How Competitive Are We?

[Guest Drunk Guardian]

You are mixing up different forms of viability. We can hold our own, we are much better than any GK. We can stand alongside of Codex: SM. But Tau and Eldar will be beyond any codex in 7ed due to GWs policy of cracking down in codex creep.

So we ally to compete with top tables. Top tables is not something every player plays. For your regular FLGS league or smaller tournaments, SW are fine even without allies.

Let me make this clear, no Imperial codex can compete on the top tables without allies as long as eldar and tau keep their codecies.

I believe you are dead on here. I play Wolves exclusively however 95% of my games are against Tau / Eldar / White Scars in some combination of the three if not all three plus the fortifications book and for the most part I get beat badly regularly, usually if I'm in a game it's due to heroic dice rolling.

 

I have an extremely difficult time with their greater maneuverability, superior fire power, superior range, and superior toughness due to cover saves and LOS shenanigans. It's at the point where I struggle to make lists now because I see the inefficiencies in everything I run. I know I'm handicapping myself by not using allies however I simply can't afford another army... The hobby is too expensive for me to begin with.

 

Tl;dr use allies if you can.

[Lord Blackwood]

 I actually am just getting settled out here a bit of a ways out of Seattle there's a store called Games and Gizmos pretty close , apparently I will be the only space wolf player there, pretty  excited since they say they have a tourney every month or so.

I plan to play my 14th Company wolves and make use of  knights since I have one of my own and my roommate is starting an all imperial knight army and shes pretty excited to break into the game.  I am seriously considering starting to work into some vanilla bikers to add as allies and some centurions you know open up the vanilla codex to me a bit. 

Tho the heart of my army is and will always be a ton of thunder wolf cavalry O w O   
14th Great Company just knows how to make friends or something I dunno XD 
 

[Vykryl]

I didn't know we had a 14th company

[Donkalleone]

I didn't know we had a 14th company

Apperantly its a big Secret and Fight CLub like, u know , cause they are special.

[Vykryl]

 

 

I didn't know we had a 14th company

Apperantly its a big Secret and Fight CLub like, u know , cause they are special.

I know there is a 13th we don't talk about, never heard of a 14th

[Frater Cornelius]

Home made fluff.

[Lord Blackwood]

 

I didn't know we had a 14th company

Apperantly its a big Secret and Fight CLub like, u know , cause they are special.

 

This is fun D:  Maybe I should post all my fluff stuff about my Great Company.  Maybe next week when I have a real desk to sit at.

[Vykryl]

 

 

 

 

I didn't know we had a 14th company

Apperantly its a big Secret and Fight CLub like, u know , cause they are special.

This is fun D: Maybe I should post all my fluff stuff about my Great Company. Maybe next week when I have a real desk to sit at.

I am curious. The 14th isn't even marked in the Grand Annulus. Is the 14th tasked with keeping tabs on the Inquisition?

[Bloody Legionnaire]

I never used mass amounts of troops, so I can't really speak to whether or not that's still a requirement.  

 

And as to whether obsec or cunning of the wolf is a better detachment bonus, it depends entirely on your army and how you plan to play it.  For me and my list, I felt that the benefit of being able to outflank a flier on a 4+, and knowing that at least 1 of those fliers would always be able to come on turn 2 vastly outweighed the benefits of obsec, and just barely outweighed the benefits of WS5 on my thunderwolves.  These were hard decisions and you will need to make them for yourself.  I'm not giving anyone a "net-list" here.  I'm sharing with this community because they all seem like good guys who make their own lists and play the way that they like to play.  I wouldn't normally share my list at all, as I feel like it's a deeply personal thing and everyone should make their own, but I wanted people to know that I think Space Wolves are still a tough army.

I really appreciated this post, I think this codex has really opened up the field for allowing commanders and generals to play their army exactly how they want to play it.. and in that way it is very balanced and personal. Part of my struggle I guess is being new to and starting at transitionary period.. the end of 6th ed. with the old Space Wolves codex. As I play and mature more in the game I guess I'll find my "own identity" so to speak... and will shy away from other players lists and strategy. In regards to the new dex being more balanced and personal, I definitely feel like we're more competitive with this codex even more so than the last one. It seems there are more builds that can be used competitively in this codex than in the last, and the same baseline formula does not need to be followed in order to have success. I know there are some players that were disappointed but I am incredibly positive about what GW has offered us. 

