Cpt maturin joining the hunt

[CptMaturin]

Hello my dear battle brothers.

I've been reading this sub-forum for a few months and now is the time to get serious about my dark angels (or successor chapter).
I bought the Dark vengeance set two years ago, and I bought 6 months ago a second hand army. I played two 2 hours game in the local Gw Shop and I have to say I'm a bit lost concerning where to go.

So here is my army for the time being :

HQ :

Azrael, Belial, Sammael, Ezekiel, Seraphicusx2, 1 Tda Int Chaplain, 4 archivists, 3 company masters.

Elites :

20 terminators, 5 DWK, 1 Command Squad. In the 25 termies I have : 2 AC, 2 CL, 1 Plas Can (bits for 2 heavy flamer, 2 AC and 2 stormclaws).
5 DA veterans, 5 Sternguard Vets ( the guy who sold me the army made a mistake).
2 Dreadnoughts (left arm 2 missile or Dread Close Combat Weapon; right arm 2 Las can, 2 AC)

FA :

3 DV set bikers. 2 landspeeders(HB+AC), 1 Nephifail.

Troops :

30 Tactical marines. 3 Plas can, 3 Plasma rifle.


As you can see, my list is very Terminator heavy. That's cool because I like the elite feeling. That's less cool because I'm a total noob and my Termies got too much of a beating the two times I played with them. I tried to play the Nephilim once, but it wasn't really effective.

I'm planning to play against a player who has a tyranid army with 6 Monstrous creatures (with one of them being a flyer and one who pops lots of puny little shooty tyranids). I think I'll struggle heavily with my Deathwing only list. So I was thinking about finding some bits to put one or two dreadnaughts into Mortis mode for Skyfire/Interceptor if I don't move + AT if they do to take care of the FMC.

So what do you think of this list :

- Belial 190 pts + Cmd Squad (2 TH/SS + CML + banner of fortitude) 340 pts .
- 8 termies (2 TH/SS + 1 AC) 426 pts, 5 termies (2 TH/SS + 1 AC) 250 pts.
- 2 Mortis dread (2 Twin-linked Las Can each) 145*2 : 290 pts.

Total 1496 pts.

Feel free to comment or guide me towards better options .

[aura_enchanted]

A whirlwind would be incredibly useful versus tyranids or a vindicator. Their large pieplates make quick work of his cannon fodder and smaller multi-wound monsters like warriors and ravenors.

 

Tyranids are always going to out cc you and out close range dakka you. You need to keep him at a distance and soften him up as much as possible at that distance.

 

Now on to your list that you have, mortis dreads should never not have twin assault cannons another loadout should be relegated to your Joe average venerable dreads. And bringing a double assault cannon dread isn't a half bad idea but only one is really necessary.

 

 

Tyranids also can't really handle av14 well and we sport the deathwing land raider. If there was ever a way to infuriate a tyranid player av14 reroll pen raiders is it :P

[CptMaturin]

Hello Aurora.

Thanks for your reply. I think his tyranids got "Armourbane". Wouldn't they eat easily a Land raider ?

By the way would my post better suited in the Dark Angels list section ? ^^

 

[Solrac]

Only a couple of the monstrous creatures have Armourbane and they still have to get to you. The rest would have to smash to get to AV14 but they would only get 1 attack.

 

Something else that works vs a horde army is an LRC + Standard of Devastation. The bolters get 24 twin-linked shots at 24" per turn (4 turns worth of shooting per turn) plus you have the twin-linked AC to boot. The high amount of shots makes short work of T6 MCs as well. It is a lot of points for that combo though.

[CptMaturin]

Hello Solrac. Thanks for your insight.
Tell me, how should I play that LRC ? Should I move it forward or keep it in my deployment zone ?

If those tyranids are hell bent on comin at cc range, shouldn't I try a static greenwing dakka banner list ?

