BA Today

[Xenith]

So got a bit of a strange list in my head, but I think it is quite a cool concept... It's all about buffing units into the stratosphere and charging as much of your opponents line as possible. Think of it as 3rd Edition Rhino Rush, but it hits on turn 2...

 

Basically you take the Flesh Tearers Vanguard Strike Force.

 

3 Tac squads. 1 Assault Squad. 1 Furioso. 1 Vanguard Squad. They all get Red Thirst (so +1 int) and while the Vanguard are alive they are all stubborn and ignore disordered charges. This is the key.

 

This is the core, then the rest of the army is as much buffing as you can possibly get. Corbulo and The Sanguinor are the main two, everyone in range of them will get +1 I/WS/A and FNP. Librarans roll sanguinary to fish for buffs. Chaplains give rerolls/ fearless. Other priests give the WS and FNP.

 

The trick is you slam forward turn one with over charged Rhinos and disembark (I think you can do this... Unsure though).

 

Shoot as much as you can but try to be in favourable positions to stop too much enemy shooting. Pod in the Furioso with some buddies to act as magnets.

 

When it comes to turn 2, you charge EVERYTHING. Leave no unit of your opponent's uncharged. With some luck all your buffs should start overlapping where possible and you shatter the enemy in a big charge. If not, the WS/ I 5 should keep you striking first and better in the later turns with the Sanguinor's attack Aura meaning you'll be getting more attacks out too.

 

Could work, could not... Thoughts?

 

As per above, you cannot disembark after a move over 6" (unless in the angels of death supplement)

 

Move and flat-out all the rhinos 24" turn 1 (dozer blades needed), shield the vanguard, move 6 and disembark t2, charge t3.

Edited June 2, 2016 by Xenith

[Charlo]

Hmm, probably a bit late by then perhaps.

 

Though you never know?

[Omega-soul]

So got a bit of a strange list in my head, but I think it is quite a cool concept... It's all about buffing units into the stratosphere and charging as much of your opponents line as possible. Think of it as 3rd Edition Rhino Rush, but it hits on turn 2...

 

Basically you take the Flesh Tearers Vanguard Strike Force.

 

3 Tac squads. 1 Assault Squad. 1 Furioso. 1 Vanguard Squad. They all get Red Thirst (so +1 int) and while the Vanguard are alive they are all stubborn and ignore disordered charges. This is the key.

 

This is the core, then the rest of the army is as much buffing as you can possibly get. Corbulo and The Sanguinor are the main two, everyone in range of them will get +1 I/WS/A and FNP. Librarans roll sanguinary to fish for buffs. Chaplains give rerolls/ fearless. Other priests give the WS and FNP.

 

The trick is you slam forward turn one with over charged Rhinos and disembark (I think you can do this... Unsure though).

 

Shoot as much as you can but try to be in favourable positions to stop too much enemy shooting. Pod in the Furioso with some buddies to act as magnets.

 

When it comes to turn 2, you charge EVERYTHING. Leave no unit of your opponent's uncharged. With some luck all your buffs should start overlapping where possible and you shatter the enemy in a big charge. If not, the WS/ I 5 should keep you striking first and better in the later turns with the Sanguinor's attack Aura meaning you'll be getting more attacks out too.

 

Could work, could not... Thoughts?

No offence but it's even contradicts itself.

 

you take Corbulo/Sanguinor - it's 2 slots. Next detachment - 2 sanguinary priest, Next detachment - librarian.

I don't even start to count the troops tax.

And you have a formation. 4 detachments.

Then you have Sanguinor - it's a 12 inch fearless bubble.

WS bonus for chalices don't stack. Making FNP for tacticals is total waste.

 

Then ok - you have all this packed with rhinos - you move forward turn 1-flatout. You losing 2-3 rhinos and tacs in them. Next turn - you move-disembark - basicly this point is the end because you shot to death or being charged.

 

And on top of this - you don't have any rerolls or Objective secure.

 

So why?

 

Why don't you like our Archangels strikeforce? All terminators without taxes geting stubborn, prefered enemy banner. Pretty much the same exept killier and tankier (although it's still lame as concept)

 

Problem with BA - is NOT to play it as designers wanted. They want us humble space marines in power armour - go and do some crazy :cuss that no other sane vanilla space marine would do.

