Frater Cornelius Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 If someone was to ask me what the best unit in the SW codex was, I tell him it was a Wolf Lord. The person then would specify and ask for the best, non-IC unit is the 'dex was. Some of you might expect me to say 'TWC'. You are wrong ;) The more I think about it, the more I start liking WG TDA, even beyond my all-time favourite Terminators, Deathwing. The reason for that is the sheer insane load-out possibilities. You can make a fully customized melee unit with every conceivable weapon, you can make combi-weapon bombs, you can make just about everything. And they are cheap. Not just 'cheap as far as TDA go'. No, I mean cheap. Free Stormshields is what really appeals to me. A dude with combi-Melta, 2+, 3++ costs you 38pts. That is good value. Finally, there is the ability to come down turn 1. While yes, it does add a 35-50pts tax to the unit, however, you are able to get right where you need to be and you have a potentially annoying unit sitting on an objective and tossing around pie plates like nobody's business. It does cost you a valuably FA slot though, but you are unlikely to have more than two TDA units in a balanced list. There is one and only one thing that really bothers me though. They are shoe-horned into alpha-strike. SW really lack a good way to bring a good amount of special weapons to the front and thus the excessive use of combi-weapons make them a one-trick-pony in the ranged department (the heavy weapon notwithstanding). Melee is a an entirely different issue and they tend to do really well there, especially with the COF WS buff. So, thoughts? Do you find them good? Or am I going insane? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Insane Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3912571 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rune Priest Ridcully Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I really want to like them as they used to always serve me well in the previous codecci and the metals I have just have kind of charecter, but I've been trying t make lists with them in and they just take up so many points when you try to give them a transport, which as I'm remaking my wolves as mechanised (mainly as a way to deal with things like tau, knights and fliers) you have to wonder if a grey hunter pack in the same transport wouldn't be better.If people have had luck with terminators that are mainly equiped with stormbolter/powerfist/power weapon, what have you found helps them? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3912601 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted January 7, 2015 Author Share Posted January 7, 2015 My preferred setup is 5 dudes, 3x combi-melta/stormshield, 1x combi-melta/wolf claw, 1x combi-melta/chain fist in a pod. Clocks in at manageable 250pts. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3912611 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rune Priest Ridcully Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 How well do they do well without combi weapons? I don't fancy cutting up my metal ones.Also if I wanted to use the Hallowed terminator plate for suicidel combi weapon strikes I'd be using my Thousand sons :P Or is it really all terminator armour does these days? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3912675 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cain21 Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 While I have to agree sw literally have the most customizable terminators I might have to disagree that they are the best non ic unit, that would have to go to twc, I know I know so repetitive but when something is true it's true, but it really boils down to general ru less twc come with the speed, toughness, and strength to really be dangerous. Whereas tdawg are slow and their combination weapons really do make them a scary opponent but like said only for a turn. So Tdawg are super powerful for a turn for sure, but twc have that reliability of continuing do be a threat. Now I have yet to use tdawg but when I do I will run them like chaos terminators, they will all just take combiweps so that way they all have power weapons and combis, though I might just maby give 1 or 2 a ss to try and keep them alive. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3912687 Share on other sites More sharing options...
tjdudey Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I have 15 TDAWG in total, 2 assault cannons, 1 cyclone missile launcher, 5xTH/SS and the rest with Storm Bolters and either Powerfists or Chain fists. I have run these in so many different configurations and never been disappointed. Based on pure numbers, TWC are better, so many attacks with rending, T5, etc, but I still love my Termies. What the TDAWG suffer from is a poor number of attacks, meaning a bad roll makes them useless for a whole round of combat. Also, psychologically I prefer rolling 3+ saves, its less disappointing when you fail, and more rewarding when you pass. That moment when you roll 2 ones on your TDAWG and remove 40% of your squad on one go is soul destroying. What I'm trying to say is I find it really hard picking between the 2, but the TWC probably edge it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3912727 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoyo ninja Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I am currently trying to decide this at the moment. My troop heavy mechanised force needs something to take out tanks and I'm considering TDA WG combi-bomb as I already have the unmade models (left over from the stormclaw box and I'm not sure what else to do with them). I was thinking along the lines of 5man squad, 2x combi-melta and SS, 2x combi-melta and frost Sword and 1 combi-melta and powerfist and put them in a drop pod. My thoughts behind it are drop them in, hopefully pop something important with meltas and then try and get them to stick around being annoying back field while I move up with my rhinos and Razorbacks. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3912787 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donkalleone Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I have a Question to Combi-Weapons. As they are extremly few and expenisve i like to ask how acceptable it is (tournamentwise) to declare that all stormbolter modells in a Squad are the same Combi weapon. Even for modelling myself from spare meltas/palsmas i dont have enough since im a beginner. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3912900 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rune_Priest_Rhapsody Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 The flexibility of their war gear, as well as their ability to fill many different roles in your army makes me agree with you Immy. I am of course biased as I have a serious addiction problem when it comes to terminators. The TWC are a great unit, but rather one dimensional in comparison to our TDAWG. The free storm shields as well as a reduced cost in war gear across the board makes them a very usable pack. The survivability of the TDA when paired with that is also really nice. End of Line Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3912903 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaveriK Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I would have said Lone Wolf. I lost some interest with Wolf Guard on TDA with this edition, not the same as the last edition with the chain fist and stormshield combo. