Chaotic thoughts after reading Talon of Horus: SPOILER ALERT

[Dammeron]

Fascinatingly different; almost totallly eschews "bolter porn" segments and varying perspectives (not to mention Imperial bias) that tend to dominate BL products when it comes to Chaos and goes for a fairly contained, quiet character study. It's all about the relationships; Khayon's relationships in particular with his Dark Eldar "Bloodward" and daemonic familiar are fascinating, in that they are genuine and intense; complicated, potentially violent, but passionate and connected. Similarly, it was wonderful getting some first person background on this most glossed over portion of the Chaos Space Marine's history; the Legion Wars are obviously quite different from the bowdlerized versions we have been presented with in the (largely Imperial slanted) codex accounts and general background material; for one thing, they are vaster and more violent than one might have imagined. I believe that Khayon at one point makes the observation that they make the conflicts of the Heresy itself look like child's play by comparison. Also fascinating is the interaction between characters of wildly differing (often conflicting) loyalties, faiths and perspectives. There is genuine politics here; genuine metaphysics. We learn a great deal not only about the Warp, daemons and their relationships to humanity, but how the Chaos Space Marines themselves regard these phenomena; how they relate to them. The principle driving imperative seems to have been to dispel commonly held delusions concerning the history of the Chaos Space Marines and, in particular, the Black Legion, since it is not, as one might have expected, originally or even principly comprised of members of the Sons of Horus; rather a hotch-potch mix of warriors from various legions, all of whom bring elements of their own character and heritage to the mix. 

 

It will be very, very interesting to see where this series goes and what it ultimately reveals not only about Abaddon and his Black Legion, but the 40K universe as it stands.

[Lord Lee]

I loved it, I just want to know when the next book is coming?

 

Lord Lee.

[Dragonlover]

 

 

So on one hand, saying Khayon doesn't feel like a Thousand Son for not mentioning the Enumerations is a bit of a reach, applying a very narrow and recent criteria to what a Thousand Son 'should' be - ruling out Ahriman himself. It's just one angle of all we've seen of the Legion over 25 years. But on the other hand, it's a good point. That idea obviously resonated with you, and it's not wrong to want to see more of it, or expect a mention here and there. I'll keep it in mind, dude.

 

 

 

 

That's fair. Thanks for taking it on board.

 

You've caused me no end of grief for my personal Nine Legions project though. How the hell do you model the quintessential Black Legion force when they're formed around a mentality and take anyone that shares that mentality/will bend the knee? I may just make Khayon, Firefist and the rest and have it as my single 'this army is ripped from the novels' project.

 

Dragonlover

[Iron-Daemon Forge]

Just started reading Talons of Horus & current half way though the book.  Just about to read part two of the novel.  Also the novel was release on the weekend I started the hobby 18 year ago (28th September 1996, Games Workshop Edinburgh) & when I started collecting Chaos a few week into the hobby - Black Legion after reading White Dwarf 202, era when 2nd ed Chaos Space Marines where being release.  Just found that pretty cool.

Overall I've enjoy reading the novel, as always it given me lot of cool idea toward conversion.  Really like the description of the IV - Iron Warriors on Gallium, using some those idea toward a new unit of Chosen before the end of this year :D  I'm currently on page 163.
 

[Excessus]

My plan is to buy it today, as always I hope for some Alpha Legion action but will probably end up denied of it as usual...

[Artein]

My plan is to buy it today, as always I hope for some Alpha Legion action but will probably end up denied of it as usual...

 

Well, they are mentioned.... once, if I remember correctly. 

[Brother Ambroz]

Kind of in just one sentence.

[Petitioner's City]

I really really liked your novel, ADB, and really wish the novel would get more attention, criticism & analysis on the main 40k sites like Natfka, Bell and 3++, so as to shape, challenged and be challenged by more people's views of Chaos, the Eye and its characters.

 

My thoughts on it are a bit rambling - I haven't managed to organise them, really. Of the novel itself, I loved so much of it, including its main characters - Khayon and Abaddon in particular. Lheor felt a bit like black sidekick, but was the most 'fun' character in the book. Telemachon was perhaps more opaque - I never really understood his independent reasons for being involved (other than during his brainwashed session), nor that of Sardar or Falkus, who were mostly cyphers - perhaps that will change in future novels?

