Taghmata Omnissiah vs 40k - overpowered?

[SevenPlagues]

Hey all,

 

I'm curious what the community's thoughts are about playing the Taghmata Omnissiah list from Horus Heresy III versus 'normal' 40k? Are they as ludicriously over the top versus even the current meta of 40k as I think they might be? I'm going to be trying to get my regular 40k playing circle to accept them to play in games without issue, so I'm a bit concerned after looking after some of the lists you can build with them.

The way I see it, compared to almost any 40k army I can think of, we've got the premiere troops choice in the Castellax, and giant squads of buffed Tech-Thralls aren't slouches in the fearless, 4+/4++ FNP troop choice department either. This gives the Taghmata of the Glory of the Machine God, blessed be, such solid choices when it comes to our Troops. Extraordinarily robust, and still deadly at shooting, and so point-efficient, I fear they're toooooo good. The Triaros can protect our T5 units vs even the deadly superheavies I play against (Fellblade, Typhon, etc). To return to the Castellax, if equipped in large numbers with Darkfire Cannons, they can destroy enemy superheavies with a fearsome reliability. With 2 Flamers for an absurdly low cost, any number of enemy chaff units are in trouble assaulting them too.

We can also take nigh-unkillable Warlords, with T6W4 2+/3++/5+ FNP, that can go inside the Triaros for protection from S10 templates! Aside from that, Krios Venators are dirt-cheap, superb anti-tank. They're not the greatest but you can take several of them for a minimal investment. This gives us yet more resilience, and place getting the VP for slaying our warlord out of reach of so many armies.

Thallax I find it somewhat more difficult to speak so glowingly about, but against normal infantry from most any army they're so resilient it doesn't matter they cost so much, especially if accompanied by a damage-dealing Magos on a Jetpack. If you protect them from S10, they can run amok amongst the enemy's troops, or light vehicles if you give them Tank Hunter, and earn their points back dying gloriously in service of the Omnissiah's inscrutable ends. At the end of the day, I feel like the number of Castellax that you take is in direct relationship to how much your opponent is going to want to play a second game against you. They can do absolutely everything (deal with hordes with subtle maneuvering, deal with heavy armour with Darkfire in big groups, and crush enough with their S6 AP2 attacks) and are still perfectly affordable, and you can take gigantic units of them if you're so inclined.

So, my questions or conversation-starter would be: I) who has played against Taghmata Omnissiah with their 40k lists, be it with Adeptus Astartes or xenos of all kinds, and what are your thoughts? II) in the context of 40k, do you think they're a very powerful and competitive list? III) do you think it's problematic to play them against 40k lists? I've read a few posts on this forum of people rolling 40k armies 10+ VP above the opponent, and while I recognize that's anectodal and situational, I'm still interested in soliciting the opinions of everyone who plays or has played against the Adepts of Mars.

[depthcharge12]

I think you need to slow down for a sec and breathe :) against 30k lists, yeah they're top tier, against 40k...ehhh no.

 

For example, here's three of the top armies I see being played that could put the hurt on AdMech:

 

1.) Dark Eldar - a sleeper winner, but a winner non the less. Able to have large number of glass hammer units that excel in shooting. You like those Castellax and Thallax? Say hello to everyone that has poison in the army. Tanks will also cry from all the bright lances. These guys are most assuredly allied with...

 

2.) Eldar - no surprises here. Pseudo rend on basic guns and impossible to hit wave serpents. Wraith guns will use their distortion weapons to ID all your big baddies.

 

3.) Tau - yup. A lot of high strength weaponry here, particularly the ubiquitous pulse rifle and missile pod. Broadsides, crisis suits, and riptides will eat up AdMech while jumping around always out of reach. Say goodbye to your nice tanks and backfield units. Oh, and don't forget the lonely 5 point kroot with a sniper rifle that can strip wounds from your high toughness units.

 

 

I think that all the AdMech has going for them in 40k is the ability to ignore cover easily. Against high density flyer and FMC armies (Nids, Chaos) you have little to no AA.

 

AdMech is geared toward the 30k mindset and is somewhat tailored to destroying marine armies with ease. Outside of that, good luck, but you don't have much going for you.

