Closer to one book to rule them all.It seems from the rumour

[Brother Hadafix]

It seems from the rumours that BA could just as easily be rolled into the core SM codex ala Black Templar as the Black Templars are.

Sanguinary Guard nothing really unique about them, they are an Hour Guard unit with a few rules.
Sanguinary Priests slight rules change as with BT Chaplins,
Baal Predatorsone unique unit avalible with Chapter trait just like Emperors Champion, ,
Death Company & Death Company Dreadnought unique with Chapter trait just as Crusader Squads and Sword Brethern are.
Furioso Dreadnoughts & Libarian-Dreadnoughts don't see any reason why these should not get the Land Raider Crusader treatment, the former is really just equipment really while the latter could be almost any Chapter.

[Jolemai]

In before lock.

[Kristoff]

It seems from the rumours that BA could just as easily be rolled into the core SM codex ala Black Templar as the Black Templars are.

 

Sanguinary Guard nothing really unique about them, they are an Hour Guard unit with a few rules.

Sanguinary Priests slight rules change as with BT Chaplins,

Baal Predatorsone unique unit avalible with Chapter trait just like Emperors Champion, ,

Death Company & Death Company Dreadnought unique with Chapter trait just as Crusader Squads and Sword Brethern are.

Furioso Dreadnoughts & Libarian-Dreadnoughts don't see any reason why these should not get the Land Raider Crusader treatment, the former is really just equipment really while the latter could be almost any Chapter.

Nothing really new there. Besides, if they were going to roll an Angel in any time soon, the Dark Angels would more likely have been done by now.

[Brother Hadafix]

 

Nothing really new there. Besides, if they were going to roll an Angel in any time soon, the Dark Angels would more likely have been done by now.

 

 

DA have had a ton of new units, unlike BA, and there are about 5 codices to go before C:SM gets redone. To me it looks like BA have been set up to be roled in ala BT.

[jeffersonian000]

Just wait for 8th Ed to hit next year, with all Marine chapters rolled up into a single $150 "Adaptus Astartes" mega-codex containing all 1000 Space Marine chapters including the Grey Knights and the Angels of Darkness. Just say'n.

 

SJ

[Leif Bearclaw]

 

 

Nothing really new there. Besides, if they were going to roll an Angel in any time soon, the Dark Angels would more likely have been done by now.

 

 

DA have had a ton of new units, unlike BA, and there are about 5 codices to go before C:SM gets redone. To me it looks like BA have been set up to be roled in ala BT.

 

The DAs got new units to give them something distinct. Whereas before they just had fearless termies, different bikes and their special characters. Whereas the BAs already have their Sanguinary Priests and Guard, Death Company, Baals and Furisos. Plus, all the arguments you presented for the BA's unique stuff being rolled into standard SM applies just as much to the Deathwing, Ravenwing, Nephilim etc.

 

Quite frankly, if BAs were going to be rolled into C:SMs any time soon, then I don't think we'd be seeing a 7th ed BA dex, and might not have seen a SW book earlier this year. Instead we'd probably see a new SM codex, absorbing both the BAs and DAs (and maybe the SWs). So I don't think it's on the cards. The Angels have had a strong enough identity and fanbase to support them as independent factions for almost 20 years, I doubt that's changed massively in the last few months.

[GrandMagnus]

Just wait for 8th Ed to hit next year, with all Marine chapters rolled up into a single $150 "Adaptus Astartes" mega-codex containing all 1000 Space Marine chapters including the Grey Knights and the Angels of Darkness. Just say'n.

 

SJ

That sounds awesome. 

[Kristoff]

 

Nothing really new there. Besides, if they were going to roll an Angel in any time soon, the Dark Angels would more likely have been done by now.

 

DA have had a ton of new units, unlike BA, and there are about 5 codices to go before C:SM gets redone. To me it looks like BA have been set up to be roled in ala BT.

