How many Marines does it take to kill a Culexes?

[Gentlemanloser]

Assuming Bolters, and in Rapid Fire range.

 

Each bolter on average has the following chance to wound a Culexes;

 

(1/6) * (3/6) * (3/6) = 0.042

 

So it takes on average 24 Bolter shots to cause a wound.

 

With three wounds, we need 72 Bolter shots to kill the Assassin.

 

At Rapid Fire range, that's a whopping 36 Marines!

 

 

The poor old Imperial Guard require 54 Guardsmen shooting Rapid Fire Lasguns at him.

[Jacinda]

The poor old Imperial Guard require 54 Guardsmen shooting Rapid Fire Lasguns at him.

Given "First rank, fire; Second rank, fire" and the number drops to 36. This is easily doable with a blob.

 

Add in Prescience and the number of guardsmen with lasguns needed drops to 12.

 

[edit]

I had the wrong upgrade listed

 

[edit 2]

Well that last bit is never going to happen since anyone in rapid fire range with lasguns is also in Psychic Abomination range so Prescience will be canceled. So at best it is 27 IG grunts with orders and Preferred Enemy.

[librisrouge]

Then add in the fact that you can overwatch when it charges to get a free round of shooting.

 

The Culexus isn't that good if the enemy has no psykers to feed its gun so it'll have to use some melee if it wants to be useful. In that situation you're better off since you'll hit on 5s instead of 6s AND you'll have any melee upgrades you might have. Charging one with TH/SS terminators fixes that issue fast since they'll take .44 wounds and then will inflict 1.11 ID wounds back to it (I assumed that 4 TH/SS terminators hadn't charged it to get that last number BTW.)

 

Now Psykers hate that damnable thing and will weep if it gets close enough.

[Gentlemanloser]

 

 

The Culexus isn't that good if the enemy has no psykers to feed its gun so it'll have to use some melee if it wants to be useful.

 

If you have no Psykers of your own to feed it, you get free 1d6 shots for his gun.

 

Nothing to sneeze at.

[Captain Idaho]

Well 1D6 capped at 3.

 

But let's not look at him in a vacuum. Attack Guard with other units and then what will the opponent choose to shoot at, the Culexus or the other units? He can attack smaller support units instead.

[Kontakt]

Let's not forget how much cheaper guardsmen are than either the assasin or those marines!

[Gentlemanloser]

Aren't 36 guardsmen still more expensive than a culexes?

[Kilofix]

Um, just use an auto-hit Flamer / template on him?

[Captain Idaho]

Well not that powerful but enough saves will cause a problem it's viable.

[shandwen]

My question is how does an evenely-costed space marine captain do against him?  Perhaps like Khan without his bike?

[Gentlemanloser]

Flamer Template;

 

1 Hit, 0.5 Wound, 0.25 Unsaved Wound.

 

It would take 12 Flamers on average to roast a Culexes.

[Spaz431]

Though a flamer works as a possible answer, if the assassin player is smart enough, they place the assassin where the flamer is ineffective, i.e where it likely hit fellow guardsmen, negating the shot.

[spafe]

But still useful as an anti charge device...

[aura_enchanted]

It only take a single land raider crusader for dark angels :p or one contempor mortis.

 

The culexus also would suck against terminator cents

[Jacinda]

It only take a single land raider crusader for dark angels

Lucky rolls don't count. If the assassin stands in just the right spot, the crusader can cause 2.89 wounds in a turn, half of which would be saved. So it will take 2.08 LRC costing 519 points to kill the 140 assassin. 500 points worth of chaos cultist would actually do a better job

[edit to correct for rounding errors]

[spafe]

Have I missed something, surely a lrc gets 7 boltgun hits (4 from the 24 shots, then twinlinked gives it another 3 from the 20 misses), 3.5 wounds and 1.75 unsaved... then it has the assult cannon and multi melta on top... thats still not a dead freak, but its more than what you've come to, what have I got wrong :-s

[Jacinda]

First ... my mistake was confusing the variants. I thought it was the Flamestorm version.

 

Second ... 24 shots?

 

3 twin-linked bolt guns in rapid fire range = 6 shots per Hurrican bolter.

 

12 shots = 2 hits.

Twin-link = 10/6 or 1.67 hits.

