Rotor cannon?

[recon0321]

Is the rotor cannon the precursor to the assault cannon?

[Emperor's Furor]

Yes but it's reallllllllly bad.

[recon0321]

Thanks quick and easy answer

[Hesh Kadesh]

Not really as I understand it. It's a developement of other early rotary weapons, essentially the 31st Millenium's equivalent of the M132 7.62 rotary gun.

 

The Assault Cannon as we know it is a slightly reduced version of the Kheres Pattern - and later developed from the Iliastus Pattern Assault Cannon that was in production in limited numbers for the Blood Angels and Imperial Fists legions during the days of the Heresy. In 30K rules, the smaller Iliastus pattern was prone to jamming - this is not only a throwback to the old 40K rules back in 3rd, and maybe 4th edition for it, but also maybe suggests that the 40K Assault Cannon is improved on the Iliastus post-Heresy (having proved itself so well during the defence of Terra with both its primary users being present in large numbers).

 

Of course, the Assault Cannon may have simply been an attempt at a massively upgunned rotary gun, with the Avenger Bolt Cannon and Vulcan as Boltgun technology based equivalents.

[Daemon2027]

Yes but it's reallllllllly bad.

Rule wise yes, but damn does it look good.

 

I hope they release some Solar Auxila Veletaris with them soon. They will become the third section in my Storm Tercios.

[God-Potato of Mankind]

I got some rotor cannons cos they look badass.

 

Why are they so bad, ruleswise though? I already have multi-meltas and heavy flamers.

[helterskelter]

Its not necessarily really bad, yes the low str but the key is the amount it can throw out. More dice = more chances to hit/wound = more forced saves rolled. Its budget firepower spam less deflagarate with more shots on the move than say 1 culverin/caliver snapshot. Yes 2015 is the year i decided to be a cup half full person and balance negativity will a pro/con way of dealing with stuff :D and going by a thousand sons novel the reaper autocannon was being replaced by assault cannon so in my view the rotor cannon is its own separate weapon. Even 40k inquisitors use them (phalanx, ben counter)

[Galron]

If it was str 4 it would be worth it, but str 3 for a marine weapon, meh. Ill take a volkite something. Now for the IG army, yeah that will be pretty awesome.

[God-Potato of Mankind]

That Mathuin chap in Ravenor used a Rotor Cannon, if memory serves.

 

Turns out it was good enough to survive 10,000 years of darkness :D

 

Plus they look so aesthetically pleasing. I'm gonna build a Centurion with full Salamander upgrade parts dual-wielding rotor cannons and it's going to be awesome.

[Lucien Eilam]

It's not a bad gun, it's just tailor-made for opponents that basically don't exist in the Horus Heresy rules. When even the squishiest most horde-like army in the game is packing carapace armour (or even carapace armour that's somehow magically better against blasts than power armour), it's pretty lacklustre. In 40k it would be useful far more often.

[Atia]

It's not a bad gun, it's just tailor-made for opponents that basically don't exist in the Horus Heresy rules. When even the squishiest most horde-like army in the game is packing carapace armour (or even carapace armour that's somehow magically better against blasts than power armour), it's pretty lacklustre. In 40k it would be useful far more often.

but you can play against eldar, orcs or dark eldar in 30k. ... they just haven't new/other units there use the age of darkness rules and gg (hell, lorgar and angron even fought against dark eldar in "butchers nails")

[Adra'Melek]

Elder, Dark Elder and Orks? I play against Tyranids unknown xenos. Nice for mowing some of those down. Sometimes 10 Culverins seems like over-kill :)

[Marshal Rohr]

Rotor cannons on support squads are purely for fire saturation. I always fail to understand why everything thinks a 10 man squad of rotor cannons (which has the output of a IG platoon) doesn't have the same merits as 30 las guns. Anyone who has ever lost a squad of terminators to a horde of las guns never fails to respect strength 3 in massive quantities.

 

Edit: When the Auxilia lists are released the cultist troop choices with suffer to rotor cannons.

[Emperor's Furor]

Rotor cannons on support squads are purely for fire saturation. I always fail to understand why everything thinks a 10 man squad of rotor cannons (which has the output of a IG platoon) doesn't have the same merits as 30 las guns. Anyone who has ever lost a squad of terminators to a horde of las guns never fails to respect strength 3 in massive quantities.

 

Edit: When the Auxilia lists are released the cultist troop choices with suffer to rotor cannons.

Could have a 10 man squad of heavy bolters.

[Marshal Rohr]

Unless of course you've got tanks in your heavy slots. Or you army doesn't represent a support unit.

 

If all you're really concerned about is effectiveness maybe Risk or Call of Duty would be games more inclined to your temperament. 

[Emperor's Furor]

No need to get snarky, I was only pointing out that yeah 30 shots is a lot but you could easily have 30 shots that hit harder as well for the same amount of marines. I'm not competitive but I do enjoy a balance between things that look good but also are at least useful.

[Daddywarcrimes]

Rotor cannons pain me.  They'd be an amazing weapon to have access to in 40k, fighting against small units of ObSec light infantry.  However, in a world of Astartes on Astartes combat, they're a recipe for an eternity of feeling like I wasted $50 that I could have spent on Legionnaires with volkites.

[blackoption]

No need to get snarky, I was only pointing out that yeah 30 shots is a lot but you could easily have 30 shots that hit harder as well for the same amount of marines. I'm not competitive but I do enjoy a balance between things that look good but also are at least useful.