Something like 2*10 man devastator squad (4lascan + 4 Missile)  with 1 librarian/pfg in each ?

[Happyfellow]

I think mortis dreads are relics. One per army.

[Solrac]

Hello Solrac. Thanks for your insight.

Tell me, how should I play that LRC ? Should I move it forward or keep it in my deployment zone ?

 

If those tyranids are hell bent on comin at cc range, shouldn't I try a static greenwing dakka banner list ?

 

Something like 2*10 man devastator squad (4lascan + 4 Missile)  with 1 librarian/pfg in each ?

 

Playing your LRC as a firing platform rather than a transport means you'll try to keep it at max range as much as possible so its not in danger of being charged. You aim it at priority targets that it can wound e.g T7 and below. Armour save doesn't matter because of the high volume of fire per turn. The command squad (whether it be a DW command or just standard) stays inside as a counter attack unit or to disembark and lend more firepower if needed. If you disembark  your command squad you always want to keep the banner at the back and within range of LRC.

 

Also don't be afraid to move the LRC. Firing snapshots with 24 twin-linked shots is still very effective. If you move it you can use that opportunity to shoot at flying MCs or any flyer with armour 10.

 

To give you an example I faced an Eldar army about 4 months ago in a 1000pt game. I built my army centred around the LRC as a firing platform. I stayed at range and the LRC alone had wiped out a 6 man Dark Reaper squad and a 5 man Wraithguard squad by the end of turn 2 shooting. You will be amazed how many 6s show up to wound when 99% of your boltgun shots hit. Then theres the Assault Cannon.

 

If you take a standard command squad load it up with 5 Plasmas for an awesome ranged counter attack unit.

[Varizel]

It really depends on the nids list. You said he got 6 MC. One is a flyer (most likely flying hive tyrant with dual devourers) and a Tervigon (Mama nids that breeds like rabbits in heat). But what about the other 4? Does he have a lot of gants or does he uses rippers for his troops? How many synapse on his army? Does he have Tyrannocyte (The new drop pod)?

Just gonna say this though, the best nids list... are not melee list. Shooting list is where it is at... He will kill you at range 18 inch shooting. So that's about 24 inch apart. If he get that close with his army mostly intact by turn 3 (which is totally doable with venomthropes), you're done basically. He gonna scoot over close to you to get that sweet range, and then shoot you off the board. He's not gonna charge. You need to be able to remove his support unit (Venomthrope or Malanthrope) off the board turn 1 if possible. They usually packed 2+ cover save during that first turn. I suggest a dual flamer (1 flamer 1 combi flamer) drop podded 5 men tactical squad to do this deed. If he is playing with gant light army, totally doable to do get rid of them this way since he doesn't have enough gants to deny drop podding too close to his venomthrope.

I assume he'll take 2 Carnifex with Dual Devourers too... and most likely with adrenal gland to give them fleet and Furious Charge. These carnifex will wreck a Land Raider on the charge. They got D3 Hammer of Wrath of Str 9, per model... rolled individually if they are in a brood/squad... and they got Str 10 on the charge. They also shoots out Twin Linked 12 Str 6 Ap- shots on a BS3 per dude. They hurt like hell. You want to charge these guys with your TH/SS Termies ASAP. Best way to get to these dudes are using LR since most likely you'll get the jump on them first. Deep Striking Termies? They gonna get blasted off the board by the fex.

Is he playing plenty of gants? Not the one that came out of Mamanids mind ya... but the actual termagant that was bought from codex. These dudes can equip devourers while the one that got pooped out can't. Those Devourers gants? 3 shots per model Str 4 AP- BS3. They usually take 10 of these.. minimum. If he does, then whirlwind might be good... otherwise whirlwind is a waste. If he does play with plenty of gants, then you want to kill the Tervigon/Mamanids. If/when Mamanids died... it blew up nearby gants. Deals 3d6 Str 3 damage to each unit of gants 12 inch of it. This is easier said than done though.

