Getting into BA - need advice

[Hillslam]

Hello,

 

I am new to WH40k.  Longtime fan of the fluff, never played a battle. Last year acquired the Space Hulk board game and this re-ignited the hobbyist in me and I began collecting more models (mainly to look good on the desk). Eventually picked up the 7th edition rules and the 6th edition codex. Got a copy of Army Builder and set about trying to put together a list for an all-comers setup that matches my fluff. I basically collect the models due to aesthetic appeal, but if they can get on a game and not get tabled that would be nice (I don't need to win, just not get wiped).

 

Here's where I am so far on the models. The rhinos/razorbacks//predators are fully magnetized and can be deployed in any config. so too the Land Raider (can deploy as redeemer or crusader also), and the dreadnought, which can run any combo of DC, Librarian or Furioso. I have a squad of DC still being built (you can see on the left behind claw-equipped Claudio). I have another rhino on order, which will also be magnetized, and enough legs to complete a second set of 5 DC. All DC can have their jumppacks swapped for regular, as can the assault squad in the middle, all are magnetized. I also have another set of Dreadnought legs on order with a body, so I can field a 2nd dread, as long as the two are different (since they'll be pulling from the same pool of weapons, front plates, arms, etc).

 

So, with that wall of text, and the picture below to show what I have to work with, I'd love some advice on how to field this. Which units to field, how to combine them, etc. I know BA are in a wierd limbo right now with the wait for codex, but I will take suggestions too on next units to buy. 

 

 

(link to full size - caution HUGE - http://imageshack.com/a/img909/8990/hs6Scv.jpg   )

 

Forum sized pic:

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/1600x1200q90/909/hs6Scv.jpg

I apologize for the bad lighting. No matter what I try, the camera always over saturates the colors and the models end up looking blotchy. They look much better in real life. Crisp with alot of shading that the eye sees but the camera doesn't. I suck at photography.

 

Thanks in advance.

Hillslam

[marine7312000]

Welcome to the forum. This isn't going to be advice but simply jealousy and a request for pictures of the squads individually. With that, those fraters with a bit more experience in 7th can help you from there. As an aside, you may want to look into getting some normal bases for your terminators. Some may have an issue with the non-round bases they currently have from the Space Hulk box.

[Hillslam]

Thanks.  Yeah I already bought a pile of terminator bases and plan to base them up but am waffling between just chopping the space hulk base off their feet and gluing them or magnetizing them.  Its not like I need to keep them pristine for Space Hulk anymore with the re-release of the 3rd edition.....

 

Not sure how I'd photo the squads since I really don't have definitive squads yet. I could take a stab at what I *think* the squads could be. with the caveat that its not list dependent on how I'd arrange them.

 

IMO the biggest problem is how to get the dreadnoughts into play. I can turtle up the marines in the rhinos/landraider. The assaults can just do their jumppack thing. The Terms will be deepstriking. But that leaves the dread lumbering along at 6 like the LR. I worry he won't be a factor, especially if DC. 

 

Here's some shots I've taken earlier as these were WIP. Again my photography sucks. Really saturates the colors and makes the details blotchy.

http://1drv.ms/1HaF2nE

http://1drv.ms/1zwERht

http://1drv.ms/1zwF6Jp

http://1drv.ms/1zwFlEj

http://1drv.ms/1HaBbah

http://1drv.ms/1zwFB6j

http://1drv.ms/1zwFLug

http://1drv.ms/1zwFNSS

http://1drv.ms/1zwGlbv

http://1drv.ms/1zwGDPs

http://1drv.ms/1HaE1fs

http://1drv.ms/1HaEsGn

[ElectricPaladin]

Wow... you are way more vigorous on the magnetizing than I am. I magnetize the obvious, but I usually go for simpler - if more expensive - options, like buying an entire extra turret on eBay to make my Baals switchable. Or, for the sponsons, getting the bits to make a whole extra sponson, then magnetizing the sponsons. I dunno... I teach middle school, so I take my work home with me every day, and vigorous magnetizing is just not worth it for me. More power to you, though, if you can make it work!

 

You really should put your Space Hulk terminators on bases. It'll weird your Space Hulk games a little, but it won't make the board game unplayable. Some opponents might object. Large bases are a disadvantage, but small bases are an advantage, because you can more easily fit more of the units into an assault. You're such a magnetizing fiend, though, and you've opted for plain black bases, so... why don't you create magnetized bases that you can just plop your terminators onto?

 

As far as what works... to be honest, it's not worth delving too deep into it right now. We're going to get a new 'dex soon, probably early next year. By the time you really get good at using our advice, it'll all be rendered irrelevant. Probably our new 'dex is going to change a lot - our current 'dex is two editions old! Even if it's just points recosting, it's probably going to be heavy recosting across the board.

 

That said, my advice is as follows:

• Get a storm raven. It's not the best unit, but it's our only flyer, and it can be fun.
• You will never use a godhammer land raider. Put the lascannon sponsons in mothballs.
• Get more sanguinary priests! 6'' Furious Charge and 5+ FNP bubbles are what make the Blood Angels work!

