Brom MKIV Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Check this list out for some pretty unorthodox choices. This list was taken to templecon fyi. Results are of his performance aren't up yet. http://greenblowfly.blogspot.com/2015/02/templecon.html?m=1 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Sevrin Loth and Grav Cents. PAGK don't really matter. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/#findComment-3946794 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brom MKIV Posted February 10, 2015 Author Share Posted February 10, 2015 Haha that is true, but only to an extent. Support elements are hard to get a bead on for exactly that reason.. the star is so good. I've been playing many different variations of centstar and they are all good, but it can fall flat in the mirror, vs heavy air forces, heavy psych/anti psych and against heavy scoring presence (assuming some form of maelstrom type missions that is). Not that familiar with templecon tbh but if its similar to BAO/LVO format then I can see the reason for those pagks. Note that he is running a CAD. I missed that at first read through. Anyway just thought it was interesting to see a competitive minded player taking pagks over ndk's in a CAD and even a freakin techmarine.. golly gee? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/#findComment-3946807 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Yeah that Marine Techy was But still, Tourny that allows Loth. :'( Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/#findComment-3947065 Share on other sites More sharing options...
robotoctopuss Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 I was considering trying strikes as anti tank at some point.. Something like 10 x strike combat squad in a LR. with 8 halberds and 2 hammers. With hammerhand its 3's to glance most rear armour with the halberds, and combat squads means they could assault different units. even deepstriking them alongside termies and Dreadknights could prove effective. Even though they are power armour, they could soak up shots otherwise aimed at our higher value units, and any surviving could have a pretty beastly run on vehicles the following turn. but then of course.. terminators.. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/#findComment-3947070 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brom MKIV Posted February 10, 2015 Author Share Posted February 10, 2015 The point still stands that strikes are *usually* worse. However they do have some small up side in this list and this tournament.. namely cost and obsec. Not sure its the better option but its obviously viable to some degree which is cool. Without obsec and even considering pt constraints it would always be better to just grab a bare dreadknight. Theres worse things you could do with 130 pts. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/#findComment-3947099 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 Strikes aren't even vaguely good. I have no idea why he'd do that. Enjoy Savlo making those psycannons useless bro. Also Strikes lose melee combat to a surprisingly large number of opponents, whereas Terminators ARE the melee threat and generally only die to more powerful melee like Stormhammers or TWC or Wraiths. As GML mentioned, any tourney that is allowing both Draigo and Loth is moronic. They're both melee powerhouses (Loth routinely vapes entire infantry squads WITHOUT BUFFS, same for Draigo), and being able to cherrypick from Biomancy is absurdly powerful. Good luck even wounding that unit, they're majority T5 with 2+ saves, a 3+ invul from Draigo, plus FNP and IWND. By themselves, they're somewhat balanced (Loth should still be banned though), but together that's just GG. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/#findComment-3947206 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 2++ From Loth. Draigo's only there for the Gate. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/#findComment-3947384 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 2++ From Loth. Draigo's only there for the Gate Just proves my point. Loth was a mistake. FW let their fanboyism for their homebrew Chapter get out of hand. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/#findComment-3947399 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bionicman Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 Sadly he doesn't explain the idea behind his list. Ok some things are obvious but techmarine and landspeeder, why? Will the strikes sit in the stormraven? Although I dislike named characters I'm looking forward to see the results. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/#findComment-3947408 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quozzo Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 Strikes aren't even vaguely good. I have no idea why he'd do that. Enjoy Savlo making those psycannons useless bro. Also Strikes lose melee combat to a surprisingly large number of opponents, whereas Terminators ARE the melee threat and generally only die to more powerful melee like Stormhammers or TWC or Wraiths.Even bog standard assault marines get 2 attacks, 3 on the charge due to 2 CCW. Strikes don't have that, instead they have a storm bolter which give an extra shot (arguably the same except cover saves, AP5 etc) and NFW which is either better or worse depending on the oppoenent. 2++ From Loth. Draigo's only there for the Gate. And to tank shots. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/#findComment-3947568 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brom MKIV Posted February 12, 2015 Author Share Posted February 12, 2015 Draigo does more beyond just GoI, he's a tank and makes the unit capable of assault too. Loth is great but not any more ban worthy than his signature power. Casting invis every turn will see him commit suicide as or more often as any other 2 wound psyker. Not arguing how good that is just saying if the power is allowed the gloves are off already. I did get some insight on his list (went 4-1 iirc, only loss to last year's champ). In a nutshell he values obsec high. The idea is the star is fine without t1 support/reserves because 2nd turn arrival increases their life span and plays the objectives. He personally feels NDKs are too expensive in such a list and die too easy. NSF doesn't work with this list btw. Pagks do ride inside the raven always. The TM was for anti armour in combat at s10 ap1 with HH. Beat a seer council with escape hatch bunker culexus, plus a strong daemon army. Loss was to 23 wc daemons, warp storm played a roll iirc. