New Chapter - Aurora Dragons

[Sigvard]

Hi Guys.

 

I am in the process of formulating of making a new IA Chapter under the name of the Aurora Dragons.

 

I have a couple of ideas floating around -  Chapter Planet, Colour Scheme, Codex etc. (which for the record will be a combinaton of Space Wolves and Blood Angels - I will state here clearly they are not going to be a "successor" to the Space Wolves in any way, I just love the codex, the play style and the tribal aspect the codex creates.)

 

I have some questions to put to the collective experience of the IA board.

 

What are the main reasons for a Chapter to have an unknown founding and to not known where they came from in terms of progenitor and primarch?

 

Sticking with the Wolves codex is it plausible a non-space wolf chapter would use beasts from the home planet as mounts - for example giant lizards (ice drakes in my case)?

 

I have been toying with the idea of hinting either at Salamanders gene stock or Raven Guard -  (basically they are going to be almost pure white skin with solid blue eyes ) Salamanders possibly more than anything the home world is a deathworld in the system of a dying star, it is a planet rich in natural resource and the hardy humans who live there live in tunnels under the ground close to the core of the planet, along with all of the planet's fauna who have adapted to life in the....wait for it......."Core".

 

Also final question due to living under ground for the most part they have almost 0 involvement in air combat apart from low flying tranports and speeders, their assault marines tend to deply in transports without Jump Packs or are very skilled on bikes does this sound plausible?

 

Thanks for any help in advance guys

 

Sigvard

 

[girot]

Hello Brother Sigvard,

 

I like where you are going with this new chapter.  I highly recommend you read "Brothers of the Snake"

http://www.blacklibrary.com/Images/Product/DefaultBL/xlarge/brothers-of-the-snake-sb.jpg

 

You will find it MOST informative, particularly the bit about how they ride sea serpents.

 

There are generations of successors so far removed from their original legions they technically vanilla marines (biologically speaking).  Mutations like extreme skin color are actually quite common and not exclusive to any of the "famous" chapters.  

 

Also originating biology does not belay the flavor of a Chapter's home world and culture.  You want Ice Drakes?  Go for it!  Just be sure to keep WYSIWYG when you're modelling/converting your minis.

 

Oh, also the last question about assault format?  You can take ASM squads without Jump Packs and put them in transports.  That's been an option since I started playing in 3rd edition.

[Sigvard]

Thanks for the feedback Girot.

 

What do you think to the reasons behind a chpater not know their origins?

[girot]

Hmmm...

 

You could write it so that whatever chapter they were originally was wiped out down to a single squad.  That squad was taken in by whatever planet their chapter sacrificed themselves to save.  They and whatever geneseed could be saved is preserved while the planet works to help them rebuild.  Since Chapter X is lost their hosts take to naming them after the fiercest creature on their planet,  the Aurora Dragons.  

 

Fast forward a few thousand years.

 

The only original member of Chapter X is an ancient and surly Venerable Dreadnought.  Out of respect for the dead and to avoid his own grief he never speaks of Chapter X.  He only ever speaks of the coming glory of the Aurora Dragons when he's lecturing the Initiates.  There is no living soul, save himself, that knows who their progenitors really are.

 

Their academy are the remains of the Chapter X battle barge that had been buried beneath the capitol city of the planet.  The Dragons have been recruiting from the local populace for generations.

and so on.  Does this work for you?

[Quozzo]

The reasons why a chapter doesnt know their proginator is rarely touched on. Im not sure if any reasons are given for the Blood Ravens or Red Scorpions not knowing from which legion they originate. Although the the indications are that the Red Scorpions do know themselves, they just arent telling, so no-one in universe is privy to that information which is how an IA is written, usually from the perspective of an inquisitor.

[Sigvard]

Thanks guys this is really great stuff!!!

 

I might take your idea Girot and run with it a little, except I might make that the this Ven Dread is so old his memory has begun to fade into dream and he only remembers scant details of the past.

 

I really want my Second Company "The Iron Drakes" to be out amongst the stars searching for signs of their past, possibly guided by the fragmented memories of the ancient hero. It works two fold for me as they are from a reasonably tribal homeworld, each of the communities though reasonably high in tech still function like a tribe with an elder council etc.

 

A further question. Do you think its feasible for the chapter to have a loose structure - so apart from the Void Fairing 2nd Company, the Veteran First Company and the Initiate 10th Company, do you think the chapter could focus more on individual squads under the leadership of a veteran  rather than a fully functioning battle company then when company strength is needed they take the squads available to them?

[NightrawenII]

Hi Guys.

 

What are the main reasons for a Chapter to have an unknown founding and to not known where they came from in terms of progenitor and primarch?

 

Sigvard

It's incredibly hard.

 

A.) The information about every, except 13th, Founding is stored on Terra.

B.) The Chapter is obliged to send a gene-seed tithe to Mars on regular basis for purity checks.

C.) The Primarch and gene-seed source is essential part of any Chapter cult and personality, so every marine knows his primogenitor.

D.) Unknown origins are Mark of Lazyness, the Fift Chaos God.