 

Not really. Elite Terminator Squad, Elite Biker Squad, 2 Attack Planes, and 2 "heavy" land speeders. Not quite a ton. Blood Angels got as much in 5th, and even had one of their units co-opted back in with the Codex Marines.

[AdamR]

It seems from the rumours that BA could just as easily be rolled into the core SM codex ala Black Templar as the Black Templars are.

 

Sanguinary Guard nothing really unique about them, they are an Hour Guard unit with a few rules.

Sanguinary Priests slight rules change as with BT Chaplins,

Baal Predatorsone unique unit avalible with Chapter trait just like Emperors Champion, ,

Death Company & Death Company Dreadnought unique with Chapter trait just as Crusader Squads and Sword Brethern are.

Furioso Dreadnoughts & Libarian-Dreadnoughts don't see any reason why these should not get the Land Raider Crusader treatment, the former is really just equipment really while the latter could be almost any Chapter.

 

How is this any different to the old codex?

5th ed - they are marines with some divergent units.

7th ed - they are marines with some divergent units.

 

Why does the new codex make them more roll-back-inable* than the old one?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

*That's my new word. If you don't like it, tough!

[deathspectersgt7]

The sky is falling, the sky is falling.

[No Foes Remain]

 

Just wait for 8th Ed to hit next year, with all Marine chapters rolled up into a single $150 "Adaptus Astartes" mega-codex containing all 1000 Space Marine chapters including the Grey Knights and the Angels of Darkness. Just say'n.

 

SJ

That sounds awesome. 

 

That would be awesome, and the idea of it makes me feeling tingly and warm..... I do not like this feeling, I must go condem an innocent world to exterminartus because the governor might be a heretic. That will sort me out.

[Demus Ragnok]

The sky is falling, the sky is falling.

I agree.

[Iron Father Ferrum]

They all started as one book, and history is cyclical.  It may not happen now or even soon, but it will happen.

[Acebaur]

 

 

 

Nothing really new there. Besides, if they were going to roll an Angel in any time soon, the Dark Angels would more likely have been done by now.

 

 

DA have had a ton of new units, unlike BA, and there are about 5 codices to go before C:SM gets redone. To me it looks like BA have been set up to be roled in ala BT.

 

The DAs got new units to give them something distinct. Whereas before they just had fearless termies, different bikes and their special characters. Whereas the BAs already have their Sanguinary Priests and Guard, Death Company, Baals and Furisos. Plus, all the arguments you presented for the BA's unique stuff being rolled into standard SM applies just as much to the Deathwing, Ravenwing, Nephilim etc.

 

Quite frankly, if BAs were going to be rolled into C:SMs any time soon, then I don't think we'd be seeing a 7th ed BA dex, and might not have seen a SW book earlier this year. Instead we'd probably see a new SM codex, absorbing both the BAs and DAs (and maybe the SWs). So I don't think it's on the cards. The Angels have had a strong enough identity and fanbase to support them as independent factions for almost 20 years, I doubt that's changed massively in the last few months.

 

 

A strong identity and and fanbase mean nothing as far as getting rolled. BT had both and still got rolled. That said, I don't think BA will be rolled... yet ;)

 

Honestly, all SM are essentially similar enough that every chapter could be in one book, with some chapter specific units and rules to support each chapter. (See Crusader Squads in C:SM)

[Leif Bearclaw]

Nothing really new there. Besides, if they were going to roll an Angel in any time soon, the Dark Angels would more likely have been done by now.

DA have had a ton of new units, unlike BA, and there are about 5 codices to go before C:SM gets redone. To me it looks like BA have been set up to be roled in ala BT.

The DAs got new units to give them something distinct. Whereas before they just had fearless termies, different bikes and their special characters. Whereas the BAs already have their Sanguinary Priests and Guard, Death Company, Baals and Furisos. Plus, all the arguments you presented for the BA's unique stuff being rolled into standard SM applies just as much to the Deathwing, Ravenwing, Nephilim etc.

