Angels Tempestus

[Sun Reaver]

Hey everyone! Thanks for showing interest in my chapter! Ever since I read Comissar Molotov's DIY chapter, The Castigators, years ago I have hoped to create a chapter of my own.

 

My goal is to make a Blood Angels successor chapter that draws heavily from South Asian themes, society, and religion. I wish to incorporate the culture of the Rajput Warriors of ancient India to help shape the chapter and traditions. I have a couple notes regarding the chapter below. My goal is for this community to challenge my ideas and help me create a well rounded and fleshed out chapter. One that can you hopefully be compared to the Castigators.

 

Update: 10/3/17

 

Brothers, it has been quite some time since I have updated my successor chapter. I have attempted to polish the chapter further and have updated whatever I have done previously. I would like your thoughts as I continue to update the chapter. Thank you!

 

The Angels Excelsior

Since their inception as part of the twelfth founding of the Adeptus Astartes, the Angels Excelsior have been lauded as a fierce and proud chapter. The edict of the High Lords of Terra decreed that this fledgling chapter was to reinforce the Imperial presence and borders in the Segmentum Pacificus, more specifically, along the area known as the Veiled Region. Home to a host of Xenos lifeforms, this stellar and unmapped zone is the home of condensed nebula and newly forming stars. As a result, the entire region is enveloped in a stellar and dust substance. Descending from the gene-line of Sanguinius, the first Chapter Master of the Chapter was Anwariel, Captain of the Blood Angels 2^nd Company. According to ancient records, Anwariel was known as a shrewd and calculating veteran who was held in high regard by his chapter and company alike. An ambitious individual, the Captain had risen through the ranks quickly and some even whispered that he would one day take the post of Chapter Master. When command of the newly formed chapter was given to Anwariel, he had accepted only begrudgingly as although the Blood Angel viewed this as a supreme honor, he was loathe to leave his chapter, his home, that he held so dead.

 

With blessings from his Chapter Master and in the company of his handpicked retinue, Anwariel set out towards the Veiled Region and whatever mysteries awaited his nascent chapter.

 

First Conflict

Upon translating into the south-eastern corner of the Veiled Region, the newly-formed chapter stumbled upon a full scale Ork invasion upon the Anjali System. Eager to test his warriors in battle, Anwariel saw this opportunity as a blessing and vowed to bring the wrath of the Imperium onto the wretched Xenos. Initial actions saw the Astartes meet repeated success with swift void strikes and boarding actions. However, after 3 standard Terran months of warfare, there was little sign of the aliens numbers dwindling. Anwariel realized that to end the campaign decisively, he needed to lure the enemy warlord to him.

 

In his command strategium, the chapters officers debated on where to make their stand. After initial planetary scans had arrived, the chapter command was awed to find a grand statue of Sanguinius on the death world of Nagar, the 5^th planet in the system. Recognizing it for the sign that it was, Anwariel immediately committed the bulk of his forces to the jungle surface of this auspicious planet. There, the chapter sent out a broadcast challenging the Warboss to the planet. The Chapter Masters plan was simple, draw the enemy to his forces and slay the Ork warlord in open combat for Glory of Sanguinius.

 

And draw him he did. Hulks rained upon the surface of Nagar with hordes of Orks bellowing praises to their heathen gods. The chapter held firm though, meeting the overwhelming assault with finely wrought blades and precise bolter fire. Though the chapter was severely outnumbered, the marines performed beyond expectation, eager to bring glory to their chapter in their inaugural campaign.

 

Unexpected aid came in the form of the local populace. Armed with rudimentary weapons, the people of Nagar fought with zeal in defense of their home. It was as if the entire world rose against the green-skins. Poisonous flora assaulted whole parties of Orks while packs of feline predators ripped them to shreds in the dense jungle.

 

At the height of the battle, Anwariel encountered the Warboss in single combat. At the base of the of the great tribute to Sanguinius, man met beast in savage fury. Though many Sons of Sanguinius fell that day, and Anwariel himself bloodied, the chapter master defeated the enemy general, impaling his bulk onto his spear and hoisting his prone form into the air. Orks fled and Orks died. Proud of his chapter and impressed by the local populace, Anwariel smiled. His chapter had been victorious in their inaugural engagement and, they had found themselves a home world.

 

Homeworld

The planet of Nagar is an ocean world primarily composed of 3 large land masses with smaller islands dotting the southernmost continent. Littered with thick jungles, the planet is similar to the Indus regions of old. Poisonous flora and vicious fauna inhabit the terrain with a singular focus to kill. The planet was a death-world in every sense of the word yet somehow, pockets of mankind eked out an existence.

 

The people of Nagar made their homes in forts of stone and wood. A hardy people, they had managed to not only live off the harsh land, but thrive on it. Unusually, the populace does not lament at their hardships for they believe that one day Sanguinius, their patron, and his sons will usher them into an age of peace and prosperity. Until that fated day, the populace continue to live and die in his name.

 

The human settlements are led by their guru caste spiritual leaders who preach the blessings of Sanguinius and ensure that life is lived as he did. A warrior people, every first born son is trained in the Nagaran way of war and enter the Veera the warrior caste. These are the soldiers of the community, defending their homes from the vicious predators and from other settlements. Those who are not firstborn, or choose not to join the ranks of the vaunted Veera, live as hunter and farmer caste. On rare occasions, if a member dishonors the teachings of Sanguinius or their settlement, they are ostracized, forced to live on the outskirts of the community as Untouchables, the lowest caste.

 

Edit 1/3/19: Title change

[Olis]

Bear in mind that when I'm asking questions, I want you to consider what the answers may mean for the chapter and how to include them in your IA, rather than simply responding to them and leaving them at that.

Okay, first things first, the name. As a Blood Angels successor may I suggest:

• Marines Carmine (not too dissimilar to the Angels Encarmine)
• Angels Cardinal (perhaps with a twist to the theme by adding very vague references to wind deities)
• Knights Crimson
• Sons of Sanguinius
• Celestial Brothers
• Crucifactors

The founding: I think, to be honest, a 10th/12th founding sounds pretty reasonable. It's not too old and still has a fair amount of history behind it.   
 
