Reclusiarch Darius Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 They had to increase the number of elite slots because they had to decrease the number of heavy supports slots (Dreadknights) and Fast Attack (Storm Raven/Interceptors) so every list wouldn't be 3 NDK backed up by 3 Interceptor squads, with the occasional SR thrown in now and again to spice things up. As I mentioned (in this thread or another) paladins are the only ones to benefit from RoT so they will be the only ones taken with it and they will eat your points faster than a tyranid at a free buffet. Even the troop slots have been reduced so you don't spam take terminators. But I can still do that with two Nemesis Strikeforces. I mean hell, two HQ's is actually a buff to the army (two cheap Libby's), two Termie squads is fine for what they do, and I get 4 Dreadknights. Nice one GW. Even in execution, you fail. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3797701 Share on other sites More sharing options...
casb1965 Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 I've seen people talk of taking SW Drop Pods in a NSF so Purifiers can DS on turn 1 but to do that you need to buy a HQ and 2 troops which works out expensive, has anyone thought of taking a StormTalon to put the Purifiers in and Strikeshield? Not sure how effective that is in comparison to Drop pods but would like to hear thoughts. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3797727 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warboss dakka slugga Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 I've seen people talk of taking SW Drop Pods in a NSF so Purifiers can DS on turn 1 but to do that you need to buy a HQ and 2 troops which works out expensive, has anyone thought of taking a StormTalon to put the Purifiers in and Strikeshield? Not sure how effective that is in comparison to Drop pods but would like to hear thoughts. Wont work as you cant deploy in a transport not bought for the unit, the rules say that you can embark into a friendly transport Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3797746 Share on other sites More sharing options...
casb1965 Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 I've seen people talk of taking SW Drop Pods in a NSF so Purifiers can DS on turn 1 but to do that you need to buy a HQ and 2 troops which works out expensive, has anyone thought of taking a StormTalon to put the Purifiers in and Strikeshield? Not sure how effective that is in comparison to Drop pods but would like to hear thoughts. Wont work as you cant deploy in a transport not bought for the unit, the rules say that you can embark into a friendly transport My mistake I meant StormRaven Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3797756 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warboss dakka slugga Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 No worries :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3797757 Share on other sites More sharing options...
casb1965 Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 No worries Question still stands though, would it work? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3797762 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warboss dakka slugga Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 If it wasnt bought as a transport? I'd assume so as it would be the same as embarking in a battlewaggon (us orky players!) or a landraider for you space meh rines! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3797766 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hidicul Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Actually Quozzo, seems like people are leaning twords Purifiers instead. I'm not convinced of the whole drop pod use, not sure it would work for the NSF as its not a dedicated transport for the purifiers. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3797787 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Coolpants Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Well drop pods are fast attack, so is just a basic transport and not specifically bought for anything (dedicated transport) As far as I'm aware, the rules say that the only unit that can go in a dedicated transport is the unit it was bought for. But as drop pods can now be bought separately as fast attack, then it's within the rules as long as you're battle brothers Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3797800 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Wont work as you cant deploy in a transport not bought for the unit, the rules say that you can embark into a friendly transport Space Wolves can purchase Drop Pods as a fast slot, and not dedicated transport. Edit: This time I was ninja'd! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3797803 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Coolpants Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Wont work as you cant deploy in a transport not bought for the unit, the rules say that you can embark into a friendly transport Space Wolves can purchase Drop Pods as a fast slot, and not dedicated transport. Edit: This time I was ninja'd! yes!!! For once in my life! Seems that the student has become the master! B-) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3797814 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 /salute When we last met you were but the student. Now you are the master. ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3797825 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Coolpants Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Wax on! wax off! (-o-) <|~ / > Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3797837 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 No known defense... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3797890 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quozzo Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Actually Quozzo, seems like people are leaning twords Purifiers instead. I'm not convinced of the whole drop pod use, not sure it would work for the NSF as its not a dedicated transport for the purifiers.Nah, Reclusiarch Darius hit it on the head. 2 HQ and two terminators gets you access to 4 NDK and you can only buy so many SW drop pods and purifiers after the aforementioned units. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3797955 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 After 4 NDK, what other units do you need? Well, apart from people who won't refuse to play you. HQ: Libby (110) Troop: Strike x5 (110) Heavy: NDK, HI, PT, GS (190) Heavy: NDK, HI, PT, GS (190) Three of those is 1,800 points on the nose. Seriously, I might be sounding like a dead horse, but a *Battle Forged* army sporting 6 NDK... Shark has been jumped. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3797975 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quozzo Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Is that a CAD? Take the NSFD for only a single mandatory troops choice. You save 330 points across all three detachments which can get another NDK and an interceptor squad. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3797991 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Typo! The x2 was x5 for the number of the Strikes. ;) It's a NSF. :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3798179 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 The thing is GL, most tournaments are leaning towards primary+Allied detachment/formation/Inquisitorial detachment etc. So normally taking 3x detachments is only going to be for casual games. As i pointed out to you before, a 6 DK list is doable, its just incredibly skewed. I'd rather run something a little less one-dimensional, if for no other reason then I have models assembled. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3798637 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 I dislike 'comp'. And now we're going to just ignore the fact that GW are forcing us to use more than two detachment, and we're ok with other people trying to say "no, not you guys." We've been chopped up into three books base. You want your old GK, Assassin, Coteaz army? That's *three* seperate detachments, before we even consider an ally. For other players to deem that's not ok for us to use is frankly absurd. You cannot limit the number of detachments nor formations a player is entitled to use any more. The core rules work *against* this notion. I'd rather not take part in any event that tried this. It's madness and folly. And we should *not* support it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3798641 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 I dislike 'comp'. And now we're going to just ignore the fact that GW are forcing us to use more than two detachment, and we're ok with other people trying to say "no, not you guys." We've been chopped up into three books base. You want your old GK, Assassin, Coteaz army? That's *three* seperate detachments, before we even consider an ally. For other players to deem that's not ok for us to use is frankly absurd. You cannot limit the number of detachments nor formations a player is entitled to use any more. The core rules work *against* this notion. I'd rather not take part in any event that tried this. It's madness and folly. And we should *not* support it. (shrug) When GW decided to drop all tourney support, they dug their own grave as far as this is concerned. It's now open slather, organisers have carte blanche to set their own comp. I wanna be clear, I don't think comp is a good idea, as it generally causes more problems than it solves. By the same token, I am infuriated by GW's complete retreat from reality and logic when it comes to army construction. Double Force Org in 5th made me concerned, but it failed to make waves so I wrote it off as nothing. Formations gave me pause, but I figured the community would largely reject it (and most turned out to be terrible rules-wise anyway). Now, as you point out, so many bits and pieces are being chopped up into their own detachments (Allied or otherwise)...and the flat out denial of any restriction in the main rulebook... I don't know what the solution is. I really don't. In my group, we have lots of casual games, and recently we've done a League with certain restrictions. Beyond your FLGS or gaming group...GW have abandoned us to our own devices. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3798663 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 All true. But we should not be allowed to be 'bullied' by those lucky enough to have a complete army in a single book (like IG/Space MArines), for whom using a second detachment (say allies) is a *luxury*, when we are, by design, forced into three seperate detachments before even considering luxury allies. It's not a level playing field. And I for one refuse to support such design by the playerbase. We've been dealt a bad hand from GW. We should not just allow this to be made worse for us, by those it doesn't really effect. I wonder what would happen if all Space Marines vehicles were removed form the Codex, and placed into thier own "Transports of the Imperium" Book and detachment. "Oh, three detachments are now ok to use in our event". /please Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3798735 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 All true. But we should not be allowed to be 'bullied' by those lucky enough to have a complete army in a single book (like IG/Space MArines), for whom using a second detachment (say allies) is a *luxury*, when we are, by design, forced into three seperate detachments before even considering luxury allies. It's not a level playing field. And I for one refuse to support such design by the playerbase. We've been dealt a bad hand from GW. We should not just allow this to be made worse for us, by those it doesn't really effect. I wonder what would happen if all Space Marines vehicles were removed form the Codex, and placed into thier own "Transports of the Imperium" Book and detachment. "Oh, three detachments are now ok to use in our event". /please Oh Throne. Don't give them ideas GL. I can see it now; 'Dataslate: Vehicles of the Imperium' /shudder Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3798770 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 Dude, I called the splitting of Deldar into Wytch Cults, Cabals and Homunculii Funky Stuff. Then what appears on the leaks as upcoming books? ;) /called it Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3798773 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 Dude, I called the splitting of Deldar into Wytch Cults, Cabals and Homunculii Funky Stuff. Then what appears on the leaks as upcoming books? /called it Oh no. DE players are going to bomb GW if that happens :( Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295906-nemesis-strike-force-question/page/2/#findComment-3798786 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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