Quite frankly, if BAs were going to be rolled into C:SMs any time soon, then I don't think we'd be seeing a 7th ed BA dex, and might not have seen a SW book earlier this year. Instead we'd probably see a new SM codex, absorbing both the BAs and DAs (and maybe the SWs). So I don't think it's on the cards. The Angels have had a strong enough identity and fanbase to support them as independent factions for almost 20 years, I doubt that's changed massively in the last few months.

A strong identity and and fanbase mean nothing as far as getting rolled. BT had both and still got rolled. That said, I don't think BA will be rolled... yet

Honestly, all SM are essentially similar enough that every chapter could be in one book, with some chapter specific units and rules to support each chapter. (See Crusader Squads in C:SM)

Could be, yes. But that hasn't been the way GW have handled the 'big 4' for as long as 40k and codex books have existed, they've always been separate. And I don't really expect them to change it up. Let alone whether that's actually a good idea.

Did they though? While I'm not doubting the fervour of BT fans, they have never seemed to be present in the numbers of the other variant SM factions. Which is presumably why they were rolled, GW didn't believe there was a large enough paying player-base to justify the cost of them as a stand alone product (not saying that's a correct assessment, I don't know, but it looks like GW thought it was). Then you have to consider the simple inertia, Templars had the Armageddon mini list and one codex under 4th edition, compared with faction that have always been separate entities. Of course it's easier to roll a faction back into it's 'parent' than run the risk of fully homogenising several classically independent faction together.

Not saying that rolling Templars was a good idea (I don't think it was), only that using Templars to infer anything abut the future of the BA/DA/SW ignores too many confounding factors to make a reasonable assumption imo.

[reckoning]

 

 

Just wait for 8th Ed to hit next year, with all Marine chapters rolled up into a single $150 "Adaptus Astartes" mega-codex containing all 1000 Space Marine chapters including the Grey Knights and the Angels of Darkness. Just say'n.

 

SJ

That sounds awesome.

Not at that price it doesn't.

[Raktra]

None of this has come from a rumour. It's just being made up.

[FlamingDeth]

The sky is falling, the sky is falling.

Nope, those are just assault Marines.

[Veteran Sergeant]

The Blood Angels were never that much different from C:SM. Their unit changes were mostly superficial. Angry dreadnoughts with claws! Angry Marines! Apotehcaries with big cups! Faster tanks!

 

 

I'm not really sure what kind of differentiating you thought there was before. But it didn't exist. Was a bunch of renaming of other units with tiny differences to justify the rename. If "Sanguinary Guard" got rolled back into "Honor Guard" there'd only be the tiniest functional difference.

 

 

The Blood Angels get their own codex because they can sell one on their own. That's the benefit of being part of the "Big Four". Twenty years of model support.

[Stormborn]

I'd prefer to see one single book with maybe a supplement for space wolves or just an appendix for personalising chapters and characters (maybe chuck a few pre-made chapters like they did with guard regiments a few editions back.

[Cpt_Reaper]

Am I the only one who doesn't want to see "One Codex To Rule Them All"?

In my opinion more would be lost that gained. In exchange for shutting up the "but I want that weapon in my Chapter" people and maybe a faster development cycle (which either goes faster at the cost of innovation or slower to perfect the super codex) we can possibly lose the character, uniqueness and flavour of the Big 4. It happened to Templars.

 

I just don't see the benefits outweighing the costs of such a move.

[Kaedes Nex]

Codex: Angels of Death

[Yodhrin]

Am I the only one who doesn't want to see "One Codex To Rule Them All"?

 

In my opinion more would be lost that gained. In exchange for shutting up the "but I want that weapon in my Chapter" people and maybe a faster development cycle (which either goes faster at the cost of innovation or slower to perfect the super codex) we can possibly lose the character, uniqueness and flavour of the Big 4. It happened to Templars.

 

I just don't see the benefits outweighing the costs of such a move.