Also, I think I have some preliminary suggestions for colour schemes: 
 
 
Plain
http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/sm/bpe=FF6200&bpj=FF6200&bp=FF6200&bpc=FF6200&hdt=FF6200&hdm=FF6200&hdl=FF6200&ey=04FF00&er=FF6200&pi=8c8c8c&nk=FF6200&ch=FF6200&eg=FFF200&sk=FFF200&abs=FF6200&bt=FF6200&cod=FF6200&ull=FF6200&lk=FF6200&lll=FF6200&lft=FF6200&url=FF6200&rk=FF6200&lrl=FF6200&rft=FF6200&slt=FF6200&sli=FF6200&srt=FF6200&sri=FF6200&ula=FF6200&lel=FF6200&lla=FF6200&lw=FF6200&lh=FF6200&ura=FF6200&rel=FF6200&rla=FF6200&rw=FF6200&rh=FF6200&bg=FFFFFF&rb=8C8C8C&gr=8C8C8C&wg=true&hsk=true&mk7=333333&/spacemarine.jpg
 
With green robes and weapons
http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/sm/bpe=FF6200&bpj=FF6200&bp=FF6200&bpc=FF6200&hdt=FF6200&hdm=FF6200&hdl=FF6200&ey=04FF00&er=FF6200&pi=8c8c8c&nk=FF6200&ch=FF6200&eg=FFF200&sk=FFF200&abs=FF6200&bt=FF6200&cod=FF6200&ull=FF6200&lk=FF6200&lll=FF6200&lft=FF6200&url=FF6200&rk=FF6200&lrl=FF6200&rft=FF6200&slt=FF6200&sli=FF6200&srt=FF6200&sri=FF6200&ula=FF6200&lel=FF6200&lla=FF6200&lw=FF6200&lh=FF6200&ura=FF6200&rel=FF6200&rla=FF6200&rw=FF6200&rh=FF6200&bg=FFFFFF&rb=8C8C8C&gr=8C8C8C&wg=true&hsk=true&mk7=333333&robes=04FF00&bpr=FF6200&cs=FF6200&/spacemarine.jpg
 
Halved colour scheme
http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/sm/bpe=FF6200&bpj=FF6200&bp=FF6200&bpc=FF6200&hdt=FF6200&hdm=FF6200&hdl=FF6200&ey=04FF00&er=FF6200&pi=8c8c8c&nk=FF6200&ch=FF6200&eg=FFF200&sk=FFF200&abs=FF6200&bt=FF6200&cod=FF6200&ull=FFFEB3&lk=FFFEB3&lll=FFFEB3&lft=FFFEB3&url=FF6200&rk=FF6200&lrl=FF6200&rft=FF6200&slt=FFFEB3&sli=FFFEB3&srt=FF6200&sri=FF6200&ula=FFFEB3&lel=FFFEB3&lla=FFFEB3&lw=FFFEB3&lh=FFFEB3&ura=FF6200&rel=FF6200&rla=FF6200&rw=FF6200&rh=FF6200&bg=FFFFFF&rb=8C8C8C&gr=8C8C8C&ha=FFFEB3&/spacemarine.jpg
 
With green robes and weapons
http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/sm/bpe=FF6200&bpj=FF6200&bp=FF6200&bpc=FF6200&hdt=FF6200&hdm=FF6200&hdl=FF6200&ey=04FF00&er=FF6200&pi=8c8c8c&nk=FF6200&ch=FF6200&eg=FFF200&sk=FFF200&abs=FF6200&bt=FF6200&cod=FF6200&ull=FFFEB3&lk=FFFEB3&lll=FFFEB3&lft=FFFEB3&url=FF6200&rk=FF6200&lrl=FF6200&rft=FF6200&slt=FFFEB3&sli=FFFEB3&srt=FF6200&sri=FF6200&ula=FFFEB3&lel=FFFEB3&lla=FFFEB3&lw=FFFEB3&lh=FFFEB3&ura=FF6200&rel=FF6200&rla=FF6200&rw=FF6200&rh=FF6200&bg=FFFFFF&rb=8C8C8C&gr=8C8C8C&ha=FFFEB3&wg=true&robes=04FF00&bpr=ff6200&cs=FF6200&/spacemarine.jpg
 
 

Take 'em or leave 'em as you wish, brother.
 

I am thinking of them being located in either the Segmentum Tempestus (south) or the Segmentum Pacificus (west).

 

Any particular reason why? Are there any significant worlds or features in these Segmenta that interest you? Or would you prefer to remain off the beaten track?
 

Again, based of the geography of India, the homeworld will have jungles, mountains, and deserts, and beaches. Its a paradise world like ancient Terra. The populace is of a tan complexion, though some will be lighter (from the north) and some will be much darker (from the south). The firstborn son of every family is sent to the chapter to attempt to become a marine. Think of India right before gunpowder.

 

A paradise world? What makes the population of interest to a marine chapter then? I would advise making either the planet or the population more dangerous/warlike. Generally speaking, chapters stay away from paradise worlds and go for feral worlds, feudal worlds or hive worlds. Places where there is strife and fights for survival.

 

Maybe it appears to be a paradise would but the flora and fauna are deadly, toxic and entirely dangerous? The chapter will want prospective initiates to be strong and tough so giving them a tough upbringing could be useful. Maybe it teaches them that beautiful things can still be dangerous?
 

The planet has a higher number of psykers and they are well integrated into the community.

 
Any reasoning to why there are more psykers than usual? And what stops them being regarded with wariness and suspicion? Psykers are generally shunned for good reason - daemons can and do possess them with tragic (and catastrophic) results. 
 

The planet was liberated by the Blood Angels legion during the Great Crusade. The populace was enslaved by Xenos who are now extinct. The natives believe the Emperor is a god and that Sanguinius was his most powerful prophet.

 
Fairly standard stuff, then. Does this event (the liberation) affect the chapter's decision to take it as their homeworld?
 

The chapter's identity was quickly taken over the beliefs of the natives.

 
Quickly, eh? What would cause that? Heavy casualties early in their history? Maybe something else?
 

I am unsure on whether I want the chapter to worship the emperor or not.

 

Easy question: Do you want them to be friends with the Ecclesiarchy or not? Bearing in mind that most chapters do not worship the Emperor. 
 

