angel2burst Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 OK this is a question i have been think about for a while and i want to hear what you guys think. The question is hands down what is the best point for point the best unit in are codex is. I know there going to be a lot of different answers but let be civil about it if you can explain why that would help, let me start. I think that RavenWing Black Knights are the best unit in are codex because they are so cheap for what they do and they are good at it. They are basically a gene stealer with twin-link plasma gun on a bike with skilled rider for the same cost as a normal plasma gunner on a bike. They are cheap for what they do having S5 Rending attacks, Skilled rider, 3 attacks base 4 on the charge, hit and run and still have the advantage of being on a bike for 2 points less then are terminators. I can go on for a while but like i said Black knights are awesome and i will stand by the are the best unit in the codex. If you have a different though please share. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polythemus Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 this is the standard response to your question. Pretty sure most people agree with this. Personally I really like trying to use the Dark Talon or Azreal with a demi squad of tactical marines. That to me is alot more interesting, but point for point, most competitive, best unit... the raven wing black knights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disciple of Caliban Sgt Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 I agree with both statements but honestly I think the Deathwing Knights are the best unit (my opinion). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shandwen Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Deathwing knights would take the cake if they had more viable support elements. The ravenwing black knights take the cake for me as they need no support. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Sheol Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Black knights (and RWCS) are they best unit of our codex but they are still overcosted (7-5 points per model if you consider BK or RWCS)... But considering that all our codex is overcosted they shine like a Diamond in the mud... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaplain Lucifer Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 RW Black knights are the best unit in DA codex. Speed, resiliance, firepower, good HtH and hit and run. That's why they get targeted so often by the enemy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnakeChisler Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Ravenwing knights But a good showing for deathwing knights I have to say And a HQ with a PFG in 3rd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shabbadoo Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 All and none, as defining the "best" unit in the codex is purely situational. There is no best all-comers unit in the codex, period, and there is no "I gotta take this unit all of the time because it always rocks!" type of unit either. Not a single one. Considering how GW usually makes some unit in every codex way whacky good for it cost, this is rather odd. Leave it to GW to, for some reason, reign in their crazy when working out Dark Angels. "Whoa, whoa, there Jeremy! Just what do you think you are doing? Are you trying to make our previous Dark Angels codices look bad, or something? That is some crazy good stuff you put in there, and we can't be having that in any Dark Angels codex! Now, you just go ahead and raise the price on those flyers, and add the rule for that one which doesn't even work for its missiles. Yeah, that's it! Now, tone down that new flyer rainbow gun to the point of near uselessness, and only give it one bomb because there surely couldn't be any more in a bomb bay of any kind! And be sure to give that new plasma speeder two hull points instead of three, and make sure it is able to overheat itself to death. And no, don't make its weapons twin-linked! Yes, I know it has a pair of weapons, but don't do it! There, now you're getting the hang of it, lad! Keep up the good work! (Bloody Yanks!)" "Uh...thanks, Jervis?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaplain Lucifer Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Shabadoo, I don't disagree but this is not a thread to rant if you know what I mean. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shabbadoo Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Yeah, yeah. That was just for fun. No riling up was intended (so don't anybody go crazy, or anything). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratvam Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 For me its the humble Tactical Squad in drop pod, I mainly play Mealstorm missions and the fact I can use this unit as 3 super scoring units is golden. My opponent is usually preoccupied with the rest of my army and fails to deal with this once I have removed the threats from the table Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shabbadoo Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 Hehe. People can be distracted by all of the "super killy stuff" in your army, forgeting that not dealing with such humble (and objective securing) untis will lose them the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ValourousHeart Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 The positive spin on Shabbadoo's rant is that we have an internally balanced codex. The good news is that we don't have any units like CSM which are completely outclassed by another unit in the same role within the codex. The bad news is that we don't have any units like chaos cultists that are auto include in every list. That means you will almost never face the same DA list multiple times during a tournament. But there are a couple of popular styles of DA armies. Now depending upon the style DA army you are building there may be some auto include units. For example, if you are building a RW list, you'll want to go ahead and include the attack bike in each squad. And you'll want to make room for either RWBK or RWCS. Sammie kinda goes without saying. But the rest of the list is open. Do you go with speeders or not? Do you go with a dark shroud or not? Do you go with flyers or not? Do you go with more attack squads and the dakka banner? Do you go with more RWBK and the RW banner? Of do you go with something different and take 2 Mortis Dreads on a skyshield? Would it be nice to have a unit that other players would envy? Maybe. Would it be nice to tell people that you play DA and for them to automatically know what over 75% of your list was? Not really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interrogator Stobz Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 If we are going situational and list building at the same time... Sammael=best HQ Libby, bike, PFG= next best HQ RWCS(5), SoF= Best support unit HQ RWCS(5)= next best support unit HQ RWAS(3)MG2, AB(MM)= best troops RWAS(3)MG2, AB(MM)= best troops RWBK(5)= best Fast attack RWBK(5)= best Fast attack RWBK(5)= best Fast attack All for around 1850points, spam is good EDIT: Yes, that's 25 Black Knights Who needs super-scoring anyway? stobz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isiah Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 ' :D ' indeed. If you're including HQs in this best unit thing then my vote goes to: Sammael on