Except that we don't even have a brand new uniqe and efficient way for fighting. Furious charge? I beg you. White scars have a "Blood-angelesque banner" that give Furious charge AND fleet with BUBBLE. And them boys have no mesley jump-packs oh-look-you-can-hammer-of-wrath-if-you-walk-with-your-T4-and-no-jink.

And still white scars leaving this towel at home. Because it's useless compare to other special rules and army composition.

 

Being Blood angels - is playing Space marine on a Nightmare mode. So be preared. Usualy it means use exeptional things that nobody provides - like heroes, fast vindicators or massed drop-assault

Edited June 2, 2016 by Jolemai
Swear filter dodge.

[Charlo]

Saying no offence always means offense so uhh yeah... Cool.

 

I was simply listing certain buffs you could combine. Fully aware you'd need a lot of tax for them. Though, if you wanted MSU scouts could fill this and also benefit from buffs/ lock other units down. Twas just an idea in a way to utilize a formation I've not seen anyone run on here before.

 

Perhaps instead of dismantling the idea, make suggestions on how to improve it? Or suggest a logical alternative? And no, I do not want to play White Scars :o

 

Plus you just contradicted yourself too, if I need all these detachments then i'll take a CAD and will have Obj Sec ;)

 

Also never said I didn't like the Arch-Angel's Strikeforce....Didn't even mention them?

[Jolemai]

Play nice and watch the language please.

[Dont-Be-Haten]

Pretty much!

 

I might give it a miss because I'm feeling a little crappy and I didn't get a decent list sorted.

 

Will probably go another day though I'm sure! One of the main problems is I like a lot of Pods, but they are hell to transport... Especially on the Tube... Even if it is only a few stops - but I'll be travelling at Rush Hour...

Nurgle strikes again! ;)

 

No worries. And about your idea, honestly, and this is just preference, and a bit of addiction/bias but instead of rhinos why not take a good look at our Razorbacks?

 

I love a good mix of rhinos and Razorbacks! And you could still do about the same type of rhino rush you are wanting to accomplish with sustained covering fire along your flanks, because mobile LOS blocking terrain is amaze.

[Charlo]

Aye!

 

Said Rhino because it was the first thing in my head.

 

Could work with pods and razors too!

[Omega-soul]

Saying no offence always means offense so uhh yeah... Cool.

 

I was simply listing certain buffs you could combine. Fully aware you'd need a lot of tax for them. Though, if you wanted MSU scouts could fill this and also benefit from buffs/ lock other units down. Twas just an idea in a way to utilize a formation I've not seen anyone run on here before.

 

Perhaps instead of dismantling the idea, make suggestions on how to improve it? Or suggest a logical alternative? And no, I do not want to play White Scars

 

Plus you just contradicted yourself too, if I need all these detachments then i'll take a CAD and will have Obj Sec

 

Also never said I didn't like the Arch-Angel's Strikeforce....Didn't even mention them?

No offence means that you don't take consecutive information too close.

 

And I was talking about absent Objective secure in your primary Flesh tearers formation as oppose to what you get in core vanila formations.

 

My general point was that this conception doesn't stack together at all because their bonuses are too weak and their price is too high.

And there is a reason why particular formations don't have much use at all.

Like blooded demi-company.

They just don't work.

Well actually Blooded demi-company have their use in Dante Avenging force when they get Objective secure.

 

But when he have a Baal-strike force and Flesh tearers strike force - many formations became redundant

 

My suggestion of that conception - you should decide what to choose - efficient spam-list, or strong buff usage. Due to limited range of bubble - 6 inch for units for corbulo and 6 inch for Models in case of Sanguinor - basicly this range if for 1 large squad or 2 small. So no spam in this case. Then you have to remember that Sanguinor is single model unit and thus pretty much vulnerable.

He costs just too much for what he does. He would be usefull if had independent character rule but now he is overmuscled version of Celestine.

