Question About Sanctions

[Julgolax]

We all know that the Astartes and the Inquisition generally have autonomy when it comes to destroying innocent lives for a purpose, but what happens when the Militarum and the Sororitas are at odds about the same task?

 

During Dawn of War: Soulstorm, which I know shouldn't be taken as canon but it still offers the only source I know of to describe this conflict of interests, the Militarum and the Sororitas are assigned to do battle on the same planet. Their goals are equally simple, yet wholly different with the Militarum seeking to reclaim and bring order to the system while the Sororitas are tasked with burning the entire system to the ground in order to purify it. Now this is obviously a problem because 1; who has the right to carry out their orders, and 2; who's going to be at fault when all is said and done?

 

To me, the Astra Militarum is wholly governed by one standing creed; unquestioning loyalty to those appointed above you and all that implies while the Adepta Sororitas is governed by their order's leadership who are in turn commanded by the Inquisition as a whole. So when the fanatical Sororitas are faced with the dogged Militarum standing in their way... what's the story?

 

I can only imagine that when the Militarum are faced with a task that they're ordered to carry out, lest they invoke the wrath of the Inquisition, that they'll fight till the last man to accomplish the task. But then the Sororitas counter with their Inquisitorial authorization to carry out their purges. It probably depends on a matter of timing, first come first serve, but then again the Sororitas are not known for compromising. What do you folks think?

[Lucien Eilam]

To me, the Astra Militarum is wholly governed by one standing creed; unquestioning loyalty to those appointed above you and all that implies while the Adepta Sororitas is governed by their order's leadership who are in turn commanded by the Inquisition as a whole.

 

No, the Adepta Sororitas are subordinate to the Adeptus Ministorum. An Inquisitor can command practically anyone. If one Inquisitor is involved, he would have authority over both the Imperial Guard and the Sisters.

 

If multiple Inquisitors with conflicting interests are involved, or there's no Inquisitor and nobody else with overall authority, the average Sisters force probably can't seriously challenge a planet-scale deployment of millions of Guardsmen and tanks, but neither are the Guard very likely to shoot at them.

 

The result is probably politics. Ecclesiarchy Cardinals threatening to excommunicate Guard commanders, both sides trying to bring in somebody with the authority to settle the dispute in their favour, and so on. The nature of the Imperium is such that you can't even rely on anyone else in ostensibly the same organisation taking your side.

 

Different forces, but compare the conflict between the Salamanders and the Marines Malevolent during the Third War for Armageddon. Both carrying out their orders as they saw fit, neither with authority over the other. Resulted in handbags at dawn, formal complaints to High Command, and both carrying on exactly as before while mostly staying out of each other's way.

[ElectricPaladin]

In other words, as an excuse for a Militarum vs. Sororitas actual fight, it's pretty poor. Even in the grimdark future, not every Militarum commander or Sororitas canoness is willing to go down in history as the one who slaughtered fellow humans over a brief political spat. As a reason that a problem manages to get out of hand, allowing Orks or 'Nids or Chaos something to become a major issue, though, it makes for a decent background conflict.

[WarriorFish]

Don't take the Dawn of War games too seriously for their lore :P

[*Furyou Miko]

Yeah, pretty much. The Inquisition and the Ministorum like to work together where possible, so really, how DoW Soulstorm would have gone down, if they hadn't decided that the Imperials had to fight each other, was that the Guard would have come to an accord to use the Sisters as shock troops, while the Guard secured the ground taken by them. The Sisters, their enemies purged, would have then moved on afterwards, leaving the Guard to do with the system as they saw fit.

[Jacinda]

Adepta Sororitas is governed by their order's leadership who are in turn commanded by the Inquisition as a whole.

A common misconception but they are separate and dispirit organizations. They highest ranking Sororitas is one of the High Lords of Terra ... who happens to be missing at the moment, but never the less it remains that the Inquisition would more likely answer to her than the other way around.

 

That said, they do have similar goals and often work together. Otherwise, the Sister follow the command of the church while the Inquisitors enjoy am autonomy and transcendent authority that allows them to press virtually anyone into service.

[ElectricPaladin]

 

Adepta Sororitas is governed by their order's leadership who are in turn commanded by the Inquisition as a whole.

A common misconception but they are separate and dispirit organizations. They highest ranking Sororitas is one of the High Lords of Terra ... who happens to be missing at the moment, but never the less it remains that the Inquisition would more likely answer to her than the other way around.

 

That said, they do have similar goals and often work together. Otherwise, the Sister follow the command of the church while the Inquisitors enjoy am autonomy and transcendent authority that allows them to press virtually anyone into service.

 

Eh... except that ever since Vandire, the Inquisition has had a weird relationship with the High Lords. Even they are not beyond the purview of the Inquisition or the Officio Assassinorum.