The marines are a very proud chapter. They are very extravagant and pay special attention to ceremony and gatherings. They are a very ostentatious chapter even when compared to the Blood Angels. They meditate 5 times a day to suppress the black rage and red thirst.

 

When you say 'proud', do you mean that they are prideful or just generally proud to be Blood Angel successors? I think you can ditch the comparison to the Blood Angels and just say they are ostentatious. They don't have to be more or better than anyone else (and it's also a name-drop). That way lies a chapter with little depth. Don't go there.

Does the meditation thing work? I think it's worth exploring the idea that it doesn't.  
 

Just like any Son of Sanguinius, they chapter excels at close combat and rapid strikes. The chapter particularly favors bikes. The chapter is also organized by the Codex Astartes. The only differences would be the ones all Blood Angels successor chapters face.

 

To be honest, a large chunk of this bit is not worth keeping. Yes they are codex compliant, excepting Blood Angel-y differences. But the only thing of interest there is that they like bikes. So, do they like them enough to have a large complement of them? In which case, how does the chapter remain codex compliant?

 

Perhaps you need to focus on the way the chapter wages war - do they fight en masse or in small groups? 
 

Each marine always carries 5 objects with them at all times. This is based of the 5 Ks that every strict follower of Sikhism holds. 
1. A steel bangle that symbolizes unity of self and of the chapter and of courage 
2. A short blade that symbolizes respect, bravery, and justice 
3. Long hair and beards? Maybe to give the chapter a distinct appearance and makes it impossible to conceal themselves 
4. TBD
5. TBD

 

Not to belittle the idea, but is this really necessary? Couldn't they, say, have a penchant for curved swords? Iirc the two swords that represent the concepts of Meeri and Peeri are important enough to have as a part of the symbol of Sikhism. (I won't delve into this further as discussion on religious matters is verboten on B&C.)

Hope that helps.

[Nomus Sardauk]

Perhaps the tolerence of the higher Psyker population could exist thanks to a sort of spiritual guru-like group/order/caste that trains them to safely contain their powers, and quickly deal with them if they cannot.

 

This could also add further characterisation of the Chapter through influencing their Librarians, perhaps they take after/recruit from these gurus? Or maybe their teachings have spread to the Chapter Cult and rather then the enraged, rehetoric-screaming zealot Chaplains of others chapters, these Chaplains are always eerily calm and serene, even whilst splattering the foe into gored paste?

[Sun Reaver]

Thanks for taking the time to respond! 

 

 

Okay, first things first, the name. As a Blood Angels successor may I suggest:

• Marines Carmine (not too dissimilar to the Angels Encarmine)
• Angels Cardinal (perhaps with a twist to the theme by adding very vague references to wind deities)
• Knights Crimson
• Sons of Sanguinius
• Celestial Brothers
• Crucifactors

The founding: I think, to be honest, a 10th/12th founding sounds pretty reasonable. It's not too old and still has a fair amount of history behind it.   

 

I like the word Carmine, it has a nice ring to it. How do the Carmine Lords sound? Carmine Kings? Crimson Lords? Crimson Kings? Maybe play with the word Raja as it means king in hindi. 

 

12th founding it is then! 

 

 

 

Take 'em or leave 'em as you wish, brother.

 

I took what you used and edited them a bit. This is what I came up with: 

 

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/sm/bpe=FF6A00&bpj=FF6A00&bp=FF6A00&bpc=FF6A00&hdt=FF6A00&hdm=FF6A00&hdl=FF6A00&ey=2E8F43&er=FF6A00&pi=FF6A00&nk=FF6A00&ch=FF6A00&eg=FAF7F5&sk=F5F1ED&abs=FF6A00&bt=FF6A00&cod=FF6A00&ull=FF6A00&lk=FF6A00&lll=FF6A00&lft=FF6A00&url=FF6A00&rk=FF6A00&lrl=FF6A00&rft=FF6A00&slt=FF6A00&sli=FF6A00&srt=FF6A00&sri=FF6A00&ula=FF6A00&lel=FF6A00&lla=FF6A00&lw=FF6A00&lh=FF6A00&ura=FF6A00&rel=FF6A00&rla=FF6A00&rw=FF6A00&rh=FF6A00&bg=FFFFFF&rb=5C5454&gr=3D3939&wg=true&aq=true&dm3=true&loin=2DAD42&mk8=true&chps=1B9E26&ti=FFFFFF&blt=549648&/spacemarine.jpg

 

 

Quote

I am thinking of them being located in either the Segmentum Tempestus (south) or the Segmentum Pacificus (west).

 

Any particular reason why? Are there any significant worlds or features in these Segmenta that interest you? Or would you prefer to remain off the beaten track?

 

It was to remain off the beaten track. I feel as if everyone is either fighting off the incursions from the Eye of Terror, beating back the Tau, or defending against the Tyranids. I wanted a chapter that was located in an area which dealt with problems such as rebellion, chaos uprisings, and the odd ork/eldar invasion as well. 

 

 

Quote

Again, based of the geography of India, the homeworld will have jungles, mountains, and deserts, and beaches. Its a paradise world like ancient Terra. The populace is of a tan complexion, though some will be lighter (from the north) and some will be much darker (from the south). The firstborn son of every family is sent to the chapter to attempt to become a marine. Think of India right before gunpowder.

 

A paradise world? What makes the population of interest to a marine chapter then? I would advise making either the planet or the population more dangerous/warlike. Generally speaking, chapters stay away from paradise worlds and go for feral worlds, feudal worlds or hive worlds. Places where there is strife and fights for survival.

 

Maybe it appears to be a paradise would but the flora and fauna are deadly, toxic and entirely dangerous? The chapter will want prospective initiates to be strong and tough so giving them a tough upbringing could be useful. Maybe it teaches them that beautiful things can still be dangerous?

 

You make some valid points. Perhaps a death/feral world then. I like of the planet appearing to be a paradise but after closer inspection, the planets flora and wildlife are extremely dangerous. Larger and more dangerous versions of tigers, elephants, and bears could be beasts that the local humans attempt to defend themselves from. 

 

 

Quote

The planet has a higher number of psykers and they are well integrated into the community.

 
Any reasoning to why there are more psykers than usual? And what stops them being regarded with wariness and suspicion? Psykers are generally shunned for good reason - daemons can and do possess them with tragic (and catastrophic) results. 