 

Althougth you may consider this thing - wonderful trio - Sanguinor-Corbulo-Seth in one squad single Flesh terres detachment - Sanguinor gives 1 attack, 2+ , eternal warrior, majority 9ws and challange protection for flimsy corbulo-seth - they on the other hand - soak up minor wounds with 3+/4++ /fnp. On charge Corbulo will have 6 attack with rending, on 6th initiative with strengh 6 (beastly don't you think?) - seth potentialy (your warlord) can have up to 10 attack with 9 strengh on charge with rending and additional attacks on sixes.

So it's 16 attacks on charge with rending and 5 attacks from Sanguinor (if we extra lucky on 10+ assault range its + 2 more attacks)

It's quite decent.

But the main part - is that they are - the eye of the storm - they should be surrounded by wall of Death company with bolters (for extra-range control) or CCW for 6 attacks on charge with 5 initiative and 5 ws.

 

So when this storm goes into charge - central eye comes up from behind sledging all remaining bodies or cracking the hard shell

 

This is intresting and cohesive conception - not so powerfull, but intresting.

 

On the other hand - assault spam list - nothing too complicated - just spaming with assault squad 2 meltas and rhino - 105 points of awesomeness. 2 squads (out of 6) can be switched to plasmaguns.

The main reason behind this conception - that fast rhino "cost" 45 points assault squad - 80 - so we have 5 space marines for 7 points each (11 in case of melta).

It's super-efficient mobile fire force.

This is our "Company support" basicly (special rule that provides vanilla with free rhinos).

 

"Core" is quite efficient for 750 points (here it little exeeds but that's changeble)

 

 Flesh Tearers Strike Force (775pts)

 HQ (50pts) 

Techmarine (50pts) [servo-arm]

 

 Troops (65pts)

Scout Squad (65pts) [Camo Cloaks (10pts), Scout Sergeant (11pts), 4x Scouts (44pts)]

 

Fast Attack (660pts)

Assault Squad (105pts) [4x Assault Marines (68pts), Assault Sergeant (17pts), 2x Meltagun (20pts), Rhino]

Assault Squad (105pts) [4x Assault Marines (68pts), Assault Sergeant (17pts), 2x Meltagun (20pts), Rhino]

Assault Squad (105pts) [4x Assault Marines (68pts), Assault Sergeant (17pts), 2x Meltagun (20pts), Rhino]

Assault Squad (105pts) [4x Assault Marines (68pts), Assault Sergeant (17pts), 2x Meltagun (20pts), Rhino]

Assault Squad (120pts) [4x Assault Marines (68pts), 2x Plasma Pistol (30pts), Rhino]

····Assault Sergeant (22pts) [Melta Bombs (5pts)]

Assault Squad (120pts) [4x Assault Marines (68pts), 2x Plasma Pistol (30pts), Rhino]

····Assault Sergeant (22pts) [Melta Bombs (5pts)]

 

So it's simple - Techmarine bumps ruin for 3+ cover where he tanks our 2+ cover scouts with his 2+ armour - solid home scoring point.

 

Evrybody else - rushing for victory - 8 meltashots and 8 rapid-plasma shots are good for 750 points game

 

But we can go further - 1850 points game - just adding a CAD:

 

 

Combined Arms Detachment) (1075pts)

HQ (85pts) 

Librarian (85pts) [Force Weapon, Jump pack (15pts), Melta bombs (5pts)]

 

Elites (190pts) 

Command Squad (190pts) [Jump Packs (25pts)]

····Drop Pod (35pts) [storm Bolter]

····Veteran (10pts) [storm shield (10pts)]

····Veteran (10pts) [storm shield (10pts)]

····Veteran (10pts) [storm shield (10pts)]

 

Troops (250pts)

Tactical Squad (125pts) [Meltagun (10pts), 4x Tactical Marine (56pts)]

····Drop Pod (35pts) [storm Bolter]

····Tactical Sergeant (24pts) [Combi-Melta (10pts)]

Tactical Squad (125pts) [Meltagun (10pts), 4x Tactical Marine (56pts)]

····Drop Pod (35pts) [storm Bolter]

····Tactical Sergeant (24pts) [Combi-Melta (10pts)]

 

+ Fast Attack (330pts) +

Assault Squad (105pts) [4x Assault Marines (68pts), Assault Sergeant (17pts), 2x Meltagun (20pts), Rhino]