 

I think the point is almost all of the "character, uniqueness and flavour" comes from models and fluff, and there's no real functional barrier to rolling them all together. Now whether you believe GW will make a good job of it or half-ass it like they did with BT, or whether you find it a desirable idea is another matter, but it's possible; eg, assuming appropriate Chapter Tactics for Blood Angels, and the option to take Inferno Pistols, Hand Flamers, and Jump Packs was added to the generic Honour Guard squad - what would the functional difference be compared to Sanguinary Guard? A minor nerf to their pre-charge bolter weapon shooting?

 

Honestly, for my money, I'd rather see GW sit down and take serious time to craft the next edition, building all the basic, core faction lists concurrently aiming for a reasonable compromise between balance and flexibility and including all of them in the BRB - end the "Codex cycle" entirely, then drive sales with campaign books and boxed sets containing variant army lists, and use those as an excuse to release new stuff for factions rather than tweaking the codex every few years. Hell they could go nuts and actually fill in the largely vacant 8 millennia between the end of The Scouring and "present day" 40K - Heresy-style Age of Apostasy series anyone?

[dusara217]

 

Am I the only one who doesn't want to see "One Codex To Rule Them All"?In my opinion more would be lost that gained. In exchange for shutting up the "but I want that weapon in my Chapter" people and maybe a faster development cycle (which either goes faster at the cost of innovation or slower to perfect the super codex) we can possibly lose the character, uniqueness and flavour of the Big 4. It happened to Templars. I just don't see the benefits outweighing the costs of such a move.

I think the point is almost all of the "character, uniqueness and flavour" comes from models and fluff, and there's no real functional barrier to rolling them all together. Now whether you believe GW will make a good job of it or half-ass it like they did with BT, or whether you find it a desirable idea is another matter, but it's possible; eg, assuming appropriate Chapter Tactics for Blood Angels, and the option to take Inferno Pistols, Hand Flamers, and Jump Packs was added to the generic Honour Guard squad - what would the functional difference be compared to Sanguinary Guard? A minor nerf to their pre-charge bolter weapon shooting? Honestly, for my money, I'd rather see GW sit down and take serious time to craft the next edition, building all the basic, core faction lists concurrently aiming for a reasonable compromise between balance and flexibility and including all of them in the BRB - end the "Codex cycle" entirely, then drive sales with campaign books and boxed sets containing variant army lists, and use those as an excuse to release new stuff for factions rather than tweaking the codex every few years. Hell they could go nuts and actually fill in the largely vacant 8 millennia between the end of The Scouring and "present day" 40K - Heresy-style Age of Apostasy series anyone?

It would be nice to see some decent codeces for a change. It would be cool for the codeces to be written from the point of the Emperor so that the fluff would be more consistent and to force the writrrs to collaberate more. You could just say that the changing writing styles are due to tje Big E's Godhood forcing him into Pschyzophrenia. Also, they could add a new faction; Emperor's Daemons, aka angels (Legion of the Damned basically become their CSM). Then, make Legion of the Damned just SM Veterans and heroes; something like "Only the greatest of the Emperor's Astartes are chosen by the Emperor to serve him for eternity amongst the Legion of the Damned; for only the heroes amongst heroes can claim to be worthy to resist Chaos until the end of time"

 

Of course, make the rules more stable, but the fluff is what draws people to 40k, not the game itself. I don't give a rat's ass about the game, I just love the settin itself. Of course, better rules would make me actually want to start playing the tabletop game...

 

Also, srry bout gramatical errors, Im on a tablet with a crappy keyboard rite.now

[Gaweda]

This seems a rather pointless conversation. We are getting a new Blood Angels codex. We haven't been rolled into the csm one. Therefore, logic dictates we are neither one step closer or one step further away, we are simply Blood Angels getting a new codex.

 

Which is awesome!

 

Besides, GW would lose money by selling less codex's. Sanguinius knows I have too many already!