GuardsmenBob Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 So I play guard and I have been looking for a second army and after going through some of the fluff and tactics of other marine armies I think like the idea of running a death wing army the most so what is a good 1000 points of death wing. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300889-starting-dark-angels/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larhendiel Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 None I think, unless you play zone mortalis I wouldn't go 1000 points army of pure deathwing. Ravenwing is most pleasant army to play imho Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300889-starting-dark-angels/#findComment-3898292 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isiah Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Playing such a small force of Deathwing is hard but not impossible. Check out Solrac's topic for interesting setup and batreps. [url=http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300039-1000pt-deathwing-battle-reports-new-batrep-19122014/#entry3895769]http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300039-1000pt-deathwing-battle-reports-new-batrep-19122014/url] Btw 'Deathwing' should be one word <_<. Cheers I Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300889-starting-dark-angels/#findComment-3898306 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interrogator Stobz Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Belial plus three squads of DW all tactical will be a challenge but you'll enjoy the scrap. Or drop one squad for a ven LRC for more mobility. Either way you'll need to be able to put out damage in both the shooting and CC phases so take mostly shooting termies with maybe a TH/SS in each squad. BS EDIT: DW is easier to spell than death wing too :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300889-starting-dark-angels/#findComment-3898311 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingleir Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Belial 1x dwcs 2x dwt Belial 2x dwt Landraider Belial 2x dwt 2x dreadnought Belial 3x dwt Belial Librarian 2x dwt Dreadnought Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300889-starting-dark-angels/#findComment-3898581 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isiah Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Take your pick. I'm not sure Dreadnoughts work that well in 7th to justfy their inclusion. They are better in pods anyway as the pods can score. So I would either go with the DWCS option or the three straight DW squads. Also a lot will depend on your intended tactics. If you're footslogging for any reason rather than deep striking then the Land Raider option is good too. Just for its AV shielding potential rather than as a transport. I love wheeling out the big guns in small games. Maybe I should play Guard ^_^. Cheers I Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300889-starting-dark-angels/#findComment-3898607 Share on other sites More sharing options...
aura_enchanted Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 · Hidden by Chaplain Lucifer, December 23, 2014 - leet speak Hidden by Chaplain Lucifer, December 23, 2014 - leet speak Take your pick. I'm not sure Dreadnoughts work that well in 7th to justfy their inclusion. They are better in pods anyway as the pods can score. So I would either go with the DWCS option or the three straight DW squads. Also a lot will depend on your intended tactics. If you're footslogging for any reason rather than deep striking then the Land Raider option is good too. Just for its AV shielding potential rather than as a transport. I love wheeling out the big guns in small games. Maybe I should play Guard . Cheers I dreads make suprisingly good tank hunters, one lascannon is all u need baby and u got it made, he can also be pretty good at polishing offsmall infantry units with an assault cannon or twin linked auto-cannon Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300889-starting-dark-angels/#findComment-3898752
Interrogator Stobz Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 My 1850 game in the weekend had two VenDreads in Lucius Pods, the FW pods are great for 50pts because they keep the Dread alive a lot longer Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300889-starting-dark-angels/#findComment-3898980 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuardsmenBob Posted December 23, 2014 Author Share Posted December 23, 2014 Thanks, for the suggestions So I think I will start like this Belial Thunder Hammer Storm Sheild Death wing command squad Apothecary Champion with halberd of Caliban X2 lightning Claws x2 Thunder Hammer Storm Sheilds Death wing knights 2 squads of death wing termies 4 thunder hammer storm shields Assault Cannon So the way I running them they are little less then 1250 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300889-starting-dark-angels/#findComment-3899009 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solrac Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Thanks, for the suggestions So I think I will start like this Belial Thunder Hammer Storm Sheild Death wing command squad Apothecary Champion with halberd of Caliban X2 lightning Claws x2 Thunder Hammer Storm Sheilds Death wing knights 2 squads of death wing termies 4 thunder hammer storm shields Assault Cannon So the way I running them they are little less then 1250 Any idea what type of mission you'll be playing? Pure Deathwing can be difficult to master at 1500pts or less as you really have to make everything count down to that last Storm Bolter. You want to maximise the things you need over the things you want. With such a low model count you really want to build your army around one thing. Too many focal points and you run out of points for things you need. That being said with the list you have, you need to either build your list around either the Command Squad OR the Deathwing Knights purely because having an extra troops choice on the board will save your bacon as most games you play will be objective based. That being said a few comments: Loadouts for any squad (inc. command squad) You should have at least 1x TH/SS in every squad to help tank AP2 hits and keep the rest of the squad alive. Put him up front with the Sergeant as lets face it if the Sergeant dies I'd rather have a power sword die straight up than a fist. The rest standard load out as you still want to have as many Storm Bolters as possible. Deathwing Command Squad If you choose to build your army around these guys you need to decide what type of support role they will play. You either kit them out for CC to help Belial smash through some troop lines or have them as a fire support unit. Fire support has worked best for me as I almost always take a Standard for Fortitude with my command squad and keeping it alive is the most important thing. It is also more cost effective and better than taking an Apothercary simply because you give Feel No Pain within 12" of it not just to the squad and you don't gimp the loadout of that trooper (e.g a Standard bearer can still have all weapon options whilst an Apothecary only has a Storm Bolter). The company Champion is a