Lord Asvaldir Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 Thinking about how to use R&H to supplement a CSM army, bit stuck with choices. Why you take R&H allies is clear-spam hordes and artillery, and the heavy support choice is easy-wyverns, thudd guns or medausa, but I'm then left with the point sink of the command squad, and what to do for the troop tax. One thought is command squad just with a lascannon or flakk missile launcher, net command vox and banner of hate, along with an infantry platoon, 3 squads of 20, 2 autoannons in each squad. However that doesn't really supplement my assault oriented CSM army terribly well, so my second thought is 50 man mutant rabble squad, covenant of khorne on the champ and just rush them forward with the arch daemongue, his command squad can hang back and shoot stuff. I'm leaning towards the second choice, but the bigger problem than the list building decision is the modelling one-sure I could use 50 cultists, but I'd much rather use some unique models. Now if spawn could be used as the troop tax-that be an easy pick. I plan on taking 3 spawn with my R&H allies since they are super cheap compared to CSM spawn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucio Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 I'd suggest that a CC orientated troop selection is the way forward to both screen your hard hitters and tie up targets to make them easier to attack. As for modelling unique models, I've seen some effective conversions mixing in Chaos Mauraders, Empire Free Company and weapons from the Cadians and Catchan troop sets (plus maybe Forge World renegade spures) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Asvaldir Posted December 9, 2014 Author Share Posted December 9, 2014 I'm leaning towards mutant rabble horde, partially because it will be cheaper money wise to acquire. Marauders+forge world sprues might actually work, since it looks like you can grab just the marauder legs off ebay fairly cheaply. I was also thinking of just converting cultists-use green stuff for some mutations, change out some of their weapons so they look more unique. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaliGn Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 You could mix in fantasy forsaken, they are pricey but lots of parts to convert other kits with, be tricky because they are odd fitting but I'm sure it can be done. Empire flagellants work well too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slave to Darkness Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 You could mix in fantasy forsaken, they are pricey but lots of parts to convert other kits with, be tricky because they are odd fitting but I'm sure it can be done. Empire flagellants work well too. Two of my fave kits for converting :tu: The forsaken kit makes better possessed than the actual possessed box, and you get some nice god specific bits as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Asvaldir Posted December 9, 2014 Author Share Posted December 9, 2014 I love forsaken, I picked up a box awhile back for my WoC. Unfortunately they are not cheap, and for a big unit like mutant rabble I'd only send up using bits here and there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slave to Darkness Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 Empire flagellants just come in handy for everything as well. Might pick up a few more boxes and another set of Forsaken over xmas, my Word Bearers/Crimson Slaughter could use another blob of Cultists and another 20 Possessed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrautScientist Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 When it comes to converting and kitbashing the right models to represent you traitors and/or mutants, there's a very good inspiration thread right here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucio Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 When it comes to converting and kitbashing the right models to represent you traitors and/or mutants, there's a very good inspiration thread right here. Which is the thread I couldn't find but thought of when this came up The Cultists in there are seriously top-notch conversion work and painting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McGibs Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 If dollar cost is what you're looking for, you can't beat skaven for mutant rat-cultists! 20 bucks on ebay will net you 40 of the blood-isle clanrats. Pick up some dark eldar pistol arms for weapons, and theyre good to go (theyre a bit short for 'humans', but a few boosted bases takes care of that). Conversely, skaven storm-vermin are also pretty inexpensive, at around 30bucks for 20, and they come with lots of bits and more human scale. They make for good weapon and sigil carriers, as well as squad leaders. http://mcgibs.com/junk/chaos-cultists.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hopkins Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 good shout was also looking at beastmen ungor for mutants Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperors Immortals Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 I like teh Skaven Idea McGibs, hadnt seen that before. I found Beastmen torsos on marauder legs was good and Beastmen legs with marauder torsos was pretty cool too, 2 main looks and a heap of cultists/mutants for pretty cheap. Hope that helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Asvaldir Posted December 10, 2014 Author Share Posted December 10, 2014 I despise Skaven, I could never bring myself to buy a single skaven model, beastmen ungors on the other hand would work well for mutants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 Buy one box of Zombis, one box of ghouls , one box of beastman and one of flaglants. All the mutant parts you will ever need.Buy two 10 mans of cadians and you have the renegades covered too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McGibs Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 I despise Skaven, I could never bring myself to buy a single skaven model, beastmen ungors on the other hand would work well for mutants. Just curious as to why? The old skaven models were some of the ugliest things ever made, but all their new sculpts are of fantastic quality. Just don't like rats? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheesh Mode Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 If dollar cost is what you're looking for, you can't beat skaven for mutant rat-cultists! 20 bucks on ebay will net you 40 of the blood-isle clanrats. Pick up some dark eldar pistol arms for weapons, and theyre good to go (theyre a bit short for 'humans', but a few boosted bases takes care of that). Conversely, skaven storm-vermin are also pretty inexpensive, at around 30bucks for 20, and they come with lots of bits and more human scale. They make for good weapon and sigil carriers, as well as squad leaders. http://mcgibs.com/junk/chaos-cultists.jpg I actually like this idea a lot. However, I am will likely add human heads and varying body shapes then rely on painting to establish a more distrubing mutant theme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatOneMarshal Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 If you need a lot of models on the cheap there's wargames factory great troops http://wargamesfactory.com/webstore/alien-suns/shock-troops-sci-fi-greatcoat-troopers Also some nice renegade heads http://www.pig-iron-productions.com/hd1-kolony-rebel-head-sprues-p-15.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheex Posted December 11, 2014 Share Posted December 11, 2014 If you need a lot of models on the cheap there's wargames factory great troops http://wargamesfactory.com/webstore/alien-suns/shock-troops-sci-fi-greatcoat-troopers Also some nice renegade heads http://www.pig-iron-productions.com/hd1-kolony-rebel-head-sprues-p-15.html WGF bodies are great, but the heads and arms are ugly as sin. I got a few of the bodies as part of a big IG trade, threw on some Pig Iron heads and Cadian flamers, and they fit right in with my GW auto gun cultists for some R&H traitors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Asvaldir Posted December 11, 2014 Author Share Posted December 11, 2014 I despise Skaven, I could never bring myself to buy a single skaven model, beastmen ungors on the other hand would work well for mutants. Just curious as to why? The old skaven models were some of the ugliest things ever made, but all their new sculpts are of fantastic quality. Just don't like rats? Nothing to do with the sculpts, just don't like rats, especially man sized versions of them. Lots of good ideas, seems with all the plastic kits GW has floating around these days some kit bashed mutant rabble won't be difficult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bozo69pd Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 I picked up some lord of the rings goblins for use as mutants/zombies because you get so many of them for cheap, they look the part, and they are so easy to put together and paint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 I plan on taking 3 spawn with my R&H allies since they are super cheap compared to CSM spawn. unfortunately, this is impossible. Spawn may only be used as non-compulsory troops choices when your Arch-Demagogue has the covenant of tzeentch and is your WARLORD (which means: not from an allied detachment). The big problem here is that CSM also very much depend on your HQ being the Warlord, as his mark determines what you will be able to bring as troops. doesn't matter if you don't field a chaos lord, but cultists are redundant with renegades, CSM suck and chosen (black legion supplement) are overpriced, all of them lacking good transport options. IMO, 5 noise marines with a blast master is what you want, and thus: a slaaneshi chaos lord as your warlord. R&H as ALLIES are propably best served with minimum command squad (Las/Plas) and infantry platoon (military training and ACs) plus either some wyverns or earthshaker emplacements or a colossus. Aegis + icarus (demagogue) would be a sensible inventment. a 2nd CAD would open up more HS slots to bring all the guns, but that's also another 150 points of abovementioned infantry. if you bring mutant rabble, add an enforcer with drug injector and LEAVE YOUR ARCH-DEMAGOGUE OUT OF THEM (you gain nothing from him but make him vulnerable to assaults). Instead, put your CSM HQ here for CC punch and fearless. Khârn or a dark apostle with MoK wouldn't be bad either for max overcharge. Don't expect to get the charge with footslogging infantry, though, and after the first turn of CC, all your bonuses are gone and you're worse than cultists/nothing but sheep to the slaughter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheesh Mode Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 What? The chaos lord does not need to be the warlord for his mark to unlock cult-specific troops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bozo69pd Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 He needs to be in the primary detachment. Although doesn't in 7th the wording primary detachment also apply to your allies now? Like you have allies in your primary detachment, you can have a 2nd detachment also with allies etc. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Asvaldir Posted December 17, 2014 Author Share Posted December 17, 2014 I plan on taking 3 spawn with my R&H allies since they are super cheap compared to CSM spawn. unfortunately, this is impossible. Spawn may only be used as non-compulsory troops choices when your Arch-Demagogue has the covenant of tzeentch and is your WARLORD (which means: not from an allied detachment). That's a shame. However I disagree that CSM depend on your HQ choice being your warlord. Sure noise marines are good and they would go rather well with R&H, but if you're not using cult troops, which I never do then it doesn't matter. R&H with allied CSM is actually probably better than the reverse I imagine. 2 infantry platoons for troops, you can then take loads of chaos spawn super cheap, load of heavy support with artillery, then use allied CSM for air support (either a drake or hell blade), a noise marine squad and oblits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 doesn't in 7th the wording primary detachment also apply to your allies now? p. 117: "...whichever Detachment contains your Warlord is your Primary Detachment." p. 122 (Allied, detachment, Restrictions): "Your Warlord can never be choasen from this detachment." @Asvaldir: what HQ & Troops do you use? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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