Memento Of Prospero Posted October 16, 2014 Share Posted October 16, 2014 Pretty sure we'll get Blood Talons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucien Eilam Posted October 16, 2014 Share Posted October 16, 2014 I dunno. That's like saying that anything given to standard Space Marines is automatically available to specialized Chapters published after the most recent SM dex. If that were the case, Space Wolves would have grav weaponry, as every one of their kits is fully compatible with basic Marine kits. No, it isn't like that at all. If you walk into a Games Workshop store and ask for a Tactical squad for your Blood Angels, they only have one box to sell you, and it has grav weapons in. Ditto Sternguard and Vanguard squads. Those three boxes are currently as much a part of the Blood Angel range as they are the Space Marine range. Given that those are the boxes you're expected to buy to build those unit entries, my bet is they'll let you use everything in it. They won't suggest you buy them for your Space Wolves at all, and they certainly won't suggest you buy Centurions. The situation isn't remotely comparable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remtek Posted October 16, 2014 Share Posted October 16, 2014 Nay to Grav here + they are really easy to ally in with both troop bikes and cent's. Marine codecies are already merging closer together. I'm no fluff expert but it seems like something that really fits with chapters like Imperial Fists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElectricPaladin Posted October 16, 2014 Share Posted October 16, 2014 Nay to Grav here + they are really easy to ally in with both troop bikes and cent's. Marine codecies are already merging closer together. I'm no fluff expert but it seems like something that really fits with chapters like Imperial Fists. Allying in awesome stuff to create a cool hybrid list is fine. Using the Alliance rules to patch holes in my army because it's missing something necessary is not. I don't mind if we get grav or not, but only because I don't think it's actually all that important. If it turns out that grav is actually key to winning games, well, then we damn well better either get grav or something like it! The Ally rules are no excuse for writing me a half-assed army. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red-beard Posted October 16, 2014 Share Posted October 16, 2014 I love my centurions and would definitely play the assault variant with my BA army given the option. That being said, the slow and purposeful nature of those units don't fit well with the BA style. I highly doubt they'll be in the new codex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inquisitor Eisenhorn Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 Blood Angels were my first army as a kid back in 2nd edition and to me they will always be generalists with a penchant for getting stuck in. I hope they get the grav, talons, and centurions. The more options the better. We can leave the things that don't suit us personally at home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
depthcharge12 Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 I don't like Grav....it seems like a crutch for bad players or needed to stay alive in the cheese that is the tournament scene. As for Stormtalon, I hope to the Emprah that we get it as it's more fitting for our fluff. Plus those vanilla cupcakes stolez our precious storm ravens.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
appiah4 Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 I actually want Centurions. Heavy weapon platforms that can fire while on the move sounds quite like BA to me. Fast Centurions maybe, even? Ok, ok, just kidding. Maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remtek Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 Nay to Grav here + they are really easy to ally in with both troop bikes and cent's. Marine codecies are already merging closer together. I'm no fluff expert but it seems like something that really fits with chapters like Imperial Fists. Allying in awesome stuff to create a cool hybrid list is fine. Using the Alliance rules to patch holes in my army because it's missing something necessary is not. I don't mind if we get grav or not, but only because I don't think it's actually all that important. If it turns out that grav is actually key to winning games, well, then we damn well better either get grav or something like it! The Ally rules are no excuse for writing me a half-assed army. Using allies is simply stronger and required for most codecies if you want to win vs an equally strong list, even Eldar. Imo that dosnt mean the codex is half-assed. Gravs are pretty unique, nothing can really compare in performance vs desired targets except non marines and assault units. Currenly the Space wolves are the strongest codex for Grav's and they dont even have them, i dont think that is a design flaw of the SW codex. They made the codex self-balanced giving a greater diversity of unit options. I don't think the prerequisite for if we get grav or not should ride on how strong our Codex is. I'd rather the codecies stay more unique, it makes for more interesting and diverse games. Grav's dont really feel like a BA option, perhaps someone with more knowledge of the fluff could clarify this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrahawk Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 I don't really care for Centurions in a BA army to be perfectly honest. Those clumsy buggers just don't fit the feel of the Chapter. However, I'd love to have Storm Talons, and I think there's a good chance of that happening. If the rumours are true, we'll know soon enough! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 I don't like Grav....it seems like a crutch for bad players or needed to stay alive in the cheese that is the tournament scene. As for Stormtalon, I hope to the Emprah that we get it as it's more fitting for our fluff. Plus those vanilla cupcakes stolez our precious storm ravens.... Oh come on Depth! That's so unfair. A weapon designed specifically for big monster, hard-infantry hunting and a viable option for dealing with these foes is a crutch? That's so misguided. By that logic plasma gun are a crutch, baals are a crutch, DC are a crutch....anything used to combat or "stay alive in the tourney scene" is crutch. Thats not a fair assessment at all. GK, Tau, Eldar, Nids, Daemons and Dark Eldar, (Crons even with Tran' Ctans) all get monsters that are really difficult to take down- grav makes perfect sense from a fluff perspective and a gaming one. rah-rah grav guns! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jolemai Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 And there we have it. You went to the Nationals with Grav bikers because you're a bad player ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
appiah4 Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 Being a BA player I'm not well versed in 'Grav' weapons, how are they superior to Plasma? Plasma is my bread and butter :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicodemus Doloroso Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 don't want stormtalons or centurions... if we wanted those we'd have already been playing counts as raven guard or black templars. Make our staple units powerful and worth taking. Sanguinary guard, blood talon dreads, jump pack DC, baal preds. I hope we'll never see the centurions in our codex(probably wish un-listing, but hey). BA have way too much style for that. I'd rather have the Land Speeder Storm as a dedicated transport for scouts, the Stormtalon and some beefed-up sanguinary guard. I want to field them again with pride and put fear in my enemies!! Other than that, our elite slot is already cramped up with lots of good units. Wouldn't mind to get access to grav weapons, as long as we won't see the centurions. :yuck: Snorri The above two posts sum up my thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knife&fork Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 Being a BA player I'm not well versed in 'Grav' weapons, how are they superior to Plasma? Plasma is my bread and butter They are AP2 salvo weapons and use the targets armor save to wound. I'm sure you can see how good that is against things like NDK and WK as we really struggle currently to get the kind of volume of fire to take these on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted October 17, 2014 Author Share Posted October 17, 2014 Being a BA player I'm not well versed in 'Grav' weapons, how are they superior to Plasma? Plasma is my bread and butter They are AP2 salvo weapons and use the targets armor save to wound. I'm sure you can see how good that is against things like NDK and WK as we really struggle currently to get the kind of volume of fire to take these on. My grav Centurions put down a Wraith Knight in a single turn of shooting. The same goes for Riptides and Dreadknights, Swarmlord, whole units of Marines, Necrons, Termies and so on... More shots at decent range, no gets hot, far superior against Riptides and Wraithknights. Only struggles with Deamons and basic Ork infantry... They also immobilise or downright destroy any vehicle they target - from Land speeder to Landraider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bartali Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 Nay to Grav here + they are really easy to ally in with both troop bikes and cent's. Marine codecies are already merging closer together. I'm no fluff expert but it seems like something that really fits with chapters like Imperial Fists. Allying in awesome stuff to create a cool hybrid list is fine. Using the Alliance rules to patch holes in my army because it's missing something necessary is not. I don't mind if we get grav or not, but only because I don't think it's actually all that important. If it turns out that grav is actually key to winning games, well, then we damn well better either get grav or something like it! The Ally rules are no excuse for writing me a half-assed army. GW certainly isn't thinking like that, and wants you to create forces with multiple detachments and allies. I'm not that bothered about Grav making it into the BA codex. It's only really good on relentless plaforms (ie bikes and Centurions). I'd probably still run Flamers/Melta on ASM and would ally in if I wanted Bikes or Centurions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