 

The original idea was to have the psykers be the ruling caste of the many tribes and villages as they have the ability to foresee attacks and disasters as well as being able to defend against the creatures who attack. The psykers wouldn't have ridiculous powers but just enough to barely get by. 

 

 

Quote

The planet was liberated by the Blood Angels legion during the Great Crusade. The populace was enslaved by Xenos who are now extinct. The natives believe the Emperor is a god and that Sanguinius was his most powerful prophet.

 
Fairly standard stuff, then. Does this event (the liberation) affect the chapter's decision to take it as their homeworld?

 

Yes, my hopes were to have the current Chapter Master defend the world against an Eldar/Ork invasion. The population and wildlife would attack the xenos to defend their own home. The chapter master would see this and be inspired by their deeds. The marines would take a large amount of casualties in this conflict but through would prevail. I pictured the final battle being taken place at a monument to Sanguinius and the Emperor, built many years ago during the crusade. 

 

 

Quote

The chapter's identity was quickly taken over the beliefs of the natives.

 
Quickly, eh? What would cause that? Heavy casualties early in their history? Maybe something else?

 

I suppose I didn't mean it like that. I guess over time the beliefs of the chapter would change as the source of the recruits would come from the heavily cultured planet. 

 

 

Quote

I am unsure on whether I want the chapter to worship the emperor or not.

 

Easy question: Do you want them to be friends with the Ecclesiarchy or not? Bearing in mind that most chapters do not worship the Emperor. 

 

I had thought of the Ecclesiarchy briefly, but my goal was for the meditation and religion to help reduce the number of marines succumbing to the flaw. 

 

 

Quote

The marines are a very proud chapter. They are very extravagant and pay special attention to ceremony and gatherings. They are a very ostentatious chapter even when compared to the Blood Angels. They meditate 5 times a day to suppress the black rage and red thirst.

 

When you say 'proud', do you mean that they are prideful or just generally proud to be Blood Angel successors? I think you can ditch the comparison to the Blood Angels and just say they are ostentatious. They don't have to be more or better than anyone else (and it's also a name-drop). That way lies a chapter with little depth. Don't go there.

Does the meditation thing work? I think it's worth exploring the idea that it doesn't. 

 

I mean both. The people of their homeplanet are a warrior race. They are proud and have a great sense of honor. They are stately, majestic, and creditable. They have a high opinion of their own dignity. They are also proud of their bloodline as they believe their primarch was the chosen one. The true first amongst equals. He who have up his life knowingly to help save the universe. 

 

And the meditation thing does work, but its not perfect. I wanted the flaw to get worse over time as more marines are falling to the curse as the years have gone by. Sort of like prolonging the end theme that the BA's and their successors have going on. Maybe this leads to a crisis of faith in the chapter. Some believe the Emperor is answering their prayers and it leads some to resent his worship and accept their faith grimly. Others could continue to believe. Maybe the tradition could be dying as the results are getting worse?  

 

 

Quote

Just like any Son of Sanguinius, they chapter excels at close combat and rapid strikes. The chapter particularly favors bikes. The chapter is also organized by the Codex Astartes. The only differences would be the ones all Blood Angels successor chapters face.

 

To be honest, a large chunk of this bit is not worth keeping. Yes they are codex compliant, excepting Blood Angel-y differences. But the only thing of interest there is that they like bikes. So, do they like them enough to have a large complement of them? In which case, how does the chapter remain codex compliant?

 

Perhaps you need to focus on the way the chapter wages war - do they fight en masse or in small groups? 
 

 

Agreed, I was just throwing out details that I thought of. I run a bike army and I have been really excited about the new codex. Maybe I can play off the idea that the people of the homeworld don't like heights and prefer their feet firmly planted on the ground. And so they embrace the Blood Angel way of fast and hard hitting strikes but instead prefer to use bikes instead of the ground? I thought of it the same way the bloods angels favor assault squads but are still codex compliant. 

 

 

Quote

Each marine always carries 5 objects with them at all times. This is based of the 5 Ks that every strict follower of Sikhism holds. 
1. A steel bangle that symbolizes unity of self and of the chapter and of courage 
2. A short blade that symbolizes respect, bravery, and justice 
3. Long hair and beards? Maybe to give the chapter a distinct appearance and makes it impossible to conceal themselves 
4. TBD
5. TBD

 

Not to belittle the idea, but is this really necessary? Couldn't they, say, have a penchant for curved swords? Iirc the two swords that represent the concepts of Meeri and Peeri are important enough to have as a part of the symbol of Sikhism. (I won't delve further into this further as discussion on religious matters is verboten on B&C.)

 

I apologize if I stepped on anyones toes or disrespected them. I just wanted to use this theme based off the Rajputs as I was always fascinated by them in history class. Perhaps it is best to just borrow examples from the 5K's such as the band and the blade. The others are being forced. 

 

 

 

Hope that helps.

 

It helped tremendously! Thank you soo much for your interest! I think I might begin to actually start writing the article. 

 

 

 

Perhaps the tolerence of the higher Psyker population could exist thanks to a sort of spiritual guru-like group/order/caste that trains them to safely contain their powers, and quickly deal with them if they cannot.

This could also add further characterisation of the Chapter through influencing their Librarians, perhaps they take after/recruit from these gurus? Or maybe their teachings have spread to the Chapter Cult and rather then the enraged, rehetoric-screaming zealot Chaplains of others chapters, these Chaplains are always eerily calm and serene, even whilst splattering the foe into gored paste? 

 

 

This is an excellent suggestion! I really like this. The monk/guru order/caste can be the spiritual leaders of the homeworld. Yes, this is something I would love to add to the chapter. The Gurus could be another term for a Chaplain who keep an eye out on the marines, especially the pskyers for signs of corruption. This could also be adopted by the chapter after a horrific incident. Say a librarian who was obsessed with looking for a cure and it led him down the path to damnation which could have killed the chapter master? The next chapter master could be one who was born on the planet and installs the "guru" system into the chapter. Sorry went on a rant, but the creative juices are flowing! 

 

As an aside, a part of me wants to make the chapter a bleached bone color, with the accents being red. Sort of like an inverted Blood Angels color scheme. Imagine a Sanguinary Priest look but on a regular marine.