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/#findComment-3948335 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 Casting invis every turn will see him commit suicide as or more often as any other 2 wound psyker. What? Dumping Combat Squadded GK boosted WC into Invis (with one left over for the 2++ Save). If you're throwing that much dice into it, I don't think there's too much trouble with Perils. So Invis + Grav Cents + Draigo + Loth? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/#findComment-3948535 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 Loth is great but not any more ban worthy than his signature power. Casting invis every turn will see him commit suicide as or more often as any other 2 wound psyker. Not arguing how good that is just saying if the power is allowed the gloves are off already. 'Invisibility' doesn't need to be banned. It's got a high failure rate, either from fail to cast or dispel. It's also able to be mitigated by Tau. I did get some insight on his list (went 4-1 iirc, only loss to last year's champ). In a nutshell he values obsec high. The idea is the star is fine without t1 support/reserves because 2nd turn arrival increases their life span and plays the objectives. He personally feels NDKs are too expensive in such a list and die too easy. NSF doesn't work with this list btw. My brain hurt reading that sentence. 'Objective Secured matters'. What is he smoking? We're an army that puts down, at best, 30 models in a normal game. They might be TDA models, but that's still not enough to play a 'camp objectives and attrition' game. >Dreadknights are too expensive and die too easily Wat. Sorry m8, not every army gets Riptides or Nurgle Princes/Soulgrinders. Some of us actually get balanced MC's who die to normal firepower. Again, what is he smoking? Beat a seer council with escape hatch bunker culexus, plus a strong daemon army. Loss was to 23 wc daemons, warp storm played a roll iirc. Oh wow, that would've been glorious. 'Hi, I'm immune to your jetbike guns and your psychic powers. Also, enjoy dying instantly when I touch you'. Warp Storm table is randumb insanity at its worst. Not even the Daemon player can control what stupid unforseen event occurs. Sucks you lost man, but normally Daemons are one of our better matchups (we at least stand a chance to deny their stupid Psychic phase, we have the best anti-witchfire tech in the game, and 'Preferred Enemy' is amazing value both in shooting and assault). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/#findComment-3948574 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quozzo Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 I did get some insight on his list (went 4-1 iirc, only loss to last year's champ). In a nutshell he values obsec high. The idea is the star is fine without t1 support/reserves because 2nd turn arrival increases their life span and plays the objectives. He personally feels NDKs are too expensive in such a list and die too easy. NSF doesn't work with this list btw.Ah I see the problem. He should buy the 7th edition codex. That will fix his misconceptions. Everything scores now, NDK are far better than strikes and well, Gating DevCents is pretty good though... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/#findComment-3948648 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brom MKIV Posted February 12, 2015 Author Share Posted February 12, 2015 Lol the response has been similar elsewhere, myself included. That said he had success with it in a highly competitive environment of 100 of some of the best players around. Power to him. Casting invis every turn will see him commit suicide as or more often as any other 2 wound psyker. What? Dumping Combat Squadded GK boosted WC into Invis (with one left over for the 2++ Save). If you're throwing that much dice into it, I don't think there's too much trouble with Perils. So Invis + Grav Cents + Draigo + Loth? Uh ya, what's the question? In case I wasnt clear running a psychically fueled star will see plenty of perils most games usually on gate/invis not to mention other damage sustained. There's a surprising number of things that can effect the unit. Point being Loth does fail and he does die. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/#findComment-3949017 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Lol the response has been similar elsewhere, myself included. That said he had success with it in a highly competitive environment of 100 of some of the best players around. Power to him. He took two of the most hated and powerful psykers in the game, with a Grav-Centurion unit. I'm not exactly surprised he stomped face. That said, Loth under normal circumstances would be banned, and the rest of his army list might as well be blank for all the difference it makes. In case I wasnt clear running a psychically fueled star will see plenty of perils most games usually on gate/invis not to mention other damage sustained. There's a surprising number of things that can effect the unit. Point being Loth does fail and he does die. Only if you're not taking Biomancy for 'Endurance'. You can FNP wounds caused by Perils ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/#findComment-3949339 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brom MKIV Posted February 13, 2015 Author Share Posted February 13, 2015 True on both. Might have to try that for a change. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/#findComment-3949419 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rurik the blessed Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Just go for Tigurius for tournament. Servin is a great character, but not always legal. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/#findComment-3950207 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffersonian000 Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 Tiggers are for bouncing, its a well known fact. SJ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303308-strike-squads-in-competitive-tournaments/#findComment-3950536 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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