Any new info on the Book Order?

[blackoption]

I'd voice caution to wishing they go faster.  FW has always been about quality.  I personally would be willing to wait another year if I had to for Ultramarine legion rules and fluff, but that is because I trust FW to put out quality and balanced products.  What I would not want to happen is FW starts putting out substandard products in order to cave to fan demands.

[Saphrael]

Development and release timetables are determined by many things, but fan demands on forums isn't one of them.

[Brother Heinrich]

I'd voice caution to wishing they go faster.  FW has always been about quality.  I personally would be willing to wait another year if I had to for Ultramarine legion rules and fluff, but that is because I trust FW to put out quality and balanced products.  What I would not want to happen is FW starts putting out substandard products in order to cave to fan demands.

Easy to say when you know your book is next up. I'm not saying they need to crank them out like the sunday paper, but I was massively frustrated by Conquest as it signified a dangerous potential for things to start slowing down and start drifting into all the little side forces of the Heresy. Yes the mechanicum played a big part, yes the Imperial army played a sizable part, but the Horus Heresy has always been about the Space Marine Legions and the destruction they wrought. Why do you think the were broken down into chapters, while the structure of the imperial army and mechanicum was never really tinkered with in any real sense. Even in game terms, what do people love? Space Marines. 

[The Red Thirst]

 

I'd voice caution to wishing they go faster.  FW has always been about quality.  I personally would be willing to wait another year if I had to for Ultramarine legion rules and fluff, but that is because I trust FW to put out quality and balanced products.  What I would not want to happen is FW starts putting out substandard products in order to cave to fan demands.

Easy to say when you know your book is next up. I'm not saying they need to crank them out like the sunday paper, but I was massively frustrated by Conquest as it signified a dangerous potential for things to start slowing down and start drifting into all the little side forces of the Heresy. Yes the mechanicum played a big part, yes the Imperial army played a sizable part, but the Horus Heresy has always been about the Space Marine Legions and the destruction they wrought. Why do you think the were broken down into chapters, while the structure of the imperial army and mechanicum was never really tinkered with in any real sense. Even in game terms, what do people love? Space Marines. 

 

 

But they were... the army was split into the Guard and Navy so a Lord Militant or future War Master couldn't move forces without the aid of the Navy and the Lord Admiral couldn't wage full scale war without the troops of the Guard. Everything was split up, mainly to keep people with power from rallying too many forces for their own use and possible rebellion. I believe the Mechanicus also had restrictions enforced upon them as to the fact the half of them went to the dark-side including the Fabricator General.

 

Yes, the Legions are important, but you can't tell me that 2,000,000 astartes [minimum assuming each legion is roughly 100,000 men] conquered the entire galaxy... alone... no, they are the spear tip, the edge of the sword, but they are far from the only troops involved in both the great crusade and the heresy.

 

30k and by extension 40k is about far more then 'just Spaeech Mahreenz" and I for one am glad that other forces in the setting are getting fleshed out too.

 

The books will come out when they come out, there is nothing [sadly] you can do about it. I'm sorry this upsets you so much but that's life.

[KBA]

I'd say the plan is nurture what they've established and introduce more factions like the Knight and Solar stuff in between and alongside the marine campaigns. I wouldn't worry about books like Conquest becoming more numerous than the main Legion books. I think they've struck a really good balance myself. At the beginning of this all, it was suppose to be just one legion I would be collecting. That's turned into one legion, mechanicum, and knights. I wouldn't say I'm alone in the other side forces tempting my wallet and winning either. We'll see Sisters of Silence, Imperial Army, Demon Hosts/Cultists, Custodes, Dark Mechanicum and probably more before this is all done.

 

This does make the wait for some legions slower, but what are you actually waiting for? Special units, rules, and fluff? You can go ahead without them: the core legion units are all available. That's got to make the wait easier, right? I'm still waiting for my Raven Guard special units to materialize in the physical, even when a special WB contemptor is teased that doesn't even have rules yet. Frustrating? Lets put this all into perspective; this is the Horus Heresy. I've been waiting over 2 decades for this crazy, awesome journey to start. A couple years more for Wolves, Angels, and Scars? I could do that.

[Marshal Rohr]

 

 

 

 

I'd voice caution to wishing they go faster. FW has always been about quality. I personally would be willing to wait another year if I had to for Ultramarine legion rules and fluff, but that is because I trust FW to put out quality and balanced products. What I would not want to happen is FW starts putting out substandard products in order to cave to fan demands.