[Nomus Sardauk]

Thanks Sun, I'm glad my suggestions were helpful for you.

 

I like the original idea of the orange armour, white trim and green robes but if I may I'd like to make a suggestion for some slight alterations;

1. Change the orange armour to a more goldish-orange tone (like this: http://deadliestwarrior.wikia.com/wiki/File:Rajput_4.jpg and http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/mediawiki/images/5/5b/Angelsofvigilance.jpg)

 

2. Alter the robe colour from the current bright lime green to more of a dark green colour.

 

Also, regarding the discussion about including the Five K's of Sikhism, some of them don't seem like they'd be necessary/relevant/important to Astartes, like the comb, headcloth or underwear, though the short dagger and iron bangle seem like they could work with the Astartes culture. Perhaps the dagger & bangle are gifted unto an Aspirant upon his induction into the Scout Company.

[Sun Reaver]

The only reason I was considering changing the armor is because I read Trial By Blood and in it, Seth is being judged by the Chapter Masters from every chapter. He makes a comment to Malakim Phoros, the Lamenter's CM, about how he is the only one wearing power armor that did not include red. It made me want to maybe adopt a primarly white/bone color scheme with red accents or a scheme like the flesh tearers, but replacing the black with the bone color. 

 

Thanks Sun, I'm glad my suggestions were helpful for you.

I like the original idea of the orange armour, white trim and green robes but if I may I'd like to make a suggestion for some slight alterations;
1. Change the orange armour to a more goldish-orange tone (like this: http://deadliestwarrior.wikia.com/wiki/File:Rajput_4.jpg and http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/mediawiki/images/5/5b/Angelsofvigilance.jpg)

2. Alter the robe colour from the current bright lime green to more of a dark green colour.

Also, regarding the discussion about including the Five K's of Sikhism, some of them don't seem like they'd be necessary/relevant/important to Astartes, like the comb, headcloth or underwear, though the short dagger and iron bangle seem like they could work with the Astartes culture. Perhaps the dagger & bangle are gifted unto an Aspirant upon his induction into the Scout Company.

 

 

Anyways, I am not a fan of the goldish-orange color portrayed in the link. It is too yellowish for me. But thank you for making the suggestions. 

 

I was thinking the same thing in regards to the bangle and dagger. Perhaps receive the bangle upon an aspirant's induction in the Scout Company or maybe even when he graduates from the Scout Company. Or the dagger could perhaps be forged by the neophyte. It could be the last step a scout would need to take in order to become a marine. 

[Commissar Molotov]

Hello, Sun Reaver! 

 

 

I think that your chapter shows a great deal of potential, and meant to post yesterday after reading the thread, but this was the first time that I had gotten to a computer. 

 

In preparation for this thread, I think that this might be a useful read: 

 

• The Marines Scimitar

 

I did once work on a Blood Angels successor based on the Vulcans from Star Trek, where the Chapters spent their lives focusing on meditation and inner peace so as to avoid the rage, and those who fell were put out of their misery, rather than ever being fielded as a Death Company. Unfortunately, the board software is being uncooperative and I'm finding it difficult to find the thread to show you. Still, I think it is important to think about the core themes of the Blood Angels, and how you're going to differentiate yourself from them, or put a new and unique spin on them. 

 

Jape's Marines Scimitar are an interesting spin on Arabic themes - who would ever expect Marines engaging in gardening and poetry? And yet, it is important to think about your Chapter as individuals as much as a fighting force on the fields of battle. 

 

 

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

 

I think that the idea of incorporating South Asian themes is a noble one, but with any of these you have to be careful how you incorporate it and, therefore, how obvious and well-integrated it becomes. South Asia is half a galaxy and thirty-eight thousand years away from your Marines, and it is important that your Chapter doesn't come across as crass or heavy-handed. 

 

 

So, based on what appears in your posts thus far: 

 

• I like the idea of the firstborn sons making an attempt to join the Chapter. Perhaps it would be important to think about the rituals and contests they have to go through. 

 

• Sanguinius has potent and powerful symbology, being an angel come down to save Mankind from itself - the idea that he fought to conquer the planet in the Great Crusade might be potent for the Chapter itself. That they might find a planet where their Primarch himself set foot could help them to choose the world as their base of operation. There's potential for an interesting element when the Chapter tells the planet that Sanguinius actually died, betrayed by the brother he loved so much. It gives your Chapter, distanced from the Heresy by years, an opportunity to re-experience the grief of the loss. 
• I wouldn't have the Chapter worship the Emperor as a God, as I don't think it works particularly well for them - though you may of course disagree. 
• The idea of daily meditation isn't a bad one - it may well work towards the idea of trying to suppress and master the Black Rage. This leads towards a somewhat inward element of the Chapter as they try to control 
• As others mention, you need to reconcile the idea of bike-mounted combat with the Chapter following the Codex Astartes. Equally, how do they follow the footsteps of the Blood Angels? 
• The items carried by devout Sikhs could transfer across to your Marines - the items themselves don't matter - what matters is why they carry them. There are many cultures within the Imperium that carry knives at all times (for example, the Catachans) so that works well enough. It's important to think why they carry them, and what for. 

 

 

 

The ideas previously mentioned about incorporating the guru caste into your world may well allow you to have a think about psykers within your home world. When you consider that it requires extreme force of will to master psychic powers, perhaps you could look at that to expand into the idea of extreme force of will and mental fortitude. Perhaps your Chapter exhibits controlled fury - seemingly placid, until unleashed.

 

I would like to see you update your first post with the bare bones of your IA article, and that way we can see where your ideas are going - I look forward to seeing this develop! 

 

Regards, 

 

Mol. 

[Tian Shan]

Hello everyone, I have joined this site just to take part in the Liber section, good to be here. Warhammer now is in China, without the players!

 

I am currently forming a Chinese-inspired Chapter with some lovely dystopian twists, your Chapter has all the possibilities to do so too.

 

Maybe this is too obvious, but implementing the Indian caste system could prove effective, this does not have to be based on the marine's rank, but say, is a phenomenon on the home world and is hard, if not impossible, to eradicate. This could lead to higher ranks being of a lower caste, or simply a less meritocratic system. Maybe this is a little too Indian.

