DC vs. Sanguinary Guard vs. Honor Guard vs. Vanguard Vets

[appiah4]

Yup, it's Power Sword only now. Which isn't too bad at STR 5, INT 5...

 

Yeah but it completely screws with my unit :/

[marine7312000]

 

Yup, it's Power Sword only now. Which isn't too bad at STR 5, INT 5...

 

Yeah but it completely screws with my unit :/

 

To the freezer with Champion!! Unless he's already painted, in which case I feel your pain.

[Frater Cornelius]

He is already included in the Command Squad, just like the Apo. You take him, whether you like it or not.

[appiah4]

Cqnt be bothered with remodelling.. It will have to count as a sword seeing as otherise is not even possible.

[appiah4]

OK so I was looking at the Command Squad wargear choices today, and you know what, for the price of a Melta Bomb, who wouldn't take a Flamer? Or three?

 

Company Champion, Power Sword, Bolt Pistol, Combat Shield

Sanguinary Novitiate, Bolt Pistol, Chainsword

Veteran, Company Banner, Flamer

Veteran, Power Fist, Flamer

Veteran, Flamer

[Remtek]

Ran into overkill issues with 10DC 1 fist + Dante, game went fine, but could never use hit'n'run or open up transports pre-assault. I might actually try an Assault or Command squad just to get some extra meltaguns and run the DC alone.

 

SG had the same overkill issues until i lost most of them to rear ap2/ap1 shots. I'm leaning towards  smaller/cheaper unit's, it's better for counter charging or games with many objectives. Not to comfortable with 5-600 point deathstars with no invul or invis. First game i got an orbital from behind which took at a huge amount of points. 

[Frater Cornelius]

Ran into overkill issues with 10DC 1 fist + Dante, game went fine, but could never use hit'n'run or open up transports pre-assault. I might actually try an Assault or Command squad just to get some extra meltaguns and run the DC alone.

 

SG had the same overkill issues until i lost most of them to rear ap2/ap1 shots. I'm leaning towards  smaller/cheaper unit's, it's better for counter charging or games with many objectives. Not to comfortable with 5-600 point deathstars with no invul or invis. First game i got an orbital from behind which took at a huge amount of points. 

 

Disordered charge helps somewhat.

[JamesI]

With the formation that gives Vanguard free power weapons or lightning claws, is anyone reconsidering where to use Vanguard?  The idea of Vanguard with all power weapons and a few storm shields seems pretty good to me.

[Jolemai]

In the previous incarnation I have used Dante with Astorath and 13 Death Company with Jump Packs (it was an Apocalypse game). Whilst it may look good on paper, it is simply too brutal which results in a Skullhamma instagibbing everyone afterwards (or the equivalent). Until they put subsequent combats back in the game, it's often better to stay in combat.

 

In short, Hit and Run on the Death Company is overrated. Yes it can help if you are charged but if that happens, then you're using your Death Company wrong imo.

[Karhedron]

Ran into overkill issues with 10DC 1 fist + Dante, game went fine, but could never use hit'n'run or open up transports pre-assault.

I thought DC could take infernus pistols to crack that particular nut?

 

Hit and Run on the Death Company is overrated. Yes it can help if you are charged but if that happens, then you're using your Death Company wrong imo.

There are other fast killy units out, TWC being the obvious example. It can be hard to guarantee the charge against these guys in which case Dante make good H&R insurance as well as being a beatstick to counter any lurking Thunderlords.

 

With the formation that gives Vanguard free power weapons or lightning claws, is anyone reconsidering where to use Vanguard? The idea of Vanguard with all power weapons and a few storm shields seems pretty good to me.

They do indeed look a lot more attractive when stocked to the gills with free upgrades. I have a unit that I have not used much since they lost the REAL heroic intervention rule. I might dust them off and get them buddies. I don't have any Sternguard yet but I had be planning to get some. 10 free Combi-gravs in a drop pod do sound rather fun! :D

[girot]

I am pondering a possible change to my Primarch's Fist VV squad (five dudes all PF/PP/JP, intended for apocalypse) from PF to PW everybody but the sergeant (his PF is sculpted on).  One of them is a hideous model with a sculpted bolt pistol.  I can ditch his PF arm but there isn't anything I can do about the pistol.  :(  I am considering tossing him in the melt bin and replacing him with a plastic model.