 

The novel's better depictions of gender in the setting were my favourite element. Not simply Nefertari, but also even just background details such as the Mechanicum magos. Gyre and Khayon's sister are harder to put within gender paradigms, since neither are truly gendered characters within the story - although maybe someone can go all Butler on me and explain that they are. Maybe the friendship between Gyre and Nefertari perhaps should make me reconsider :) I remembered your Independent Characters interview a few months ago and your comments on gender therein, and how you wanted to avoid space marine girlfriend syndrome. That definitely felt so here - although maybe could we just have girl space marines someday??? 

 

Talon inspired me in relation to other works too. I reread Ahriman: Exile immediately after to see how French had similarly and differently handled these (admittedly a few millenia later, post-Gate) early days in the Eye. Whilst I'm not sure you want us to join the dots between even these close bits of the IP (in the way one would with current Treklit or past SW lit), it does feel good to do so - and see two very distinct visions of post-Heresy warband life. (Of course the only problem from this is perhaps silly small continuity things, like Khayon and his rubricae seemingly in blue - whereas French has the blue be a result of Ahriman's later defeat of Amon.) 

 

In terms of connections and works that have pushed the boundaries of world-building with chaos, it really reminded me of Traitor General (and to a lesser extent Salvation's Reach) and Abnett's very independent and not-very-model-dependent depictions of Chaos and the traitors within. Talon is equally as beautiful as the ecclesiarchy world setting of Pariah from recent BL work - and showed as much imagination as that did versus the more dissapointngly conservative or dull versions of the ecclesiarchy seen in, for example, Stormcaller). Talon is, like these aforementioned novels, excellent, inspired, world-building at its best - literate and expansive and ambitious.

 

I also wish i still had the second edition codex somewhere, just so i could compare those old, inspiring texts and this. This definitely felt like the Eye and its madness as existed then - right down to the beastmen and the crazy daemons. 

 

I really like how you added context to the destruction of Prospero, similar to how Scars did also. Am I right in understanding Lheor found Khayon on Prospero's ruins? And that Khayon survived the battle. The exposure to what happened to the 1000 Sons fleet was also good. And is Sortarius a new name for the Planet of the Sorcerors, or is it older? I never realised 1000 sons fought on Terra - that was really interesting too!

[Excessus]

Kind of in just one sentence.

Better than none, now I will looking for that sentence! :D

[Fury_of_Fenris]

Read it, and frankly im very pleased.

 

I find it's just so interesting to read about all the little tidbits and the going on's, the various characters settings and challenges. especially the fresh water part.

 

I find these types of stories soooo much more interesting and diverse than the regular stuff, hell i even enjoyed it more than the heresy series.

 

I particulalry liked the idea of the world eaters as able to function rather than just mindless brutes, also ADB, what info is out there on how the Emperors children come to dominate the legion wars? if they couldnt function on Terra how the hell did they give such a beatdown to the SOH?

[Kol Saresk]

That's the thing, they did function on Terra. It was just that there main concern was not the Siege.

[Balthamal]

I still believe the book needs a few read throughs before fully processing everything it contains. Much as Khayon experiences at one point, you read the words and follow their direction without their true import sinking into your mind. I've read it at least ten times now, I've bought the ebook because I don't want the constant re-reads to damage the first edition. 

 

I've given my thoughts on the book elsewhere and copped a few accusations of being too much of a :cuss sucking fan boy so I'll present the toned down version here. In short, it is everything a chaos player would want from the scope of the Legion Wars, how a warband comes together and continues to function, how it can prosper and how it can fall, the differences between what will come to be the Black Legion and the remnants of the other nine Legions who ran to Hell with them. This book right here is compulsory reading for anyone who has the remotest interest in anything related to the Warp and the armies it spews forth. 

 

I've never been interested in the Black Legion, comparing them (along with Word Bearers) as generic, boring, chaos-ultramarines. Now I want to put the Kha'Sharhan on the table top, do a model for Telemachon, actually make Abaddon stomp face like he's described as doing. That should say a lot about this book.

