Dakka preds

[BassWave]

So i'd like your thoughts on this. 3 predators in a squadron with auto cannons, heavy bolter sponsons, and pintle mounted heavy bolters. Thats 27 hb shots and 12 ac shots for 345 points. Thoughts?

[ItsPug]

So i'd like your thoughts on this. 3 predators in a squadron with auto cannons, heavy bolter sponsons, and pintle mounted heavy bolters. Thats 27 hb shots and 12 ac shots for 345 points. Thoughts?

 

It should actually work out at 330, the heavy bolter sponsons had a slight cost decrease in the LACAL book. Its a lot of dakka, the problem is that its all aimed at one squad. In larger games where the FOC might be restrictive itd be a choice to consider, but at lower points values you'd probably be better with a Sicaran or two. for 60 points more than one of the predators you gain twin linked, rending, ignore jink and 2 shots on the main gun, plus better armour and become fast. personally Id never take a dakka predator if I could also take a Sicaran.

[Hesh Kadesh]

Itspug has the right of it. The other benefit that a Pred Squadron has is that it is a Squadron and cheap - An AV13 wall is very resilient and at 225pts can absorb more firepower than a Land Raider. Althpugh 'only' putting out 12 AC shots it protects your dudes.

[Raktra]

I honestly like it, for the cost of it. Considered it myself awhile back. Yeah it does kinda suck that you're throwing all of that at only one unit at a time, but I reckon with stuff like 20 man units with FNP kicking about in the Heresy, it's a bit less overkill. Of course against non-Plague Marine things in 40k armies that's less true, but hey, upsides.

[Memento Of Prospero]

I will be making a squadron of conversion beamer preds, because that's what a true son of the Gorgon would do. Put more overkill onto of your overkill, justbto make sure traitors stay over dead.

[Athrawes]

For 345 points, you could get a 10man Volkite culverin squad with artificer armor on the sarge to soak up hits. Thats 40 strength 6 shots with deflagrate with a 48" range. It chews up everything from terminators, to tac squad. I've even used a librarian to cast misfortune on a Spartan Assault tank. WIth Rending, 40 culverin shots glanced it to death in a single turn, even with a flare shield.

[Memento Of Prospero]

For 345 points, you could get a 10man Volkite culverin squad with artificer armor on the sarge to soak up hits. Thats 40 strength 6 shots with deflagrate with a 48" range. It chews up everything from terminators, to tac squad. I've even used a librarian to cast misfortune on a Spartan Assault tank. WIth Rending, 40 culverin shots glanced it to death in a single turn, even with a flare shield.

 

AT S5, they need 5-6s on 6s no? That's... 27 hits ish, 5ish 6s, and maybe 2 glances as a result.

[Raktra]

Where's the rending coming from? The psyker?

[Moonstalker]

I don't really rate dakka preds in the HH.  Maybe if your meta has a lot of 4+ saves (lots of Mechanicum/SA players, or if you are playing 30k in 40k), you can put those bolters to work - against marines, those heavy bolters just aren't doing enough.  Honestly, I would rather shoot AC/LC predators at marines than AC/HB.  At the very least, you can also use those AC/LC predators for anti-vehicle as well.  It's only 5 points more expensive than the triple HB option.

 

9 HB shots @ BS4 vs MEQ

6 hits, 4 wounds, 1.333 failed armor saves, .888 failed FNP

 

2 LC shots @ BS4 vs MEQ

1.333 hits, 1.111 wounds, 1.111 failed armor saves, 1.111 failed FNP

 

If you want to actually specialize in killing lots of marines, take Executioners with HB sponsons (no pintle :| ) or a WW Scorpius.

[Emperors Teeth]

This unit is in my list of 'units I wish I could use'. It's mostly filled with really awesome looking units that either don't quite cut the mustard, or are so over-costed to be absurd. My original version of this squadron also had machine spirits on the tanks so the autocannons could shoot at light armour while the bolters concentrated on infantry.

