The tyranids!

[Captain Coolpants]

They're getting a lot of love lately from GW.

You guys think we should be worried? With their monstrous creature drop pods, with a capacity of 20 or 1 MC, could bring synapse creatures within range turn 2 or a whole mess of other creatures in our face.

 

Is it time to spam out psylencers? :-P

[ChaoticEric]

Definitely. That Toxicrene-thing with poison 2+ and ap2 sounds seriously scary...

[Everon]

Nids? They taste like chicken. Light em up brothers!

[boreas]

Yep, new units might make it an even match....

[jeffersonian000]

Synapse range by Turn 2? Pretty sure I've been getting into Synapes range on Turn 1, and burning them.

 

SJ

[raverrn]

Definitely. That Toxicrene-thing with poison 2+ and ap2 sounds seriously scary...

 

Good thing it's AP -.

 

GW put the rules for the Toxicrene and Maleceptor here: http://www.blacklibrary.com/Home/free-to-download.html

 

Presumably they'll put the rules for the spore variants and the Neurothrope there eventually as well, but I've got them if anyone has more questions or misconceptions.

[Reclusiarch Darius]

(shrug) I'm honestly not that worried

 

If you know you are fighting a spore list, Ally Coteaz. Watch them rage-quit. 

 

As for the new MC's, neither of them are especially problematic.

- The Toxicrene is god-like in melee...provided it can wound you on a 6. You can take it apart at range with psycannons and incinerators, and in melee force weapons end it (it won't on average dice wipe out a 5-man squad, which leaves the squad hammer able to kill it). DK can probably survive melee with it, but it would be a calculated risk (don't charge unless you have 'Force' active, you don't wanna risk extended combat against it). 

- The Maleceptor needs to get a focused witchfire off at WC2. A Librarian with Mastery 3 and stave (gee never see that do we) dispels his worse Psychic Shriek on a 3+ re-rolling 1's. Good luck Nids, I'm behind Aegis plate. Also, if you're really concerned, just ally a Culexus and watch him cry silently as you murder it in melee. 

[ChaoticEric]

 

Definitely. That Toxicrene-thing with poison 2+ and ap2 sounds seriously scary...

 

Good thing it's AP -.

 

GW put the rules for the Toxicrene and Maleceptor here: http://www.blacklibrary.com/Home/free-to-download.html

 

Presumably they'll put the rules for the spore variants and the Neurothrope there eventually as well, but I've got them if anyone has more questions or misconceptions.

The shooting attack cloud-thing is ap- but it's a monstrous creature so surely it's melee attacks (which are also poison 2+) are ap2?

 

It's got 6 attacks base, poison 2+, ap2 and 6's mean instant death so it sounds pretty scary to me. Add lash whips to that and they are hitting at i6...

[Reclusiarch Darius]

The shooting attack cloud-thing is ap- but it's a monstrous creature so surely it's melee attacks (which are also poison 2+) are ap2?

 

It's got 6 attacks base, poison 2+, ap2 and 6's mean instant death so it sounds pretty scary to me. Add lash whips to that and they are hitting at i6... 

 

Correct. So committing infantry to it is not ideal, although as I mentioned earlier, it has awful WS (you hit it on 3's if you're WS4+), so it on average won't wipe a 5-man squad, so hopefully your last dude hits it with the squad hammer. Also DK's will usually survive combat, but again its not ideal. 

 

Your best bet is to take it down from range. Incinerators and 'Perfect Timing' on psycannons reks it, as do Purifiers with 'Cleansing Flame'. Given it has no ranged attacks, its not a huge priority to kill though. I'd be focusing on their FMC's and Exocrines, and things like Tervigons or Biovores. Everything else is trash. 

[ChaoticEric]

 

The shooting attack cloud-thing is ap- but it's a monstrous creature so surely it's melee attacks (which are also poison 2+) are ap2?It's got 6 attacks base, poison 2+, ap2 and 6's mean instant death so it sounds pretty scary to me. Add lash whips to that and they are hitting at i6... 

 

Correct. So committing infantry to it is not ideal, although as I mentioned earlier, it has awful WS (you hit it on 3's if you're WS4+), so it on average won't wipe a 5-man squad, so hopefully your last dude hits it with the squad hammer. Also DK's will usually survive combat, but again its not ideal. 

 

Your best bet is to take it down from range. Incinerators and 'Perfect Timing' on psycannons reks it, as do Purifiers with 'Cleansing Flame'. Given it has no ranged attacks, its not a huge priority to kill though. I'd be focusing on their FMC's and Exocrines, and things like Tervigons or Biovores. Everything else is trash.

