Outfitting VV from Sanguine Wing Formation

[L30n1d4s]

Like many others, I am quite interested in the Sanguine Wing formation from Shield of Baal: Exterminatus.

 

If you aren't familiar, the Formation requires two 10-man Vanguard Vets Squads with JPs, plus a 10-man Sternguard squad in a Storm Raven, all starting in reserve and all arriving on a single, re-rollable, reserve roll. Most importantly, the VVs get a free PW or LC each and the SG each get a free combi-weapon or SB.

 

Regarding the VVs, I think the best configuration for each squad is as follows:

 

-10 VV with Jumpacks (mandatory)

-5 VVs with Power Lance (cheap since Power Lance is free; combine with Furious Charge for 20 x S6 AP3 attacks on the charge)

-3 VVs with Lightning Claw and Storm Shield (LC is free and Stormshields can absorb enemy AP3/2/1 attacks)

-2 VVs with Lightning Claw and Power Fist (again, LC is free; combine with PF, which is also a Specialist Weapon, and you get either 8 x S5 AP3 Shred attacks at I4 or 8 x S9 AP2 attacks at I1 on the charge)

 

Altogether, a 10 man VV squad equipped like this costs the same as a Land Raider + 2 PFs, which is pretty darn good for the mobility (12" move from Jump packs, DS ability), durability (10 wounds with 3+ save, plus 4 models with 3++ to absorb deadliest weapons), and offensive horsepower (20 x S6 AP3, 9 x S5 AP3 Shred, and 8 x S9 AP2 attacks on the charge) it can put out.

 

 

[Morticon]

Id consider this:
 

 

4x shields (4x LCs)

3x Axes 

2x Mauls

1x Lances/Swords

2x MBs

 

250 pnts.

 

I wouldn't bother with more than that. Already quite expensive.   

[tsijben]

I would never take Power Fists.

Two of them are 50 points and give you 8 attacks at S9, AP2.

For the same points you can take 10 Melta-bombs, giving you 10 attacks at S8, AP1 with Armourbane against Vehicles and MC's.

That would still give you a free Power Axe to deal with Sv2+ units.

 

The additional benefit is that a Precision Shot cannot easily take out half of your anti-AV weaponry.

[Pascalnz]

precision shot is rare as hens teeth at the moment, not really a big problem. 

 

the issue with the formation is that it's a horrible trap:), it's 10 stern guard not in a drop pod and 20 vanguard vets with jump packs that have to deep strike, 

 

so instead of turn one shooting and turn two assault, it's [at best] a round later for both, the VV's are template interceptor chow food and the raven can get shot down killing all the transported guys.

 

Please do go and try it out, it might even be great for your meta, but for me, it's the most expensive "free" 400 points in the game

[Shaezus]

^ this kinda hits the nail on the head.

 

Not sure if you can DS an IC or two with the VV but if you can then Angel's wing would hoot-nanny at any intercept. As for the SG, it's a big nasty case of having your cake and not being allowed to eat it. Could be great for an assault-buster, but that relies on the raven entering in hover mode so that some SG might actually survive the inevitable. Which is about as absolutely pants as one can get for a pre-planned 'strategy'.

[JamesI]

In this formation, I would not bother with fists unless I had  amodel I really wanted to field. 

 

I like Morticon's build, though would trade the Mauls for Axes based on my local Meta.

[Deschenus Maximus]

5 x LC + SS

5 x Mauls

 

Attach JP Priest

 

Profit

[Quixus]

5 x LC + SS

5 x Mauls

 

Attach JP Priest with Angel's Wings

 

Profit

Fixed that for you.

 

If you aren't familiar, the Formation requires two 10-man Vanguard Vets Squads with JPs, plus a 10-man Sternguard squad in a Storm Raven, all starting in reserve and all arriving on a single, re-rollable, reserve roll. Most importantly, the VVs get a free PW or LC each and the SG each get a free combi-weapon or SB.

I don't have SoB: Exterminatus but according to this source you only get one free weapon per squad, not per model. So what does the actual book say?

[Quixus]

Sorry double post. Please delete

[Xenith]

 

5 x LC + SS

5 x Mauls

 

Attach JP Priest with Angel's Wings

 

Profit

Fixed that for you.

 

If you aren't familiar, the Formation requires two 10-man Vanguard Vets Squads with JPs, plus a 10-man Sternguard squad in a Storm Raven, all starting in reserve and all arriving on a single, re-rollable, reserve roll. Most importantly, the VVs get a free PW or LC each and the SG each get a free combi-weapon or SB.

I don't have SoB: Exterminatus but according to this source you only get one free weapon per squad, not per model. So what does the actual book say?

 

 

I dont think you read that. From BoK:

 

"1st Company Armoury: Vanguard Veteran Squads from this Formation can take a single power weapon or lightning claw per model as a free upgrade. Sternguard Veteran Squads from this Formation can take a single storm bolter or combi-weapon per model as a free upgrade"

 

Emphasis mine.

 

As ever, if you're unsure, go back and re-read. Especially when something someone says seems to contradict what everyone else is saying.

 

Would anyone combat squad them?

 

4 VV units coming on T2 isnt too bad. Might overwhelm some defences. 

[JamesI]

The bookis clear, it is each modelgets the free powerweapon.

[Quixus]

Nevermind then.

[Deschenus Maximus]

 

5 x LC + SS

5 x Mauls

 

Attach JP Priest with Angel's Wings

 

Profit

Fixed that for you.

 

 

I was going to say "I would never Deep Strike that unit", but then I remembered that you HAVE to. Good catch.