 

It isn't flawless, for me at least, I would have preferred the occasional viewport other than Khayon's. I know him being a powerful Telepath gets around that in most cases but having Lheor or Sargon's impressions of Khayon himself would have added some interesting facets but I'm hardly going to gripe over something that doesn't significantly detract from the story being told.

 

I still rate this a 10/10 but I put Betrayer just ahead in terms of ADB's best work. 

[Neigorath]

Read it, and frankly im very pleased.

 

I find it's just so interesting to read about all the little tidbits and the going on's, the various characters settings and challenges. especially the fresh water part.

 

I find these types of stories soooo much more interesting and diverse than the regular stuff, hell i even enjoyed it more than the heresy series.

 

I particulalry liked the idea of the world eaters as able to function rather than just mindless brutes, also ADB, what info is out there on how the Emperors children come to dominate the legion wars? if they couldnt function on Terra how the hell did they give such a beatdown to the SOH?

EC took a ton of slaves from Terra and most likely other loot as well so they were pretty well off when they finally reached the Eye. SoH on the otherhand tried to throw their weight around during the early days and otherwise were pretty broken because of the death of Horus. (I remember from old fluff that every single Son felt the single moment when the emperor slew Horus, might remember wrong though.) Also, it was not only EC but a coalition of every single other legion attacking the Sons, the legion they blamed for the defeat.

 

I blasted through the book in less than 24 hours so might need to reread it someday soon.

[Kol Saresk]

In the words of Worf "Today is a good day to read."

[Dammeron]

Another thing that struck me about the book is that it is basically a homage to those of us who have been involved in the background since the very beginning; the references to past (and often obsolete) sources of background come thick and fast; anyone who has read the RoC books will find A LOT of stuff here.

 

Most notable for me was the re-establishment that Soritarius (formerly simply known as The Planet of the Sorcerers) is infested with Tzaangor (Tzeentch Beastmen) whom the Thousand Sons use as crew, cannon fodder etc. This hasn't been mentioned in the background largely since the RoC days (perhaps there's a passing mention in the second ed Chaos codex; can't recall right now).

[Loesh]

Another thing that struck me about the book is that it is basically a homage to those of us who have been involved in the background since the very beginning; the references to past (and often obsolete) sources of background come thick and fast; anyone who has read the RoC books will find A LOT of stuff here.

 

Most notable for me was the re-establishment that Soritarius (formerly simply known as The Planet of the Sorcerers) is infested with Tzaangor (Tzeentch Beastmen) whom the Thousand Sons use as crew, cannon fodder etc. This hasn't been mentioned in the background largely since the RoC days (perhaps there's a passing mention in the second ed Chaos codex; can't recall right now).

 

That is pretty awesome, i'd like to see more Beastmen in general. I always liked Slaangors(Big surprise, right?) and it'd be cool to see them more often in 40k.

[Bulwyf]

 

So, I'm re-reading it, and you know what? It's better on the re-read, with no expectations to colour it. I now want to make all of my guys take the black, but I am resisting.

 

My sole criticism now is that Khayon doesn't feel like a Thousand Son, in terms of way of thinking and stuff, but that may have been deliberate as a way of distancing him from his Legion, so I'm willing to see where it goes.

 

It sounds really dumb, but I find the lack of references to the... damn, I forget the word. Enumerations? Irritating. They struck me as a standard way of thinking for the Sons is all. I guess part of the point may be that Khayon has moved past the need for them possibly, but it's something I'd have liked mention of.

 

It doesn't sound dumb. It's an interesting point. And there are a few ways to look at it.

 

The first is that Khayon is pretty much a prototypical Thousand Son in terms of how he acts, thinks, and perceives things, based on a lot of classic Thousand Sons lore. Especially in the melancholic scholarly vibe of their Index Astartes article and their Codex Chaos info. Ahriman doesn't use the Enumerations in the Ahriman series, and he doesn't feel like any less of a Thousand Son because of it. 