Easy to say when you know your book is next up. I'm not saying they need to crank them out like the sunday paper, but I was massively frustrated by Conquest as it signified a dangerous potential for things to start slowing down and start drifting into all the little side forces of the Heresy. Yes the mechanicum played a big part, yes the Imperial army played a sizable part, but the Horus Heresy has always been about the Space Marine Legions and the destruction they wrought. Why do you think the were broken down into chapters, while the structure of the imperial army and mechanicum was never really tinkered with in any real sense. Even in game terms, what do people love? Space Marines.

But they were... the army was split into the Guard and Navy so a Lord Militant or future War Master couldn't move forces without the aid of the Navy and the Lord Admiral couldn't wage full scale war without the troops of the Guard. Everything was split up, mainly to keep people with power from rallying too many forces for their own use and possible rebellion. I believe the Mechanicus also had restrictions enforced upon them as to the fact the half of them went to the dark-side including the Fabricator General.

 

Yes, the Legions are important, but you can't tell me that 2,000,000 astartes [minimum assuming each legion is roughly 100,000 men] conquered the entire galaxy... alone... no, they are the spear tip, the edge of the sword, but they are far from the only troops involved in both the great crusade and the heresy.

 

30k and by extension 40k is about far more then 'just Spaeech Mahreenz" and I for one am glad that other forces in the setting are getting fleshed out too.

 

The books will come out when they come out, there is nothing [sadly] you can do about it. I'm sorry this upsets you so much but that's life.

This is Brother Heinrich. The worst part about slow releases means we don't get to see his take on the Heresy that much sooner. It isn't mutually exclusive to want FW to put out legion rules AND want a beautiful FW fluff. I don't think he's griping because he's mad, I think he's excited. We all are. This is a great expansion for the game. It's natural to want everything faster. No harm in it.

 

If FW wanted they could easily put out a book covering the Legions not already covered a la the Legion Crusade army list book. That would go miles in helping people start up armies without massive books on background.

[Marshal Rohr]

I'd say the plan is nurture what they've established and introduce more factions like the Knight and Solar stuff in between and alongside the marine campaigns. I wouldn't worry about books like Conquest becoming more numerous than the main Legion books. I think they've struck a really good balance myself. At the beginning of this all, it was suppose to be just one legion I would be collecting. That's turned into one legion, mechanicum, and knights. I wouldn't say I'm alone in the other side forces tempting my wallet and winning either. We'll see Sisters of Silence, Imperial Army, Demon Hosts/Cultists, Custodes, Dark Mechanicum and probably more before this is all done.

 

This does make the wait for some legions slower, but what are you actually waiting for? Special units, rules, and fluff? You can go ahead without them: the core legion units are all available. That's got to make the wait easier, right? I'm still waiting for my Raven Guard special units to materialize in the physical, even when a special WB contemptor is teased that doesn't even have rules yet. Frustrating? Lets put this all into perspective; this is the Horus Heresy. I've been waiting over 2 decades for this crazy, awesome journey to start. A couple years more for Wolves, Angels, and Scars? I could do that.

Conquest was always meant to be a stop gap. Not the shape of things to come. Hopefully we see more Conquest style books after all the legions are released. That would be the perfect way to fill the space before the Siege of Terra.

 

Edit: the HH stuff has ramped up the veteran 40K community in ways unseen since the Eye of Terror campaign came out. Specifically, it gives us more freedom and latitude to do what we want with our armies that are unavailable in 40K. Do you want an IH air assault army? You can. It's way more plausible in a legion of 120K than a chapter of 1000. Blood Angels siege company without a single jump pack? Entirely possible. Writing about a campaign that involves thousands of space marines from six or seven legions? It happened. You have free reign to make up whatever you want in ways 40K just doesn't allow for.

[The Red Thirst]

*SNIP*

I don't think he's griping because he's mad, I think he's excited. We all are. This is a great expansion for the game. It's natural to want everything faster. No harm in it.

Couldn't agree more, I for one am very excited, but it isnt like were getting nothing between now and when BA, DA, SW, WS and TS land.

 

Patience is key

[Brother-Chaplain Kage]

I don't believe for a second that FW just decided to slow things down on the Legions and slip in a book introducing two new factions into the 30k setting. The development phase for something on the scale of the Knights and Solar Auxilia is just too long for them go "We're getting behind on the Legions... we need to bang out something over the weekend for Book IV". Mechanicum rules have been in there since the first book, and they had to have been working on the Knights and Auxilia for a long time now, so it seems to me this is all part of the plan.

 

Personally, I'm glad they're introducing other factions because honestly, as much as I do love me some Space Marine Legions, only having rules for them is discounting a HUGE amount of the forces that the Imperium brought to bear in those days. Open it up a bit and let some of those 40k Guard players join the crew with their version of our Legions with all kinds of pretty new models and Martian death rays. And honestly, who here hasn't dreamed of playing a Mechanicum army since the moment you first read about them?