[JamesI]

 

 

5 x LC + SS

5 x Mauls

 

Attach JP Priest with Angel's Wings

 

Profit

Fixed that for you.

 

 

I was going to say "I would never Deep Strike that unit", but then I remembered that you HAVE to. Good catch.

 

There are 2 flaws with that formation (in my opinion).  1) you have to deepstrike and there is nothing to give you a reroll to your reserve roll.  2) No Red Thirst.  

 

I love the formation, but 860 (at a minimum) points starting in reserve worries me, on 1 reserve roll with no reroll

[Xenith]

Dante or Karlaen help with that. Or the vitae veritas with a battleforged (combined arms detachment) gives you two rolls on strategic both with rerolls to get the rerolling reserves trait.

[JamesI]

Dante or Karlaen help with that. Or the vitae veritas with a battleforged (combined arms detachment) gives you two rolls on strategic both with rerolls to get the rerolling reserves trait.

Dante does not help at all.  DOA only applies to units in Dante's detachment.

[JamesI]

I just found the formation automatically has a reroll built in to the reserve roll so that partially fixes an issue.

[damnedsilverskulls]

I put together my 2 VV Squads last night.   I outfitted them with all free power weapons, 2 Axes and 8 Lightning claws per squad and gave each a SS.  It's what came in the box.  Additionally, I gave the squad 6 melta bombs

355 points

 

My thought is the points I would've spent on free weapons I will use for defense, i.e. the storm shields (SS).  Imagine 2 squads of these guys landing in your backfield all with SS,  the ability to take on any unit in the game, and to stick around due to its SS.

 

I did not model them with swords to get the +1 attack.  30 or so attacks from this unit would be pretty good in most cases. I like the idea of re-rolling wounds on the lightning claws with the furious charge buff.  The axes are for the 2+ armor saves.

[shaun03]

Like all formations there pros and cons.

 

Played 3 games useing it when it works it works but when it fails big time. Taking the Baal strike force gives the +1 I which is nice and should try to be maximize. For VV Load out I stuck with lance And LC, and all SS on them, few MB. For SG I want with all grav in one game and half melta and half grav for the others, in all comes list mix of melta and grav should be a good set , depending in local meta.

 

combat sq the VV is nice spreading out SS. As full 10 man sq with PW is over kill for most of what it hits, unless your going after a knight.

[Shaezus]

A Damocles would be big for this force.

[Deschenus Maximus]

Like all formations there pros and cons.

 

Played 3 games useing it when it works it works but when it fails big time. Taking the Baal strike force gives the +1 I which is nice and should try to be maximize. For VV Load out I stuck with lance And LC, and all SS on them, few MB. For SG I want with all grav in one game and half melta and half grav for the others, in all comes list mix of melta and grav should be a good set , depending in local meta.

 

combat sq the VV is nice spreading out SS. As full 10 man sq with PW is over kill for most of what it hits, unless your going after a knight.

 

I'm not sure if you meant to say that the VV are getting the +1 Init from Red Thirst or not, but just in case you were, they don't. Formations don't benefit from other Detachments' rules.

[dakkamasta]

I used this formation for the first time against chaos space marines/daemons and all nurgle. I gave the VV all power swords, 3 melta bombs and a storm shield on the sergeant. I brought dante and SG for extra deep striking units for target saturation and for less scatter. It was devastating, deep striked them behind buildings/bunkers and afterwards utterly annhilated every plague marine squad and their transports, a great unclean one and a squad of plaguebearers, while the sternguard used a melta/plasma combo to destroy a land raider and the marine squad inside. For this formation to work you need the right shooting to eliminate the strongest ap3/2 shooting the opponent has or you're gonna have a bad day. I used dante and the SG and the stormraven to hit his soul grinders with S8 AP3 blasts, without those the VV's would have been shot down to almost nothing before they could charge. Deep striking them near each other and preferably on one side of the board seems to be a good idea so that you can possibly avoid the shooting of units across the board and can support each other incase one squad starts taking too many casualties.

 

However i could see how things could go horribly wrong, I dont play against tau but i could see how an intercepting riptide could give you a really bad day. Not too sure how to deal with that aside from sternguard combi-plasma, but by then it's already gotten to shoot at your VV's. 

 

As to equipping them i think power swords and 3 melta bombs did fine, they can take on practically anything in combat (and nurgle stuff is a lot harder to kill generally and they did fine), and the one storm shield on the sergeant for challenges keeps them quite cheap which is the whole point of taking the formation in the first place. Don't forget even 5-6 of these guys will still slaughter most units, considering i didn't have much trouble against plague marines or a great unclean one (which had endurance and a rerollable invuln.). So against certain armies this formation could be devastating, but against others it could struggle.

[Venemox]

Deep strike accuracy issues?  Time to deploy some servo skulls.  1 Inquisitor, 3 servo skulls, cheap as dirt, is it's own fomration for Battleforged.

 

EDIT:  And don't forget about a comms relaty on your Aegis Defense Line to tre-roll those reserve rolls!

[Karhedron]

 

However i could see how things could go horribly wrong, I dont play against tau but i could see how an intercepting riptide could give you a really bad day. Not too sure how to deal with that aside from sternguard combi-plasma, but by then it's already gotten to shoot at your VV's. 

 

 

Have an IC with Angel's Wing join one VV squad ( I think this is allowed) and use that squad to land near the Riptide. Interceptors can only snapfire meaning no Ion Accelerator and everything else only hitting on a 6.