 

The second is that the Enumerations are standard in A Thousand Sons. They're a cool idea and I like them a lot, but they're also pretty recent and not a universal thing that binds every author. And in all honesty, even if and when other authors write about the Thousand Sons in the Heresy, I wouldn't expect to see every author use them universally. There are a squillion ways to work psychic power in the setting, and a lot of different rituals, techniques, and processes for sorcerers to work with. The same way Native American shamanism, voodoo, prayer, Enochian ritual, Wicca, and so on all have means of achieving the same thing, but do so through vastly different processes.

 

The third (and a very cool in-universe angle) is that given the two Thousand Sons we've seen in detail post-Heresy (Ahriman and Khayon) don't use them, the Enumerations are either an archaic process - used when the Thousand Sons were on the very first steps of a much longer path, or something that various Thousand Son warbands still use rather than universally spread across every sorcerer. And there's a wealth of fairly dense/complex sorcery in Talon already. 

 

So on one hand, saying Khayon doesn't feel like a Thousand Son for not mentioning the Enumerations is a bit of a reach, applying a very narrow and recent criteria to what a Thousand Son 'should' be - ruling out Ahriman himself. It's just one angle of all we've seen of the Legion over 25 years. But on the other hand, it's a good point. That idea obviously resonated with you, and it's not wrong to want to see more of it, or expect a mention here and there. I'll keep it in mind, dude.

 

 

 

I rather inferred from the previous HH novels that spot lighted the TS that the Enumerations were realized by the TS as just a doorway into something far different than they imagined and as a result simply discarded using them after their "rebirth" on their demon world in the Eye. I honestly never even thought about Khayon not using them in ToH as a "whoa, wait, why isn't this guy running with the program on how they use their powers" error.

[A D-B]

The novel's better depictions of gender in the setting were my favourite element. Not simply Nefertari, but also even just background details such as the Mechanicum magos. Gyre and Khayon's sister are harder to put within gender paradigms, since neither are truly gendered characters within the story - although maybe someone can go all Butler on me and explain that they are. Maybe the friendship between Gyre and Nefertari perhaps should make me reconsider I remembered your Independent Characters interview a few months ago and your comments on gender therein, and how you wanted to avoid space marine girlfriend syndrome. That definitely felt so here -

The reception of Talon has absolutely blown me away - and this thread is probably my fave so far - but I just wanted to thank you sincerely for that particular comment, PC. That was exactly the angle I was going for. This is a topic with a lot of levels, and one I try to pay a lot of attention to when I'm writing stuff.

One of the things that's fairly difficult in 40K is the nebulous limitations of female characters in Space Marine-centric fiction. That's not new. It just means that the majority of your characters are likely to be male - albeit in the ostensibly genderless way of Space Marines. So your immediate problem when you make the human supporting cast is that if they're largely female, you're then unbalancing them for the sake of overall story, and not necessarily correctly showing a real, believable population. That, however, is the least of the problems.

If the main human character is female, it's always immediately noticeable. That's a byproduct of the rarity in general, and it sucks. A lot depends on just how the Space Marines interact with the main human character, but there's a pretty noticeable difference in perception among certain circles. Space Marine characters interacting with main male characters, in any way at all, barely get mentioned. Space Marine characters interacting with main female characters, in any way at all, run the risk of various idiots immediately calling out the relationship as a Space Marine and his "waifu" or whatever. Especially if the two main characters discuss anything in depth.

For context, I went into Talon wanting to break that apart and try something entirely new. I realise this sounds insanely self-indulgent, but I also think it might be enlightening since you mentioned that interview about me wanting to avoid Space Marine Girlfriend Syndrome, so screw it. Ultimately, I don't believe Space Marine Girlfriend Syndrome exists. I think it's a knee-jerk reaction to a surface glance.