 

The Great Crusade and the Heresy is the greatest stage ever set in this universe we've all come to love and I think it should be shared with as many people and factions as possible. Do I want the V Legion stuff now? Yeah, I wanted it two years ago, as a matter of fact, but I trust FW with my time a lot more than I do GW.

[karden00]

Development and release timetables are determined by many things, but fan demands on forums isn't one of them.

Testify, brotha!

[Huggtand]

I would also like to see FW give some attention to the “enemies” of the empire.

 

Sure it’s the civil war that’s in the focus but there is still room for battles against for example the orks, eldar/dark eldar and other factions.

[Brother-Chaplain Kage]

Forge World doing The Fall of the Eldar would be awesome. Like the Space Marine Legions compared to their 40k Chapters, there wouldn't be such a hard defining line between the Eldar in 30k; the depraved aspect of Eldar society would not yet have become what we know as the Dark Eldar and they would have a much more closely shared technological base.

Considering the size of the Eldar Empire just before the Fall, there could easily be some shiny new toys that were long since lost to the Craftworld and Dark Eldar of 40k. Oh yes, I like that idea.

 

Orks would be basically the same, since they don't really record history and only live in and for the present. No Tyranids, Tau, or Necrons yet, but it would be feasible to introduce a new 30k race that's been hunted to extinction or left known space in the intervening 10 thousand years...

[Atia]

 

 

Orks would be basically the same, since they don't really record history and only live in and for the present. No Tyranids, Tau, or Necrons yet, but it would be feasible to introduce a new 30k race that's been hunted to extinction or left known space in the intervening 10 thousand years...

Now i want some Squats, Chaos Squats and Space Skaven :<

[Marshal Rohr]

I would also like to see FW give some attention to the “enemies” of the empire.

 

Sure it’s the civil war that’s in the focus but there is still room for battles against for example the orks, eldar/dark eldar and other factions.

Please god no. It's one thing to wait while FW writes about other legions and battles in the HH while your legion sits undone. It's entirely another to sit and wait so FW can release another spectacularly underwhelming Eldar book.

[Brother Heinrich]

Yeah I will say that always struck me as a little odd, that in the 10,000 years since the heresy, every other race in the galaxy stagnated technologically except the Tau. If anything I'd think the Orks and Eldar would have made leaps and bounds in technology, given that there's no hidebound tradition and mechanical mysticism holding them back. But I digress...

 

I know me complaining doesn't really change anything, and I also do see the value of expanding and fully fleshing out this period with all the numerous forces involved. The things is that I've been down this road before, I started Heresy World Eaters before the first book was even released, just after they had created the first run of older Mk.3 and Mk.4 armor. 

 

http://i1162.photobucket.com/albums/q532/mv8830/1904060_10152646959423761_850781098_n_zps41c83037.jpg

 

I put all this effort into hand-painting the Legion Symbol and colors only to have Betrayal come out with all the awesome pre-built pads, a change in the whole legion symbol, new details about legion customs, markings, etc. Basically it made me kill the project and start Night Lords in 40k (which isn't a bad thing, but I've always loved the heresy and wanted to return). I just don't want to build a Blood Angels armored strike company and then have all the markings and whatnot be wrong and have to explain away a bunch of stuff that clashes with their Legion traditions and markings.

[Allart01]

That Contemptor is fantastic, Heinrich.

It's a shame you left the 12th, 'cause I'd love to see more of your work on it.

Come back, we got the nails a nice sense of humor and a loving primarch rules!

[Daemon2027]

Orks would be basically the same, since they don't really record history and only live in and for the present. No Tyranids, Tau, or Necrons yet, but it would be feasible to introduce a new 30k race that's been hunted to extinction or left known space in the intervening 10 thousand years...

 

Well the Orks will be bigger being top dogs in thier empires, imagine having the ork warlord that almost killed the Emperor. Also there tech will be different in some respects, while most human worlds were based off STCs they were not standardised Imperial like in 40k. If they were inclined, they could make the Orks into something wonderful. I doubt they will.

 

Also have we not had references to the Necrons, I'm thinking the alien race that the Imperial Fists fought on the planet to be kown as Necromunda.

[depthcharge12]

Well idk about the orks. I believe all the "brain boyz" are dead or gone, so their technology won't advance much, but this doesn't mean they won't have a loss of ingenuity. You can always count on the orks to make something for a purpose that nobody would have thought possible! :D

[Emperor's Furor]

Yeah I will say that always struck me as a little odd, that in the 10,000 years since the heresy, every other race in the galaxy stagnated technologically except the Tau. If anything I'd think the Orks and Eldar would have made leaps and bounds in technology, given that there's no hidebound tradition and mechanical mysticism holding them back. But I digress...

