Is Logan Grimnar good? Are Power Fists worth it..?

[Merellin]

Hello, It's me again, The crazy rambling person who spams the forum with diferent ideas.. I still wanna do something with my space wolves.. I was thinking, Are Power Fists worth it? Would be kind of cool to have a fist heavy force, And Grey Hunters can take 2 fists per unit! Also, I was curious, Is Logan Grimnar on his sled any good? Cus I want that model.. XD

[Frater Cornelius]

Logan himself is a regular beat stick. His chariot, however, allows for interesting tricks. I suggest you have a thorough look at the Chariot rules in the BRB. It is certainly interesting having him on the field.

 

As for Fists. They are awesome in the right places. On GH, I wouldn't say they are worth it, because a regular GH only gets 1A base with a Fist. On a WG TDA they are more appealing (especially the Chain Fist). On a Thunderwolf, they are amazing with 4A base at WS5 with COF. On a Thunderlord they are god-like with up to 6A base (up to 8 without allied help) and re-roll to hit.

Given how expensive they are, I would not suggest to put them where ever you can, but build a force that is designed to carry them. We are talking TWC, WGTDA and maybe the odd WG Biker unit with a Fist in there.

[Merellin]

*nods* I shall dig out my mini rule book and check the chariot rules then! I keep trying to think of ideas for making my space wolves more intresting, And to have more/something diferent then my usual 3 groups of Grey Hunters with 1 unit of Thunderwolves and 1-2 units of Long Fangs.. Oh! Hey, Mayhaps I could get some sugestions on what to add to my space wolves? What I have so far is

 

5 ThunderWolves
3 Rhinos
1 Land Raider
2 Rifleman Dreadnoughts
30 Grey Hunters (5 Meltas I belive)
5 Wulfen
6 Missile Longfangs
4 Lascannon Longfangs
2 Longfang leaders
10 Scouts (2 with Melta)
6 Wolf Guard Terminators
Arjac Rockfist
Logan Grimnar
Ragnar Blackmane
Njal Stormcaller
Canis Wolfborn
2 Rune Priests
1 Wolf Priest

[Frater Cornelius]

I guess it would not hurt to stock up to 10 TDA (4 more) and get around 15 Fenrisian Wolves. Never hurts to have those. Beyond that, Harald and 3 pods and you are pretty much set ;)

Well, some Forge World stuff maybe, but those are secondary at best.

[Merellin]

I'm thinking of getting a unit of 10 sniper scouts, And a axe and shield dreadnought.. My terminators I normaly use as sergeants in my grey hunter units.. Are Swiftclaws and Skyclaws any good? What about the Stormfang? And the Predator, Vindicator and Whirlwind? I want to get up my force a bit so I can run them in apocalypse, And run more varied lists.

[+Grimdark Prince Adam+]

Logan himself is a regular beat stick. His chariot, however, allows for interesting tricks. I suggest you have a thorough look at the Chariot rules in the BRB. It is certainly interesting having him on the field.

As for Fists. They are awesome in the right places. On GH, I wouldn't say they are worth it, because a regular GH only gets 1A base with a Fist. On a WG TDA they are more appealing (especially the Chain Fist). On a Thunderwolf, they are amazing with 4A base at WS5 with COF. On a Thunderlord they are god-like with up to 6A base (up to 8 without allied help) and re-roll to hit.

Given how expensive they are, I would not suggest to put them where ever you can, but build a force that is designed to carry them. We are talking TWC, WGTDA and maybe the odd WG Biker unit with a Fist in there.

Immersturm, could you maybe elaborate further on the chariot tricks? I got the model as a present, I really like it, I read the rules for chariots, where are the tricks?

[Frater Cornelius]

The main thing is to abuse the allocation of shots. This good thing is immune to S5 and slower, so you can hunt Troops all day and nothing will bother you. Even S6 will struggle to break the chariot. You can also tank the occasional Melta or LC with Logan and the Chariot, but it is those shots the rest of your army needs to take care off. If the LCs are preoccupied or out of commission, then Logan can rock out.

The main skill here is to know what sort of guns you have to take out with the rest of your forces and when to allocate wounds on the Chariot and when to take it with Grimnar. Bonus points for having one or two TWM Iron Priests for on-the-go repairs.

Grimnar has excellent output on the charge because of the impact hits. Make sure you always get the charge off.

 

That is about it really. Evaluate the threats, allocate shots and go to town ;)

[Merellin]

Oh oh! How about Land Speeders? add those to the list of units I want opinions on! XD

[Frater Cornelius]

I love Land Speeders, especially the Typhoon variant. However, I find myself never using those with SW, because FA slots are already taken by various things. However, when playing a bike army like RW, I take as many as I can carry. They are low profile compared to most units, but when ignored they can do considerable damage. You do not really want to dedicate a whole unit to shoot a lone AV10 skimmer, you want to shoot that big unit about to tear you a new one. But that lone speeder is forcing jinks on your units and is grabbing objectives like a boss.

[Merellin]

What about the other units I asked about? Sniper scouts, Skyclaws, Swiftclaws, Stormfang, Vindicator, Whirlwind and Predator?

 

Sorry for asking so many questions, i'm just realy rying to think of what to do with my wolves and how to expand them for apocalypse, and more varied lists..

[Yoyo ninja]

I love my Skyclaws, they are great for dealing with blob squads or objective grabbing. I usualy put a wolf priest with them.

