 Posted August 27, 2014 Share Posted August 27, 2014 And on that note....the universe imploded Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3791899 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted August 27, 2014 Share Posted August 27, 2014 When the turn starts, before you'v rolled for reserves, is the Locator beacon on the board? Nope. ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3791908 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted August 27, 2014 Share Posted August 27, 2014 If I have a termie squad on the table and Draigo and also another IC in that same squad equipped with a Teleporter homer, and I use the "Gate of Infinity" psychic power - technically I am deepstriking but the homer WAS on the board at the Start of the turn. Do I erase scatter? Psychic phase does come after movement... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3791945 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted August 27, 2014 Share Posted August 27, 2014 Not coming in from Deep Strike Reserves. Our TH won't work. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3791960 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted August 27, 2014 Share Posted August 27, 2014 Hmmm, that's unfortunate. What are the rules for locator beacons? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3791962 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted August 27, 2014 Share Posted August 27, 2014 'Friendly units do not scatter when they Deepstrike, so long as the first model is placed within 6" of a model with a locator beacon. The locator beacon must have been on the battlefield at the start of the turn in order for it to be used.' pg. 216, Codex Space Wolves Basically everything teleport homers should be. The best part is, they don't care what kind of unit is landing off the beacon, whereas teleport homers only work for TDA units. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3792064 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted August 27, 2014 Share Posted August 27, 2014 And out TH only work for TDA/PT arriving from DS Reserves. More restricted than even 'normal' THs. Why GW? So you could add PTs to them? Have to take away to give... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3792085 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hidicul Posted August 28, 2014 Share Posted August 28, 2014 The one thing I dont like about our homers is that our Strikes cant benifit from them. Why give us a org that is meant for everything to DS but our only hommer we can get on the board turn 1 only works for termies and jump troops? Fail GW FAIL! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3792999 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reckling Posted August 28, 2014 Share Posted August 28, 2014 An inquisitor with TDA and 3x servo skulls will set you back 74 points. Heck, why not throw in a psycannon for max synergy. More importantly, has anyone found a unit that can manipulate reserve rolls without starting on the board from turn 1?(Please dont suggest Ultramarines Sicarius, Comms Relay, Wolf Guard Void Claws formation, Pods with Beacons, etc). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3793014 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted August 28, 2014 Share Posted August 28, 2014 Master of the Fleet Any Divination psyker that rolls 'Scier's Gaze' Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3793180 Share on other sites More sharing options...
boreas Posted August 28, 2014 Share Posted August 28, 2014 An inquisitor with TDA and 3x servo skulls will set you back 74 points. Heck, why not throw in a psycannon for max synergy. More importantly, has anyone found a unit that can manipulate reserve rolls without starting on the board from turn 1? (Please dont suggest Ultramarines Sicarius, Comms Relay, Wolf Guard Void Claws formation, Pods with Beacons, etc). Do Inquisitor still have those awesome psycannon that aren't salvo? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295816-gate-of-infinity-and-teleport-homers/#findComment-3793215 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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