 

+++

 

Sorry, but Gitor's idea doesn't work. Crimson Fists recovering from their losses after Rynn's World disaster are exception not a rule. A Chapter with a single squad left is as good as dead. Really.

 

+++

 

 

The Blood Ravens loss of their legacy is part of their theme, ie. search of knowledge. So it's to a degree acceptable and by the looks of it, something Sigvard wants to achieve.

 

 

~ NightrawenII

[girot]

Fair enough.  Since he's going with a Space Wolves + Blood Angels angle would it be possible for some distant successor of each to get hit hard then combine the survivors into a new chapter?  That could be explained away easily....

 

Void Wolves and Blood Lances (successors) somewhere out on the rim were rivals.  Then a Warp Storm hits the region they're in and they are forced to work together to survive the continuous onslaught of demons and such.  After a couple centuries they are force to combine their resources and eventually merge into a single chapter.  Once the storm passes they settle on a new world and start from scratch.  Has a real Underworld vibe considering we're talking about merging vampires and werewolves, lol.  Imagine squads of Wulfen painted up like Death Company!  :p

[girot]

@Sigvard:  Having been down this road myself?  Trying to sell a new chapter with an oddball/mysterious past is virtually impossible.  You can have as much flavor in your chapter's background as you like.  It doesn't matter what the rest of us think or say as long as your army lists are legal.

[NightrawenII]

Fair enough.  Since he's going with a Space Wolves + Blood Angels angle would it be possible for some distant successor of each to get hit hard then combine the survivors into a new chapter?  That could be explained away easily....

Never happened, and most likely never going to happen. First off, the SW successor is impossible according to current lore. Second, this was discussed looong time ago and IIRC, the concesus was that the Chapters of different gene-seed are... well culturaly different to work like one single entity.

 

Third, he said he want use Salamander or RavenGuard gene-seed.

 

@Sigvard

To be more constructive.

It was, and I hope it still is, unofficial policy of Liber not to care what Codex you are using to represent your Chapter on tabletop. In fact, it was encouraged to keep the Combat Doctrine section as vague as possible because the Codexes and Army Lists change (prove me wrong), Lore stays the same. And it's kind of lame to rewrite your CD section every time you change your army list or use a different codex or try a new unit et cetera et cetera...

 

The ubiquitous thing with DIY Chapter is almighty WHY? - If you can reasonable explain the oddities of your Chapter in the article then almost anything is fine.

 

 

~ NightrawenII

[Sigvard]

Thanks for the feedback guys. I really appreciate all the he so far. So it is looking like an unknown origin may not work in this instance.

 

First off. I would like to clarify they are not going to be a Space Wolves successor -no sir, happened once with the Wolf Brothers and pretty much would never happen again.

 

I was leaning towards having the chapter nearly crippled but either having another chapter take them under their wing and recover but I feel t hat would be a creative theft from the Celestial Lions back story. In which case I would then consider putting them as Salamanders successors due to the pale/albino-like skin and solid blue eyes, they are also great artisans and are very tribal in their make up. They still move in and out of their old communities freely or Blood Angels due them being artisans and very proficient at lightning assaults and hand to hand combat,further from that I was thinking of having them with berserkers, marines who have fallen to the bloodlust of melee and are unleashed upon enemy rather than deployed.

 

The Gene-Seed tithe. This clearly does not happen for all chapter surely.? Storm Wardens for example have mo idea who their founder is due to the tragic loss of their Chapter Command and Vet Company who are all in stasis, surely if they provide the tithe they would find out who their Primarch and Progenitor is reasonably quickly.? I also could not see the Carchaodoms providing tithe when they disappear for centuries at a time?

 

Also see my previous post regarding loose chapter structure?

[NightrawenII]

The Gene-Seed tithe. This clearly does not happen for all chapter surely.?

No, it's mandatory, one of the sparks which started Badab War was Astral Claws being late with theirs.

 

Also see my previous post regarding loose chapter structure?

 

The ubiquitous thing with DIY Chapter is almighty WHY? - If you can reasonable explain the oddities of your Chapter in the article then almost anything is fine.

 

 

~ NightrawenII

[Quozzo]

The Gene-Seed tithe. This clearly does not happen for all chapter surely.? Storm Wardens for example have mo idea who their founder is due to the tragic loss of their Chapter Command and Vet Company who are all in stasis, surely if they provide the tithe they would find out who their Primarch and Progenitor is reasonably quickly.? I also could not see the Carchaodoms providing tithe when they disappear for centuries at a time?

Also see my previous post regarding loose chapter structure?

The AdMech cannot determine the proginator of a chapter by geneseed alone. At least they have made no attempt to do so for several chapters, including the newly recorded Carmine Blades in the new 7th ed BA codex. Astorath turned up and told them why some of their marines were going bat :cuss crazy. Raven Guard have no idea who their proginator is too, which is why they collect relics as they may hold clues, and to hold onto the past since they had clearly lapsed recording it. Why a chapter doesnt know their proginator is actually unknown in itself. Logic dictates they would, even by way of mouth, but some dont. I wouldnt expand on it, if the chapter doesnt know their parent then they probably dont know which founding they are from, as the two usually go hand in hand.