[Ulrik_Ironfist]

I love jump pack troops. They are underrated as far as I'm concerned. I don't have many of them (10) and I take them as wolf guard usually, They are a great threat unit. Put them out front and make your opponent deal with them. If he doesn't, then move 6" and HoW him in the assault, before ripping in with WS5 I4 attacks (CoF Supp). Alternatively, give them all stormbolters (Jumpguard only) and move them around through cover getting them into place quickly and and use them as ambush troops. Use their rerolls on charge distance to full effect. The fact that you can move them 12" means you can get them in close fast.

 

Use them to screen your force, if the opponent chooses not to deal with them, see above. If he does, it's stuff he's not shooting at more important things, like vindicators. Same can be said for skyclaws, use them the same, I like them as WG because of the weapon options, also because they gain deepstrike, it's not as expensive a melta-bomb as some. They also work great for objective grabbing. 

 

Vindicators are amazing, S10 AP1 ordinance 1 large blast, will pretty much wreck anything. Use them. Whirlwinds are pretty much our only source of barrage without taking allies. They are fantastic against hordes, and they can be annoying to deal with. Take it as a Scorpious pattern (include a rune priest as a Keeper of the Relics to get more than 1) for 48" S8 AP3 heavy 1(+d3, if you don't move) barrage small blast. There's a trade off there but the ability to put S8 AP3 templates out there without needing LOS, and it kinda makes up for it. Granted it's forgeworld (My meta allows proxying, so no big deal). That said, I plan on adding a couple of whirlwinds to my collection (You can also make a Damocles command rhino out of them just by removing the launcher assembly)

 

As for Predators, I have one, I plan on 3 more 1 annihilator (lascannon) and 2 Destructor (Autocannon and HB), to give me a decent base of fire. Again forgeworld has the best variants, because of the heavy conversion beamer. Give that puppy LOS and it will 72" S10 AP1 large blast everything. Bear in mind that version has to stay in place to fire. The Deimos Executioner (with the plasma destroyer) is nice it's a 3 shot plasma cannon that doesn't get hot. So yeah, when you use forgeworld rules, you get some pretty awesome stuff. 

 

I plan on using some of those rules to see if I like them. At first blush they sound great, but who knows how it will play. I'll say this, armour doesn't really fit my play style, since I'm an airpower guy. I've run everything in my motorpool at least once.

 

You mentioned the fliers. The stormwolf is the best value for the points, with the lascannons and skyhammer missiles for free, and trading the large blast for twin linked small blasts it's better. Take it as a dedicated transport for some termies, and then deep strike the termies and you get the flyer and a free foc slot. The stormfang is a bit harder to use, as its lance weapon suggests tank hunting, but you'll still glance on 4's so you might as well not use it. Instead use it against multi wound deathstars. Nothing will hurt more than losing 2-6 multi wound models in one go (Ideally, it'll wound and the opponent will fail all the saves you force him to take). Especially if said multi-wound model is a Named character. I took out Khârn this way. The Stormfang works great as an anti infantry platform, the helfrost rule is great against low toughness multi-wound models.

[TheWolfLord]

To give people an example of how durable Logan can be to shooting I faced a Hamme of Cadia full mechanised unbound list today.

 

I was against;

 

Baneblade

3 Leman Russ

Leman Russ Demolisher

Leman Russ Executionor

Hellhound with melta cannon

Hellhound with Chen cannon

3 Hellhounds

 

I had:

Logan on Stormrider

Murderfang in Lucius pod

Canis Wolfborn with FW in 15 FW's

9 Bloodclaws with Ulrik in a Stormwolf

5 Grey hunters with lvl 2 Rune Priest in las razorback

Vindicator

Voidsclaws (5 man)

 

I deployed first and got seized on so had to go through 2 turns of shooting. First turn my opponent wrecked the vindicator and shot Banebland and 3 Russes at Logan. Bs3 so half the shots missed, as he had only shooting I took everything on Logan and took 2 wounds.

 

My turn and brought the lucius pod and Voidclaws in. Moved 12" with Logan on one flank and Canis on the other. Logan couldn't charge but managed to get 4 Fenrisian Wolves in combat with a Hellhound and thanks to Canis rerolls to hit and Furious charge I wrecked it.

 

My opponent tried to take out the FW and Canis with his Hellhounds and Voidclaws with all his ap2 fire. Only shot at Logan with a couple of tanks but I saved the wounds.

 

My turn 2, Murderfang wrecked the executioner, rune priest and grey hunters wrecked a Russ by shooting living lightning, plasma pistol, combi plasma and plasma gun. Can wrecked the Demolisher. Logan failed his charge of 3".

 

Turn 3 my opponent wanted to take out Logan and hit him with everything he had left, baneblade, 2 Russ and Hellhound with melta cannon, as Stormfang treats all pens as glances and has a 4++ save I I took another wound on Logan then the rest on Stormfang, leaving me with 1 on each. He took a crazy amount of fire and kept on coming, really quick and is dangerous to infantry and armour alike.

 

The opponent surrendered turn 3 after my Stormwolf blew up his Baneblade in a single round of shooting and I had a 6" charge or less onto everyone of his remaining tanks.

 

He's not tournament standard but I'll bring Logan along much more often, Canis in a single pack of Wolves is deceptively good although will struggle against armour 2+