Inquisitor_Lensoven Posted November 3, 2014 Share Posted November 3, 2014 I know this is not the first time this topic has been done, but the navy has kept me away from the hobby for several years now, so lets see how some of the forum's new members feel about the image of our noble chapter. personally i like the darker more vampiric theme that was portrayed in 2nd ed and 3rd ed more than the image that has taken shape lately with the sanguinor and sanguinary guard. (love the SG models don't get me wrong) i preferred the dark image with the glimmer of hope for redemption, rather than the current bright sunshiney hopeful image with a light sprinkling of grim dark around the edges. so what about you guys? more dark vampire, or stay with the hopeful angel theme? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Dallo Posted November 3, 2014 Share Posted November 3, 2014 Personally, I like the angelic hopeful theme for the Blood Angels, and the darker Vampiric feel for some of their Successors. Dallo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaezus Posted November 3, 2014 Share Posted November 3, 2014 Things are probably grimdark enough, what with the ever-present black rage, astorath and the fact the whole galaxy seems to have ground to a halt while every tyranid, ork, servant of chaos and his dog queues up to invade Baal. I really don't like how they've overdone the renaissance theme; the roll of company commanders reads like the cast from a bad gangster movie! I want the BA to be bold, blingy and noble in the face of destiny, with a hint of Sanguinius's gift. Not too much to ask. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inquisitor_Lensoven Posted November 3, 2014 Author Share Posted November 3, 2014 Things are probably grimdark enough, what with the ever-present black rage, astorath and the fact the whole galaxy seems to have ground to a halt while every tyranid, ork, servant of chaos and his dog queues up to invade Baal. I really don't like how they've overdone the renaissance theme; the roll of company commanders reads like the cast from a bad gangster movie! I want the BA to be bold, blingy and noble in the face of destiny, with a hint of Sanguinius's gift. Not too much to ask. you can still have blingy vampires :P after all a lot of vampire stories (not myths, or folklore, but stories) protray vampires as aristicrats or holding similar status. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverson Posted November 3, 2014 Share Posted November 3, 2014 I actually see them as 2 sides of the same coin. On the 1 hand we have Dante, the sanguinor, sanguinary guard and the sanguinary priest as the light side that is what we all aspire to be. On the other side death company, death company dread, astorath, Mephiston, lemartes, reclusiarchs and chaplains as the darker side to us all that we try (to different degrees of success) to keep subdued. And the shining example of it all combined in captain tycho who was the next in line to succeed Dante (if I remember correctly) but then fel and then sucome to the fait that awaits us all. Death! I read/heard/saw it on tv something once that I think awaits all blood angels at some point in there lives. Heroes either die young (not so young in blood angels case) and there memory is kept as a guiding light to what you should aim to be or they live long enough to fall and should be a reminder of what can happen if the darkness ever takes hold. Wow this is a bit more grim dark than I intended so ill lighten it up by just adding tho I do like the fluff and the 40k entirity is very engaging it is at the end of the day a game for us to enjoy and should not be taken to seriously :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inquisitor_Lensoven Posted November 3, 2014 Author Share Posted November 3, 2014 you say tycho was the shining example, this might just be miscommunication between us, but in 3rd tycho and dante were the goal that all BA strove for, but mephiston was the 'shining example' that you could overcome the black rage, and not only could it be overcome but you could come out stronger in the end. just a minor difference, but a profound one in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperors Immortals Posted November 3, 2014 Share Posted November 3, 2014 I read an interesting paper on the rebirth of the vampire mythos. That grim, older, brooding hyper sexual murderers who can manipulate others motivations to achieve there aims have been remade into sexless prepubescentnon-threatening tragic beingswhoengageinneverlethal combat. Classicaly masculine characters using classically feminine powers to achieve there aim. Quite a lot like madmen,etc. Of which I am no fan. But I love Faust. I hope BA stay fast on the ground, the best in the air and a display of humanities best qualities when confronted with the inevitable realisation all this will fail if we darestop trying g for even a minute. And feral CC masters. TlDr; MOAR BLOOD, MOAR BLING, FASTER AND FASTER AND FASTER AND FASTER. