Dark Angel Popularity

[aura_enchanted]

 

PFG has been FAQed that way for a long time... since everything else that involves area effect invul save works that way too for other army, The one that comes to mind is KFF for Orkz... the KFF only works for that trukk. My take on it is that it should at least give 4++ to the tank itself. GW is also not consistent though, that it changed PFG, but doesn't change the banners.

Great post Varizel.

 

It bugs the heck out of me that, not only is our FAQ'd PFG inconsistent with the Ork Kustom Field and our banners, it's also inconsistent with the digital, interactive DA codex entry for the PFG - which allows the PFG to protect the *transport itself* - vs the print FAQ, which says the PFG only protects the models *embarked* upon the transport.

 

yea i think thats dumb

[Isiah]

It's what it is. Whatever gave you the idea that clarity and consistency was a prerequisite of Games Workshop rule writing :teehee:

 

Cheers

I

[Marshal Rohr]

How can anybody dislike Dark Angels?

[twopounder]

How can anybody dislike Dark Angels?

 

I guess you'd have to ask the people who dislike our chapter. I'm not sure what they don't like about it either. Well, there is the alleged use of force against other chapters. And the leaving battles without any notice (often to our allies' demise).

 

But aside from that, cool fluff, cool models and a lot more character than the codex thumpers.

[Frater Cornelius]

Heh, apart from the owner of our local GW store and some kid in there, I have not met any DA player. I have met plenty people from across Europe at tournaments.

The owner was totally hyped when a high profile player in our community (me) came to him with a bunch of DA boxes with the intention to make them into my main army, since he has been playing them since 2ed. Guess I am going to find out how people react

Well, one guy did. He laughed at me for going DA, but he is a jerk anyway, so I do not care.

[twopounder]

Heh, apart from the owner of our local GW store and some kid in there, I have not met any DA player. I have met plenty people from across Europe at tournaments.

The owner was totally hyped when a high profile player in our community (me) came to him with a bunch of DA boxes with the intention to make them into my main army, since he has been playing them since 2ed. Guess I am going to find out how people react

Well, one guy did. He laughed at me for going DA, but he is a jerk anyway, so I do not care.

The funny thing is, when you beat the power gamers that only run the flavor of the month codex and all power units, they tend to rage quit and declare everything you have broken.

[JJD]

I think the reason we keep having the same argument about the dark angel codex is that it is so very nearly a good codex there are just a hand full of glaring issues that negatively effect the whole book. This is also why some people have become so frustrated with it because it would only take a few small changes to make it significantly better and yet when the FAQ arrived it really missed the mark and failed to address almost all of the issues.

[Prot]

JJD that is bang on.

 

Look at the uniqueness of the codex. Look at the fantastic model line. Honestly? Overall I'd say the Dark Angel model line is far nicer than any other Chapter line. Back when they were just green marines and bone termies, it didn't look that hot. Now look at the bikes, knights, characters, etc. 

 

Now look at the units. So much character and possibility in those pages! It's all just lost opportunity. Funky plasma speeders, amazing looking flyers, the list goes on.

[Frater Cornelius]

The codex ain't that bad. Yeah, people complain, but most of them only heard it third hard from a self-proclaimed internet-guru who heard that we pay 44pts for a TDA or something.

 

Frankly, I never got the complains about overpricing and underpricing. If our bikes were costed like WS, we would be able to get 2-3 additional bikes or a naked HQ into our RW lists. That won't make much of a difference.

It is the structure and strategy of the army that needs to be right. If you can not get that right, even 10 additional models will not make a difference.

[Prot]

Well I've played them for a long time, and can accurately assess the codex against my Ultramarines, and there is an efficiency issue when two equal players face off, and one is paying too much for his stuff. imho, 10 models does make a difference in this case.

 

The bigger issue is the lost opportunity.... For example if you ever field multiple Stormtalons, you're never going to touch a Nephilim. I tried using that darn model for over a year. It's as useful as a white crayon. (but read the history behind it... that thing should be amazing!)

 

I do agree that the codex isn't that bad. I came off of Chaos and during a year or so of playing DA all I heard was 'how bad' the DA codex is. It simply isn't true. Is it innefficient in some cases? Yup, but it has some angels that simply can't be replicated by any other codex. Then you have some units that are just amazing... like Black Knights.