Internet wisdom will tell you to kill the synapse and the nids army will crumble. Rarely worked... at least not when you play a decent Nids player. They have enough synapse creatures or wounds to usually weather that obvious tactics and after you failed to kill his synapse.... they will wreck your army good. This is usually the biggest mistake most peeps playing against nids did. Focused too much on his synapse.

If he has a drop pod, he will drop his zoanthrope near your LR or whatever units he deemed needs to die first... and then warp lance it to death. Or he will drop a Carnifex or Tervigon with crushing claw (armorbane) and then withstand the amount of firepower you shoot at it, then crush your LR/tank next turn or just swamped the objectives.

Now anyhow, most likely this guy is playing a ripper swarm troop army or a single 30 gants to make the tervigon troops. Since 6 MC... will most likely cost him around 1k pts there. Then he got his synapse and supports which will be zoanthropes, venomthropes (gives shrouded to units 6 inch of these suckas), and maybe Tyranid Warriors (pretty durable actually contrary to what people said about them). So if you aiming to shoot him down, you need to remove the venomthropes first. After that you need to remove the high number of shots dudes... most likely carnifexes and Flying Hive Tyrant.

With what you have, i would suggest, a drop podded combi flamer, flamer 5 men tactical squad... or maybe 2... if it's 2 then you want a combi plasma, plasma gun tactical squad drop podded too.. so you can have 3 drop pods. A devastator squads with 3 plasma cannons. The rest you can use your termies or Ravenwings. Just give some of the DW TH/SS to take that melee hits from MC and that AP2 warp lance from Zoanthrope. If you don't have drop pods, i'd suggest you get the good ole gatorade ... or snappy just like how old players from pre 5th ed did it. So you can sip the awesome taste while blasting him off the board.

Dreadnought can be used to take out the MC by charging it if it got the DCCW/Power Fist. Don't charge dreadnoughts to carnifexes or Crushing Claw equipped MC though. They just gonna tore it apart. If his army is MC heavy though and relied on that MC to kill you, you can actually outmelee him using your proposed list on top... assuming you survived the shooting. How you survived though depends on the terrain... all i can say is good luck .

My 2 cents brother.

[Isiah]

Very insightful post Varizel. A great "Know your enemy" piece :yes:

 

Cheers

I

[CptMaturin]

Hi guys.

Wow Varizel ! I concur with Isiah. Thank you for the insight it's great ! Well concerning his list, I do think what he has is a Flying Hive tyrant, two carnifexes (which one I don't know), he's got the MC giving birth to gaunts and he has a huge load of regular gaunts (more than 20).
The first 2 hour game I played against him, he rushed his flying tyrant alone against my troops ( 6 motos +sammael, one tactical). I was lucky enough to pop a AA objective that gave the anti-air rule to my ravenwing squadron allowing me to ground him. Sammael then did duel him during two rounds, but to no good (Slayer of Caliban activated on a 6+ for a turn, but he saved all wounds bare one). I think he's not going to do the same mistake twice since the hobby manager taught him to stick the tyrant into his gaunt blob for protection.

"If you don't have drop pods, i'd suggest you get the good ole gatorade ... or snappy just like how old players from pre 5th ed did it. So you can sip the awesome taste while blasting him off the board." Sorry what did you mean. I didn't get that part. You mean bringing some moutain dew (I'm not a soda guy but I like that one ^^) while I keep all my units in my spawn to fire from afar ?

 

[Varizel]

Thank you brother Isiah and CptMaturin... I hope what i've posted helps. As for Gatorade or Snapple (not Snappy :D), that's just energy drink/juice/anti oxidant drinks.... not soda. Their bottles are approximately close to the dimension of a drop pod. You can substitute it to your favorite drinks of course, but soda cans and that small soda bottle are too small to be drop pod imho. 

[CptMaturin]

Aaaaaaaaaaah I see :D.