BetterOffShred Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Hello fellas, I am a long time heretic, and I figure since I know the heretic the next logical step.. purge the heretic! Nah but seriously, I am going to start a grey Knights force and I am wondering if the Vanguard for $215 American (the one from GW's webstore) is a good starting point. It seems like a good deal, though after reading most of the lists here and a few other places , you don't see many land-raiders anymore. I was going to buy the Terminator Librarian model for an HQ and the Vanguard to get me off the ground. I know quite a few ally with an inquisitor with Servo Skulls, so I may buy the Forgeworld chap as well. I realise that list building is super subjective, but with the new codex there seems to be only a couple of real legitimate Grey Knights lists. That being said, I'm not a power gamer at all, and I don't want to just build that Draigo Centurion cheese list. I'd like to start with something that is capable of winning games sometimes at least! Thanks for reading -Brett Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deet Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Pretty much how I got started. Dreadknight, Libby, and two troops and you're off to a good start. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3949396 Share on other sites More sharing options...
thraxdown Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Yeah its a pretty good deal especially starting out. But like you said, its hard to fit a land raider into most grey knight lists. If I didn't have my army finished already I would buy the vanguard, sell the lr and then use that money to buy another dreadknight. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3949425 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malicth Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 1 librarian, 2 5-man terminator squads, 2 dreadknights. Get more terminator models, another librarain, and a stormraven in my opinion and you will have a good amount of what you will want. IF you want PAGK then either interceptors or purifiers. I personally like interceptors more but purifiers are good. Also draigo is great to have as well. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3949430 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Ignore the box set. Selling that Land Raider kit is going to be a pain, no one uses them (not even 30k players). Your purchases should be; 2-4 x Terminator boxes (depends on how many you wish to run, but 10 minimum for Troops purposes) 2-4 x Dreadknight boxes (2 are bare minimum in all lists, ideally run 3-4) 2-3 x Strike squad boxes (best value for money in terms of PA models. Also, you won't ever need more than 30 x PA models, 20 is usually heaps) You can make all our heroes except Draigo using Terminator bits, so don't bother buying the overpriced metal GK ones. I'd also pick up an Aegis Line for a Fortification. With a Comms Relay, it really help make the Nemesis Strikeforce work as intended. Without it, you're at the mercy of Reserve rolls. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3949622 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetterOffShred Posted February 14, 2015 Author Share Posted February 14, 2015 Well I bought the Librarian (finecast jernt) and a box of Grey Knight Terminators to start with. I'm testing out a paint scheme which is primed black with Boltgun or whatever its called now heavily dry-brushed over, then washed with blue and drybrushed again (I know this has been done before) to give it a little more aged look. Going to buy a dreadknight and a 10 man strike squad and then 5 more terminators. Should be well on the way. Thanks guys -Brett P.S. What weapon do you guys tend to prefer on the librarian? I am pretty dece at converting and was thinking of giving him a force sword or hammer for a little heavy lifting. Any thoughts? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3950547 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffersonian000 Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 I prefer the Staff, Stormbolter, and Liber for my Libby. Just being traditional, I guess. SJ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3950555 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetterOffShred Posted February 14, 2015 Author Share Posted February 14, 2015 Cool, thanks for the input :) Well I talked to the boss about a little bit of the spread from our tax return, and it ended up going quite well. I went back to my LHS and bought the other box of terminators, the 10 man strike squad box, and the NDK. It was all the Grey Knights they had. So now I need to get to trimming and gluing and painting :) -Brett Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3950594 Share on other sites More sharing options...