 

I know me complaining doesn't really change anything, and I also do see the value of expanding and fully fleshing out this period with all the numerous forces involved. The things is that I've been down this road before, I started Heresy World Eaters before the first book was even released, just after they had created the first run of older Mk.3 and Mk.4 armor. 

 

http://i1162.photobucket.com/albums/q532/mv8830/1904060_10152646959423761_850781098_n_zps41c83037.jpg

 

I put all this effort into hand-painting the Legion Symbol and colors only to have Betrayal come out with all the awesome pre-built pads, a change in the whole legion symbol, new details about legion customs, markings, etc. Basically it made me kill the project and start Night Lords in 40k (which isn't a bad thing, but I've always loved the heresy and wanted to return). I just don't want to build a Blood Angels armored strike company and then have all the markings and whatnot be wrong and have to explain away a bunch of stuff that clashes with their Legion traditions and markings.

I wish I could achieve something like this.

[Daemon2027]

That's sort of what I mean, they rely on the scraps of technology from the thier conquests. 30k universe there is a much wider amount of tech, so many different cultures with no Imperium or Mechanicu, telling them what not to use. So the Orks have more raw material to make thier crazy stuff from.

 

Yeah I will say that always struck me as a little odd, that in the 10,000 years since the heresy, every other race in the galaxy stagnated technologically except the Tau. If anything I'd think the Orks and Eldar would have made leaps and bounds in technology, given that there's no hidebound tradition and mechanical mysticism holding them back. But I digress...

 

I know me complaining doesn't really change anything, and I also do see the value of expanding and fully fleshing out this period with all the numerous forces involved. The things is that I've been down this road before, I started Heresy World Eaters before the first book was even released, just after they had created the first run of older Mk.3 and Mk.4 armor. 

 

http://i1162.photobucket.com/albums/q532/mv8830/1904060_10152646959423761_850781098_n_zps41c83037.jpg

 

I put all this effort into hand-painting the Legion Symbol and colors only to have Betrayal come out with all the awesome pre-built pads, a change in the whole legion symbol, new details about legion customs, markings, etc. Basically it made me kill the project and start Night Lords in 40k (which isn't a bad thing, but I've always loved the heresy and wanted to return). I just don't want to build a Blood Angels armored strike company and then have all the markings and whatnot be wrong and have to explain away a bunch of stuff that clashes with their Legion traditions and markings.

 

I wish I could achieve something like this.

You can bro, just keep painting.

[Stormborn]

I'm happy with the pace FW put the books out and 3 Legion books then something a bit different seems a good balance to me.  My only complaint is that legion specific shoulder pads, doors etc. should all have been out long ago, its not like people aren't going to buy them (there's no point me buying those Mk III BA shoulder pads at the moment as there are no rules for BA yet, I'll wait until HH176 - We're Almost There! comes out).

[Brother-Chaplain Kage]

Yeah I will say that always struck me as a little odd, that in the 10,000 years since the heresy, every other race in the galaxy stagnated technologically except the Tau.

 

That's something that always bothered me too.

 

 

I just don't want to build a Blood Angels armored strike company and then have all the markings and whatnot be wrong and have to explain away a bunch of stuff that clashes with their Legion traditions and markings.

 

Make it up. There were 10 times more Astartes at the start of the Heresy than there is in 40k and FW isn't going to detail every chapter and company and squad in each Legion. I can't imagine that you would come up with markings or Legion traditions so divergent from what we already know about the Blood Angels that it would clash as much as you're predicting.

[Slips]

Or you could just Paint them Blank and Leave the Markings off until the book detailing them is released, as hard as that might be on a completionists/perfectionists soul...

[Daemon2027]

 

Yeah I will say that always struck me as a little odd, that in the 10,000 years since the heresy, every other race in the galaxy stagnated technologically except the Tau.

 

 

That's something that always bothered me too.

 

Well in regards to the Eldar, they have suffered a massive disaster in thier society which could lead to ultra conservatism and a need to cling to the ideas of the past. So instead of making new tech they rely on that of the past, plus they lead strict lives, with emotion controlled. New ideas tends to grow in free societies. Also they are space elves and they are all about being awesome back in the day and who only care about survival. So massive fantasy cliche!

[Brother-Chaplain Kage]

But completely technologically stagnant for 10 thousand years? Hell, I'd settle for the 3rd edition version of the Starcannon. >_>