[Slips]

You forgot to mention the Thanatar and its Plasma Mortar.

 

But I agree with Depthcharge above. The prevalence of Poison (DE), Lance (Dark for DE, Bright for Eldar) and long range firepower (Tau mostly) will be a pain to deal with.

 

They mostly look overpowered against 40k lists on paper but in practice, not so much the case - that is, after the 'unknown' effect wears off since they'll most likely not know what 30k AdMech can do.

 

...Granted you'll have the easiest time making Horde armies cry due to Volkite and Flamer Spam (destructors and Castellax, among others) and the Thanatars Plasma Mortar.

 

Don't forget that you can do some pretty crazy things with Mechanicum Land Raiders - Though I don't think they're Taghmata.

 

 

 

Edit: That said, at lower points games, I think they're the most competitive of the 30k Armies - though the Solar Auxilia are a stiff competition.

[Dark Bjoern]

I fought against Orks, DE/Eldar, 3x SM (BA, Crimson Fists and SM/SW), IG and Tau so far.

I lost to the BA cause the guy was cheating, i lost to the SM/SW list cause this guy was really good and i lost to the DE/Eldar cause i tried to play at 3000 points for a victory through annihilation. I had have only 29 models on the table while my opponents had have nearly three time that number avialable and i failed only briefly. The poison weapons had been not such a big deal for me. Most of their weapons still allows you to use your armour saves. And i have an incredible luck when it comes to inv saves. The Eldar Wraith Guards are more dangerous to you.

In general you can say that you can play on equal level with the 40k armies. AA could be a problem. I solved it by adding a Lightning to my Taghmata.

Next week i will fight against the foul hordes of the CSM. I don't know what will expect me, but i think i can handle it.

[Malios]

I'm very fortunate because I have two mates who both play very different mechanicum armies.

 

The first mate's army mainly consists of thallax and castellax units supported by buffing tech priests wheras the second is a questoris knight detachment with allied thallax and thanatars. Both are very different to play against naturally... but I find that its easier (and more fun) to play against them with my 40k orks rather then my 30k alpha legion.

 

In the case of my first mate's army, he struggles against the orks simply because his thallax and castellax struggle to deal with large hordes of cheap infantry, though I will humbly admit that his army was purely equipped for killing marines in power armour. The saying from veteran ork players that "everything dies to power klaws" holds true even in 7th edition and my mate knows this from experience.

 

The second army is alot more challenging due to the sheer amount of high strength, low AP pie plates it can dish out. As every ork player knows, pie plates make a giant mess, particularly with our new codex because invul saves are next to non-existant without big meks. But, despite how daunting it is on paper, it's not entirely unbeatable: I've had the hilarious experience of removing a Knight from play with a single shokk attack gun shot (and ironically the following turn had the same big mek catapulted head first into combat with its angry buddy) and, if thrown literally, the sheer weight of loota fire and tank bustas will bring knights and thanatar crashing down.

 

The point to take from this is that 40k is a very different game to 30k. What would steam roll over a 30k legion for example (my poor alpha legion...), may not necessarily steam roll over a 40k force that is very different in composition and style such as daemons or orks.

[Nusquam]

Don't forget you have to re-roll successful poison wounds against automata due to Cybernetic Resilience. So DE aren't so hot after all.

 

As for Eldar there are so many ways to give -2/-3 to cover that jinking/cover won't save them.

 

As for Tau theres plenty of ways to give AdMech interceptor and between Deep Striking Plasma-fusil Thallax escorted by a Magos with a jet pack, double-fusil, and a cyber occularis battle suits will melt. The Conveyor is tough as nails and can put things like Destructors in range to radiate anything short of riptides. As for riptides, the sheer amount of S9 AP2 a squadron of Krios can dish out, perhaps with a -1 to cover from a wandering ocularis, will put the hurt on. The Thanatar also are deadly. With the array, BS5/-1 to cover on top of re-rolling successful cover will melt broadsides and the like.

 

AdMech are top-tier in both 30k/40k. A lot of it has to do with the player. You can really optimize the list for pain and you will do well. Or if you simply want technomancy and arcane weapons for the fun of it it can be casual, good and fun. Just don't go crazy with it.