You're of course right, there are ways to deal with it. I'm just saying that it'll definitely be a useful addition to the Tyranid line-up and one which require at least some attention when up against it.

 

Are the rules or rumours out for their new drop pod-things? Once they can start deep-striking toxicrene and carnifexes it'll get messy :)

[Reclusiarch Darius]

You're of course right, there are ways to deal with it. I'm just saying that it'll definitely be a useful addition to the Tyranid line-up and one which require at least some attention when up against it.

Are the rules or rumours out for their new drop pod-things? Once they can start deep-striking toxicrene and carnifexes it'll get messy

Toxicrenes sound like an answer to ground infantry TBH. They rip apart anything that lacks either strong invul saves or faster Initiative, which is like 90% of things they'll encounter.

Maleceptors...I dunno. They're nowhere near as good as Exocrines in the 'shooty support role'. Also, being psychic powers put them at serious risk of being dispelled by any army with decent psykers. They're borderline useless against us for that reason.

The spore rules are out. They're more expensive but with good reason. You get six guns now. Coteaz and armies with Interceptor won't be too concerned, but anyone lacking Interceptor is in for some fun. Mind you, given Drop Pod lists have been around forever, I don't see this shaking up the meta that much. Exocrines and Carnifex landing in enemy lines is pretty amusing (or landing a Toxicrene), but its still expensive to do so.

[Captain Coolpants]

I've actually never gone against a tyranids army before. To me they sound extremely scary, but general concensus is that we'll easily curb stomp them all the time.

 

How so?

 

Because multiple drop pods landing in my face, each with 20 shooty guys or 20 genestelers or something amazing in combat or a few kick ass MC's sounds super overwhelming, unless half our army focus fires at each pod (which obviously is usually impossible) , each pod WILL get into combat (unless they scatter away or we are also deepstriking).

 

Because before they sucked because unless they were flying creatures, They had to slowwwwly run up whilst being shot to bits, but now they no longer have that problem, the drop pod itself is a MC with 5 Wounds lol.

 

 

Probably my utter lack of experience going against them.... But they sound hard to deal with. Unless you spam purifiers and luck out with cleansing flame rolls.

[Reclusiarch Darius]

I've actually never gone against a tyranids army before. To me they sound extremely scary, but general concensus is that we'll easily curb stomp them all the time. 

 

You really need to fight them dude. They're actually a competitive army, and they do have some problematic units for us. 

Because multiple drop pods landing in my face, each with 20 shooty guys or 20 genestelers or something amazing in combat or a few kick ass MC's sounds super overwhelming, unless half our army focus fires at each pod (which obviously is usually impossible) , each pod WILL get into combat (unless they scatter away or we are also deepstriking). 

 

Coteaz allows you to shoot them as they arrive, as does Interceptor weaponry. Also, they can't charge the turn they arrive from Reserve, so they can only shoot you. At which point you move, 'Cleansing Flame'/cast your buff powers, shoot them, then assault them. 

Because before they sucked because unless they were flying creatures, They had to slowwwwly run up whilst being shot to bits, but now they no longer have that problem, the drop pod itself is a MC with 5 Wounds lol. 

 

Like all their MC's, once they hit combat our force weapons at either S6 or S8/10 take care of them pretty easily. Also, you can ignore the pods until you've killed the cargo. 

Probably my utter lack of experience going against them.... But they sound hard to deal with. Unless you spam purifiers and luck out with cleansing flame rolls. 

 

 

It's actually mean to take Purifiers against Nids, they're just so broken in that matchup. Put them in an Aegis line or AV14 bunker with Coteaz and four psycannons, watch the Nid player cry when he tries to advance on you. 

 

Our basic tools are enough though dude. Psycannons deal with both Nids infantry and MC's, incinerators are solid gold against all their non-MC's, and psilencers actually find a use insta-gibbing Warriors and their MC's (putting 'Misfortune' on the target is highly recommended, as when you Rend you bypass armour and thus get your 'Force' bolts into their face). In melee, we're just too scary to engage with our high Strength AP3/2 force weapons. Genestealers are a rare sight nowadays, as its just impossible for them to charge without being torn to shreds by our firepower first (incinerator Overwatch is...not nice). 