[Jolemai]

 

Hit and Run on the Death Company is overrated. Yes it can help if you are charged but if that happens, then you're using your Death Company wrong imo.

There are other fast killy units out, TWC being the obvious example. It can be hard to guarantee the charge against these guys in which case Dante make good H&R insurance as well as being a beatstick to counter any lurking Thunderlords.

 

 

 

I'm a firm believer in two things:

 

1) Chop the shooty and shoot the choppy

2) Never fight a fair fight. If I have to assault something choppy then I'm going to zerg it.

[girot]

Hit and Run on the Death Company is overrated. Yes it can help if you are charged but if that happens, then you're using your Death Company wrong imo.

There are other fast killy units out, TWC being the obvious example. It can be hard to guarantee the charge against these guys in which case Dante make good H&R insurance as well as being a beatstick to counter any lurking Thunderlords.

I'm a firm believer in two things:

1) Chop the shooty and shoot the choppy

2) Never fight a fair fight. If I have to assault something choppy then I'm going to zerg it.

You're sure you're a marine player? LOL

[Charlo]

With the formation that gives Vanguard free power weapons or lightning claws, is anyone reconsidering where to use Vanguard? The idea of Vanguard with all power weapons and a few storm shields seems pretty good to me.

This is giving me an excuse to make some VV! What formation/ detatchment/ etc is that from?

EDIT: Just seen the formation... Hot Damn! Gives me an excuse to convert up some Van/ Sternguard and is also pretty fluffy with my Successor.

Random question about Formations though: Do the units in it take up Force org slots? Or are they just taken from a separate table? E.g. after using this formation would I have no elites choices left without going unbound?

[Karhedron]

A formation is a stand-alone entity and does not use up slots from another detachment. In fact you do not have to have a detachment at all. It would be legal to play an army composed entirely of formations.

[Jolemai]

With the formation that gives Vanguard free power weapons or lightning claws, is anyone reconsidering where to use Vanguard? The idea of Vanguard with all power weapons and a few storm shields seems pretty good to me.

This is giving me an excuse to make some VV! What formation/ detatchment/ etc is that from?

EDIT: Just seen the formation... Hot Damn! Gives me an excuse to convert up some Van/ Sternguard and is also pretty fluffy with my Successor.

Random question about Formations though: Do the units in it take up Force org slots? Or are they just taken from a separate table? E.g. after using this formation would I have no elites choices left without going unbound?

Does this help?

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-tkglpLLURik/U-pnFpHBXtI/AAAAAAAAI_k/SjzpQ50mW9M/s1600/battleforged_BAO1.jpg

[Charlo]

With the formation that gives Vanguard free power weapons or lightning claws, is anyone reconsidering where to use Vanguard? The idea of Vanguard with all power weapons and a few storm shields seems pretty good to me.

This is giving me an excuse to make some VV! What formation/ detatchment/ etc is that from?

EDIT: Just seen the formation... Hot Damn! Gives me an excuse to convert up some Van/ Sternguard and is also pretty fluffy with my Successor.

Random question about Formations though: Do the units in it take up Force org slots? Or are they just taken from a separate table? E.g. after using this formation would I have no elites choices left without going unbound?

Does this help?

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-tkglpLLURik/U-pnFpHBXtI/AAAAAAAAI_k/SjzpQ50mW9M/s1600/battleforged_BAO1.jpg

Yep! Thanks, that is really nice news. Time to buy some Sternguard, Vanguard, More BA Tacs and a Raven. Got a use for my extra DC jump pack pieces I got!

[Landrick]

Has anyone tried the Command Squad as a mobile gun platform? I am thinking of giving the 3 vets either 3 plasma guns or 3 melta guns and 3 storm shields. They will escort my support librarian, all have JP. Before I make the (financial) investment, I am curious if anyone else has seen it in action, or if it is just a massive points sink

[Deschenus Maximus]

Has anyone tried the Command Squad as a mobile gun platform? I am thinking of giving the 3 vets either 3 plasma guns or 3 melta guns and 3 storm shields. They will escort my support librarian, all have JP. Before I make the (financial) investment, I am curious if anyone else has seen it in action, or if it is just a massive points sink

 

Wouldn't want to try it with Plasma, but with melta + storm shield, it seems like a fine unit. Once you factor in the cost of the Champion's power sword, a CS is basicaly a slightly cheaper DC unit without Rage and Fearless BUT with access to full-sized meltas and Storm Shields. So slightly less punchy, but far more survivable against Plasma and MCs, and far more capable at tank killing.