[Hesh Kadesh]

For 345 points, you could get a 10man Volkite culverin squad with artificer armor on the sarge to soak up hits. Thats 40 strength 6 shots with deflagrate with a 48" range. It chews up everything from terminators, to tac squad. I've even used a librarian to cast misfortune on a Spartan Assault tank. WIth Rending, 40 culverin shots glanced it to death in a single turn, even with a flare shield.

That's really good rolling to get 40 shots to hit; 

 

3's to hit = 26ish hits, 6's to rend = 4ish, 5's to glance = 1.48 glances. Neat.

 

Also, I don't think that they're as good as people make out. 40 shots is 26ish hits, and 22ish wounds. That's 4ish wounds and deflagrate is less than 1 wound. I wouldn't say "chew up". It's a decent result, but that's 120pts of damage.

 

If we're talking "wish I could use", it's up there with full units of Word Bearer Outriders toting Plasma Guns while joined by a Character with the Legion Relic and Be'lakor. It's about a 1000 points of Goodbye Terminators and "nanananana I have a 2+ Jink and around 20 power weapon attacks on the charge"

[Sevatar]

I like the idea of Volkites, but they don't quite cut the mustard because, ultimately they are extremely squishy 3+ models, and the AA will not save everything. What are the thoughts on AC/LC Predators for 345? I like them visually, but are they too expensive?

[Moonstalker]

I think AC/LC Predators and WW Scorpii are both bargains.  115 points for AV13 front, some good weapons, and 3 hull points.  With good squadron positioning, you can spread damage out among your Predators and present only AV13 to the enemy (most of the time).  Their ability to shoot on the move is awful, but they make a great firebase.

[Sevatar]

Is it not 125 for an AC/LC Predator?

[Moonstalker]

Is it not 125 for an AC/LC Predator?

 

115.  LC sponsons dropped 10 points in LACAL.

[SillyDreadnought]

AC/LC preds are good in 40k. In 30k, with the increased RoF of the autocannon and the point discount from the LACAL book, they're a solid heavy support choice for their points. Good all-round units to build your back field firepower around.

[Brofist]

Agreed. They are also the cheapest way to get plasma cannons into your army, spam AV13, are deadly backfield interdictors with interceptor, and if you throw Orth into a squadron of 3 the firepower is pretty impressive. 

[Hesh Kadesh]

How do you get Interceptor? The LACAL and confirmed by the FAQ killed that rule off.

[sedobren]

what about 3 plasma ones? 9 plasma 3" seems ok for 330 points!

Of course it would be better if they could take the plasma sponsons like the leman russ though

[Moonstalker]

They're pretty good if you can spare the points for them and have your anti-tank handled elsewhere.  Worth considering the bolter sponsons or a pintle weapon - they might net you some extra kills, but most importantly you want a little insurance against weapon destroyed results taking out your very expensive gun.  Also, if you're buying the Deimos Predator from FW it doesn't come with doors, only sponsons, so you probably have to put sponsons on it anyway or do some conversion work.

[Brofist]

How do you get Interceptor? The LACAL and confirmed by the FAQ killed that rule off.

 

If your group isn't letting you use the omitted squadron command tank rules, you can ally in admech. If you're a battle bro, use them for interceptor.

[Hesh Kadesh]

It's getting annoying to keep posting this;

 

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Downloads/Product/PDF/H/Horus_Heresy_7th_Ed_FAQ_Dec_2014.pdf

 

 

 

Command Tank (HH1 Page 238; CAL – page 81) The general version of the Command Tank special rule should be as follows: If the vehicle is upgraded to a command tank, then all models in the same army within 24" may re-roll failed Morale checks.

 

This not only changes the LACAL, but the Book I; Betrayal rule as well. It's not omitted, it's changed. And how do you get vehicle squadrons for Interceptor as a result of Battle Brothers?