3.67 hits go to 1.33 wounds.

half save for 0.67 unsaved wounds.

 

Tha Assault Cannon's rending shoud do 4/6 + (4-4/6)/6 = 4/6 + 20/6/6 = 24/36 + 20/36 = 44/36 = 11/9 hits.

0r 1.22 auto wounding hits.

half save for 0.61 unsaved wounds.

 

I was not aware they came with melta (just checked -- they don't, but could be added)

1 multi-melta - 0.17 hits, 0.4 wounds, 0.2 unsaved. Instant Death will on average cause 2 wounds loss so 0.4 wounds from the melta.

 

0.67 + 0.61 + 0.6 = 1.88 total wounds per turn.

 

 

=======

 

If you are talking about using the Standard of Devistation with it ... 1.88 + 0.67 (double the bolter damage) = 2.55 unsaved wounds at a cost of ... LRC + Standard + squad to carry it ... 545 points. Bolters from the command squad should push the total to > 3 unsaved wounds.

 

The guard with command squad to issue orders and a platoon will give enough guardsmen to kill the assassin (see math above) for 190 points.

 

============================

 

and just to say why it comes out so much cheaper ... when look at "what does it take to kill target X" all that matters is offensive power. The weakest models make the best choices because you are not worried about defense and you don't have to pay for AV 14 or cover saves or power armor in a strictly math based shooting attack.

[spafe]

Bah, my mistake, for some reason I was doubling up the boltguns again (so thinking there was 6 boltguns per side rather than 3)

 

and the melta was because (from very falible memory) they are 250 with the melta upgrade (which I assumed was how you had got to 2 of them equally 500).

 

Thanks for explaining, I knew I had to have something wrong :)

[Sapheria]

I for one use the Culexes extremely effectively, the fact that shooting hits on 6's and CC is 5's makes them a giant sink of attacks. Infiltrate them into cover behind or around your enemy and they either have to shoot at it, or shoot at the oncoming wave of soldiers you send walking up to greet them. Those D3 hits you can possibly take even without a psyker around are still S5 AP1, I have blown up rhinos with him before. 5's to glance 6's to pen and +2 on the pen roll. Not to mention that is a psychic phase attack, you can still charge elsewhere with him.

 

On average for me, the opponent will sink rougly 60 shots at him, and kill him by turn 3/4, but again I also run a Callidus nearby so another 40 or so shots are her, Again dying turn 3/4.

 

The best way to take him out imo is assaulting him asap. If he pops up near a transport get out and rapid fire at him to try to get some lucky shots in.

 

As per the math involved... I for one pray to the Dice gods every game; and they reward me with my opponent only getting 1-2 wounds per tactical squad rapid firing. And that is before saves.

[Captain Idaho]

I'm thinking that a squad of 10 Space Marines would work better charging him than shooting him (obviously shooting pistols on the way in). Their numbers should tie him up if nothing else and 20 attacks hitting on 5s is actually not too shabby at putting a couple wounds on him. Forget the math; taking 3-4 saves on a 4+ is hardly reliable. You won't roll a 1.5, you'll roll a definite number like 1-2.

 

Up close he's at his most dangerous yet at his most vulnerable.

[Sheesh Mode]

Why would you shoot at a Culuxes with bullets when you can simply torch him with flamers? 

 

For me, the solution is an angry Contemptor Dreadnought which is both immune to the culuxes attacks and fully capable of killing the assassin outright. 

[Marshal_Roujakis]

Apart from units that are Fearless or Marines with ATSKNF, Assaulting a Culexus (or getting Assaulted by a Culexus isn't really healthy...

 

His Wargear states that Any CC or Shooting Attack allocated to him is resolved at WS/BS 1 that involves Overwatch or other shenanigans. So good luck getting that lucky 6 to hit him. Flamers would obviously work, but the only way to really kill him is to ID him with a Large Blast Weapon... multiple times...

 

In melee, if he gets to kill 2 of your guardsmen, and you got 1 wound out of him, chances are your big blob squad would just disappear because of Sweeping Advance... I7 is also nothing to sneeze at... with all his extra buff to make him harder to kill and with his decent chance of killing things both in melee and range it's better to just either tie him up with something he can't kill, i.e. a Dreadnought or the simplest way is to use transports such as Rhinos and/or Drop Pods to bar his way and not let him get close to your army.