ndk's are the bomb!

[tomsev]

Had a games yesterday, and used a space marine detachement with a NSF

MVP of the game was definetly the dreadknight, with a turn 1 killing 30 boyz from shooting... I kid you not, then went on and tied up ghazgull ans his reunite of 6meganobs for thé rest of thé game well almost he killed them all by turn 4 and sent on to claim an objective after that... Draigo was also really good gating around my dev cents, and the grand master did really well tooo so all in all great performance by the grey knights...

[boreas]

Yep, NDK are definitely our most powerfull unit. By the way, I also have my auto-corrector on "french", so I love the accent in your post :)

[ChaoticEric]

I played three today in 2000p (I bought them recently, otherwise I wouldn't do it as I consider it quite cheesy). It was the first time ever I played them with teleporter as I've always considered 75p too much and it completely transformed them for me. First turn they teleported/shunted to all the places on the table where my opponent didn't want them and then they started causing havoc all over his army. This combined with two squads of terminators deep striking in on turn one really caught my opponent off guard and he never really recovered. The only thing he had going for himself was Khârn who took out a knight on his own before getting instakilled by a second knight only because one wound slipped through after the knight managed to roll a few 5++.

[hendrik]

what setup did you use on your knights that you managed to kill 30 orks (or did some of them run off the board?) heavy psylencer and incinerator?

[tomsev]

I used the heavy psycannon and incinerator, its my opponents fault he got very Lazy after moving 2 squads of 20 boys and just put them in 2 piles, he didnt think id jump there but i couldnt resist... I got 3on 1squad with the incinerator and 13 on the other and then the psycannon large blast hit on the squad i was orginnally shooting at down 15 more...

[Captain Coolpants]

I played three today in 2000p (I bought them recently, otherwise I wouldn't do it as I consider it quite cheesy). It was the first time ever I played them with teleporter as I've always considered 75p too much and it completely transformed them for me. First turn they teleported/shunted to all the places on the table where my opponent didn't want them and then they started causing havoc all over his army. This combined with two squads of terminators deep striking in on turn one really caught my opponent off guard and he never really recovered. The only thing he had going for himself was Khârn who took out a knight on his own before getting instakilled by a second knight only because one wound slipped through after the knight managed to roll a few 5++.

the nemesis strike force detachment only has 2 heavy support slots. So you could only have 2 dreadknights. Unless you allies with yourself and had 2 separate nemesis force detachments? Because only the nemesis strike force allows your troops to deepstrike turn one.

[gk1989]

 

I played three today in 2000p (I bought them recently, otherwise I wouldn't do it as I consider it quite cheesy). It was the first time ever I played them with teleporter as I've always considered 75p too much and it completely transformed them for me. First turn they teleported/shunted to all the places on the table where my opponent didn't want them and then they started causing havoc all over his army. This combined with two squads of terminators deep striking in on turn one really caught my opponent off guard and he never really recovered. The only thing he had going for himself was Khârn who took out a knight on his own before getting instakilled by a second knight only because one wound slipped through after the knight managed to roll a few 5++.

the nemesis strike force detachment only has 2 heavy support slots. So you could only have 2 dreadknights. Unless you allies with yourself and had 2 separate nemesis force detachments? Because only the nemesis strike force allows your troops to deepstrike turn one.

This is true, but can you ally a NSF and a CAD of Grey Knights together? I was under the impression you couldn't ally with the same faction as your main detachment.

[Hidicul]

 

I played three today in 2000p (I bought them recently, otherwise I wouldn't do it as I consider it quite cheesy). It was the first time ever I played them with teleporter as I've always considered 75p too much and it completely transformed them for me. First turn they teleported/shunted to all the places on the table where my opponent didn't want them and then they started causing havoc all over his army. This combined with two squads of terminators deep striking in on turn one really caught my opponent off guard and he never really recovered. The only thing he had going for himself was Khârn who took out a knight on his own before getting instakilled by a second knight only because one wound slipped through after the knight managed to roll a few 5++.

the nemesis strike force detachment only has 2 heavy support slots. So you could only have 2 dreadknights. Unless you allies with yourself and had 2 separate nemesis force detachments? Because only the nemesis strike force allows your troops to deepstrike turn one.