 

The biggest risk with the matchup is Exorcrines (who shred our infantry and will bring down DK's if not dealt with early), Flyrants (who require Ravens or anti-air Fortifications to kill), and Biovores (who dump a lot of wounds on our tiny handful of infantry models). The chaff we melt with our basic firepower, and most of their MC's die to DK's before they can swing. Toxicrenes I'd add to the 'problem' list, but not Maleceptors (your basic Mastery 3 stave Libby defeats them easily). 

[ChaoticEric]

I've actually never gone against a tyranids army before. To me they sound extremely scary, but general concensus is that we'll easily curb stomp them all the time.

How so?

Because multiple drop pods landing in my face, each with 20 shooty guys or 20 genestelers or something amazing in combat or a few kick ass MC's sounds super overwhelming, unless half our army focus fires at each pod (which obviously is usually impossible) , each pod WILL get into combat (unless they scatter away or we are also deepstriking).

Because before they sucked because unless they were flying creatures, They had to slowwwwly run up whilst being shot to bits, but now they no longer have that problem, the drop pod itself is a MC with 5 Wounds lol.

Probably my utter lack of experience going against them.... But they sound hard to deal with. Unless you spam purifiers and luck out with cleansing flame rolls.

You have the ultimate answer to MCs; force and hammerhand. And now you can even shoot with force.

 

You also have the answer to hordes; incinerators.

 

And when they think they've had enough, you bring the purifiers...

 

With a good mix of these, I don't see tyranids in general posing much of a problem to us. Perhaps we're even one of the factions they'll struggle the most with?

[Captain Coolpants]

Yeah assault 6 or large blast plasma without getting hot is crazy good!

 

Other than that, are there any other things I should look out for?

And would you recommend staying put, or running at the enemy?

[jeffersonian000]

The only issue I've had in the past when play my GK vs Nids is the standard curse of the low model count army: just can't kill enough to matter.

 

I've lost a number of games vs Nids despite not losing a single model, simply on Objectives. Since the new 7th Ed Dexes for both armies, I haven't tried a game vs the new Nids yet, although when I do it will be my standard NSF Draigo Shunt list because it's all about incinerating and Psycannon pot-shots while bouncing all over the place. Should be fun.

 

SJ

[Reclusiarch Darius]

Other than that, are there any other things I should look out for? 

And would you recommend staying put, or running at the enemy? 

 

Depends on the mission. I'd say take objectives and hold them. Nids are a melee army with shooty support from a few key units, they want to get into close-combat ASAP. 

 

I'd definitely get aggressive with DK's, Purifiers, Terminators. Shoving those units into his ground MC's and stuff like Warriors melts them. His horde infantry are annoying but if you take out the Tervigons he loses the ability to replace losses easily. 

The only issue I've had in the past when play my GK vs Nids is the standard curse of the low model count army: just can't kill enough to matter.

 

Same as against other armies; focus a flank, punch it so hard it evapourates, then roll down his battle line. Ignore the hordes of chaff unless they block charge lanes, in which case clear a path over their broken corpses. Nids hate our firepower and facing Terminator Troops, they basically need Exocrine help or melee to deal with them, and your DK's rek Exocrines. 

I've lost a number of games vs Nids despite not losing a single model, simply on Objectives. Since the new 7th Ed Dexes for both armies, I haven't tried a game vs the new Nids yet, although when I do it will be my standard NSF Draigo Shunt list because it's all about incinerating and Psycannon pot-shots while bouncing all over the place. Should be fun.

 

Draigo is nightmare fuel for them. He's so tanky, he can't be insta-gibbed by boneswords or Toxicrenes, and he melts everything they have in melee. 'Gating' Purifers into their lines is pretty mean too, you melt half their lines Turn 1. 

 

Honestly I feel like Knights are better suited to just wiping people off objectives, rather than playing the mission. We don't have the staying power to trade for long, and we hit like a truck in both melee and gunfights but pay through the nose for it. Get aggressive and focus things to death. 

[ChaoticEric]

Yeah assault 6 or large blast plasma without getting hot is crazy good!

Other than that, are there any other things I should look out for?

And would you recommend staying put, or running at the enemy?

Depends on the lists I would say. If he's bringing hordes and you bring incinerators; get them in range asap and start frying. If he's got MCs and you have psilencers; activate force and keep shooting, if you've got psycannons you can skip force but keep firing. If he makes it to your line, keep activating force, add hammerhand and charge :)

[calvin the wraithlord]

Ive always found Nids laughable to us, force weps pop there stupidly expensive big units with such ease its hardly even fun and incinerators make there hordes into ash, they charge they die on overwatch, they dont they get burned then charged, might i add CLEANSING FLAME