BlOoD_GoD Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 Well the name kinda says it all, but are the GK a viable army choice with their 7th ed codex? I've always thoughts they were super cool and looked badass, and was going to do Dark Angels up until I noticed they had a new codex out so I thought I'd so some asking around first. Also how does the whole alliance detachment thing work? I've seen it thrown around but thats about the extent that I've heard of it. I've always remembered seeing GK paired with IG but I guess times have changed now and things have gotten broader Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 Depends what you mean by viable. If you mean 'can we take on the absurd power builds of Eldar, Necrons, Tau etc', the answer is a definite no. They actually love fighting us, as we pay dearly for our infantry, and we have the lowest model count of any army outside of Deathwing or Knight-Titans. We can and will get tabled by the current tourney lists. Don't even pretend you stand a chance against them, actually good army books (Marines, Space Wolves, IG etc) struggle and they at least have all the tools and lots of options. If you mean 'in a casual game, or against bad players/lists, or terrible armies like Sisters/DE', yeah we do alright. If people don't bring sufficient AP3/2, they'll struggle to gun down enough of our infantry before we hit melee, at which point the scales swing hard in our favour (very few armies can reasonably trade with us in melee). We also stomp Daemons flat, which is nice. Our codex is barely an army book, its more a glorified data-slate they stapled together at the 11th hour with some token relics and they forgot half our wargear and special rules/tricks. We couldn't be more an 'Allied' army if they printed it on the front in giant block capitals. Regarding Allies, I suggest you head over to the pinned thread. We're going through the different Ally options there. Marines have cool combos with us, as do Space Wolves. IG also help us a lot in the manpower and vehicle areas, where we traditionally struggle. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3825890 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 While this may sound a bit harsh, GK makes for an excellent ally. I have been using their excellent Librarian (with the Liber of Awesomeness) and a NDK as an ally to my TWC SW list. The pressure from even a single NDK is unreal when combined with an imminent TWC charge, especially when you consider that the enemy has to decide what he wants dead, NDK or the TWC. The Librarian and his TDA did a damn good job jumping around with Gate and casting Cleansing Flame to thin out the enemy.Thanks to that new addition I managed to take a pretty nasty Necron Tournament list (which did pretty damn well in the last tournament) and won the game reliably by turn 4, even though I made some mistakes due lack of practice with that setup and unfavourable terrain for me.So yeah, while they may not make the best solo force, GK can offer some pretty nasty things to another army. Consider this when building your force. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3826128 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted October 6, 2014 Share Posted October 6, 2014 While this may sound a bit harsh, GK makes for an excellent ally. I have been using their excellent Librarian (with the Liber of Awesomeness) and a NDK as an ally to my TWC SW list. The pressure from even a single NDK is unreal when combined with an imminent TWC charge, especially when you consider that the enemy has to decide what he wants dead, NDK or the TWC. The Librarian and his TDA did a damn good job jumping around with Gate and casting Cleansing Flame to thin out the enemy. Not an insult, more a factual observation. As I said, GW stopped short of making us digital-only, as their only concession to the players. In every other measurable way, we are an Allied data-slate. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3826575 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted October 6, 2014 Share Posted October 6, 2014 There's one way to run us without being 'allied gravy'. Skimp on *anything* that isn't an NDK. And smash faces with as many NDKs as you can squeeze into the points limit. Preferably Unbound, but if you're forced to play Battle-forged, that just means base Librarians and Strie Squads, with everythig else into Teleporting NDK. You want to be primary in this case in order to funnel as many points into your NDKs. Allying in anyone else is a waste, as it removes points you would aotherwise be able to put into NDK. Have I mentioned the Nemesis DreadKnight too much in this post? Edit: Dataslate: DreadKnights (with a DreadKnight only FoC a-la Imperial Knights) Calling it. Edi2: I'm going to be controversial and say GW have specifically *not* made us an Allied Dex. We no longer have the cheap cheap HQ/Troop to entice Allied us of our ZOMG OP unit. Unlike (for example only) Space Marines. Where to ally in a unit of Centurion, you can dip a cheap base Libby and a base Scout Squad. A base of ~120 points. For us, you need to invest in 220 points minimum to unlock an NDK. Less attractive for an Allied detachment. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3826577 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted October 6, 2014 Share Posted October 6, 2014 Yeah, but a Mastery 3 Libby in TDA with stave is very worthwhile. The Strikes are a tax, but at least they'll do something compared to Scouts who typically do nothing at all (even with sniper rifles, BS3 is just pathetic). You'll find uses for the stuff that unlocks DK's. And DK's are so amazing for Marines, they won't mind the cost. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3826643 Share on other sites More sharing options...