 

He might of just used a CAD you know.

[Raktra]

 

 

I played three today in 2000p (I bought them recently, otherwise I wouldn't do it as I consider it quite cheesy). It was the first time ever I played them with teleporter as I've always considered 75p too much and it completely transformed them for me. First turn they teleported/shunted to all the places on the table where my opponent didn't want them and then they started causing havoc all over his army. This combined with two squads of terminators deep striking in on turn one really caught my opponent off guard and he never really recovered. The only thing he had going for himself was Khârn who took out a knight on his own before getting instakilled by a second knight only because one wound slipped through after the knight managed to roll a few 5++.

the nemesis strike force detachment only has 2 heavy support slots. So you could only have 2 dreadknights. Unless you allies with yourself and had 2 separate nemesis force detachments? Because only the nemesis strike force allows your troops to deepstrike turn one.

 

He might of just used a CAD you know.

 

Apparently that's blasphemy now.

[Valerian]

 

 

I played three today in 2000p (I bought them recently, otherwise I wouldn't do it as I consider it quite cheesy). It was the first time ever I played them with teleporter as I've always considered 75p too much and it completely transformed them for me. First turn they teleported/shunted to all the places on the table where my opponent didn't want them and then they started causing havoc all over his army. This combined with two squads of terminators deep striking in on turn one really caught my opponent off guard and he never really recovered. The only thing he had going for himself was Khârn who took out a knight on his own before getting instakilled by a second knight only because one wound slipped through after the knight managed to roll a few 5++.

the nemesis strike force detachment only has 2 heavy support slots. So you could only have 2 dreadknights. Unless you allies with yourself and had 2 separate nemesis force detachments? Because only the nemesis strike force allows your troops to deepstrike turn one.

This is true, but can you ally a NSF and a CAD of Grey Knights together? I was under the impression you couldn't ally with the same faction as your main detachment.

 

 

You cannot ally with the same Faction as your Primary Detachment, but that restriction only affects the inclusion of Allied Detachments.  There is no such restriction to combining at Combined Arms Detachment with a Nemesis Strike Force Detachment; neither are allies, but simply different 'building blocks' for assembling a Battleforged army. 

 

V

[jeffersonian000]

You can run multiple NSF, because they are formations, and there are no restrictions on number of formations.

 

SJ

[IndigoJack]

The NSF is not a formation, it is a detachment. The "Grey Knights Brotherhood" is a formation. However, there is still no restriction on the number of detachments you can run. The only restrictions on detachments are specific to the allied detachment, which must be a different faction than your primary faction, and the allied detachment cannot contain your warlord (because it can't be the primary detachment).

[Captain Coolpants]

Well that's what I meant by allied with yourself. Because 2 detachments is practically the same thing... Yall just being picky. But that doesn't change the fact that he simply couldn't have deepstruck turn 1 with 3 dreads unless he was running a combined arms, to which we're still waiting for a reply.

[Purifying Tempest]

Well that's what I meant by allied with yourself. Because 2 detachments is practically the same thing... Yall just being picky. But that doesn't change the fact that he simply couldn't have deepstruck turn 1 with 3 dreads unless he was running a combined arms, to which we're still waiting for a reply.

Cannot have an allied detachment of grey knights when your primary detachment is also grey knights.

 

You can, however, run a nemesis strike force detachment and have a second nemesis strike force detachment.

 

There is no such restriction on them, only restriction is only on "allied detachments". The game stresses that they are not allies, just different detachments in an army.

[Gentlemanloser]

You can run a GK CAD, with an 'allied' GK NSF.

 

A NSF is an Allied Detachment in all but name (and restrictions!) really. ;)

 

FORGE THAT NARATIVE!

[Valerian]

Well that's what I meant by allied with yourself. Because 2 detachments is practically the same thing... Yall just being picky.

 

But, in this case, it is important to be picky, to ensure folks know how to play them correctly.  Four months into 7th Edition and there are still a ton of players out there that are confused by how all of this works.