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3912904 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rune_Priest_Rhapsody Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I have a Question to Combi-Weapons. As they are extremly few and expenisve i like to ask how acceptable it is (tournamentwise) to declare that all stormbolter modells in a Squad are the same Combi weapon. Even for modelling myself from spare meltas/palsmas i dont have enough since im a beginner. In your case, I would ask the TO or whom ever you are playing if proxies are acceptable. I've spent two years gathering enough combi's to get to the point I am now. The Sternguard kit is hands down one of the most useful kits for kit bashing I have seen in years. It just happens to be loaded with combi-weapons as well!! I would have said Lone Wolf. I lost some interest with Wolf Guard on TDA with this edition, not the same as the last edition with the chain fist and stormshield combo. Being able to deep strike them now allows for more scary situations for your opponent as well. But then we also lost the storm shield and chainfist combination here. End of Line Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3912906 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted January 7, 2015 Author Share Posted January 7, 2015 The flexibility of their war gear, as well as their ability to fill many different roles in your army makes me agree with you Immy. I am of course biased as I have a serious addiction problem when it comes to terminators. The TWC are a great unit, but rather one dimensional in comparison to our TDAWG. The free storm shields as well as a reduced cost in war gear across the board makes them a very usable pack. The survivability of the TDA when paired with that is also really nice. End of Line My thoughts exactly. WG TDA have the flexibility. TWC may do melee well, but that is all they do. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3912942 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatSmasher Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I like them as well, because of the threat they pose and the fact that they demand attention, But i find they suffer in the same way dreds do, they are too slow. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3913041 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Blackwood Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I love terminators but I just dont have the points in my lists to accommodate them , unless im playing a big game Pack Axe Murderers is one of my favorite squads of models but the cost of admission is just so high that I can never shoehorn them in below 2k Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3913048 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rune Priest Ridcully Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 So how do people counter that? When I used my wolves before they did okay on foot but that was in 5th and the whole army was foot slogging. I'm thinking either a Stormwolf or a Land raider redeemer, both allow for a heavy weapon and attatched character or extra terminators and bring extra firepower to the list.I'm turning my wolves mounted, so Razorbacks for the long fangs and a grey hunter pack in rhino and one in a Storm wolf, so both have a good survvability, both double the price of the squad.And that is the pain of transporting terminators :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3913055 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karack Blackstone Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Is the Stormwolves riding WG TDA packs a viable option, from CoF? It pays in points, however it seems to greatly solve the mobility issue by getting TDA into the air; the other side of this is the added WS 5 benefit. Thoughts? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3913076 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted January 7, 2015 Author Share Posted January 7, 2015 I dislike putting anything in flyers, so I have no comment. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3913078 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatSmasher Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I find that the Landraider and the stormwolves are very expensive shells, and only deliver 5 wounds of terminators. I do like the idea of a 3x WGTDA TH/SS hunting pack in a storm wolf. Keeps the costs from sky rocketing, provides a decent assault and may survive a crash Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3913126 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Blackwood Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I find that the Landraider and the stormwolves are very expensive shells, and only deliver 5 wounds of terminators. I do like the idea of a 3x WGTDA TH/SS hunting pack in a storm wolf. Keeps the costs from sky rocketing, provides a decent assault and may survive a crash but even if they dont crash its a turn 3 assault at best and forces yer stormwolf to hover to drop the boys off honestly I wish termis could just jump out of the thing and hit stuff but the way the game works sorta makes it dangerous to even employ flyers as anything but gun boats which is dumb since I have a stormwolf im very proud of and just cant make use out of besides an air to air or air to ground killing machine with an empty assault bay Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3913145 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted January 7, 2015 Author Share Posted January 7, 2015 Spartan Assault Tank FTW. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3913151 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oz of the North Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 They can also be made much better with the thunderstrike formation. Makes for fun shenanigans with twin linked plasma/melta/flamers Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3913153 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frater Cornelius Posted January 7, 2015 Author Share Posted January 7, 2015 Yeah, I just hate that you need a whole 10man Squad of PAWG. Couldn't we get two units of TDA without size requirements in that formation? It would've been awesome. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3913160 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TopToffee Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 The flexibility of their war gear, as well as their ability to fill many different roles in your army makes me agree with you Immy. I am of course biased as I have a serious addiction problem when it comes to terminators. The TWC are a great unit, but rather one dimensional in comparison to our TDAWG. The free storm shields as well as a reduced cost in war gear across the board makes them a very usable pack. The survivability of the TDA when paired with that is also really nice. End of Line My thoughts exactly. WG TDA have the flexibility. TWC may do melee well, but that is all they do. Yeah but they do melee really REALLY well FWIW, I love Terminators, and especially ours - they're the best looking models available to us imho, and I never leave home without them... but I'd find it impossible to rank them above TWC, just down to the sheer damage output the cav are capable of. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3913235 Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightHowler Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 I don't think it's delusional crazy-talk at all. I don't think they're the best unit we have, but I still think they're freaking awesome. 2+, 3++ for 33 pts per model? Yes please. And the mix and match options are many. 1) Deep strike a unit of 10 COF stormguard (storm bolter/storm shield) and you have a huge, durable, WS5 unit that can pump out 20 S4 shots per turn. Throw in a couple of chainfists and assault cannons and its even deadlier. Your opponent can't ignore it and they'll have a hard time killing it. 2) Pod in multiple 2+, 3++ melta squads and watch the enemy's armor evaporate. 3) Put 8 Chainfists in a Stormwolf and your Titan problems are guaranteed to disappear by T3. 4) Someone already mentioned the Spartan Assault tank... sorry, I just jizzed my pants. Are they the best? Not in my opinion. Are they the bee's knees? Yes. And the bee has some really nice knees. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/301629-wg-terminators-a-hidden-gem-or-delusional-crazy-talk/#findComment-3913521 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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