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firepower Posted November 3, 2014 Share Posted November 3, 2014 I still like how they were portrayed back in the Angels of Death codex. While they have something very sinister and dark just waiting to get out, it made them humble (by Space Marine standards) rather than brooding. Balancing on the knife's edge between noble and bestial is a lot more interesting than diving fully into one or the other. The actual 'vampire' symbolism was actually pretty watered down. I remember reading somewhere that the Blood Angels really were meant to simply be Space Vampires at one point early in their creation (like RT days) before the authors dialed it back. Going too far in that direction feels hokey (especially with the modern version of vampire characteristics), and turns the symbolism of the Chapter into a much lazier irony of devils wrapped in angelic visages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverson Posted November 3, 2014 Share Posted November 3, 2014 you say tycho was the shining example, this might just be miscommunication between us, but in 3rd tycho and dante were the goal that all BA strove for, but mephiston was the 'shining example' that you could overcome the black rage, and not only could it be overcome but you could come out stronger in the end. just a minor difference, but a profound one in my opinion. I understand what your saying and agree with how coming back from the black rage gives all blood angels hope. I guess my choice of words was poor as it is fully what Ment that Dante and tycho were what blood angels aspire to be. Thanks for correcting me :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheHarrower Posted November 3, 2014 Share Posted November 3, 2014 Personally, I like the angelic hopeful theme for the Blood Angels, and the darker Vampiric feel for some of their Successors. Pretty much this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knife&fork Posted November 3, 2014 Share Posted November 3, 2014 as long as they sparkle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElectricPaladin Posted November 3, 2014 Share Posted November 3, 2014 I feel like you could read the Why Play Blood Angels thread and get a very clear idea of what we all want out of the next edition of Blood Angels. Visually, I think we are all interested in Blood Angels as the most ornate Space Marines, with angelic imagery and a slight renaissance flair. Backstory-wise, I like the idea of Blood Angels being the most tragic and heroic marines. While the Space Wolves are concerned with personal glory, the Dark Angels with hiding their secrets, and the Ultramarines (and many of their successors) with building pocket empires, the Blood Angels throw themselves into the thickest fighting, the most desperate battles, all the while struggling against their own corrupted flesh. Theirs should be a legacy of bravery and tragedy, of glorious deeds done for the sake of Mankind and defeating its enemies, rather than out of any hope of fame or redemption. What do I not want to see? I don't want to see the grimdark turned up too high. I like the idea of individual Blood Angels successors, like the Flesh Tearers or the Blood Drinkers, devolving into monsters, but I don't want to see "blah! I vant to suck your blud!" turned into the default state of the Blood Angels or all their successors. I like the idea of the Blood Angels fighting against their terrible urges, not eagerly becoming horrors. The Blood Angels aren't space vampires, they're Space Marines who really, really, really don't want to be space vampires. That's an important, but subtle, difference. I want to see the Blood Angels speed and assault capabilities remain strong, but I want them to retain the traits that make them Space Marines. I want to see Mephiston get a new model. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marine7312000 Posted November 4, 2014 Share Posted November 4, 2014 What do I not want to see? I don't want to see the grimdark turned up too high. I like the idea of individual Blood Angels successors, like the Flesh Tearers or the Blood Drinkers, devolving into monsters, but I don't want to see "blah! I vant to suck your blud!" turned into the default state of the Blood Angels or all their successors. I like the idea of the Blood Angels fighting against their terrible urges, not eagerly becoming horrors. The Blood Angels aren't space vampires, they're Space Marines who really, really, really don't want to be space vampires. That's an important, but subtle, difference. I want to see Mephiston get a new model. These two things are what I want. I've always liked that the BA spent their entire lives resisting their urges and fighting to remain true to their Primarch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElectricPaladin Posted November 4, 2014 Share Posted November 4, 2014 What do I not want to see? I don't want to see the grimdark turned up too high. I like the idea of individual Blood Angels successors, like the Flesh Tearers or the Blood Drinkers, devolving into monsters, but I don't want to see "blah! I vant to suck your blud!" turned into the default state of the Blood Angels or all their successors. I like the idea of the Blood Angels fighting against their terrible urges, not eagerly becoming horrors. The Blood Angels aren't space vampires, they're Space Marines who really, really, really don't want to be space vampires. That's an important, but subtle, difference. I want to see Mephiston get a new model. These two things are what I want. I've always liked that the BA spent their entire lives resisting their urges and fighting to remain true to their Primarch. I think we actually agree. I want the dark urges to be a part of every Blood Angel... but I want resisting the urge to be what the Blood Angels do, not some grimdarky "we eat humans to protect humans" nonsense. Except for the successors. The Blood Drinkers rock that attitude, and it's great for them, but not the nobility I want to see as the "default" for the Sons of Sanguinius. Er... unless you were agreeing with me all along. I can't tell - I find your wording a bit