[ContemptuousAngel]

You do not need to ally that one. SW have access to one. Just take both to be sure :D

I'm quite confused by this. How exactly do we have access to this?

[FenrisWolf]

I believe he is talking about the Sicaran battle tank. If so then that is in the Forge world book Imperial Armour 2, 2nd edition; and one may be taken by the space Wolf army, no allies needed. Then he says to ally in the Centurians as well.

[ContemptuousAngel]

Ok... That's crazy. If it werent for :cuss like Knights and wraithknights, i'd call that game breaking.

 

Sorry I'm tired and on a phone.

[FenrisWolf]

Yes, the Sicaran may be a bit overpowered, but any SM army can take 1. You can take 2 with an appropriate HQ choice (which is currently unavailable due to the codex change). Has anyone received official word from ForgeWorld on this?  Either by email or phone or in person?

[Jochteas]

I mentioned it in the FAQ at the top of the page outside of that I haven't heard

[Sohail187]

So following on from my previous post. Managed to get a 2nd position finish unfortunately could not retain the title. Played some insane lists and managed to pull enough VP to secure the wins!

 

My first game i was very worried and did not expect to win 17-0 on victory points. My opponent won the roll to deploy and go first but he gave it to me!! :-/ ??? That was my thought at the time. After speaking to him at the end of the game he didn't think my centurions could do what they did. The C'tan has 6 wounds 3+ and 4++ and a 5+ FNP so he felt 15 grav shots would not kill it.

 

Neconrs:

 

3 Anhillation Barges
2 Ghost arka
C'Tan  // Upgrades: Flamestorm D shot // The 6 D6 Str 8 Shots and the 18 inch move.

Death marks
Night Sytch 
Few warriors squads.

Champions of fenris

 

Wolf lord / Fellteeths Claws / Morkais Claws / TWC / Runic Arm
Rune Priest lvl2 / Bike
Damochles Command Rhino

x5 WG Bikers 
x5 WG Bikers 
x5 GH Rhino
x5 GH Pod
x3 TWC + 2 Stormshields + PowerMaul
X3 TWC + 2 Stormshields + PowerMaul
X1 Drop pod - Legacy of Glory Dropsite massacare
Allies:
Chief librarian Tiggi

x5 Scouts + Snipers
x3 Centurions + Grav amps + omniscope.

Inquisition:
Corteaz

As he gave me turn 1 my centurions landed on an objective on his side of the table and in range of the c'tan. This gave me the annoying vehicle claiming items on his side of the table and if he ignored it a 100% line breaker. My Centurions caused 14 wounds on the c'tan and managed to make him go BOOM! Killed all my centurions tiggi 1 Barg 1 Ghost Ark just LOL.

following from this he really did not have much to stop my Lord and twc causing havoc. WG bikers running the table blitzing through for objectives! first blod line breaker slay the warlord all mine.

Game2:

 

This guy i knew was a really good player and his list was making me shiver in side. 5 Wave serphants 3 WK with wraith cannons  and 5 squads of dire avengers and a farseer. As he knew i was drop podding the centurions he bubbled his  wraithknights for cover save + night fighting. However he forgot i had prescience and perfect timing and forewarning on my centurions. Centurions did an amazing job killing 2 knights by turn 2. When he started his turn 2... o boy... boy o boy... He dis embarked all 5 serphants and lined up 4 serphants and 4 squads of dire avengers shooting my HQ TWC blob.... due to bad positioning i got totally out done. However I had marines and bikes close by and he was left out of position. I was able to get his rear armor for bolt gun shots and krak grenades and charges. Due to this by turn 3/4 4 serphants all dead to boltgun fire and kraks in combat. Turn 3... I had 1 TWC left stormshield and power maul. The power maul kept the last Wraithknight concussed causing 1 wound or 2 wounds every combat so i was attacking first! and i was hitting on 3's him on 4's! Funny thing is after passing arm saves from the WK for 2 turns (which would have Intant killed me)he finally charged me with 3 dire avengers, got 3 hits.... and rolled 2 6's for wounds... and i snake eyes! opse. 