[Leif Bearclaw]

 

They highest ranking Sororitas is one of the High Lords of Terra ... who happens to be missing at the moment, but never the less it remains that the Inquisition would more likely answer to her than the other way around.

 

Not according to this:

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/High_Lords#fn_1

 

The Head Sister can be a High Lord, but isn't automatically,  she's 'merely' one of the contenders for the three seats which are more 'up for grabs'. Whereas the Inquisition gets one of the nine permanent seats at the table, which is where the buck ultimately stops for Inquisitors (as can be seen in Vraks, the Inquisitorial Representative didn't want to fight Rex's corner to prevent forces being transferred away from the 88th Army, so Rex had to lump it or go rogue). So while it's possible that she could influence individual Inquisitors (especially more junior and/or devout ones), she certainly doesn't have authority over the organisation as a whole. (But does anyone really have that?)

[*Furyou Miko]

In either case, the Adepta Sororitas still do not answer to the Inquisition - at least no more than any other Imperial institution, such as the Adeptus Astartes or Adeptus Astra Telepathica.

 

The fact also remains that the High Lord seat held by the Abbess of the Adepta Sororitas has been held by the Abbess for the last five thousand years solid - since the Sororitas' inception in M.36 - and is, in fact, still assigned to her even if she hasn't been around to sit in it recently. Essentially, its 'open' nature is a technicality at best.

[Julgolax]

Interesting stuff to be sure! :) I'm still wondering though what would happen if both sides came upon a conflict of interests. If the Adepta Sororitas were to attack the Astra Militarum because they would not yield a planet to them, what would be the ramifications of that and who would be in the right do you think?

[*Furyou Miko]

The Sororitas, of course.

 

The Sororitas are the will of the Emperor made manifest. They are his holy Daughters. What does a Guardsman know of the Emperor?

[graysparrow]

.....who would be in the right do you think?

 

Whoever wins.

[Kilofix]

Didn't the Militarum go up against Sisters in BL's Redemption Corps? I can't remember exactly.

[*Furyou Miko]

Didn't the Militarum go up against Sisters in BL's Redemption Corps? I can't remember exactly.

Not exactly. A Canoness under the influence of an Istvaanian Inquisitor kidnapped some Stormtroopers because the Stormtroopers were being too effective at preventing a Chaos Cult from taking a planet that was part of some nutbar scheme to prove to the High Lords that the Imperium needs more Space Marines.

 

Basically just another author thinking that nobody will care if yet another writer takes a dump on the Sororitas' fluff.

[ElectricPaladin]

 

Didn't the Militarum go up against Sisters in BL's Redemption Corps? I can't remember exactly.

Not exactly. A Canoness under the influence of an Istvaanian Inquisitor kidnapped some Stormtroopers because the Stormtroopers were being too effective at preventing a Chaos Cult from taking a planet that was part of some nutbar scheme to prove to the High Lords that the Imperium needs more Space Marines.

 

Basically just another author thinking that nobody will care if yet another writer takes a dump on the Sororitas' fluff.

 

 

I really wish the Istvaanians weren't always portrayed as pants-on-head crazy.

[Kilofix]

 

Didn't the Militarum go up against Sisters in BL's Redemption Corps? I can't remember exactly.

Not exactly. A Canoness under the influence of an Istvaanian Inquisitor kidnapped some Stormtroopers because the Stormtroopers were being too effective at preventing a Chaos Cult from taking a planet that was part of some nutbar scheme to prove to the High Lords that the Imperium needs more Space Marines.

 

Basically just another author thinking that nobody will care if yet another writer takes a dump on the Sororitas' fluff.

 

 

But doesn't that exactly match the OP's situation:

 

.... the Militarum are faced with a task that they're ordered to carry out, lest they invoke the wrath of the Inquisition, that they'll fight till the last man to accomplish the task. But then the Sororitas counter with their Inquisitorial authorization to carry out their purges. It probably depends on a matter of timing, first come first serve, but then again the Sororitas are not known for compromising. What do you folks think?

 

.... except that's its a Sororitas 'anti-purge' rather than a 'purge'?

 

That said, I agree that the Sororitas dumping is getting out of hand.

[*Furyou Miko]

It doesn't match exactly, because in Redemption Corps, it's a much smaller situation - a single squad of Stormtroopers (at the time, not technically a Militarum unit) and a single loose Canon(ess).

 

Because yeah, its not like a Canoness of the Adepta Sororitas is actually, you know, loyal to the Emperor or anything.

 

I really wanted to like that book. I really did. It had Valkyries. It had Drop Troops. It had Battle Sisters. It had all the ingredients for an awesome novel... and then it decided to gak it all up and throw anything respectable about the forces involved out of the window.