 

More advice to follow...

[Zeller]

Funny, I wish my sanguinary priest's FNP was worth a damn. 

 

Multi-melta attack bikes get my vote as the go-to anti-tank platform. At 50 points a pop they are fantastic.

[ElectricPaladin]

Funny, I wish my sanguinary priest's FNP was worth a damn. 

 

Multi-melta attack bikes get my vote as the go-to anti-tank platform. At 50 points a pop they are fantastic.

 

And you can't see the utility in giving that squad of six T5 wounds a 5+ FNP? Or even better, however many ablative wounds (if you put the attack bike in a normal bike squad) 5+ FNP? My FNP invariably keeps my dudes alive way longer than my opponents expect.

[Theduke08]

When, (keeping fingers crossed) the cost for priests goes down with the new dex I will for sure be fielding a unit of 3 mm attack bikes with an attached priest.  More than likely we will be getting some sort of a shooting relic and slap that on him and hes good to go...  

[Charlo]

Attack bikes are one of the coolest space marine units in the game IMO. They are luckily also a very effective choice. It's a shame they can't have a vet with a cheeky power weapon/ fist in it though to make them an all comers unit, but I suppose you can just give that to the priest... With a combi flamer for maximum versatility.

[Father Mapple]

I love the good hammer land raider. I put a scoring assault squad in there to be a light counter charge unit that can still reach out and shoot things across the board, but handle infiltrators or scouting/deep strikers. Or put death company in it and roll it up the middle to open the transports the squishy infantry targets for the DC are in. Or do the same and put a priest in there to provide a much larger feel no pain bubble to the jumpers advancing under cover of av14. Lots of options. Compared to the Redeemer, it actually gets to shoot usually. Once the Redeemer is in range it dies to melta.

[Kais89]

Its hard to say what you should get/field with a new codex on the horizon.

 

My best suggestion for the current meta and codex would be 2 Vindicators, a second Baal Predator, Assault Terminators, Mephiston, Stormraven, 2 Sniper Scout units.

 

The basic sniper scouts for 75 a unit is great for meeting the troop minimum, and they can put wounds on MC.

 

Our strength sadly lies everywhere but troops imo when you compare to the rest of the armies. Corbulo + TH/SS Terminators in a Raider is stupid good.

 

Mephiston is still scary even with random powers, put him in a Raven (his toughness means he can survive the explosion) and he will get to the front lines fast, or use him to deny a portion of the board.

 

Our Baals anf Vinds are pretty affordable and provide the necessary AV13 front and "all comers" feel.

 

I personally run a Knight Errant as well because its fun.

[Hillslam]

I finished my 3rd Rhino/Razorback/Predator for inclusion.

Now I can turtle up all squads that'll have problems getting to the enemy. The DCs are still being painted (I hate the high contrast black/white/red to work with although it looks great when done). The Dreadnought still remains an issue for me in usage. Drop Pod?

I don't see me buying bike units because as I mentioned I buy the models primarily for aesthetic appeal, those I'm drawn to. And the bikes just dont look good to me. That plus the fact that I'm a rider in real life and the idea that a motorcycle could be used in combat (not transporting mind you, but IN the battle) is just too farcical for me to sustain my suspension of belief. Sorry. Battlefield transporters are completely reasonable however, lol. I *may* try a landerspeeder or two maybe.

But this was really a request on how to pick from and assemble or run these models shown.

With that in mind: are there other sanguinary priest models out there I can use? I won't be running a bunch of "Corbulo" models, much too "clone-y" on table, and proxying violates my OCD...

Couple quick picks of the new metal bawkz:

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/661/iHMNeH.jpg

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/661/pJDP1n.jpg

Links to fullsize:

http://imageshack.com/a/img661/4857/iHMNeH.jpg

http://imageshack.com/a/img661/9881/pJDP1n.jpg

Once again - crappy camera, terrible lighting, all shading detail washed out. sorry

[ElectricPaladin]

I actually always saw Space Marines as slamming their bikes into the enemy, then getting off and fighting on foot. That would explain both "Hammer of Wrath" and the lack of any substantial difference in combat (except for the +1T, which I can handwave away). And Space Marines and their gear are made of such stern stuff that I always figured their bikes could survive something that a real motorcycle couldn't and still be picked up, dusted off, and ridden again.

 

Or not. Whatever. It's your army and I'd rather you be happy with it than anything else.

[Hillslam]

Could Landspeeders do the same job as bikes and ignore terrain? some of the landspeeder models are tasty.

 

 

How I plan to run these, at least until the DC gets finished:

 

12"ers

- 5 man tact squad in razorback

- 5 man tact squad in razorback

(add power weapons to flavor)

(Corbulo attaches to one of these for extra objective squatting power, besides he's not in termi armor)

- 5 man assault squad w jumpacks, no transport

- Predator: flamestorm turret and sponson heavy bolters.