casb1965 Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 I see two ways i'll be playing my GKs 1. NSF - ML3 Libby, Terminators, NDK (or two or three if I get the figures) and Inquisition allies 2. NSF minimum allowed as allies to a larger Inquisition force either way they are viable. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3828495 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 Now drop the Inquisition. We could all say Grey Knights are a top tier 'viable' army. We're just running Eldar with allied GK for an NDK. ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3828524 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deamon Wolf Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 I Hate running anything but a single dex army so the way to look at it is if you can win with the grey knights ( which is possible ) then if you have any other army that you regularly play then winning whith them becomes a doddle ( my Space wolves and Black Templars havent lost a game yet in 7th ed ) I do agree that the grey knights dex may have been a little slap dash but " if / when " we get our supliment we may find that we have options we never thought of. personally I want to se a founding supliment with the 8 being depicted now that would be interesting Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3828558 Share on other sites More sharing options...
casb1965 Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 Now drop the Inquisition. We could all say Grey Knights are a top tier 'viable' army. We're just running Eldar with allied GK for an NDK. I had Inquisition before I had GK and I like my models :) The problem I have with GK is the lack of anything that can hurt AV12+ and my multiple Henchmen units are great at annoying Imperial Knights. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3828667 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adeptus Posted October 9, 2014 Share Posted October 9, 2014 While getting a supplement that adds useful choices to our army would be good, I hate to encourage this bull:cuss attitude from GW that it's acceptable to split a codex over two or three publications. Supplements are just material that should have been included in the codex in the first place. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3828966 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted October 9, 2014 Share Posted October 9, 2014 While getting a supplement that adds useful choices to our army would be good, I hate to encourage this bull:cuss attitude from GW that it's acceptable to split a codex over two or three publications. Supplements are just material that should have been included in the codex in the first place. Agreed. Having said that, GW rarely are influenced by the community's opinion, so if we want to play by their rules, at least give us something. A Dreadknight formation, better rules for Purgators...anything. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3829020 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Coolpants Posted October 9, 2014 Share Posted October 9, 2014 While getting a supplement that adds useful choices to our army would be good, I hate to encourage this bull:cuss attitude from GW that it's acceptable to split a codex over two or three publications. Supplements are just material that should have been included in the codex in the first place. I completely agree! It's bad enough that some of us need to purchase 3 publications already! Just to use the same units that we used in 6th. So even though a supplement will be welcomed, it would also :cuss: me right off that I'd now have to go and buy yet ANOTHER book... Because of these reasons, I've torrent downloaded the assassin/inquisition and the grey knights Codex. If only everyone did what I did, then GW would have NO choice but to make single books without splitting everything they can to rinse us of money. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3829106 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zembar Posted October 9, 2014 Share Posted October 9, 2014 Because of these reasons, I've torrent downloaded the assassin/inquisition and the grey knights Codex. If only everyone did what I did, then GW would have NO choice but to make single books without splitting everything they can to rinse us of money. I wouldn't say they have NO choice. They could roll us into the SM codex because nobody buys ours, for instance. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3829110 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adeptus Posted October 9, 2014 Share Posted October 9, 2014 If only everyone did what I did, then GW would have NO choice but to make single books without splitting everything they can to rinse us of money. GWs response to falling sales is almost always to simply increase prices. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3829155 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffersonian000 Posted October 9, 2014 Share Posted October 9, 2014 Remember when I posted that the then up-coming 7th Ed GK codex would be a suppliment to the SM codex, with all the non-GK stuff stripped out? And everyone said I was wrong, no way would GeeDub roll GKs into the SM 'Dex? Yeah. I remember that, too. However, I was pleasantly surprised that GeeDuh did in fact write the new GK codex to fully support my play style despite stripping out my favorite unit, namely Mordrak and his Ghostly Bodyguards. TDA heavy, Deep Strike abusing, low model count, 1st turn Blitz seems to be the way GeeDub wants the GKs to play, with allied (or bring allied to) SM units to shore up our many weaknesses. Personally, I'm liking a tight NDF with Libby, GKT, GKIS, NDKs, Draigo. and a Knight Errant. Its Stompy-Good fun at 1500pts. SJ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3829506 Share on other sites More sharing options...