bargain at its points cost but if you intend not to get into assault, put those points somewhere else (unless you have points left over). Deathwing Knights If you choose to build your army around these bad boys, always have more than 5 in a unit, especially if they are deep striking. It only takes one or two die from a 5 man squad to lose their effectiveness even with their Smite mode. Normal Deathwing Squads keep to the standard loadout above to maximise Storm Bolters as these guys should only be assaulting a weakended Elite unit or an assured win over troop choices. Otherwise stand back, thin down infantry with Storm Bolter fire and Split Fire any anti-tank weapons at armour. Remember to resist throwing your standard squads into assault just because you want to. Powerfists arn't effective on a dead terminator having to wait to attack at I1. If you decide to take them as a CC unit, take more than 5 if deep striking and still have one of them take a Cyclone. The option to weaken a squad before assaulting is always better than fighting something at full strength. Final Comments Weight of fire/attacks will be the end of you. Always position your terminators to try and prevent so much firepower going onto one squad, as 1s WILL eventually show their face. Cyclones arn't always the best for armour, in most cases Assault Cannons can do a better job. Lastly weight of fire works against your enemy as well. If you can spare the points make use of Belials no scatter rule. My 10 man Deathwing Squad with 2 heavy flamers still has more kills than anything else i've fielded to date. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300889-starting-dark-angels/#findComment-3899059 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solrac Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Sorry about the long post. I' at work on Christmas Eve and don't want to be here :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300889-starting-dark-angels/#findComment-3899065 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isiah Posted December 24, 2014 Share Posted December 24, 2014 Nice post Solrac :yes: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300889-starting-dark-angels/#findComment-3899381 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epimetheus13 Posted December 24, 2014 Share Posted December 24, 2014 Great advice Solrac! A question about the DW Command Squad Champion. If I recall correctly, it says 1 Deathwing in the *army* can be upgraded to the Champion. Does that really mean that the Champion upgrade can be given to a non-Command Squad Deathwing unit? Or must the Champion reside in the Command Squad? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300889-starting-dark-angels/#findComment-3899708 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isiah Posted December 24, 2014 Share Posted December 24, 2014 Nope. There is no Champion upgrade route available in a normal termy squad. It's only an upgrade for a DWCS member. Thus he has to be in the DWCS. Cheers I Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300889-starting-dark-angels/#findComment-3899730 Share on other sites More sharing options...
warsmith Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 Belial 1x dwcs 2x dwt Belial 2x dwt Landraider Belial 2x dwt 2x dreadnought Belial 3x dwt Belial Librarian 2x dwt Dreadnought I've been thinking along the same lines as a few of these - specifically the belial + 3 troops and also the belial, 2 troops and 2 dreads. One other thing I've been wondering about is the inclusion of Ravenwing units at less than 1000 points? Any idea what type of mission you'll be playing? Pure Deathwing can be difficult to master at 1500pts or less as you really have to make everything count down to that last Storm Bolter. You want to maximise the things you need over the things you want. With such a low model count you really want to build your army around one thing. Too many focal points and you run out of points for things you need. That being said with the list you have, you need to either build your list around either the Command Squad OR the Deathwing Knights purely because having an extra troops choice on the board will save your bacon as most games you play will be objective based. That being said a few comments: Loadouts for any squad (inc. command squad) You should have at least 1x TH/SS in every squad to help tank AP2 hits and keep the rest of the squad alive. Put him up front with the Sergeant as lets face it if the Sergeant dies I'd rather have a power sword die straight up than a fist. The rest standard load out as you still want to have as many Storm Bolters as possible. Deathwing Command Squad If you choose to build your army around these guys you need to decide what type of support role they will play. You either kit them out for CC to help Belial smash through some troop lines or have them as a fire support unit. Fire support has worked best for me as I almost always take a Standard for Fortitude with my command squad and keeping it alive is the most important thing. It is also more cost effective and better than taking an Apothercary simply because you give Feel No Pain within 12" of it not just to the squad and you don't gimp the loadout of that trooper (e.g a Standard bearer can still have all weapon options whilst an Apothecary only has a Storm Bolter). The company Champion is a bargain at its points cost but if you intend not to get into assault, put those points somewhere else (unless you have points left over). Deathwing Knights If you choose to build your army around these bad boys, always have more than 5 in a unit, especially if they are deep striking. It only takes one or two die from a 5 man squad to lose their effectiveness even with their Smite mode. Normal Deathwing Squads keep to the standard loadout above to maximise Storm Bolters as these guys should only be assaulting a weakended Elite unit or an assured win over troop choices. Otherwise stand back, thin down infantry with Storm Bolter fire and Split Fire any anti-tank weapons at armour. Remember to resist throwing your standard squads into assault just because you want to. Powerfists arn't effective on a dead terminator having to wait to attack at I1. If you decide to take them as a CC unit, take more than 5 if deep striking and still have one of them take a Cyclone. The option to weaken a squad before assaulting is always better than fighting something at full strength. Final Comments Weight of fire/attacks will be the end of you. Always position your terminators to try and prevent so much firepower going onto one squad, as 1s WILL eventually show their face. Cyclones arn't always the best for armour, in most cases Assault Cannons can do a better job. Lastly weight of fire works against your enemy as well. If you can spare the points make use of Belials no scatter rule. My 10 man Deathwing Squad with 2 heavy flamers still has more kills than anything else i've fielded to date. That's some very clear and concise held there Solrac, I'll echo the others with my thanks. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/300889-starting-dark-angels/#findComment-3904567 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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