Here goes:

• In Cadian Blood, the cast was all male, so the idea never arose.
• In the Night Lords Trilogy, Talos has Septimus and Octavia, as a 50/50 divide. There's nothing sexual between Talos and the humans, obviously, but the 'Space Marine + Female Character' is a noticeable trope because of the depth and frequency of the conversations that take place. It's balanced (at least, you'd hope people notice that...) by the fact that Talos ultimately treats Septimus more carefully/tenderly at times than he does Octavia, and more harshly than her at other times. But Octavia is the inexperienced perspective in the narrative, themore useful slave, and we see the Night Lords fairly often through her eyes. (All three eyes, as it happens).
• In Helsreach and Blood and Fire, Grimaldus essentially spends far less time in battle and conversation with Princeps Zarha (female) than he does with Andrej (male), and beyond a few clumsy attempts to relate to them and/or inspire them, they're essentially creatures that completely confuse him because he's so far removed from humanity. So between those two, it's a wash. Andrej is revealed to be in love with another soldier, and Zarha is an ancient crone encased in a coffin. Grimaldus isn't particularly close with either of them. They're just a princeps and a soldier that happen to be female and male, respectively.
• In The Emperor's Gift, there's a certain affection between Inquisitor Annika Jarlsdottyr and Hyperion, and she's the Inquisition's eye-level character in the narrative, so with the difficult shifting of complicated institutional alliances and the weird history of the factions that needs explaining, there're several conversations going on at that level. She ultimately doesn't trust him
  (excluding him from her plans towards the end)

  and they don't speak alone all that often, but despite how difficult he finds it to understand humans, he likes watching the interactions between her and her warband. She's also revealed to at least have a physical relationship with one of her warband, and at various points is disappointed in Hyperion because of his actions. So they're not exactly best pals. She's an inquisitor and a POV character that happens to be female. I made half of her warband male, and half female.

• In The First Heretic, the principal human POV character is Cyrene. The relationship between her and Argel Tal is a mirror of Garviel Loken and Kyril Sindermann in Horus Rising (which, note, was barely ever commented on as being out of the ordinary) but where the Luna Wolves of the Great Crusade were dealing with secular scholars, the Word Bearers have a more religious approach, and Cyrene serves as the Confessor of the Serrated Sun. She's also a walking, talking embodiment of Lorgar's and Argel Tal's guilt, and as a living lesson to remind the Word Bearers of the 'mistakes' (or at least, the events) of the past. Her and Argel Tal are immensely close, as one might expect from a guilty sinner and his confessor. Her gender is irrelevant in the narrative, but I can absolutely see how this one adds to the overall trope.
• In Betrayer,
  Cyrene briefly returns - an act for which Argel Tal damns himself and loses his life

  , showing the nature of the path he's on. He was too far gone to break out the violins of regret, so to speak, and there's no going back. The principal mortal characters are a Titan crew, which is 50/50 male/female as I recall, and Lotarra Sarrin, the female captain of the Conqueror, who spends significant time talking to Angron and Khârn. She's not particularly close to either of them, but frankly it would've been a dudefest on that bridge with those two talking all the time (especially in the audio drama The Butcher's Nails) so I made the captain female.

• In Prince of Crows, the two main human characters are a female pilot (whom Sevatar watches over because he believes she's one of several men and women who are the descendants of his brothers and sisters) and a psyker of sorts, who serves as Curze's dream-eater, based on the old notions of a sin-eater. The main Space Marine character, Sevatar, clearly has some affection for the pilot, but barely interacts with her; he spends more time with the psyker, who's infinitely more important.
• In the upcoming audio drama The Long Night, about Sevatar's captivity aboard the Invincible Reason, there are essentially only two voices. Sevatar's, and the ghost of a dead girl haunting him. That's purely because it's an audio drama, and it's cool to have a growling Space Marine opposite a creepy little girl. If you Google Image Search "black-eyed children", they're almost always scary little girls, and The Shining famously makes the case for the gender divide there. And, again, her gender beyond that is irrelevant. It was a coin toss and went with what was creepier.

From all of that screed, you can probably guess this is something I think about lot and take pretty seriously. It's a balance I pay attention to.

Which brings us to Talon.

Prepare for all the spoilers, ever.

I wanted to deconstruct the gender identity of several female characters completely, in the same way that we always see with Space Marines. Space Marines are masculine, without exactly being male, if you get me. I wanted to mirror that in some female characters. Not even to avoid the irritating "waifu" comments (though people being smart enough to move past those would be awesome), but to show a common theme from a new and alien perspective. Basically, it's something we should maybe feel uneasy and curious about, as fans and readers, but we're sort of used to it from Space Marines now. Their inhumanity is interesting, but expected. (On a related note, I think the key to Space Marines and Chaos Marines is making them relatable and occasionally sympathetic, but not humanising them. And I think a lot of folks relate to a character, and understand them, but mistake that as "humanising" said character, which isn't necessarily the case.)