incinerator950 Posted October 9, 2014 Share Posted October 9, 2014 I really need a Chaos bat an eye meme for the joker. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3829516 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted October 9, 2014 Share Posted October 9, 2014 Remember when I posted that the then up-coming 7th Ed GK codex would be a suppliment to the SM codex, with all the non-GK stuff stripped out? And everyone said I was wrong, no way would GeeDub roll GKs into the SM 'Dex? I've written up Chapter Tactics: Grey Knights a few times. ;) Wouldn't be too hard to roll us. And we'd be better off, getting more options and all. I'd welcome being rolled, over our current Codex. Honestly would. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3829564 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hidicul Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 Chapter tactics Grey Knights: every unit has the brotherhood of psykers USR, only suffer perils on a double 6 when using powers from the sanctit disapline and for x points can give one weapon force(more likely swap for a melee force weapon as force would be op on say grav-cannons) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3829764 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 I've written up Chapter Tactics: Grey Knights a few times. Wouldn't be too hard to roll us. And we'd be better off, getting more options and all. I'd welcome being rolled, over our current Codex. Honestly would. Don't give Jervis ideas. We've already had most of our codex taken away. I'll stop playing 40k entirely if that happens to us. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3829785 Share on other sites More sharing options...
treadhead Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 Just wait come christmas gw will release dataslates psybolt ammo, servo skulls and the working dreadnoughts supplement and all will be forgiven Seriously looking forward to 8th edition when we get a new dex and hopefully some love (sniff wipes away single tear over the death of his army) Side note was anyone else as hacked off with the rereleased "grey knights" landraider, ven dread and storm raven not having any new treats in them not even a new transfer sheet Back on topic We've been gutted basically, left on the high tide mark for the crows with our internals as externals. Losing some good characters hurt Free (slot wise) techmarines didn't hurt Losing psybolt, psyflame, servo skulls etc hurt Gaining salvo for psycannons hurt Losing our original psychic powers and the option to buy specific ones hurt Only elite dreads hurt (my list at least) Draigo becoming a low hurt and it's pointless comparing him to a baneblade Losing the inquisition hurt Losing assassins hurt. Getting them as a free slot (effetivley) lessened the pain. But then having to fork out for a secondary set of rules for 4 characters who have been in the codex since 3rd edition (iirc vindie and co came out in 2nd then got folded into our codex for 3rd) brought it flaring back up again As i've said elsewhere stuff em I'm using 5th edition rules for as long as i can get away with it (subtle scalpel work and some regluing later and i have a workable 7th edition gk codex) any one know where i can safely dispose of these hazardous leftovers? Will leave you with my favourite quote Nuke them from orbit it's the only way to be sure. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3829824 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quozzo Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 As i've said elsewhere stuff em I'm using 5th edition rules for as long as i can get away with it (subtle scalpel work and some regluing later and i have a workable 7th edition gk codex) any one know where i can safely dispose of these hazardous leftovers? Ditto. The best way to use our codex; throw it in the bin and use the previous one. It means I can't use the NSFD and cheaper NDK but it's a small price to pay for our special characters, PAGK, Dreadnoughts, psybolts... in fact just everything you said above Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3829875 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 Just wait come christmas gw will release dataslates psybolt ammo, servo skulls and the working dreadnoughts supplement and all will be forgiven I know you're kidding...but that still hurts. To realise just how much one update robbed us of workable units and upgrades. Seriously looking forward to 8th edition when we get a new dex and hopefully some love (sniff wipes away single tear over the death of his army) We'll probably be reduced down to Terminators, a Brother-Captain and Dreadknights. Side note was anyone else as hacked off with the rereleased "grey knights" landraider, ven dread and storm raven not having any new treats in them not even a new transfer sheet Marketing ;) GW have been playing that game since forever. By all means use the 5th edition codex guys. However, given our board is an international one and some of us do participate in competitive arenas, it's worthwhile to give advice on our actual codex. I love the old book as well but you can't take it to tourneys anymore. Anyway, I think the NSF does finally offer a means to deploy and fight in a manner that we're supposed to ie mass teleport into enemy lines ASAP. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3831426 Share on other sites More sharing options...
treadhead Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 Seriously looking forward to 8th edition when we get a new dex and hopefully some love (sniff wipes away single tear over the death of his army) We'll probably be reduced down to Terminators, a Brother-Captain and Dreadknights. Heck I started playing at the tail end of first so i remember when we were just terminators Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/297611-viable-army-choice/#findComment-3831523 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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