[Olis]

Hello everyone, I have joined this site just to take part in the Liber section, good to be here. Warhammer now is in China, without the players!

 

I am currently forming a Chinese-inspired Chapter with some lovely dystopian twists, your Chapter has all the possibilities to do so too.

 

Maybe this is too obvious, but implementing the Indian caste system could prove effective, this does not have to be based on the marine's rank, but say, is a phenomenon on the home world and is hard, if not impossible, to eradicate. This could lead to higher ranks being of a lower caste, or simply a less meritocratic system. Maybe this is a little too Indian.

 

Welcome to the Liber, brother. I'm eager to see your thread when you decide to court the opinions of the fraters here - 'lovely dystopian twists' sounds very intriguing! ^_^

[Knurd]

I am really liking this theme for a BA successor. 

 

Have you thought of maybe making the 5Ks something the Marines already have. I wrote down some ideas along with yours. I did a quick wiki so I apologize if I'm off on the premise of the 5Ks. 

• Kesh - Long hair and beards? Maybe to give the chapter a distinct appearance and makes it impossible to conceal themselves 
• Kirpan - A short blade that symbolizes respect, bravery, and justice 
• Kara - A steel bangle that symbolizes unity of self and of the chapter and of courage
• Kangha - This can be a sacred cloth that they use to keep their weapons and armour clean. To symbolize that their lives should be tidy and organized
• Kachhera - This can be the Black Carapace since it is the last implant they receive. It is the undergarment for the armour they wear. This lets them be ready at a moments notice. 

[Aqui]

I quite like the idea that meditation is used to stave off the worst of the Black Rage and Red Thirst, but ultimately is slowly becoming more and more ineffective. I also like the idea mentioned that a portion of the Chapter is growing more and more resentful that their meditation and prayers to Him on Earth are being ignored

[Sun Reaver]

I have updated the origins section of my IA! 

 

 

Hello, Sun Reaver! 

 

I think that your chapter shows a great deal of potential, and meant to post yesterday after reading the thread, but this was the first time that I had gotten to a computer. 

 

Commissar Molotov! You commenting on my thread means a lot as your chapter was my inspiration! Thank you for the kind words!  

 

 

 

I think that the idea of incorporating South Asian themes is a noble one, but with any of these you have to be careful how you incorporate it and, therefore, how obvious and well-integrated it becomes. South Asia is half a galaxy and thirty-eight thousand years away from your Marines, and it is important that your Chapter doesn't come across as crass or heavy-handed. 

 

I believe this is my greatest struggle as I do not know what to incorporate and what not to. My goal was to have the chapter stumble upon a planet who followed a caste system and culture similar to the one practiced in India some time ago. Hopefully as the IA expands, I can be guided in the right direction. 

 

 

 

• I like the idea of the firstborn sons making an attempt to join the Chapter. Perhaps it would be important to think about the rituals and contests they have to go through. 

 

I want the population to be a warrior race. People who know hardship and must survive against the environment every day. I had hoped the Chapter would host a set of games every 3-5 years where the applicants must journey to the a city made specifically for this purpose. The hopefuls would then compete in physical and problem solving trials. 

 

 

 

• Sanguinius has potent and powerful symbology, being an angel come down to save Mankind from itself - the idea that he fought to conquer the planet in the Great Crusade might be potent for the Chapter itself. That they might find a planet where their Primarch himself set foot could help them to choose the world as their base of operation. There's potential for an interesting element when the Chapter tells the planet that Sanguinius actually died, betrayed by the brother he loved so much. It gives your Chapter, distanced from the Heresy by years, an opportunity to re-experience the grief of the loss. 

 

I really like this line of thinking and would love to explore it further and incorporate it into the IA. 

 

 

 

• I wouldn't have the Chapter worship the Emperor as a God, as I don't think it works particularly well for them - though you may of course disagree. 
• The idea of daily meditation isn't a bad one - it may well work towards the idea of trying to suppress and master the Black Rage. This leads towards a somewhat inward element of the Chapter as they try to control 

 

My thought process with this was that the chapter meditates in prayer to the Emperor. But maybe simply making in meditation works just as well. 

 

 

 

• As others mention, you need to reconcile the idea of bike-mounted combat with the Chapter following the Codex Astartes. Equally, how do they follow the footsteps of the Blood Angels? 

 

I wanted the chapter to embrace the BA philosophy of a swift and fast attack style. I suppose I will have them follow the Codex Astartes the same way the other Sons of Sanguinius do. The bike-mounted combat was something I just wanted to throw in there but it doesn't make to much sense. 

 

 

 

• The items carried by devout Sikhs could transfer across to your Marines - the items themselves don't matter - what matters is why they carry them. There are many cultures within the Imperium that carry knives at all times (for example, the Catachans) so that works well enough. It's important to think why they carry them, and what for. 

 

Glad to get some support on this idea. I will have to think on this harder and come up with solid and justifiable items. 

 

 

 

 

The ideas previously mentioned about incorporating the guru caste into your world may well allow you to have a think about psykers within your home world. When you consider that it requires extreme force of will to master psychic powers, perhaps you could look at that to expand into the idea of extreme force of will and mental fortitude. Perhaps your Chapter exhibits controlled fury - seemingly placid, until unleashed.

 

Again this suggestion is a good one! I like the idea of my marines having an extreme sense of mental fortitude. Whereas the Flesh Tearers embody the uncontrolled fury of the Primarch, perhaps my marines can exhibit his cold and calculating fury. 

 

 

 

Maybe this is too obvious, but implementing the Indian caste system could prove effective, this does not have to be based on the marine's rank, but say, is a phenomenon on the home world and is hard, if not impossible, to eradicate. This could lead to higher ranks being of a lower caste, or simply a less meritocratic system. Maybe this is a little too Indian.

 

Are you suggesting that even though aspirants of all castes can join the chapter, the marines themselves would hold members of lower castes in contempt? Sort of like a struggle within individual castes in the chapter? 

 

 

I am really liking this theme for a BA successor. 

 

Have you thought of maybe making the 5Ks something the Marines already have. I wrote down some ideas along with yours. I did a quick wiki so I apologize if I'm off on the premise of the 5Ks. 