Assault Squad (105pts) [4x Assault Marines (68pts), Assault Sergeant (17pts), 2x Meltagun (20pts), Rhino]

Assault Squad (120pts) [4x Assault Marines (68pts), 2x Plasma Pistol (30pts), Rhino]

····Assault Sergeant (22pts) [Melta Bombs (5pts)]

 

+ Lord of War (220pts) +

Commander Dante, Chapter Master of the Blood Angels (220pts) [Warlord]

 

In addition to first part - this includes 1 mobile aggresive unit with Dante buffed by libby with quickening and supported by 3 storm-shilded meaterans and FNP

We also took 3 drop-pods - 2 for our obsec tacticals and 1 stabilising with our command squad.

So we can have a tool for emergency denying-scoring.

 

And additional 3 assault squad with melta-to-plasma ratio 2-1

 

Summarising it's - 9 assault squads (18 units) 1 scout-techmarine squad (2 units) 2 tactical squad (4 units) Command squad-Libby-Dante (4 with drop-pod)

28 units lists for 1850 means that average cost of unit is 66 points.

 

And frankly - it's not such an easy targets! rhinos still a vehicle with 3 hp - assaults are still 5 men in 3+ with ATSKNF - scouts are safe and command squad is killy.

There is no need for additional buff with sanguinor or corbulo nor they do need ignoring penalties for disordered charge.

Edited June 2, 2016 by Omega-soul

[Slothysaur]

While working on my etl vow (dante) I've come to the realisation I hate yet another aspect of fine cast. That and I should have kitbashed him. He's so much smaller than my captain model (vow 2?). All complaints aside, he's almost done to my tabletop standards and I finally got painting again!

[appiah4]

Look what came in the mail today, my kitbash Dante and Vanguard Veterans!

[Charlo]

Cheers for the insight Omega, lots of food for thought there.

 

As efficient as 16 mounted units packed with special weapons is, it's sadly not my idea of fun and I'll never have the models for that! But it is an interesting idea :)

 

Tech-Marine and scouts is a nice little bit of synergy I never noticed before, that is a nice heads up.

 

Corbulo and Seth is also a really cool combo now I think of it. Because of special rules they could somewhat reliably knee-cap an Imperial Knight on the charge... Especially with Librarian support. Both are rending with S9 and 6 respectively and will be easily hitting the knight first as well. Obviously if you fail you have the D to contend with... But a potential risk that may we worth it. Plus with them being on foot it's a cool set of dudes to put in my Caestus Ram :P

 

I mean, Seth on the charge, with quickening has a potential....

 

4 base + 2 rage + 3 quickening + 3 rampage + 12 whirlwind of gore... Obviously this is rolling all 6s to hit but EMPEROR, up to 24 S9 Rending attacks at ungodly initiative...

 

Seth is only 155points too...

 

I just wish he had Eternal Warrior. He should, really... All the other Chapter Masters do!

[Dont-Be-Haten]

In other news, grabbed the deathwatch librarian for a modest price. With a little bit of work I think he's going to make a fine counts-as Mephiston. Picked up the idea from the Mephiston Thread. Part of me wants to just buy Severeth Loth, and do a weapon switch and either shave the scorpion off or swap the shoulder pad, but I can't justify paying that much for only wanting 1 model. And Russkie knock offs while half the price, come with twice the headache so I've been told. 

[Charlo]

I know someone  who has gotten a couple of items from the Rusky Repuplic of Reduced-Price Resin and no problems at all.

 

Can't argue with ~40% stuff for what seems like no noticeable difference!

[Jolemai]

... and that's enough of that trail of thought please!

[Dont-Be-Haten]

I know someone who has gotten a couple of items from the Rusky Repuplic of Reduced-Price Resin and no problems at all.

 

Can't argue with ~40% stuff for what seems like no noticeable difference!

Reeeaaalllly? Mary and Joseph don't tempt me Charlo!

[CaptainHelion]

I just wish he had Eternal Warrior. He should, really... All the other Chapter Masters do!

 

Actually, not all of them. The Rebuilder Pedro Kantor lacks it, as does Tyberos the Red Wake, Shadowy Lias Issodon, the Lamenter's Own Malakim Phoros, The Traitor King Luft Huron, The Secret-Keeper Azrael, and High Marshal Helbrect.