So - mentioned in The Talon of Horus - you have Nefertari, Gyre, the Anamnesis, Governess Ceraxia, and Moriana. All of whom are ostensibly female.

Ceraxia is a towering robotic monster savant. I like to think she's creepily feminine without really being female. She likes Khayon immensely, largely because he's intelligent and loyal in terms she needs and appreciates. She prizes stability in an unstable region. She doesn't care about the metaphysics of his powers or the emotional fragility of Legion identity. She wants the Legion Wars to settle down and stop ruining everything, and Khayon is an agent of that desired state of stability.

Gyre is... Gyre. She's in the form of a daemonic she-wolf, but there's nothing about her that really sends the perception either way. A male character, FitzChivalry Farseer, in Robin Hobb's famous (and glorious) fantasy series Realm of the Elderlings was bonded to a male wolf called Nighteyes. Since Talon was also written in first-person, and heavy on magic, I wanted to avoid as many similarities as I could. So Gyre is female purely because Nighteyes was male, even though ultimately it makes no difference because there's nothing female - or even feminine - about Gyre. Also, if you note Gyre's shadow on the wall once or twice, she's not even really a wolf.

The Anamnesis is a narrative mirror to Khayon. They're both cut off from what Khayon, at least, considers their preferred states. Over the course of the novel, as Khayon comes to rediscover the idea of a fulfilling brotherhood but not quite in the way he imagined, the Anamnesis also becomes more herself, but in a similarly unexpected way. The only times she speaks of herself as "I am Ultio" rather than "We are the Anamnesis" is towards the very end, after she becomes the heart and soul animating the Vengeful Spirit. She begins as a gestalt entity incapable of individuality, and though she ends (apparently) as a singular individual with a vast gestalt hive-mind to call upon, she's also completely, utterly removed from her gendered life forever. No going back now. The one nod to her gender is in the classic Age of Sail / naval sense, where she's a she because all ships are female. She's addressed that way, the Vengeful Spirit considers itself female for the same reason, so the Anamnesis perceives herself in those terms.

Moriana will show up later, and barely gets a nod in Talon. She, at least, seems to be what she appears: Khayon refers to how much he despises her and how she's at Abaddon's right hand, but little more than that.

Nefertari is like all of the above, and like none of them. She's probably the most sexless of them all, because she's not just a monster or a machine like the others where nothing is physically possible anyway - there technically(?) could be something there, but Khayon is a Spartan eunuch who doesn't think about that kind of thing and she's from a race of aliens that, to human eyes, are haunting, repulsive, and compelling in equal measure, who is equally disinterested in such things, to the point it never even crosses her mind. Khayon can appreciate her beauty in terms of her lethality, but he's actively repulsed by her because she's an alien. Her alien skin smells bad to him, and his sweat smells absolutely vile to her. Her mind is a mess, and they can't communicate psychically the way he can with so many others. She's much older than him, yet she looks much younger. She's young by the standards of her race - just out of adolescence and entering her physical prime - and still as lethal as one would expect of a Scourge / Solarite / Wych / Succubus / Independent Character / Whatever She Is... but she's also a lonely exile standing with another lonely exile. Her main relationship with Khayon is actually threatened, significantly, by his reforming sense of brotherhood. She makes it clear that he was born to fight in a Legion, among his brothers, and as useful as she is to him, he needs much more than a daemon-wolf and an exiled eldar as a companion.

She's probably the closest to the Space Marine Girlfriend trope (as Marshal2Crusaders joked earlier), but she actively compromises her position there, in that she advises against that very bond. She's also disliked by most of the other characters for various reasons (largely that she's an alien, and they're repulsed by her just as she's repulsed by them). But, frankly, I liked the idea of two deeply-exiled characters finding their various ways 'home' over the course of the series, and the song that inspired their creation destined one to be male and one to be female. I put a world of thought into how it mattered, and how it's different from anything else, and I'm deeply grateful that's showed to a lot of people. Nefertari is an exile first, an alien second, a murderer third, and female fourth. Hanging out with her isn't "Look at this Space Marine's girlfriend", it's "Jesus, it's uncomfortable being around aliens" and "Why is she hiding in the Eye of Terror?"