Correct me if my memory is wrong, but Tactical Support squads with Rotor cannons are a troops choice, while has a heavy support squads with heavy bolters are a heavy choice. So if you have your heavy support filled with spartans and tread goodness...  rotor cannons become an attractive choice if you need to clear out GEQ forces or saturate death star units.

 

At least in my area, legion lists regular go up against AM, Ork, and Eldar codices (and the occasional DE).  While at first glance underwhelming, I agree that the rotor cannon is a useful tool against horde armies.

[Emperor's Furor]

 

No need to get snarky, I was only pointing out that yeah 30 shots is a lot but you could easily have 30 shots that hit harder as well for the same amount of marines. I'm not competitive but I do enjoy a balance between things that look good but also are at least useful.

Correct me if my memory is wrong, but Tactical Support squads with Rotor cannons are a troops choice, while has a heavy support squads with heavy bolters are a heavy choice. So if you have your heavy support filled with spartans and tread goodness...  rotor cannons become an attractive choice if you need to clear out GEQ forces or saturate death star units.

 

At least in my area, legion lists regular go up against AM, Ork, and Eldar codices (and the occasional DE).  While at first glance underwhelming, I agree that the rotor cannon is a useful tool against horde armies.

 

Ok, perhaps Calivers then, who shoot twice at range 30 and deflagarate so they can do double the amount of wounds as well, so potentially 40 wounds from 10 men for exact same price, they are heavy weapons though so can't move, but they are available to tactical support squads and they are double the strength and have an AP of 5.

[blackoption]

 

 

No need to get snarky, I was only pointing out that yeah 30 shots is a lot but you could easily have 30 shots that hit harder as well for the same amount of marines. I'm not competitive but I do enjoy a balance between things that look good but also are at least useful.

Correct me if my memory is wrong, but Tactical Support squads with Rotor cannons are a troops choice, while has a heavy support squads with heavy bolters are a heavy choice. So if you have your heavy support filled with spartans and tread goodness...  rotor cannons become an attractive choice if you need to clear out GEQ forces or saturate death star units.

 

At least in my area, legion lists regular go up against AM, Ork, and Eldar codices (and the occasional DE).  While at first glance underwhelming, I agree that the rotor cannon is a useful tool against horde armies.

 

Ok, perhaps Calivers then, who shoot twice at range 30 and deflagarate so they can do double the amount of wounds as well, so potentially 40 wounds from 10 men for exact same price, they are heavy weapons though so can't move, but they are available to tactical support squads and they are double the strength and have an AP of 5.

 

 

Calivers are good for firesupport, but the heavy limits their mobility.  Rotor cannons are Salvo 3/4 (based on memory), so they can move and still engage.  I prefer not to have to set up static fire lines.  Its a matter of player style and choice.  Rotor cannons have a solid niche they can fill if the player chooses.  I use them for GEQ/Horde armies and some fire saturation of deathstar units. 

[recon0321]

Wow I didn't think I would spark so much conversation

[Cloud Runner]

I think it's worth having a small squad of them for 2 reasons:

 

1 they add a bit of flavour to the army

2 they look kinda cool 

 

I'm scratch building mine (like most of my army) using GK psilencers and assault cannon barrels 

 

They're not great, but they have a fun look to them, and can be good if you drive them up in a rhino and then pop up to 30 shots off!! 

[ThatOneMarshal]

See this is why I like the heresy this a bit of a weak weapon yet a lot of you are saying that your going to use it anyway becuase hey rule of cool trumps all. Just from reading the replies, rotor cannons are useful head off the army you play against. If it's against a lot of marines or legion then it's pretty bad but if you play a lot against 40k armies then they are a bit better.

[Hesh Kadesh]

Rotor cannons pain me.  They'd be an amazing weapon to have access to in 40k, fighting against small units of ObSec light infantry.  However, in a world of Astartes on Astartes combat, they're a recipe for an eternity of feeling like I wasted $50 that I could have spent on Legionnaires with volkites.

And therein llies a major problem with them. While a squad of Devastators is easy enough to fix up with a decent set of kit, with marines and spare heavy weapons accessible by the dozen on bitz sites, heresy does not have that, and with twice the amount of heavy weapons, and 'requiring' them to have the preheresy marks of armour means that each squad costs you what £50 for the marines and a further 25 for the guns, they're just not very good. Not only that, but Volkites are cheaper.

 

Without access to relentless rending or Sniper (why can't veteran tacticals take Rotor Cannon? Why?) Rotor cannons are fairly poor. I'd love to see a Terminator Rotor Cannon squad (maybe Blood Angels, with an upgrade to an Iliastus?). At 225pts, though. You kind of need a bit more bang for your buck than Salvo 3/4 s3.

[Brother-Chaplain Kage]

Anyone who has ever lost a squad of terminators to a horde of las guns never fails to respect strength 3 in massive quantities.

 

This. This very thing happened to me back when I still played, but it was to a carpet of termagants with fleshborers. I watched my ten-man unit of assault termies get wiped off the board, and said, "Well, if you roll enough dice, you'll kill anything." It became a common phrase around that place. As for the potential output of a ten man unit with volkite weapons, I have the potential to win the lottery every time I buy a ticket.

 

And who's requiring anyone to have 30k armor marks?

 

Now, with regard to the snarkiness, let's all calm down a bit.