[Charlo]

Well, it's more that he is a God Damn Lord of war. If he was HQ maybe but being LoW I think he needs it. Or a set of artificer...

[CaptainHelion]

I'd agree, to be honest. I was actually very surprised when I double checked on Azrael. He's at least not a CC beatstick character.

[Charlo]

Aye, Azrael is a weird one indeed. Though Sammael has it for the Codex and he also has an AP2 sword and jetbike too!

[CaptainHelion]

Sammael is just wicked cool. He is the coolest. He's got the cool sword, the cool car, the cool bike the cool colour scheme, the cool hair. He's practically The Fonz in power armour.

[Charlo]

Aye - looking into it there is literally no reason to run my Bikers as BA ones, when I can just take a bike chappy and two squads of Raven Wing bikers for essentially the same price as their mini detachment. Exchange Furious Charge for Skilled rider, Scout, Hit & Run and 3+ Re-roll Jink...... No Brainer really!

 

Will probably convert up some "Sanguinary Black Knights" at some point too, as I already have my Deathwing Equiv in the works.

[evildrcheese]

Alright, so my game against crons last night. Ended up as Relic with DoW deployment on a city board with lots of ruins and a big los blocking piece in the middle with a landing pad on top. The relic started on this landing pad.

 

I rolled the infiltrate trait, and the add 1 to seize/modify reserve rolls for my Warlord traits.

 

I rolled 5 & 6 for my psychic powers on fulmination, which is the move aunit 18" and the ol' switcharoo.

 

This gave me plenty of flexibility, to the point that some of it was wasted and I would've preferred one of the kill-y attacks combo'd with one of the movement-y powers over having 2 movement-y powers. However the primaris is cool!

 

So, I won the roll off and decided to deploy first (mistake?), deployed all my none infiltrators. I infiltrated a scout squad on the relic , and another on the ground floor below it. Termies and Meph also infiltrated centrally. DC and Chappy infiltrated on the right flank to go for his warlord.

 

Sternies dropped in and shot poison /combi plas at the overlord and lynch guard, hoping weight of fire would soften the unit up for the dc. Even without the 4+ reanimation only 1 lychguard dropped.

Also killed 1 warrior. With the termies. This becomes a theme, my dice cold, his dice hot! As a further example I put 9 wounds on his wraiths with my Baal Pred, only 1 went through.

 

In my T2 the DC got into combat and performed terribly even the rerolls from my chappy didn't help. I split meth off from the termies with the intention of sending him into a warrior squad, hoping he would sweep them relatively easily. I made a scout squad eat the overwatch, they took no casualties (yey!) but failed the charge (boo!). Meph killed maybe 4 crons, took 2 wounds in return and failed 1 (*facepalm). Meph then proceeded to take a single wound in each ensuing round of combat and failed each...

 

My DC were eventually chewed through by the L guard and overlord. A squad of 3 Wraiths destroyed a Baal from only the HoW attacks. I think that covers the high/low lights.

 

In the end, we drew as I was hiding with the relic and he got all 3 secondaries.

 

Final thoughts. Fulmination I cool, but not suited for meph though, he either needs to be buffing with divination powers or a CC monster with Sang powers.

 

Considering burying my dice and buying new ones too.

 

EDC

[Lucumon]

Necrons are rough for BA because they are highly survivable and can tarpit you in HtH... it's difficult where you have to rely on sweeping them in order to keep them down.

 

Usually my target priority is:

1. Canoptek Harvest - these guys advance quickly and tarpit you. I'm a fan of using flyers for this work (specifically Angel's Fury) as Skynet has issues against flyers

2. Transports: these guys are impressive gunboats AND revive dudes.  This usually isnt an issue for me as BA have our pretty awesome meltacide squads that make short work of these.

3. Overlord/characters: Wait, they allow re-rolls of 1s on RP?  golly gee?

 

Play the mission, stay fast.

[Slothysaur]

I have a set that always likes rolling 1s. They got demoted to wound counters

[Dont-Be-Haten]

I have a set that always likes rolling 1s. They got demoted to wound counters

The rule I go by. If you're rolling 1s paint the model, if the model is painted, buy new dice