 

Deepstrikers:

- 5 Man Term Squad w librarian (deepstriking or LR below)

- 5 Man Term Squad w REclusiarch in termi armor (deepstriking or LR below)

 

6" slow boats:

- Dreadnought: lib, fur, or DC (depending on feels)

- LandRaider, (God, Crus, Redeem at flavor of the day) - w Multimelta if Cr or RD (Stormbolter if Godpattern)

 

I'm sure there are a ton of problems with this: please shoot it full of holes.

 

thanks

[ElectricPaladin]

I love landspeeders, especially in a Blood Angels army. I especially love typhoons. They're like devastators except they can move, Deep Strike, are really fast and, always have a cover save!

[Xenith]

I especially love typhoons. They...always have a cover save!

Not if you want to shoot well!

 

The bikers are also, basically small bunkers. They can ride through solid walls without losing speed etc and are massively armoured. At least in the fluff. Still, if you dont like he models...have you seen Forgeworld's outrider units? Theyre a different take on the SM bike.

 

Very nice looking army.

 

Also bear in mind that in 5 man squads, tacticals cannot take any heavy or special weapons.

10 the 10 man squad, they can take both, but only get to choose one transport.

 

As your army is currently, Id run them something like this:

 

10 man tactical squad heavy and special weapon, razorback.

10 terminators, attached librarian, attached corbulo

death company + terminator chaplain in land raider redeemer with multimelta

Baal Pred (assault cannons, preferably)

dreadnought (frag cannon or librarian version) drop pod.

Assault marines

 

Having the termies et al on board T1 presents a lot of threats to the opponent. Suddenly they have to deal with a baal, land raider dread and scoring drop pod in their deployment zone T1. Your scoring units should be free to hop around as they please, adding fire support and taking objectives. The big bunch of 2+, 5++ 5+ FNP dudes i nteh middle will also cause a problem. Get the librarian divination/prescience for bolter fun, or biomancy for endurance/others.

 

Next, I'd consider:

Drop pod for the dread

5 more assault marines to make them 10 man

5 assault marines without packs to put in the other razorback? Alternatively Sternguard.

 

As ever, feel free to ignore. Always go for the models you like the look of the most. This is just what I would add to the army. Bikes would be in there, but you said you dont like them. Maybe speeders? MM/Flamer?

[Jolemai]

When it comes down to Attack Bikes and Land Speeders they have one thing in common: redundancy in numbers. One of each will never do the job you want it to, so always go 2+.

 

The Attack Bike is a cheap melta delivery system (second weapon being a twin-linked Bolter/Krak Grenade/Frag Grenade/Bolt Pistol - though you'll never use the latter choice), can be buffed (Chaplain/Librarian/Priest) and is well liked by many.

 

The Land Speeder can do the same job but it slightly more expensive, and at AV 10, is arguably the weaker choice. However, the weapon loadouts can be very interesting. For example, equipping two Heavy Bolters on three Land Speeders is eighteen STR 5 shots...

 

In short, it's your preference and your mileage may vary.

[marine7312000]

For Priests you could always convert your own. That what most people do anyway. Or wait and see if they release a new model.

[Hillslam]

Thanks for the input.  Learned a couple things: I didn't know I could attach more than one IC to a unit. I also didn't know you couldn't give HW to a tac squad of 5. I'm basing alot of my building from what the Army Builder program lets me do, as I'm not familiar enough with the books to be able to look everything up or even know if I'm supposed to look something up. So this input is much appreciated.

 

Question:  If I 10-man the tacs, then they won't fit in a Razor. Should I swap the razor to a Rhino and put the pintle mounted stormbolter and hunterkiller missile on to help make up the difference in firepower? (unless of course you mean a las-plas or twin linked LC RB).  If I do attach the razor and 5 of the tacs need to stay outside? Then they'll fall behind. Or do I Combat-Squads them T1, sending 5 here and 5 there? Is that the idea, so I get the HW and I still essentially runnng 5s? I am probably messing up a rule here I'm sure. (not a mix max guy)

 

Yeah I'm thinking the drop pod for dred is a necessity. I only hesitate on it as it'll take up a ton of space on my desk during rest of the week. Shelve it maybe in between games... OCD kicking in... must. pose. drop pod...

 

Question:  is there any value in have a rhino/rb/pred on field for the jumppacks to hide behind early on? Both move 12. Well I guess does it depend on the amount of terrain/cover?

[Xenith]

You pretty much have the gist of it. The 10 man tacticals can take the razor, and then split into 2 fives, so you end up with 5 in a tank, then 5 doing something else. Generally works well for the special weapon and sergeant, who wantto get up close, and the the heavy weapon, who may be better standing back. I would generally say you should always split into combat squads unless you are playing kill points, or you need 10 bodies in a unit as they are your hammer unit, or are protecting an independent character.

 

I'm not familiar enough with the books to be able to look everything up or even know if I'm supposed to look something up. So this input is much appreciated.

Starter (and even expert) advice. Look everything up. Army builder is a tool to help you use the codex, not the other way around. Army builder often throws up stuff like that and you need to be able to catch it. Read the codex and army list entries thoroughly to know what you can and cannot do.

 

I once met a guy who thought that you could take 4 heavy weapons in a devastator squad for every 5 guys. he had dreams of running an 8 multimelta unit. He looked so sad when I told him.