Aspiringchaoschampion Posted December 17, 2014 Share Posted December 17, 2014 I rarely run cult marines as troops either i prefere chaos tactical marines Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaeron Posted December 18, 2014 Share Posted December 18, 2014 If dollar cost is what you're looking for, you can't beat skaven for mutant rat-cultists! 20 bucks on ebay will net you 40 of the blood-isle clanrats. Pick up some dark eldar pistol arms for weapons, and theyre good to go (theyre a bit short for 'humans', but a few boosted bases takes care of that). Conversely, skaven storm-vermin are also pretty inexpensive, at around 30bucks for 20, and they come with lots of bits and more human scale. They make for good weapon and sigil carriers, as well as squad leaders. http://mcgibs.com/junk/chaos-cultists.jpg That's a superb ideal - they look lovely too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Asvaldir Posted December 18, 2014 Author Share Posted December 18, 2014 @Asvaldir: what HQ & Troops do you use? Chaos lord, sometimes a dark apostle when I try to be very Word Bearers fluffy, always 2 CSM squads in rhinos with plasma guns for troops and some cultists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheesh Mode Posted December 18, 2014 Share Posted December 18, 2014 Dark Apostles actually seem very useful for Renegades and Heretics thanks to their leadership bubble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Dark Apostles actually seem very useful for Renegades and Heretics thanks to their leadership bubble. how many units of 20 can you fit within 6"? Na, you get so many command voxes on your (fanatic) demagogues, I wouldn't even bother with a banner of hate. What's so bad about cannon fodder running anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Asvaldir Posted December 19, 2014 Author Share Posted December 19, 2014 Well better to have them hang in there than run away, and a dark apostle is going to do that for you. Especially for an assault oriented R&H army with say 2-3 mutant rabble hordes, you can keep at least 2 squads in the bubble and not have to rely on a squishy command squad. So he does have some use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 2-3 mutant rabble is 100-150 models. The main reason that this is not an assault-oriented army is that you really don't want to move this pile of miniatures across the table. After 2 movement phases, before even one charge happened, the game has gone one for 3 hours of realtime and your opponent quits because he is tired of watching you move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aspiringchaoschampion Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Id love to add in some renegades and heretics to my Plague Wolves bur that means id have to give up my daemon allies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Nay good sir! Renegades Primary - Psyker traits. -> Summon Daemons CSM Allies - Crimson Slaughter -> Make Sorcerer a Daemon -> Summon Daemons All 3 Chaos factions! :D At least I think that works, I'd have to check the rules on Malific again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aspiringchaoschampion Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Nay good sir! Renegades Primary - Psyker traits. -> Summon Daemons CSM Allies - Crimson Slaughter -> Make Sorcerer a Daemon -> Summon Daemons All 3 Chaos factions! :D At least I think that works, I'd have to check the rules on Malific again. Very true once ive got my marines to a point where im happy with them looks like il be needing IA13 and guard models :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Yeah I've been thinking on it, and the R&H list is just too much fun, I'm going to start pressuring tournament admins to get it accepted and go nuts. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheesh Mode Posted December 21, 2014 Share Posted December 21, 2014 It is also worth considering that we can buy veteran squads with meltas and deepstrike them in the enemy back field. That alongside marauders with outflank would make an interesting accompaniment to an aggressive Chaos Marine Army. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted December 21, 2014 Share Posted December 21, 2014 But those Veterans come in more expensive than the same amount of melta-shots on CSM terminators. ...and why is it that everybody thinks guardsmen equivalents make for viable assault units anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheesh Mode Posted December 21, 2014 Share Posted December 21, 2014 You misunderstand, the term 'assault' is used in reference to a rapid-attack unit which may or may not have close combat capabilities. What is more, that single unit of guardsmen is more economic than a unit of suicide terminators and can potentially survive for a longer period of time due to the enemy's reluctance to divert fire to a five man unit of guardsmen. Even if they do that simply means they are not shooting at something more important. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted December 21, 2014 Share Posted December 21, 2014 I wouldnt use the RH list for assaulting, I'd use it for. 1. Mechanicum, Dark Magi. 2. Random psykers. 3. Cannon fodder. 4. Mech Support (not sure you all have noticed, but CSM pure isnt the most shooty) I'm sourcing models for a Mechanicum list right now, with my Decimator and Defiler, just because, allied with some marines, maybe even that Crimson Slaughter idea so I can summon up some Daemons too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted December 21, 2014 Share Posted December 21, 2014 the term 'assault' is used in reference to a rapid-attack unit which may or may not have close combat capabilities. a rapid attack unit that isn't rapid and can't attack is what I call a bad unit. What is more, that single unit of guardsmen is more economic than a unit of suicide terminators and can potentially survive for a longer period of time due to the enemy's reluctance to divert fire to a five man unit of guardsmen. Even if they do that simply means they are not shooting at something more important. a 5 man unit has exactly 1 melta shot and pays ginormous prices for upgrades like deep-strike or military training. besides that, it is the perfect target for things like pintle-mounted storm bolters and exess