 

My first year of Ravenwing these guys became so notorious my opponents did everything they could to wipe them off the table. In all honesty my track record with Ravenwing got so good people kind of moaned when I pulled them out so I put them away. That doesn't sound like a uncompetitive codex to me. 

 

Then I got into goofy stuff... my Az-Zeke bomb lists were supposed to be for fun. I found in Maelstrom they were fantastic. I still think the codex has a lot of kick to it. Just if someone wants to play tacticals... I'd suggest looking elsewhere. But otherwise this codex is fine until you start comparing it to the truly broken mechanics of 7th. IE: Tau-dar, Zombie-Croissant Wing...etc, etc. (In which case every 'traditional' army is going to struggle.)

 

Have fun with your Ravenwing. You'll catch lots of people off guard with it. Then they'll start to hate you for it. ;) 

[Frater Cornelius]

Exactly what I am looking for ;) and I keep save in the knowledge that I started them because I like the models and play style. It's the whole package :D

[MadMek83]

Only people to Dislike Dark Angels are heretics... and Heretics are afraid that our interrogator chaplains pull out their hidden dark truth. That + Terminator envy. And that we got Black Knights. In this area, one players Thunderwolf Cavalry was unbeaten for nearly 3 years. First time they encountered my 3 Black knights, was first time they got defeated and utterly destroyed.

 

Our codex is not bad. It just doesn't offer clear solution ro problems like flying AV12 vehicles like other codexes. It just have some early power creep issues which plague C:SM as you could not deliver first 6th edition codexes to be as strong as later ones and mid chance of edition. However our codex is wonderfully versatile and Dark Angels as army which also forces players to think well how to play and challenge their startegist thinking just like real Dark Angels would do. And Dark Angels is one of the most intriguing armies in 40K power armor has and it still got some best bikers in the game.

 

And considering they're only still active Loyalist legion with command structure for Legion, man power for legion and confirmed location of Primarch confirmed to be alive. Basically its envy thingy.

[Frater Cornelius]

With 7ed bringing codices back in line, the gap is getting incrementally smaller as well.

[Prot]

I have a bunch of threads linked in my DA blog here at the BnC, and basically one of them was supposed to be a 'positive' conversation on what is better on the other side of the fence. Is it greener? Or browner? 

 

The conversation had some really good comparisons in it and I learned a lot from it but I wanted to see myself so I dove into Ultra pretty hardcore. I was honestly quite surprised. I think the Codex Astartes superiority complex is way over hyped. 

 

Both codexes offer some great differences, and similarities.  What I took from my experiment is pointing out the deficiencies in both codexes and learning not to lean too heavily in the wrong direction for each 'dex.

 

For example... I simply can't get into a SM Terminator list. No way. But I could never get into hardcore Tactical Greenwing on the DA side as well. The differences aren't -massive- but significant. Both dexes are good though... but this is 7th. It's a shooty war.

[Bryan Blaire]

But otherwise this codex is fine until you start comparing it to the truly broken mechanics of 7th. IE: Tau-dar, Zombie-Croissant Wing...etc, etc. (In which case every 'traditional' army is going to struggle.)

And in reality, none of those have anything to do with broken mechanics of 7th Edition, because they are all left-overs from 5th and 6th Editions. The game may actually look very different once all Codexes are actually brought up to the "7th Edition standard". Hopefully it fixes some of our left over issues from 6th as well.

[Gillyfish]

I have very rarely encountered true negativity. Friendly teasing on both sides, yes, but never accusations of being cheats or the like.

 

My local store is an independent and there seems to be an unusually high number of DA players there, so I think they are actually pretty popular round my neck of the woods!

[Darkangeldentist]

I have almost never encountered any negativity towards Dark angels as a chapter. Fair amount of ribbing, jovial wind-ups and banter but intended to be humourous always. Generally people have wondered why Dark angels? However that is as much fluff based, "what made you pick them" type question as it is one about power levels and competitiveness. Most of the time after a chat and maybe a game most people I see and play against agree that Dark angels have some pretty nice toys and options to bring to the table. 

 

I am one of the only people locally to play Dark angels a lot and it's affected the perception of the army. Some regard the book as a bit bonkers powerful for units like Black knights and items like the power field generator and banners. The weak/bad options just aren't seen on the table so although there is no disagreement about those being bad it doesn't change the fact Dark angels can beat face as well as any other army.