appiah4 Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 Thanks, Grav sounds like something I'd look forward to having for my Bike Squads; I'll be magnetizing the hands for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted October 17, 2014 Author Share Posted October 17, 2014 Thanks, Grav sounds like something I'd look forward to having for my Bike Squads; I'll be magnetizing the hands for sure.That's a great way to run it. Also it's good to run a command squad on bikes and a captain all tooled with Grav.The tl Bolters on bikes can take care of units the grav struggles with. Anyways, I think if BA get the Stormtalon they should have a unique missie option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knife&fork Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 My grav Centurions put down a Wraith Knight in a single turn of shooting. The same goes for Riptides and Dreadknights, Swarmlord, whole units of Marines, Necrons, Termies and so on... More shots at decent range, no gets hot, far superior against Riptides and Wraithknights. Only struggles with Deamons and basic Ork infantry... They also immobilise or downright destroy any vehicle they target - from Land speeder to Landraider. The funny thing about your description is how they seem like an utterly broken unit when in fact they aren't. Grav centurions is actually a very good example of how to make a great unit from a rules perspective. A broken unit is one that breaks the game, one that's just good or great at almost everything with no real downside. We have examples of this like the majority of the current Eldar codex or 5th ed GK. Even when those units are fairly priced they make the game boring because they usually ignore so many aspects of the game. It's just roll dice and die. Grav centurions on the other hand have things they are really good at; killing MCs and elite infantry (they are good vehicle killers too, but only as long as they haven't started taking casualties). But they also have some serious drawbacks like a lack of invul, huge footprint, limited deployment option, really poor at close combat and not very good vs non elite infantry. It's really only when you start to combo them with things like guaranteed/highly probable 'invisibility' that they approach 'broken' status, and that's the fault of the particular psychic power, not the unit itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 Thanks, Grav sounds like something I'd look forward to having for my Bike Squads; I'll be magnetizing the hands for sure. Also, Appiah, one of the awesome things too, is that the weapon is concussive! So, against greater daemons and princes and things its a really nice equaliser! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remtek Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 Wouldt mind them on bikes, but are Centurions really BA fitting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElectricPaladin Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 I think that assault centurions might be Blood Angels style. They're slower, sure, but there's nothing about the Blood Angels way of warfare that's against bringing heavily armored transports, like land raiders and spartan assault tanks, both of which could easily carry assault centurions into position. I've said it before and I've said it again - if I had the power to add anything new to the Blood Angels army, it would be something like assault centurions, but with enhanced speed (ie. jump packs or something like it) rather than slow speed, Deep Strike, and something that lets them do damage to units they fly over (like those Dark Eldar jetbikes) and/or flyers. I'm not saying we need them... but that would be awesome. And they should be kind of like assault centurions, but slimmer and spikier looking, with great big wicked claws. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight of the Raven Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 If I'm forced to live with more than one loyalist marine codex while chaos gets dinobots and sisters of battle remain in eternal limbo, I'd like each codex to actually be different enough from regular marines. One codex with grav and killer vending machines from hell whereas the other has inferno pistols, hand flamers and a honor guard that traded artificer armor for jump packs is fine to me. If you're dead set on distributors of devastation, have something like Flint13's ursarax instead of those awful centurions. Or at least give sisters of battle the predator baal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theredknight Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 Talons would be nice as a second option, I have 2 and it's a silly rule ba not having access. As for grav, the option to take as a terminator weapon or dread weapon maybe? I'd love volkite as first founding, but think that's pushing the boat out. Death company Termies maybe? We don't seem to have a wraith / necron guys/ obliterators/ centurion shooty/cc box set. I know they usually take them out of the armour, but hey ho, a guy can dream. I can't help this horrible feeling that we will get lumbered with a 'big thing' god I hope not...unless it's a mastodon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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