Ulrik_Ironfist Posted December 21, 2014 Share Posted December 21, 2014 So I have 2 stormtalon gunships, and I want to get some use out of them. But I don't want to always run the astartes storm wing just to get them. That stormraven tax is sometimes more than I want. I don't want to give up my command benefits by going unbound. Please help. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Blaire Posted December 21, 2014 Share Posted December 21, 2014 Pay the HQ, 1 Troops tax for an Allied detachment or the HQ, 2 Troops tax for a second CAD? Edit: There's also the Saint Tylus formation from the Tyrannic War Veterans Dataslate that requires Chaplain Cassius, 1+ units of Tyrannic War Vets, and then it's 0-6 Stormtalons. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3897024 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulrik_Ironfist Posted December 21, 2014 Author Share Posted December 21, 2014 So basically its cheaper to pay the stormraven tax? So by going unbound, I lose my re-roll warlord trait, and my +1 WS on my CoF detachment? That kind of sucks. I have found the boosts to be quite well worth it. I need to try it out and see. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3897056 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Blaire Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 I guess man, I've been looking for other ways to get it in, but honestly, I think that the Stormraven "tax" is probably the cheapest way to get the Storm Talons in. :( Maybe someone can find another way, but I haven't seen one yet. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3897194 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted December 22, 2014 Share Posted December 22, 2014 You will get more mileage out of the Raven. To you two or more Talons, you need to buy 1 HQ and 2 Troops as second CAD. At best it will cost you 165 points. But that would mean two units of naked Scouts and a naked Librarian. Getting better stuff means going beyond 200 points, at which points you might as well get the Raven. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3897546 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulrik_Ironfist Posted December 23, 2014 Author Share Posted December 23, 2014 Raven it is then. Or unbound. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3898237 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest loganwolf Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Space marine detachment, hq as a librarian, two scout sniper squads , two storm talons and a grav centurion squad sat in a fast attack space wolf drop pod. Compliments a drop pod heavy wolves list very well. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3907375 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Space marine detachment, hq as a librarian, two scout sniper squads , two storm talons and a grav centurion squad sat in a fast attack space wolf drop pod. Compliments a drop pod heavy wolves list very well. You are roughly paying 750 points for that setup. Not much left to make any major drop pod elements with SW. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3907382 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest loganwolf Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 At 2000 points I run 7 drop pods. Pod 1 - 6 grey hunters, flamer, power axe. Wolf guard, terminator armour, combi flamer, power axe. Inquisitor, servo skulls x 2, incinerator. Rune priest, runic axe. Pod 2 - 6 grey hunters, flamer, wolf standard, power axe. Wolf guard, terminator armour, combi flamer, power axe. Inquisitor, servo skulls x 2, incinerator. librarian, force axe Pod 3 - thunder strike formation - power armoured wolf guard, 8 combi plasma, 1 power axe, 1 storm shield. Pod 4 - thunder strike formation - terminator wolf guard x 4, 4!combi melta, 2 power axe, 1 chain fist, 1storm shield Pod 5 - murderfang Pod 6 - centurion devastator squad, grav cannons, grav amps, omniscop Pod 7 - empty 2 squads of scouts, sniper rifles 2 storm talons - sky hammer missiles 1999 Scots sit back field on objectives. Drop pods alpha strike depending upon opponent. In decided what chapter tactics to run..... Do any allow for reserve roll manipulation? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3907448 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulrik_Ironfist Posted January 3, 2015 Author Share Posted January 3, 2015 Sorry, but I don't believe so. At 2000 points I run 7 drop pods.Pod 3 - thunder strike formation - power armoured wolf guard, 8 combi plasma, 1 power axe, 1 storm shield.Pod 4 - thunder strike formation - terminator wolf guard x 4, 4!combi melta, 2 power axe, 1 chain fist, 1storm shield If I'm not mistaken, those don't add up. the Thunderstrike is 5 TDAWG deep striking, and 10 PAWG podding. It has to be both. It all comes in as one unit. And the way I take that formation it comes out at 450pts, two would be 900-1200pts of your 2k list, + ~750 points for your SM CAD, and that doesn't leave you much else. I think you need to go back and rework your list. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3907740 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest loganwolf Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Adds up perfectly to 1999. Thunder strike can come in turn one so long as the wolf guard terminators are placed in a fast attack drop pod. Nothing to stop you doing that... Minimum squads size is three for wolf guard terminators and 10 for wold guard power armour to fulfil the thunder strike requirements.Full list with points below. Apologies if points are no allowed to be posted+++ Wolves (1999pts) +++++ Space Wolves: Codex (2014) (Combined Arms Detachment) (746pts) +++ HQ (60pts) +Rune Priest (60pts) [Psyker Mastery Level 1, Rune Axe, Warlord]····Power Armour [bolt Pistol, Frag & Krak Grenades]+ Elites (170pts) +Murderfang, the Curseborn (170pt) [searchlight]····Drop Pod [storm Bolter]····Relic: Murderclaw [in-built Heavy Flamer]····Relic: Murderclaw [in-built Storm Bolter]+ Troops (411pts) +Grey Hunters (218pts) [5x Chainsword , Permits One Lone Wolf, Wolf Standard]····Drop Pod [storm Bolter]····6x Grey Hunter [6x Bolt Pistol, 6x Bolter, Flamer, 6x Frag & Krak Grenades, 6x Power Armour, Power Axe]····Wolf Guard Terminator Pack Leader [Combi Flamer, Power Axe, Terminator Armour]Grey Hunters (193pts) [5x Chainsword, Permits One Lone Wolf]····Drop Pod [storm Bolter]····6x Grey Hunter [6x Bolt Pistol, 6x Bolter, Flamer, 6x Frag & Krak Grenades, 6x Power Armour, Power Axe]····Wolf Guard Terminator Pack Leader [Combi Flamer, Power Axe, Terminator Armour]+ Fast Attack (105pts) +Drop Pod (35pts) [storm Bolter]Drop Pod (35pts) [storm Bolter]Drop Pod (35pts) [storm Bolter]++ Space Wolves: Codex (2014) (Formation Detachment) (482pts) +++ Formation (482pts) +"Wolf Guard Thunderstrike" (482pts) [Champions of Fenris Formation]····Wolf Guard (315pts) [Permits One Lone Wolf]········Drop Pod [storm Bolter]········9x Wolf Guard [7x Combi Plasma, 9x Frag & Krak Grenades, 9x Power Armour, Power Axe]········Wolf Guard Pack Leader [Frag & Krak Grenades, Power Armour, Storm Shield]····Wolf Guard Terminators (167pts) [Permits One Lone Wolf]········3x WG Terminator [Chainfist, 3x Combi Melta, 2x Power Axe, 3x Terminator Armour]········WG Terminator Leader [Combi Melta, Storm Shield, Terminator Armour]++ Inquisition: Codex (2013) (Inquisitorial)+ HQ (86pts) +Ordo Malleus Inquisitor (46pts) [Psyk-out Grenades, 2x Servo Skulls]····Carapace Armour [Frag and Krak Grenades, Incinerator]Ordo Malleus Inquisitor (40pts) [Psyk-out Grenades]····Carapace Armour [Frag and Krak Grenades, Incinerator]++ Space Marines: Codex (2013) (Combined Arms Detachment) (685pts) +++ HQ (65pts) +Librarian (65pts)····Power Armour [Force Axe]+ Troops (120pts) +Scout Squad (60pts) [4x Scouts , 4x Sniper Rifle]····Scout Sergeant [sniper Rifle]Scout Squad (60pts) [4x Scouts, 4x Sniper Rifle]····Scout Sergeant [sniper Rifle] + Fast Attack (250pts) +Stormtalon Gunship (125pts) [skyhammer Missile Launcher, Twin-Linked Assault Cannon]Stormtalon Gunship (125pts) [skyhammer Missile Launcher, Twin-Linked Assault Cannon]+ Heavy Support (250pts) +Centurion Devastator Squad (250pts)····Centurion [Grav-cannon and grav-amp, Huricane Bolter]····Centurion [Grav-cannon and grav-amp, Huricane Bolter]····Centurion Sergeant [Grav-cannon and grav-amp, Huricane Bolter]Created with BattleScribe (http://www.battlescribe.net) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3907875 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 When talking RAW, then Thunderstrike wouldn't be able to arrive T1 and benefit from the twin-linking rule. Why? Because the Formation has to roll for reserves to arrive. When arriving otherwise, the Formation can not fulfill it's arrival rule and thus invalidates rule two. However, Explosive Arrival rule only mentions 'they arrive' and it does not mention anything about Formations. Again, RAW could mean that the means of arrival is irrelevant as long as both arrive at the same time. It could go both ways and I have seen it being discussed to death. Check with your opponents or TO, because an FAQ will probably never come. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3907918 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vykryl Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 And with points just show the over all for each unit selected. Don't give points breakdown for each option taken Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3908025 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest loganwolf Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Fair enough. Wasnt sure regarding points. I just did a copy and paste from battlescribe. Agreed about the thunder strike formation rules being poorly written what if it is the only pod in the army one rule will get broken, drop pod assault or explosive arrival. I read a interezting debaye on this very forum that came to the conclusion that it was legit. Definetly only needs three terminators however. Doesnt say anything about not being able to place the terminator wg in a fast attack pod and the explosive arrival states turn they arrive. Played in logs of tounements this year and thats how its been ruled. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3908055 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulrik_Ironfist Posted January 4, 2015 Author Share Posted January 4, 2015 In my local meta, we ruled that drop pod assault is a reserve roll manipulation (It's an auto pass as far as we're concerned, for turn 1) meaning the formation can arrive first turn. This is supported by our Friendly Neighbourhood Games Workshop Employee (ok, former employee), That's the way I play it and no one has any objections. As far as putting the TDAWG in a FA drop pod, I wouldn't bother, since you essentially get to put down 2 units for 1 drop pod. I put an IC in the Termies and go to town. If I run 2 thunderstrikes in my 5 pod list, I can put down 6 units first turn and that suits me fine. If I decide to run all thunderstrikes my first wave puts down 7 units and my second wave is putting down 4 units. Nasty stuff. Still, I think we have come way off topic. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3908696 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest loganwolf Posted January 4, 2015 Share Posted January 4, 2015 Reason I put the WG terminators in a drop pod is so that they can come down turn 1. Tournaments nationally don't allow the terminators to deep strike turn 1 but but putting them in a drop pod the drop pod assault rule does. Just out of curiosity how to you arm the thunderstrike formation? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3908774 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted January 4, 2015 Share Posted January 4, 2015 Reason I put the WG terminators in a drop pod is so that they can come down turn 1. Tournaments nationally don't allow the terminators to deep strike turn 1 but but putting them in a drop pod the drop pod assault rule does. Just out of curiosity how to you arm the thunderstrike formation? Combi-weapons all around. Probably combi-plasmas on PAWG and combi-meltas in TDAWG. If manage to bring down Ulrik in a pod close to those guys, you can basically delete two high profile units. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3908788 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest loganwolf Posted January 4, 2015 Share Posted January 4, 2015 So what does Ulrik bring to the table? The storm strike formation is already twin linked turn one... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3908829 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donkalleone Posted January 4, 2015 Share Posted January 4, 2015 Cause it allows rerolls on To HIt and To wound of 1s .Till to toughness 5 a S7 weapon hits on a 2 (and on T6 on a 3) making a reroll very potent to kill Champs etc. When attacking Rear Armor of 10 its almost the same: @S7 a 3 Glances (S8 on 2s but its melta so wayne) so having a chance to reroll a 1 increases the to Wound significally. Furthermore Ulrik still convertshis benefits in the following rounds and Stubborn in CC is important. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3908839 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulrik_Ironfist Posted January 4, 2015 Author Share Posted January 4, 2015 If you're worried about challenges, remember that all characters have preferred enemy characters in the formations from CoF. As for bringing the terminators down turn 1, the formation comes in as one, you don't need to use drop pods to get them in T1, if your meta allows the formation to come down T1. If it doesn't, or it's tournaments you're concerned with, why even run the formation? Sure it's twin linked its first turn, but you're defeating the whole point by putting the TDA in a drop pod. Again, way off topic. I'm trying to figure out how to get stormtalons into my force without going unbound and losing my beautiful +1 WS perk. And preferably without sinking half my points into allies I don't want or need. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3909097 Share on other sites More sharing options...
wulfgar hammerfist Posted January 4, 2015 Share Posted January 4, 2015 The cheapest version would be a SM CAD with librarian, two scout squads and then the two storm talons. It is all bare bones but clocks in at 395 points. The usefulness of the librarian and scouts are questionable without some toys. You may be better served taking the storm wing formation and using the SR as an assault transport if it fits your game plan and list. I have been struggling with the same thing and I came up with the list below. I have yet to test it. Wolf Priest - wulfen stone (leads blood claws in storm raven)10 Blood Claws - power fist3 x 5 Grey Hunters - melta-gun, PL w/CM, Pod2 x 5 Grey Hunters - plasma-gun, PL w/CP, Pod2 x 3 TWC - 2 x storm shield, 1 x power fistStorm Wing Formation:Storm Raven - twin-linked lascannon, twin-linked multi-meltaStorm Talon - SkyhammerStorm Talon - Skyhammer On paper, I like it but the effectiveness on the tabletop remains to be seen. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3909171 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulrik_Ironfist Posted January 4, 2015 Author Share Posted January 4, 2015 I've been using the storm wing formation, exactly how you set it up. I've been using the fliers as gunships rather than transports, as it's already 450pts not on the table, and I didn't want to keep more off than needed. I have been using one thunderstrike formation, and a voidclaw formation to bring in more units first turn, while 2 pods are filled with full up melta GH squads, and my 2 reserve pods are bringing in dreads as reinforcements. The storm wing has been very effective in dealing with fliers, and ground targets. The only time it didn't kill what I pointed it at was against a black legion contemptor dread. It's done a bang up job so far, more than my flying boots have ever done. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3909305 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted January 4, 2015 Share Posted January 4, 2015 ++No listing points for upgrades on the BnC, just do full unit totals without the details. I'll go edit your post to get it in compliance.++ EDIT: Don't put all of the rules for the units in either; I've edited that out as well. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3909418 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest loganwolf Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Many thanks and apologies ... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300807-how-to-get-stormtalons/#findComment-3910480 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.