/End insanely long diatribe that took over an hour to write, which I hope is interesting rather than pointless.

Another thing that struck me about the book is that it is basically a homage to those of us who have been involved in the background since the very beginning; the references to past (and often obsolete) sources of background come thick and fast; anyone who has read the RoC books will find A LOT of stuff here.

Most notable for me was the re-establishment that Soritarius (formerly simply known as The Planet of the Sorcerers) is infested with Tzaangor (Tzeentch Beastmen) whom the Thousand Sons use as crew, cannon fodder etc. This hasn't been mentioned in the background largely since the RoC days (perhaps there's a passing mention in the second ed Chaos codex; can't recall right now).

Totally glad you picked up on that, dude. A lot of the series' inspiration comes from Rogue Trader and - most notably - the Codex Chaos vibe of Andy Chambers' work in 3rd Edition. I apologised to him after Talon was published for missing him out of the acknowledgements despite sourcing a mountain of his work, and promised to make it up to him in the next one. Terminally uncool of me to forget, especially as his name is on my research docs as much as anyone else's.

[Brother Ambroz]

ADB, will the series ever go into any detail on Abaddon's transformation from first captain to what he was in the Talon? With all of his pilgrimages it seemed to me like he was already preparing for this since the Legions fled to the eye.

[Tenebris]

ADB, I will use this opportunity to say again how much I loved the presentation of Khayon and his warband. It is no secret that I am a Thousand Sons fan and I devoured every snippet of lore on the XVth legion you have provided. 

 

A question if I may. Is Khayon a bearer of a Mark of Tzeentch, with all that entails this, or is he an "Undivided" Sorcerer. From his actions I understand that he is a Telekine and a Daemonologist, being this two his favorite disciplines but I assume as one ho has been part of the Rubic ritual and who still is quintessentially a Thousand Sons albeit with a black livery (though not in this novel, bar him in M41) and as a sorcerer who still calls upon Rubic Marines, isn't it logical for him to be "marked" by Tzeentch? 

 

On a side note, I really enjoyed the part where you explain that there was much more to the Thousand Sons other than the infamous "cults. We have philosophical salons, debate circles, political scholams... all this minor ways in which a legion of scholars is able to express itself among peers. Really the Thousand Sons are effectively an intellectual's dream as a legion.

[Balthamal]

As I understand it, and I could be wrong so feel free to correct me, it's only really Magnus who's directly "owned" by Tzeentch in terms of actively working towards His goals etc. I'm sure that there are plenty of sorcerers of all stripes, not just those of the XV who beseech aid/power/knowledge from Him at some point without specifically bearing his mark. On the whole I get the impression that the Black Legion couldn't care less about the Pantheon, taking their "gifts" as a matter of course from living within the Warp for a few thousand years and keeping their focus on the big prize - ruling the Imperium. Much the same way Telemachon has been changed by the touch of Slaanesh, I don't see him dancing around in the black and bronze plastered with the Mark.

 

I particularly loved the passage where Khayon muses "Let the Four empower who they desire" - it displays utter ambivalence towards a facet of the Long War that other warbands utter devote themselves to. 

[incinerator950]

I think it's because of the grey area in devotion or association with Legion groups compared to cults.

[Trevak Dal]

I like it's depiction of Abaddon. I have never really cared for him, or the Black Legion previously. But even if it's all Bull:cuss "It's Khayron's point of view and even though he's being honest/that's how they started out, happened and things changed, everything and nothing and all the dodgy horse :cuss" I really liked Abaddon's Mission Statement as it gels with my own views of the Primarchs and the Legions, so that's going to be my interpretation/understanding of the Black Legion from now on.

[incinerator950]

I honestly don't care anymore, and I'm forcing myself not to.

[Kol Saresk]

Then don't? No need to post about it if that's what you want to do. Might be easier for you if you didn't.