• Kesh - Long hair and beards? Maybe to give the chapter a distinct appearance and makes it impossible to conceal themselves 
• Kirpan - A short blade that symbolizes respect, bravery, and justice 
• Kara - A steel bangle that symbolizes unity of self and of the chapter and of courage
• Kangha - This can be a sacred cloth that they use to keep their weapons and armour clean. To symbolize that their lives should be tidy and organized
• Kachhera - This can be the Black Carapace since it is the last implant they receive. It is the undergarment for the armour they wear. This lets them be ready at a moments notice.

 

Im glad you like the theme! As stated above, I may not use the exact same 5Ks of Sikhism. I do wish to incorporate the sword and bangle. The Idea of the Black Carapace being an "item" they receive is very appealing and I hadn't thought of it that way. It is an excellent suggestion, one that I wish to use. 

 

 

 

I quite like the idea that meditation is used to stave off the worst of the Black Rage and Red Thirst, but ultimately is slowly becoming more and more ineffective. I also like the idea mentioned that a portion of the Chapter is growing more and more resentful that their meditation and prayers to Him on Earth are being ignored 

 

I'm really happy everyone likes the meditation idea. All of the recent BA fluff has made it apparent that the marines are succumbing to the Flaw faster than ever and I wanted to show that even a practice that has staved off the results for centuries is now failing as well. Also in terms of the resentment, I wanted to create a complex struggle within the chapter and have this sense of hope and no hope. 

 

Thank you all for your amazing replies! I look forward to hearing more of your feedback as this IA grows! :) 

[Knurd]

The meditation idea is good. I am using something similar, my Void Angels use labor and meditation. But I am seriously slacking on my IA. 

 

Have you decided on a name yet?

[Sun Reaver]

The meditation idea is good. I am using something similar, my Void Angels use labor and meditation. But I am seriously slacking on my IA. 

 

Have you decided on a name yet?

 

I really can't think of one at all. I don't know why I am having such a hard time. I was thinking of the Crimson Kinds but then I realized that was Magnus' nickname during the HH. 

[Knurd]

I usually make a list of terms I want to use and just combine things. (these are just a few suggestions)

 

Typical blood descriptors

• Vermillion 
• Carmine
• Sanguine
• Red
• Blood
• Crimson

And some different nouns

• Angels
• Knights
• Rajas
• Kings
• Guard
• Hammers

You can also use a generator. 

 

Also fleshing out the Chapter a bit more might get the creative juices flowing. 

[Knurd]

Carmine Devas\Devas Carmine - I know it Hinduism and not all Indians are Hindu but thought I'd throw it out there. Also in Buddhism the description of a deva is in line with Space Marines. 

[Prefect Apollyon]

Devas Carmine sounds like a great suggestion from Insein, unless you're going for a Sikh theme (can't tell).

[Welcheren]

Agreed on Divas Carmine. It helps to set the tone for the chapter with its exotic ring (to me anyway).

[Commissar Molotov]

Honestly, I wouldn't go for Devas or Rajas. Part of your work comes in integrating your Chapter with the Imperium and making it make sense. I would suggest that the route to a name might be in thinking about what aspect of Sanguinius's multi-faceted character you wish to exemplify and emulate.

[Knurd]

Devas does exemplify Sanguinius. That is the reason I suggested. 

 

• in Hinduism, can be loosely described as any benevolent supernatural being.
• in Buddhism, is one of many different types of non-human beings who share the characteristics of being more powerful, longer-lived, and, in general, much happier than humans, although none of them are worthy of worship.

 

But I honestly feel that there is no absolute need to have to base the Chapter name, or any part of the Chapter's persona, on the Sanguinius' facets. The Chapter can be strongly shaped by their home world, allies, battles, etc. The Chapter's name can be shaped after their creation as well, it has happened before if I'm not mistaken (besides the renegade Chapters). 

 

The different Blood Angel Successors deal with their curse in different ways. I would imagine that sometimes their ways of coping with it would make them unBA-like but they're still Sons of Sanguinius because they cannot avoid the curse. 

[Sun Reaver]

Honestly, I wouldn't go for Devas or Rajas. Part of your work comes in integrating your Chapter with the Imperium and making it make sense. I would suggest that the route to a name might be in thinking about what aspect of Sanguinius's multi-faceted character you wish to exemplify and emulate.

 

I was thinking along those lines as well. When I created the concept of this chapter, I wanted it to exemplify an aspect of Sanguinius' character trait. I had made a list of the successors and the traits I perceived them to have and came up wit the following list: 

 

Blood Angels - Represent him as a whole, nobility 

Flesh Tearers - Represent his darker nature and rage 

Angels Encarmine - Represent his unending sense of duty and zeal 

Blood Drinkers - Represent his desperation to do whatever to save his gene line 

Angel Sanguine - Represent his hidden secrets and aloofness 

Lamenters - Represent his tragic life and his determination to see it through the end 

Carmine Blades - Represent his nativity and sense of purpose 

 

I wanted my chapter to exhibit his cold fury. His belief in the Imperial Dream and his determination to right the wrongs done upon it. A perfect way to describe this is when Sanguinius realizes Horus had betrayed him. He does not wallow in sorry or rage, he simply accepts it and utilizes all his strength and focus to stop Horus. 

 

Devas does exemplify Sanguinius. That is the reason I suggested. 

 

• in Hinduism, can be loosely described as any benevolent supernatural being.
• in Buddhism, is one of many different types of non-human beings who share the characteristics of being more powerful, longer-lived, and, in general, much happier than humans, although none of them are worthy of worship.

 

But I honestly feel that there is no absolute need to have to base the Chapter name, or any part of the Chapter's persona, on the Sanguinius' facets. The Chapter can be strongly shaped by their home world, allies, battles, etc. The Chapter's name can be shaped after their creation as well, it has happened before if I'm not mistaken (besides the renegade Chapters). 

 

The different Blood Angel Successors deal with their curse in different ways. I would imagine that sometimes their ways of coping with it would make them unBA-like but they're still Sons of Sanguinius because they cannot avoid the curse. 

 

I wanted to avoid the word Devas as that follows to closely along the lines of Hinduism. The name does have a nice ring to it, but I feel as if it isn't right for the chapter outwardly. I believe the Chapter can be shaped by its homeworld, but I would assume it would still title itself in the language of Imperial Gothic. 