The bikers again won that game for me cannot remember the exact score something like 13-7. This game was sooo close and tense back and forth a great game wish i had more like this.

3rd game... This was another joke army u had to be kidding me... I looked at my army and i looked at his... and i thought damm...... i've lost this.

 

Commander
4-5 drones with marker lights
Skyray
x2 FW skimmers with marker lights and the locator beacon thing.
x2 FW riptides the new one and the old one.
X2 Normal riptides
Epherial 
x2 Normal troops squads
x3 Plasma suit squad
x2 Melta suit squad

He deployed 3 of the riptides on the table and the new FW one in reserves all suits in reserves. WHat he tried to do was split my army up which would allow him free shooting if i split my army up. He did this by placing one half of the army to the left and one to the right.  Being so scared of 2 riptides with EWO i ignored them and went for the Skyray which was on the other side of the table. As my pod did not scatter i made sure i deployed in a way that he could not EWO my centurions with the Ion cannon as it would hit his own tank!. Skyray was dead but this left my centurions on the other side of the table not being able to reach the riptides.... The game was downhill from there and i just ignored the riptides and tried my best to get into combat with what i had left. He had some really bad maelstorm cards, and my bikes YET AGAIN and rhino moving round the table claiming everything. I managed to dish out some but it was a shooting fest for the tau!. BUt as he left the entire middle and right side of the table to me (Where all the objectives where) i starting racking the points up. 11-2.

 

How competitive are we? I would say we are up there if a all round list can be balanced and played correctly.

 

 

[mcpolle]

Thats a fine bat rep, and well done that man, good to see Wolves up there against some hard armies.

 

Polle

[Hear da Lamentation]

and good to see the Bikes rocking too :)

[Sohail187]

Those WG Bikers were awsome for clearing basic troops off the objective. Mass twin linked bolt gun shots, and 20 attacks on the charge if its a full squad! + 5 hammer of wraths!. When my bikers got close to most units holding maelstorm objectives in my mind i just could not help but think *excuse me, please get off my objective*. 125 points for 5 ws5 bikers with 4 attacks on the charge YES PLEASE!

[Rift Blade]

Well done Sohail. I've been toying with trying WG Bikers. Guess I 'm just gonna have to try it.

[Frater Cornelius]

As close as you can get to the excellent Eldar Jetbikes. My only criticism for WG bikes is that they can not take special weapons, just combi. Otherwise I'd be all over it. Alas Swiftclaws share slots with TWC and drop pods :/

[Sohail187]

Only reason for taking the wg bikers was because i had to if i wanted to benefit from the WS5 to wg bikers and TWC. However i feel that WS5 paid for its self through out all my games.

[Guest Drunk Guardian]

As close as you can get to the excellent Eldar Jetbikes. My only criticism for WG bikes is that they can not take special weapons, just combi. Otherwise I'd be all over it. Alas Swiftclaws share slots with TWC and drop pods :/

I don't think the special weapons thing hurts the bikers all that much. They want to be in assault, and jink supports that. You can take two melta bombs for the cost of one melta gun, and get the same result, just in their own happy mobile way.

[Sohail187]

 

As close as you can get to the excellent Eldar Jetbikes. My only criticism for WG bikes is that they can not take special weapons, just combi. Otherwise I'd be all over it. Alas Swiftclaws share slots with TWC and drop pods :/

I don't think the special weapons thing hurts the bikers all that much. They want to be in assault, and jink supports that. You can take two melta bombs for the cost of one melta gun, and get the same result, just in their own happy mobile way.

 

Yes sir and they serve that purpose perfectly.  The biggest upgrade you want to give this unit for them to work effectively is a melta bomb or 2. Lets be honest you are fielding 2 units of twc and something else the last concern your enemy is going to have is to shoot bikers with no upgrades. However those bikers are pesky as hell! scoring from one side of the table to the other. Great at killing regular units and even tanks. Cannot explain how happy i am with this unit honestly the best 130 points i can spend.

[Evilmerlin]

What psychic powers did you pick for Tiggy and the Centurions?

[Frater Cornelius]

Always divination. You are looking for Ignore Cover and 4++. If you play against the likes of Necron, try to get Precognition as well to re-roll saves with Tiggy. What you do with the last power once you get those two is up to you though. You do not really need Prescience because Warp Charges will be used elsewhere.