weaponry of all flavours because - other than those terminators - the chance they'll die from it is actually quite good. summon up some Daemons much better idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lagrath Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 Well, it sounds like my recent ideas fit into this thread nicely... Two days ago I went to a local tournament with a lot of good players while running a 1500 triple chaos unbound list of CSM, Daemons, and R&H. It had a good summoning component to it with the IA13 maelfic vehicle upgrade added on. I went undefeated and took second place overall. If anyone is curious, my list and the report of how things worked out are here: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279118-army-log-hexfleet-virules-nurgle-csm-daemons-and-rh/page-2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheesh Mode Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 the term 'assault' is used in reference to a rapid-attack unit which may or may not have close combat capabilities. a rapid attack unit that isn't rapid and can't attack is what I call a bad unit. What is more, that single unit of guardsmen is more economic than a unit of suicide terminators and can potentially survive for a longer period of time due to the enemy's reluctance to divert fire to a five man unit of guardsmen. Even if they do that simply means they are not shooting at something more important. a 5 man unit has exactly 1 melta shot and pays ginormous prices for upgrades like deep-strike or military training. besides that, it is the perfect target for things like pintle-mounted storm bolters and exess weaponry of all flavours because - other than those terminators - the chance they'll die from it is actually quite good. Deepstriking next to the target is not a rapid attack? Also, fifteen points is overpriced? Let's consider that whatever is attempting to kill this unit is not shooting - or moving towards - something else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted December 24, 2014 Share Posted December 24, 2014 fifteen points is overpriced? Let's consider that whatever is attempting to kill this unit is not shooting - or moving towards - something else. deep strike + 5 veteran + 1 melter buys you 2 terminators. I would consider shooting weapons worth mentioning at Terminators, but not at 5 guys who die just as well to stock stormbolters or the hull-flamer of the vehicle that they targeted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheesh Mode Posted December 24, 2014 Share Posted December 24, 2014 fifteen points is overpriced? Let's consider that whatever is attempting to kill this unit is not shooting - or moving towards - something else. deep strike + 5 veteran + 1 melter buys you 2 terminators. I would consider shooting weapons worth mentioning at Terminators, but not at 5 guys who die just as well to stock stormbolters or the hull-flamer of the vehicle that they targeted. The same vehicle which would be better suited shooting at something else? Well ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted December 24, 2014 Share Posted December 24, 2014 as long as its main weapon isn't ordnance, it doesn't have to choose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheesh Mode Posted December 24, 2014 Share Posted December 24, 2014 Perhaps there is a misunderstanding and I failed to effectively express my point: a unit that is not a super heavy or without the split fire rule can only fire at a single enemy unit a turn. What weapons the enemy uses to kill the guardsmen is irrelevant as the weaponry is forced to focus its fire on a single unit which is a waste of potential maneuvering or firing upon other, more threatening, targets. Simply put: threat overload. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted December 24, 2014 Share Posted December 24, 2014 and as long as the main weapon of a vehicle isn't ordnance or skyfire, it may very well pivot and ALSO shoot at a target across the table but lay down its hull-mounted heavy flamer template so that it covers a many models of its target unit as possible (zero) and all of your veterans. Likewise, the same is possible with flamers in infantry units with 24" range weapons. Assault units are happy about easy targets within charge range that provide them extra movement, too! you have to realize that you do not simply present another target with those veterans, but also present a target for weapon that couldn't be fired otherwise. Terminators on the other hand are more of a thread and draw fire of a different kind: high S low AP that typically has a medium to high range and really could hurt your vehicles if not applied to more immediate threads. 3 Terminators fire 3 combi-meltas after deep-strike, but they could also bring a chainfist and assault next turn. That is a thread that one might dedicate, say, a predator worth of lascannons to - but never to 5 guys with a melter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minionboy Posted December 24, 2014 Share Posted December 24, 2014 As much as I'd like to make up a good use for R&H veterans, deep striking with meltas is probably not a solid start... As Nehekhare said, CSM can already do that with more effectively with termicide. Some of the big things I'm enjoying with my CSM are a Tz Arch-demagogue with obliterators or hades reapers, wyverns (yay barrage), and russes (exterminators with melta sponsons). The renegade infantry platoons are cool, but nothing crazy, a couple 10-mans in chimeras does fine though. Unfortunately the strengths of the list are in the HS slot, and at least locally, double CAD isn't allowed... Hopefully with all these other armies getting multiple CAD-like detachments, people will get their head out of the sand and let the older books take double CAS, but that's a whole other discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheesh Mode Posted December 24, 2014 Share Posted December 24, 2014 and as long as the main weapon of a vehicle isn't ordnance or skyfire, it may very well pivot and ALSO shoot at a target across the table but lay down its hull-mounted heavy flamer template so that it covers a many models of its target unit as possible (zero) and all of your veterans. That is very specific. *shrugs* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.