Jetbike. Elites: DW Knights. Troops: Ravenwing Attack Squadron. Pretty much as Stobz's but with meltabombs on the sarge for good measure. Fast Attack: Ravenwing Attack Bike with MM. But as you can't actually get this on its own it's a bit of a cheat :P. Heavy: A full Dev squad with four of the same heavy weapons (but preferably not heavy bolters). Cheers I It's interesting looking at other peoples' take on what's best to use as an ally from our dex. Many go for the PFG-toting Librarian. My choice to when in termy armour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marvmoogy Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 The word 'best' here is the problem. Allow me to explain.... To me, the 'best' unit in the 'dex is the humble Venerable Dreadnought with 2x TL Autocannons. Why? Because in all the games I have played, he has out performed everything else in my army. This little dude has taken down more points on his own than anything else I have fielded. In a decent, mixed-wing list, other units are of a higher priority (DWKs, RWBKs etc) so this guy gets overlooked whilst continuing to pump out 4 TL- Autocannon rounds per turn. There are many who would disagree, but this is *my* best unit. HOWEVER, If we are comparing all other units in the dex, I'd back up the RWBKs........it's just mine like to die. A lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isiah Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 'Best' is subjective and situational. That's what makes it so interesting. Cheers I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SvenONE Posted November 11, 2014 Share Posted November 11, 2014 I wouldn't say BKs are the cheapest unit but they are the best. The command squads with banners are novel and a nice unique flavor to our codex and the deathwing landraider is probably one of the most durable vehicles in the game outside of the super-heavy category Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt_Reaper Posted November 11, 2014 Share Posted November 11, 2014 Don't forget the humble Scout squad. I had a 5-man team (4 snipers and a missile launcher) take an entire turn of Eldar shooting to dig them out of cover. 2+ cover saves for days! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isiah Posted November 11, 2014 Share Posted November 11, 2014 So you're saying Scouts are our best unit ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Sheol Posted November 11, 2014 Share Posted November 11, 2014 @Valorous Heart... I dont think that our codex is so internally balanced... There are almost useless units alongaide very strong ones and almost everything in the codex is overcosted too.. Basically i think that DA and CSM codices are 5th Edition ones with some costs and rules altered For 6th... Considering the HUGE gap between the last 5th edition codex and the CSM one (1 full year) and that the DV has DA vs CSM i starter to think that DA and CSM were ready to be released during 5th (imagine DWK with regular PW in 5th... they would be cheesy like hell) and adapted badly to 6th to be released with DV... This is what happens when marketing overcomes all other things... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt_Reaper Posted November 11, 2014 Share Posted November 11, 2014 I think every unit has the chance to be "The Best" at any given stage. My scouts were The Best for a turn or two, allowing my terminators to get into position and prepare to be The Best. Also with the rumoured Cities of Death release I might just get a LSV. That vehicle would be superb in urban combat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interrogator Stobz Posted November 11, 2014 Share Posted November 11, 2014 I think that the 'Best' unit needs to be able to shine in the most phases of the game and not just occasionally or situationally. That is where the RWCS/BKs are our undoubted standouts; they have crazy good mobility only hampered by multilevel buildings, they can get where they need to score or deny or kill things on their terms (especially in Maelstrom missions). They are brutal at shooting at expensive elite units and vehicles (except AV13/14 which are rare so they do need help there), they are excellent at mowing nearly everything in CC (including AV13 vehicles which are predominantly AV10/11 at the rear), and to top it all off they are quite resilient for MEQ. All this considering they are not too overcosted in comparison to many of the other specialist units in our Jeremydex makes them the 'Best' by a country mile imho. In my last game vs Tau they zoomed in close to a Riptide, shot at it doing only one wound :devil:, they then multi charged it and a collection of suit wearing freaks with an HQ fishguy, won the combat by a fair bit and chased them all off the board when they failed their morale check. Being able to act well in every phase is the key to being the 'Best'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Avoghai Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 @Valorous Heart... I dont think that our codex is so internally balanced... There are almost useless units alongaide very strong ones and almost everything in the codex is overcosted too.. Basically i think that DA and CSM codices are 5th Edition ones with some costs and rules altered For 6th... Considering the HUGE gap between the last 5th edition codex and the CSM one (1 full year) and that the DV has DA vs CSM i starter to think that DA and CSM were ready to be released during 5th (imagine DWK with regular PW in 5th... they would be cheesy like hell) and adapted badly to 6th to be released with DV... This is what happens when marketing overcomes all other things... That's why dark eldar codex is so overpowered it's a 7th ed codex... Almost every unit is so powerful that it's a pain for DE player to choose which fantastic unit he should get rid of ... <_< Sincerely... Which codex doesn't contain useless units? Tau has vespyds, the 2 flyers, piranhas etc Eldar has scorpions, banshees, etc It's just how the codex/army books are made for 30years now.... Moreover : overcosted relating to what? Eldar codex? An eldar army is just 2 farseers on jet bike, wave serpents, wraith knights... meaning that 90% of the eldar codex is useless. So don't you think that eldar players should complain of the uselessness of their units? Or what you are saying is just : "I want a DA codex made like an eldar one with no brainer options"? Finally : ALL the powerful list of the ETC are made using allies : IH centurions in SW pods, eldar fire dragons with voivoide and warp portal etc etc... So before thinking that DA codex is "weak" 1- Start thinking which army can beat a DA army without ally (hence pure codex vs pure codex)? 2- Start thinking including allies if you have too many WAAC players in your area (who surely include allies in their own army without any shame) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdemings Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 i'm pretty fond of our Techmarine... doesn't occupy a force org slot, access to a plasma, flamer, and ap1 combat weapons for 25pts, ability to carry a PFG and relic wargear. can take a bike, or ride around in your LR/rhinos and fix them... hide him in a ruin with a dev squad and get the bump to the cover save from bolster ruins... the versatility is amazing. other than that, black knights. lots and lots of black knights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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