 

I'm surprised I don't see people talk about this unit more.

[Landrick]

 

Has anyone tried the Command Squad as a mobile gun platform? I am thinking of giving the 3 vets either 3 plasma guns or 3 melta guns and 3 storm shields. They will escort my support librarian, all have JP. Before I make the (financial) investment, I am curious if anyone else has seen it in action, or if it is just a massive points sink

 

Wouldn't want to try it with Plasma, but with melta + storm shield, it seems like a fine unit. Once you factor in the cost of the Champion's power sword, a CS is basicaly a slightly cheaper DC unit without Rage and Fearless BUT with access to full-sized meltas and Storm Shields. So slightly less punchy, but far more survivable against Plasma and MCs, and far more capable at tank killing.

 

I'm surprised I don't see people talk about this unit more.

 

why not plasma? 24" shots with 3+ and FNP to stop Gets hot, then rapid fire w/in 12". I am not thinking I would use these guys to assault at all unless the opportunity was good. these guys are there to put the type of fire i want wherever my enemy doesnt want it to be, and support the rest of the army while doing it.

[hairojin]

 

 

Has anyone tried the Command Squad as a mobile gun platform? I am thinking of giving the 3 vets either 3 plasma guns or 3 melta guns and 3 storm shields. They will escort my support librarian, all have JP. Before I make the (financial) investment, I am curious if anyone else has seen it in action, or if it is just a massive points sink

 

Wouldn't want to try it with Plasma, but with melta + storm shield, it seems like a fine unit. Once you factor in the cost of the Champion's power sword, a CS is basicaly a slightly cheaper DC unit without Rage and Fearless BUT with access to full-sized meltas and Storm Shields. So slightly less punchy, but far more survivable against Plasma and MCs, and far more capable at tank killing.

 

I'm surprised I don't see people talk about this unit more.

 

why not plasma? 24" shots with 3+ and FNP to stop Gets hot, then rapid fire w/in 12". I am not thinking I would use these guys to assault at all unless the opportunity was good. these guys are there to put the type of fire i want wherever my enemy doesnt want it to be, and support the rest of the army while doing it.

 

 

I'm also thinking about this unit, jump pack, plasmaguns, storm shields and librarian with divination. Prescience, 3+ and FNP should be enough to keep them safe from overheating. I think it's a costly unit but will be good in a support role, shooting and buffing where needed and claiming mid-field objectives.

 

To represent the storm shields I will get these from FW: http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Warhammer-40000/Space_Marines/Space_Marine-Infantry-and-Accessories/SPACE_MARINE_BOARDING_ASSAULT_UPGRADE_SET.html

[Cronhour]

Has anyone tried the Command Squad as a mobile gun platform? I am thinking of giving the 3 vets either 3 plasma guns or 3 melta guns and 3 storm shields. They will escort my support librarian, all have JP. Before I make the (financial) investment, I am curious if anyone else has seen it in action, or if it is just a massive points sink

I used them as a grav and plas platform in pods and they were good, killed stuff and held their own when counter charged. FnP can be great, quite pricey though.

[JamesI]

I haven't played them with this codex, but I have used a command squad with plasmas in the previous codex.  Worked ok, but right now I feel like we can just take the far cheaper 5 man assault squad for the same role.

[Deschenus Maximus]

 

why not plasma? 24" shots with 3+ and FNP to stop Gets hot, then rapid fire w/in 12". I am not thinking I would use these guys to assault at all unless the opportunity was good. these guys are there to put the type of fire i want wherever my enemy doesnt want it to be, and support the rest of the army while doing it.

 

 

 

I'm also thinking about this unit, jump pack, plasmaguns, storm shields and librarian with divination. Prescience, 3+ and FNP should be enough to keep them safe from overheating. I think it's a costly unit but will be good in a support role, shooting and buffing where needed and claiming mid-field objectives.

 

To represent the storm shields I will get these from FW: http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Warhammer-40000/Space_Marines/Space_Marine-Infantry-and-Accessories/SPACE_MARINE_BOARDING_ASSAULT_UPGRADE_SET.html

 

 

My issue with giving this squad plasmaguns is that it stops them from charging. That turns the Company Champion from an asset (or at least not a hindrance) to a tax.

[hairojin]

That's true but on the other hand the champion is free compared to the cost in C:SM.