 

Your take on how the word Deva can be a facet of Sanguinius' personality is very interesting. I like it. However, I am unsure on how I would translate that into IA. Perhaps the local population can worship the Emperor and instead of calling his sons Primarchs, they might refer to them as Devas. This could sort of tie into the cultural legend of a war between the gods, kind of like the Mahabarat. 

 

Also I think I might ditch the orange color scheme and go with a more traditional BA succesor scheme. I played the Blood Angels because my favorite color was red when I was 10 years old. This isn't final, I just wanted to get some thoughts on this. I came up with the following: 

 

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/sm/bpe=F70505&bpj=F70505&bp=F70505&bpc=F70505&hdt=F70505&hdm=F70505&hdl=F70505&ey=D705F7&er=F70505&pi=F70505&nk=F70505&ch=F70505&eg=3D3B3B&sk=3B3737&abs=F70505&bt=F70505&cod=F70505&ull=F7F0F0&lk=F7F0F0&lll=F7F0F0&lft=F7F0F0&url=F70505&rk=F70505&lrl=F70505&rft=F70505&slt=F7F0F0&sli=F7F0F0&srt=F70505&sri=F70505&ula=F7F0F0&lel=F7F0F0&lla=F7F0F0&lw=F7F0F0&lh=F7F0F0&ura=F70505&rel=F70505&rla=F70505&rw=F70505&rh=F70505&bg=FFFFFF&rb=423F3F&gr=FFFFFF&ha=F7F0F0&wg=true&aq=true&dm3=true&mk7=333333&ti=453F3F&lkg5=3D3636&/spacemarine.jpg

 

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/sm/bpe=F20505&bpj=F20505&bp=F20505&bpc=F20505&hdt=F2EDED&hdm=F2EDED&hdl=F2EDED&ey=DB02F7&er=F2EDED&pi=F2EDED&nk=F2EDED&ch=F2EDED&eg=474242&sk=4A4545&abs=F2EDED&bt=F2EDED&cod=F2EDED&ull=F2EDED&lk=F2EDED&lll=F2EDED&lft=F2EDED&url=F2EDED&rk=F2EDED&lrl=F2EDED&rft=F2EDED&slt=F2EDED&sli=F50505&srt=F2EDED&sri=F70505&ula=F2EDED&lel=F2EDED&lla=F2EDED&lw=F2EDED&lh=F2EDED&ura=F2EDED&rel=F2EDED&rla=F2EDED&rw=F2EDED&rh=F2EDED&bg=FFFFFF&rb=4A4545&gr=FFFFFF&wg=true&aq=true&dm3=true&mk7=333333&pws=true&/spacemarine.jpg

[Aqui]

Blood Angels - Represent him as a whole, nobility 

Flesh Tearers - Represent his darker nature and rage 

Angels Encarmine - Represent his unending sense of duty and zeal 

Blood Drinkers - Represent his desperation to do whatever to save his gene line 

Angel Sanguine - Represent his hidden secrets and aloofness 

Lamenters - Represent his tragic life and his determination to see it through the end 

Carmine Blades - Represent his nativity and sense of purpose 

 

I wanted my chapter to exhibit his cold fury.

I quite like this idea

 

Also quite like the two new colour schemes as well. I'm hard pushed on which I like more though.

[Tian Shan]

 

 

 

 

Maybe this is too obvious, but implementing the Indian caste system could prove effective, this does not have to be based on the marine's rank, but say, is a phenomenon on the home world and is hard, if not impossible, to eradicate. This could lead to higher ranks being of a lower caste, or simply a less meritocratic system. Maybe this is a little too Indian.

 

Are you suggesting that even though aspirants of all castes can join the chapter, the marines themselves would hold members of lower castes in contempt? Sort of like a struggle within individual castes in the chapter? 

 

 

I think that warring alongside one another / gene-seed implantation would temper any radical views, but there are numerous ways one could take the idea... I like the idea of when there is the rise of a Master from the highest, smallest caste which could be seen as an omen for a prosperous new age. There could be an inward Chapter reflection into the ratio of different caste brothers, a wish for a balance by some or a domination of a particular caste by others is plausible. 

 

 

 

I prefer your first new colour scheme, I find the second too top-heavy feeling yet it is too hard to picture in my head. I like usually halved colour schemes, it can bring meaning to the colours; the silver could represent Sanguinius' idealism and the red is his rage.

[Conn Eremon]

Some suggestions that popped out to me while reading:

 

For the 'Five K's,' I'd recommend alluding to a tradition that could possibly be like that, without going into any detail. You could mention, for instance, a traditional warrior's band about the forearm, but leave it just that mention. You're paying proper respect to the source material, but you're not getting bogged down by details that will detract from the whole.

 

For names, may I suggest Nagar for the home world? It's short and sweet, with the name for its people, Nagari, sounding suitable for an Asian-themed world. It's literally the Hindu word for 'deity' with the first part, 'Deva,' removed (according to Wikipedia).

 

As for the Chapter itself, what I have read makes it seem like it would be well-suited to the "Angels X" style of name. You mentioned that your Chapter will embody Sanguinius' "cold fury." I'd recommend looking around for words that could infer or describe that, and see if any could replace that X.

 

For some reason, Angels Lapideus pops to mind, with Lapideus meaning 'made of stone.' A Dr. Who fan would probably love that. But the gist of that name seems like it would fit your Chapter well, I'm just not so sure on actual sound of it.

 

The Angels Adamant could work as an alternative, meaning effectively Angels of Steel. You could replace Angels with Lords if you want that 'Rajah' connection. I don't think Kings would work.

 

As for castes, there is something of that in the Salamanders and their home world of Nocturne, with those born outside of the Sanctuaries seen as 'lesser' to those born within. Nick Kyme's books explored how much of this prejudice can remain within the Salamanders. Sarah Cawkwell (who can be seen on these forums going by the display name pyroriffic) has written about the Silver Skulls with a similar prejudice between those born of different worlds. However you decide to put a caste system into your home world, there is room for that thinking to enter the Chapter. But, unless you intend it to have a major impact, or to lead to an integral event, I would suggest to keep mention of it minimal like with the Five K's.

[Knurd]

How about Spears of Telesto? What could show Sanguinius' fury more than his weapon...