haunther Posted February 6, 2015 Share Posted February 6, 2015 In 6th Lukas counted as an upgrade to a BC pack, now it seems he's his own independent character? So what I'm asking is does he still count as a Bloodclaw? So if I had a pack of 14 Bloodclaws + Lukas would I get the extra special weapon?The load out I'm aiming for is...1x Wolf Priest 1x Lukas the Trickster14x Wolfclaws with 2 meltas and a powerfist...In a StormwolfI know it's a lot of eggs in one basket for something that will arrive on turn 2 at the earliest... but I just love the idea of it Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucien Eilam Posted February 6, 2015 Share Posted February 6, 2015 No, he's an independent character bought separately, not an upgrade to the squad. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3941912 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vykryl Posted February 6, 2015 Share Posted February 6, 2015 Lucas doesn't take up a slot if you take a Bloodclaw pack. You would still need to take 15 Bloodclaws to get the 2nd special Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3941913 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rune Priest Jbickb Posted February 6, 2015 Share Posted February 6, 2015 Honestly I think you would get more mileage out of a flamer than a melta as your can't pop a vehicle and then charge to contents, and with bs 3 the flamer usually gets more work done. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3942269 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Targetlock Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 ive converted my own version but yet to use him, how good is he? is he worth the points? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3943599 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donkalleone Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 Honestly I think you would get more mileage out of a flamer than a melta as your can't pop a vehicle and then charge to contents, and with bs 3 the flamer usually gets more work done. Thats False. In 7th Edition you can take out the Transport and then assault the units that it transported. So using a Melta viable. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3943665 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rune Priest Jbickb Posted February 8, 2015 Share Posted February 8, 2015 Honestly I think you would get more mileage out of a flamer than a melta as your can't pop a vehicle and then charge to contents, and with bs 3 the flamer usually gets more work done. Thats False. In 7th Edition you can take out the Transport and then assault the units that it transported. So using a Melta viable. Please quote that rule, if so that's amazing but I can't find it and have not been playing that way all along. I want so badly to be wrong believe me. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3944291 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoic Raptor Posted February 8, 2015 Share Posted February 8, 2015 I don't think there's a rule that says you "can", as much as the rules simply allow it because there's nothing to prevent it. If you were to destroy the vehicle in the Shooting Phase (or cause the squad to dismount), then they would be an eligible target to charge in the Assault Phase. None of the conditions preventing it are present. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3944311 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucien Eilam Posted February 8, 2015 Share Posted February 8, 2015 I don't think there's a rule that says you "can", as much as the rules simply allow it because there's nothing to prevent it. If you were to destroy the vehicle in the Shooting Phase (or cause the squad to dismount), then they would be an eligible target to charge in the Assault Phase. None of the conditions preventing it are present. No, it needs a rule, because the default is you can only assault a unit that you shot at. Fortunately, there is just such a rule: If a Transport is destroyed by a shooting attack, any unit that shot it that turn can, if allowed, charge the now disembarked passengers. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3944340 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoic Raptor Posted February 8, 2015 Share Posted February 8, 2015 I don't see any rule that says you can only charge a unit you shot at. In fact, you don't need to shoot at all in the Shooting phase to charge in the Assault phase, from what I can see. Please point me to that "default" rule. The only restriction is that, if you fired at a unit, that's the unit you must charge. If it's a dedicated transport, it's part of that unit, right? A unit that fired in the Shooting Phase can only charge the unit that it targeted during that turn's Shooting Phase. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3944345 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucien Eilam Posted February 8, 2015 Share Posted February 8, 2015 I don't see any rule that says you can only charge a unit you shot at. In fact, you don't need to shoot at all in the Shooting phase to charge in the Assault phase, from what I can see. Please point me to that "default" rule. The only restriction is that, if you fired at a unit, that's the unit you must charge. We're talking about the context of a unit that fired in the shooting phase. Some units can shoot at more than one target (super-heavies, Split Fire, etc.) hence "a unit" that you shot. If you didn't shoot at all, of course you can charge anything you like, but I don't see what that has to do with the topic being discussed. If it's a dedicated transport, it's part of that unit, right? No, it isn't. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3944350 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donkalleone Posted February 8, 2015 Share Posted February 8, 2015 If a Transport is destroyed by a shooting attack, any unit that shot it that turn can, if allowed, charge the now disembarked passengers. Just so you dont have to Search: its under Vehicles - Transports - EFFECT OF DAMAGE ON PASSENGERS Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3944357 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoic Raptor Posted February 8, 2015 Share Posted February 8, 2015 I had presumed that the dedicated transport was part of the unit, which would solve the issue automatically - but that doesn't address what happens when a unit is embarked upon a non-dedicated transport. Thanks for clearing up the confusion. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3944364 Share on other sites More sharing options...
haunther Posted February 8, 2015 Author Share Posted February 8, 2015 So if my meltas destroy a rhino for example I can now charge the disembarked enemies? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3944607 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jay170788 Posted February 8, 2015 Share Posted February 8, 2015 Yes you sure can mate Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3944667 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rune Priest Jbickb Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 Well that is an awesome change from 6th. Thanks for pointing that out guys I must have totally missed that little gem. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3945363 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jay170788 Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 You could in 6th edition too..,, Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3945442 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gman Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 To fully answer the original question: As I take it, Lukas is not an upgraded BC, however I believe he takes a BC slot. He of course can only join BC, and different from last codex, he is now an IC. Which kind of sucks, as it was cool having his hidden claw. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3945707 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulrik_Ironfist Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 If you take Lukas and BC, he doesn't take up a FOC slot (just like Arjac with terminators), but he doesn't count towards the total in the Unit, so you can't take him and get the second special weapon. Now, I'm not hung up on having that special weapon, since I don't want my BC shooting stuff, I want them stuck in doing CC. I also don't take full 15 man units, I have 20 BC, so I put them in units of 10 so I can drop pod them in. I'm not much of a tank guy. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3945776 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gman Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 To be clearer, what I meant by "takes a slot" I meant of the BC unit. So it's either 16 BC, or 15 BC and Lukas. At least that's how I interpret the entry for him, I could be wrong, maybe you could do 16 BC and still include Lukas. However, he definately does not take up an HQ slot. He is just a BC character. Can you imagine having Lukas lead your army into batle? LOL I have a unit of 10 BC and nicely painted up Lukas. When I saw the new flyer, and it's transport capacity, I got a big stupid grin, and fully intend to build some more BC and field a full unit(with Lukas) charging out of the stormwolf. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3945873 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoic Raptor Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 It's never 16 Blood Claws without Lukas. The basic BC unit is 5 Blood Claws, and you can add up to 10 more. One of those can be upgraded to a WGPL, but you'd still only have 15 guys at most. Lukas may join a unit of Blood Claws, but nowhere is it implied that he takes the place of one of them. He merely does not occupy an additional FOC slot as a character normally would. So you could still fit a fully-upgraded BC unit plus Lukas into a Stormwolf or Crusader. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303101-lukas-the-trickster-bloodclaws/#findComment-3945879 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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