thraxdown Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 cool man, post pics when you get them painted Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3950855 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetterOffShred Posted February 14, 2015 Author Share Posted February 14, 2015 So I've been into 40k for a while, and a large majority of my greater Daemons are Metal jobs. So I got this Librarian model, and it just blows me away how much finecast sucks. I got a Lord of Change right when it came out finecast and it ended up being so bad that GW sent me another one for free. I ended up fixing it with green stuff and rock them both, but this poor librarian model is pitiful. I was going to ask a couple more questions about the knights. Are purifiers worth it? I really like idea of them in my head, but I'm not sure if they work out so good in practice. I guess really my question is this: " I have one 10 man strike squad box, and I'm curious as to what seems to be everyones favorite way to assemble this" . I'll probably end up getting a stormraven if that affects the decision. I got all 10 of my terminators based and washed, and one of them I got halfway through the detail just to see what it would look like. I have to say these models are fun to paint. Started assembling my DreadKnight, and its kind of a pain, but it looks cool. -Brett Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3951193 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 I was going to ask a couple more questions about the knights. Are purifiers worth it? I really like idea of them in my head, but I'm not sure if they work out so good in practice. I guess really my question is this: " I have one 10 man strike squad box, and I'm curious as to what seems to be everyones favorite way to assemble this" . I'll probably end up getting a stormraven if that affects the decision. If you have a delivery system, yes. Allied Drop Pods (use BA or SW for that, as vanilla Marines can't take them in FA yet) or a Raven are your two best methods. Drop Pod is especially nice, as it eats Interceptor for them, and 'Cleansing Flame' doesn't require Line of Sight, so you can hide behind the pod and still cast it. Combat squad your Purifiers, then when you disembark from the pod double cast 'Cleansing Flame'. Watch as the enemy line dies in flame :) . Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3951375 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikkyWicks Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 I'm some what curious as well, is it possible to make a good looking libby out of a terminator box set or am I better off just buying one? I've been told by my local club it is but I'm not sure how to go about it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3960274 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 I'm some what curious as well, is it possible to make a good looking libby out of a terminator box set or am I better off just buying one? I've been told by my local club it is but I'm not sure how to go about it. I use a converted Brother-Captain Stern model for my Librarian (I like the pose it has). The Terminator Librarian is a great model too. However, you can always just use a normal Terminator and convert him a little bit. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3960287 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetterOffShred Posted February 24, 2015 Author Share Posted February 24, 2015 My Finecast librarian is already getting paint and magnetized. I am having a hard time with the Purifier heads currently. I really like the look from the box, but it's not blue enough... I painted mine with white scar, and then used that blue glaze, I forget the name. Then i dry-brushed white scar back over it with a real small brush. It looks pretty good, I'll upload some pictures soon. I have everything I bought assembled, base-coated, washed, and edge with mithril silver. Detail is going on slowly with school and the family, so I don't expect to have them all done soon. I'm probably going to buy another box of purifiers and 5 more terminators next month. Then a second NDK and a StormRaven. Boom. Plans within plans. -Brett Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3960293 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikkyWicks Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 How would you convert something to a librarian? Just paint more stuff blue and glowing or do they have something really distinctive about them? I think I remember someone saying just build a normal termie but paint the sash blue and give him a staff. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3960380 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetterOffShred Posted February 24, 2015 Author Share Posted February 24, 2015 Well the Librarian model is sculpted with the Psychic hood, which is part of his profile, I think it's cool looking personally. Other than that, the model comes with the staff as mentioned and is quite a bit more ornate than a standard terminator. He has all kinds of books and magazines and whatnot open all over his armor and has a little crest including a book (which I omitted and Used the inquisitor "I" with the three skulls in it in from the Terminator/Paladin sprue) and purity seals. Sure you could mock up one of these fine fellas from the terminator kit but it wouldn't have the same little bits of goodness all over. The model is actually really easy to magnetize with his standard issue pose for the right arm. There is one swept back right arm from the terminator sprue that you can magnetize at the wrist and shoulder to hold whatever weapon option you like, and there is an ultra-gaudy shoulder pad that doesn't look out of place compared to the rest of the model. Just my opinion :) -Brett Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3960635 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikkyWicks Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 Thank you Ryan, I might go down to shops and have a look at one and compare all their details. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3961018 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetterOffShred Posted February 25, 2015 Author Share Posted February 25, 2015 Who is Ryan? Nah but seriously I would recommend the Finecast model other than look it over really good through the package and make sure it doesn't have any big holes in it anywhere. As I mentioned before I have a ton of Greater Daemons that are metal and a ton more that are finecast, and it's super hit and miss with the finecast where the metal was great every time.. oh well. I personally like having different models for HQ's.. I've made a couple Chaos Lords out of bits and various parts here and there, but I always like starting with the right Kit. The extra details on the models are noticeable to me. I have a question for any other fellas who are reading this and knowledgeable.. How exactly does the combat squads rule work? can I take 3 squads of 10 purifiers and then split them into 6 squads of 5 dudes? Or since that's more than the allowed 4 elite slots can I not do that? I'm thinking I'm going to design my purifiers like 1 hammer, 3 sets of falchions and an incinerator per 5 man set. I'll be counting on Raven drop action for at least 10 dudes.. any thoughts? -Brett Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3961385 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffersonian000 Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 I did my Libby from the GKT kit, built as a Pally with Justicar legs, staff, books, no helmet, and some guitar string running from his temples to the Hood. All GK armor is Aegis armor, which has its own built in Psychic Hood. Also, stat wise, GK Librarians are IC Paladins with expanded power access and slightly different war gear selections, so kitting them out with Pally bling is appropriate. I've been thinking about modding some spare GK Stormbolters into Combi-weapons, and magnetizing his arm for swapping out his different range weapon options. His melee arm is already magnetized so he can share Nemesis weapon options with my other Termies. Haven't gotten around to modeling a Glaive, yet, which will most likely be a Sword mounted to a Halberd shaft. SJ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3961440 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 I have a question for any other fellas who are reading this and knowledgeable.. How exactly does the combat squads rule work? can I take 3 squads of 10 purifiers and then split them into 6 squads of 5 dudes? Or since that's more than the allowed 4 elite slots can I not do that? I'm thinking I'm going to design my purifiers like 1 hammer, 3 sets of falchions and an incinerator per 5 man set. I'll be counting on Raven drop action for at least 10 dudes.. any thoughts? Yeah, that's exactly how combat squads work. Basically, its a way to A: have more Warp Charge, B: multi-cast 'Cleansing Flame' and C: dilute enemy firepower and split fire/charges against different targets. So, the one 10-man unit has more effect on the enemy army by being 2x 5-man combat squads. You generally don't need more than 5 Purifiers to be a threat to most targets. With Purifiers, you really don't need melee upgrades. They're expensive enough as is (Sternguard price), and they get the job done with 'Hammerhand' and 'Force'. Same for incinerator, you have 'Cleansing Flame' which is almost always better (especially as it can hit things out of Line of Sight, a big limitation for non-Torrent template weapons is their tiny effective range). Run them basic at 10-man, combat squad, profit. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3961531 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grand Master Caloth Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 As for slots, those are an issue only when writing the list. Once the game has started, the FOC is moot, otherwise malific casters would not be able to summon daemons if those slots are full Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3961590 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 As for slots, those are an issue only when writing the list. Once the game has started, the FOC is moot, otherwise malific casters would not be able to summon daemons if those slots are full Well more to the point, Force Org has zero impact on summoning new units. GW are quite clear on that, along with that anything Conjured (as they're defined as Conjuration powers now) isn't a denial unit and doesn't use the Force Org chart (and isn't considered part of a detachment). The Force Org roles of different units still matters in-game. Different detachments grant different bonuses based on a units role (for example 'Objective Secured' is normally only for Troops units). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3961592 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zembar Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 My thinking for purifiers is that if you give them incinerators, they're much less likely to be charged after the first turn, giving them a better chance of getting more CFs off before they're blasted to smithereens. Also, isn't one hammer per squad potentially worth it just to be able to mess up a vehicle while you're at it? I'm just a bit unsure whether "naked" purifiers are really the best way to go. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3961618 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusiarch Darius Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 My thinking for purifiers is that if you give them incinerators, they're much less likely to be charged after the first turn, giving them a better chance of getting more CFs off before they're blasted to smithereens. Unless your opponent is a total moron, they'll never charge Purifiers. They'll just back up and shoot them. Incinerators don't deter any serious assault unit anyway. Also, isn't one hammer per squad potentially worth it just to be able to mess up a vehicle while you're at it? That's why you have 'Hammerhand'. Also, Purifers aren't for killing tanks, they're for killing infantry en-masse. Bring Dreadknights if you wanna punch tanks to death (or Riptides etc). I'm just a bit unsure whether "naked" purifiers are really the best way to go. They only get expensive with upgrades, not more effective. And you always need the points elsewhere. We cost a lot. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3961623 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zembar Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 My thinking for purifiers is that if you give them incinerators, they're much less likely to be charged after the first turn, giving them a better chance of getting more CFs off before they're blasted to smithereens. Unless your opponent is a total moron, they'll never charge Purifiers. They'll just back up and shoot them. Incinerators don't deter any serious assault unit anyway. Also, isn't one hammer per squad potentially worth it just to be able to mess up a vehicle while you're at it? That's why you have 'Hammerhand'. Also, Purifers aren't for killing tanks, they're for killing infantry en-masse. Bring Dreadknights if you wanna punch tanks to death (or Riptides etc). I'm just a bit unsure whether "naked" purifiers are really the best way to go. They only get expensive with upgrades, not more effective. And you always need the points elsewhere. We cost a lot. You're making a lot of sense. The only point I could contend with is that since we're so expensive, you won't get much for the points you save anyway... but I'll see what it would do to my list if I can make them a bit cheaper. EDIT: Actually though, why wouldn't it be good to charge purifiers? Even if you don't kill them, they can't do CF when tied up in melee, right? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/303425-starting-a-grey-knights-force/#findComment-3961635 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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