[aura_enchanted]

I have almost never encountered any negativity towards Dark angels as a chapter. Fair amount of ribbing, jovial wind-ups and banter but intended to be humourous always. Generally people have wondered why Dark angels? However that is as much fluff based, "what made you pick them" type question as it is one about power levels and competitiveness. Most of the time after a chat and maybe a game most people I see and play against agree that Dark angels have some pretty nice toys and options to bring to the table.

 

I am one of the only people locally to play Dark angels a lot and it's affected the perception of the army. Some regard the book as a bit bonkers powerful for units like Black knights and items like the power field generator and banners. The weak/bad options just aren't seen on the table so although there is no disagreement about those being bad it doesn't change the fact Dark angels can beat face as well as any other army.

I still think the fact that we don't have a supplement is a huge hindrance to our codex. Ita about options and it's fairly silly to be the only "marine" dex without a full supplement. We need options and alternatives and failing to provide them to us and New players isn't fair to us as a community.

 

With grey knights and daemons things are a little different there is only one grey knight chapter and daemons are daemons are daemons. We are a legion and we come in many shapes and sizes. And I feel it's a real missed opportunity. I'd like to see guardians of the covenant or the angels of vengeance, one could even make a case for the angels vermilion. And if some nobody like the crimson slaughter can burst into existence, we can flesh out a later generation chapter of dark angels seed.

[Frater Cornelius]

Well, that is why there are now rumours abound that DA Campaign book, which is a defacto supplement, is on it's way after Skaven and Crons.

 

Just pray it is not the same quality of stuff BA got, in which case I would buy myself a copy just to use a toilet paper.

[Dark Haven]

 

 

Just pray it is not the same quality of stuff BA got, in which case I would buy myself a copy just to use a toilet paper.

 

Could you clarify? 

 

I'm not sure how those rules were bad, they got new force Orgs, relics, traits and nasty formations. Hell, Nids, Crons and BA all made out like bandits with Deathstorm. What did I miss? 

[Frater Cornelius]

 

 

 

Just pray it is not the same quality of stuff BA got, in which case I would buy myself a copy just to use a toilet paper.

 

Could you clarify? 

 

I'm not sure how those rules were bad, they got new force Orgs, relics, traits and nasty formations. Hell, Nids, Crons and BA all made out like bandits with Deathstorm. What did I miss? 

 

 

Most of those Formations are unusable outside of 2.5k+ games and the Archangel Detachment is bad because it forces you to take Terminator HQ and prohibits named characters and has no FA slots for Pods to put said Terminators in. Marvelous.

Just because they got a lot, does not mean it is good. A whole lot of garbage is still garbage, just plenty of it.

[Chaplain Lucifer]

The thread is about DA popularity, lets keep it that way. ;)

[Sete]

I like to tease DA players but I like DA they are my Top 3 favs with BT and IF.

Pity that on my area a guy already has 5k Dark Angels so maybe its just only me but its a bit weird to do Dark Angels. Maybe one of these days I might do a sucessor. Maybe angels of vengeance.

[Tanhausen]

Countless times my games have started like this:

Rival - What do you carry?

Me - DA

R-Wow coooooool! I play Tau-dar-inquisition-the-latest-internet-rage currently, but I have XX Deathwing terminators and YY bikes and all! I'm a true DA in my heart!!!

M- Have you brought them today to this cut-throat tournament?

R- err...no...I'm playing this net-list now and...

M- *** grabs a few of his DA icon dice and rolls them casually on the table, without looking at the rival ***

I'd say there is only one true DA at this table today

---

I might (probably will) get slaughtered later, but guess who scored first in this battle

[Space Truckin]

Countless times my games have started like this:

Rival - What do you carry?

Me - DA

R-Wow coooooool! I play Tau-dar-inquisition-the-latest-internet-rage currently, but I have XX Deathwing terminators and YY bikes and all! I'm a true DA in my heart!!!

M- Have you brought them today to this cut-throat tournament?

R- err...no...I'm playing this net-list now and...

M- *** grabs a few of his DA icon dice and rolls them casually on the table, without looking at the rival ***

I'd say there is only one true DA at this table today

---

I might (probably will) get slaughtered later, but guess who scored first in this battle

http://www.sinofdamnation.com/images/shared%20pics/DAplayer.jpg