[Gentlemanloser]

Especially about Unbound actually having a Detachment!

(And until recently I'd derped and not realised you could use Formations in Unbound as well! Edit: Which is another RAW headache if you try to include a Formation of the same faction as your Unbound Warlord...)

[ChaoticEric]

Well that's what I meant by allied with yourself. Because 2 detachments is practically the same thing... Yall just being picky. But that doesn't change the fact that he simply couldn't have deepstruck turn 1 with 3 dreads unless he was running a combined arms, to which we're still waiting for a reply.

Wasn't on the board for a few days, hence the late reply.

 

The way I read the rules on detachments there's no limit on the number of detachments you're allowed to use so I simply ran two NSF detachments. They had an HQ and a Troops choice each and then two knights in one and one knight in the other.

 

I'm happy to be corrected but I didn't see anything in the rules that prohibits running mutiples of the same detahment with the same faction in both.

 

Knights didn't deep strike, they started on the table and used teleporters to move/shunt up the table in turn one.

[Bionicman]

Is the PT really always mandatory or is there a case in which it could be switched out for a second ranged weapon? I am thinking of some kind of midfield thread with two ranged weapons like psycannon + incinerator or psilencer + incinerator, while having 1-2 NDKs shunting. Mostly I don't have the points left for a PT, CC weapon and two ranged weapons so I always value mobility over firepower and only take one instead.

[ChaoticEric]

Is the PT really always mandatory or is there a case in which it could be switched out for a second ranged weapon? I am thinking of some kind of midfield thread with two ranged weapons like psycannon + incinerator or psilencer + incinerator, while having 1-2 NDKs shunting. Mostly I don't have the points left for a PT, CC weapon and two ranged weapons so I always value mobility over firepower and only take one instead.

 

Of course you could but for me it's incredible value at just 20p now. It assures that my knights are always in the right place; in the thick of it. With just a 6" move you're running the risk that they end up on their own on the table, isolated and not enough around them to kill to make their points worth.

 

I've actually been reasoning the other way around; running them with just a sword. I always tend to aim them at the biggest mass of enemy points (still avoiding ap2 and big S) and charge in as soon as possible.

[Captain Coolpants]

Well, heavy psycannons are always the auto include because they have 2 profiles now, 1 is anti horde and the other is for smaller squads and vehicles, so any other gun you choose isn't really needed really.

 

And after having my first game today with the new dex, I was really missing the re-rolls of the greatsword

 

And I find them pretty useless without the teleporter, because it just doesn't have the firepower to just walk around shooting stuff like a riptide. Although we can now deepstrike them and run them turn 1 with isn't so bad I guess

[THE PORTCULLIS]

Any competitive list you make will have 2 NDK is over 1000pts. It is the be all end all best choice in the codex.

 

Hits hard, takes an effort to kill, has gun choices for every occasion, is very mobile, can take on any niche, excellent value points wise.

 

You go to make lists and try to leave them out by picking other stuff? NO, by doing that you are giving your opponent a chance everytime.

 

There is no list that cannot be made better by adding an NDK.

[Bionicman]

Well, heavy psycannons are always the auto include because they have 2 profiles now, 1 is anti horde and the other is for smaller squads and vehicles, so any other gun you choose isn't really needed really.

 

 

Don't overlook the heavy incinerator. 5'' means 3 units under the template against any skilled opponent. It also means scatter and cover saves. Flamer is torrent, is maximum number of models under the template per rule and without scatter and also ignores cover. I don't want any xenos **** laughing in my face as they claim an 4+ cover save while wearing paper armour. And S6 vs S7 makes no difference against T4.

 

Agreed psycannon is also against vehicles (and much needed). But dedicated anti horde is flamer. Always.

And torrent is so much better than not torrent.

[Gentlemanloser]

 

 

It is the be all end all best choice in the codex.

 

And the utter epitome of bad game design.

[Bionicman]

 

It is the be all end all best choice in the codex.

 

And the utter epitome of bad game design.

 

 

True. But GW made us do it.