ambiguous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marine7312000 Posted November 4, 2014 Share Posted November 4, 2014 I agree with you ElectricPaladin. The BAs are noble because they resist, the Blood Drinkers are more blood-thirsty because they give in to the flaw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenith Posted November 4, 2014 Share Posted November 4, 2014 I read/heard/saw it on tv something once that I think awaits all blood angels at some point in there lives. Heroes either die young (not so young in blood angels case) and there memory is kept as a guiding light to what you should aim to be or they live long enough to fall and should be a reminder of what can happen if the darkness ever takes hold. You mean you watched the Dark Knight: http://youtu.be/zDz8CW6utWY?t=1m10s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jolemai Posted November 4, 2014 Share Posted November 4, 2014 Unfussed. Even if Mephiston ends up in a goblet shaped chariot pulled by rainbow bats and Dante retires, only to be succeeded by Edward Cullen, I'm still going to play them the same as I always have. If I were to have one wish though, it would be to have something that would stop my fellow brethren wishing for a chapter tactic that allows us to double tap our jump packs. I mean seriously. How anyone can think that represents the rage we struggle to suppress each day is beyond me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverson Posted November 4, 2014 Share Posted November 4, 2014 I read/heard/saw it on tv something once that I think awaits all blood angels at some point in there lives. Heroes either die young (not so young in blood angels case) and there memory is kept as a guiding light to what you should aim to be or they live long enough to fall and should be a reminder of what can happen if the darkness ever takes hold.You mean you watched the Dark Knight: Lol oh yea, I think I'll have to watch the films again :) thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Red Thirst Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Blood is Love, Blood is Life... I agree with Firepower, the Blood Angels should embody both. Balancing on the knife's edge between noble and bestial is a lot more interesting than diving fully into one or the other. Leave the bestial to the Flesh Tearers and the Nobility to the Lamenters Lets break out the chainswords, we're going to town. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inquisitor_Lensoven Posted November 6, 2014 Author Share Posted November 6, 2014 seen a lot of posts here that i agree with. i do not want to see the BA become a chapter full of nosferatus and draculas, but the rage and thirst have seems extremely down played in this last codex. and i think EVERYONE wants to see a rescuplt of mephiston....though at times i shudder to think what they might do to ruin him. partially i think james swallow also helped to destroy the BA i remember from when i started...if we could just forget him and write some new stories that highlight the thirst and our brothers' efforts to resist i think that would be great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knife&fork Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 james swallow Who? Never heard of him. Just like I've never heard of a 4th Alien movie :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jolemai Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 Well, it was better than the third (not saying much, I know)... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElectricPaladin Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 I liked the James Swallow books. They weren't find literature, and the first Omnibus was better, but I don't think he got anything wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marine7312000 Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 There are a few books that I consistently re-read. Fear to Tread is one and Betrayer is another. Fear to Tread is the only Swallow book that I can stand to re-read without cringing at what he's done to my beloved Angels. I have his entire BA series somewhere but I'd be hard pressed to find it quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChapelXIII Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 I want the Blood Angels to be representation the struggle against the evil in oneself in 40k. They represent both the best and the worst of the humanity. The angelic visage that Dante and the Sanguinary exemplify next to the dark bestial power of the Death Company and Mephiston represent. The rest of the chapter a constant pull between the two of these deep natures. The Blood Angels represent the constant struggle in everyone between light and dark, good and evil. They are flawed and as such make it so they should be more prone to falling victim the temptations of Chaos, and yet because of their will are able to walk the knife edge between salvation and damnation. They are the most human because of this, and a chapter that can be looked up to because of it. I personally would like to see the Blood Angels pushed against the wall by the overwhelming forces they are supposed to face in the Darkest Hour. Only against crucible can true greatness be forged. (Be warned: a bit of heresy to follow) I think having Baal being destroyed and the Blood Angels and their various successors having to flee taking with them remainsd of Sanguinius and having to become a fleet based chapter instead would be a very interesting turn for the Blood Angels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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