Tactical Terminator Weapon Choice

[FishFuzz99]

What weapon do you guys prefer on your tactical terminators? I know they aren't very good right now but I picked some up for like $20. I would normally magnetize everything but the Cyclone Launcher looks like it would be more trouble than it is worth to magnetize. I've heard that the assault cannon is not worth the points. Is that true? What about the Cyclone? What about chainfists?

[Quixus]

Unless you insist on having the special torso front for the CML, magnetizing it is pretty easy. Every torso back has those nubs and the CML has grooves. Just widen the space between the two grooves and put a 3,, magnet there and one into the torso. Unless you know that thers is supposed to be a cable going from the torso to the CML, it looks like the thing is glued. If looking at the model from the back you might want to use GS to make the round magnet look flat.

Just magnetize everything and find out what works for you.

[DominicJ]

Never found the CML to be of much use.

I tried my best to like flamers, but struggled to get them close enough to use, and now we have tactical flame its probably pointless.

Mine get AssCannons

10 with two cannons and a sang priest is a fair multi purpose tool, thats very hard to put down, the problem we have is, why?

It makes sense if you want to sit back, but if you want that, you would probably be better with Codex Marines and Fists or UltraMarines.

[CastellanDeMolay]

I say Assault Cannon. It has synergy with the Storm Bolters, putting out lots of shots makes it good vs infantry, but being S6 Rending means it could penetrate the armour on a Russ or a Raider if you're lucky. The CML will never do that, and probably won't hit many more models over the course of a game.  

 

I think Tactical Termies are equipped back-to-front. They have mediocre guns that are only any good for anti-infantry, and powerful anti-tank weapons for melee that make them strike last in assault. I think they should have better guns and worse melee weapons. Something like Melta/Grav-guns and Heavy Chainswords or something. Bust open a transport with the guns, then assault the squishy things inside. Something like that would give them a more clearly defined battlefield role, aswell as keeping them relevant in the current meta. 

[appiah4]

Heavy Flamer and a single chainfist is optimum imo.. At which point you may as well take squad Alphaeus from Deathstorm for Pref. Enemy Bugs.

[Xenith]

Assault Cannon, convert the heavy flamer to be on a tactical marine ;)

 

Cyclone was great when you could take 2 weapons in a 5 man squad. 2 krak missiles are still ok, but not for 230pts.

[Quixus]

Cyclone was great when you could take 2 weapons in a 5 man squad.

When was that?

[appiah4]

 

Cyclone was great when you could take 2 weapons in a 5 man squad.

When was that?

 

 

3rd Ed.  Back then Terminators had no Invulnerable save.. they got it later on through Chapter Approved (the game had evolved into something you could say was 3.5E; kind of like how 6E grew into something different with Escalation and Fliers).

[Remtek]

CML is stronger vs MEQ, MC, 5+ or worse armor save and AV11+. Assault Cannon better vs TEQ, 4+ save, low invul save and strong cover save units. It's actually pretty close. Think i'd still prefer Assault Cannon, but CML isnt a horrible option. 

[Jolemai]

My 2p worth:

 

General rule of thumb:

• If Deep Striking/Podding, go for a five man squad with a heavy flamer
• If marching a five man squad up the board, opt for the assault cannon
• If marching a ten man squad up the board, opt for two cyclone missile launchers (note that two AC can also work here)

... and finally, there is no right answer here and as always, your mileage may vary.

[Remtek]

I'd definatly prefer CML if marching due to the range.

[Quixus]

I'd definatly prefer CML if marching due to the range.

Being outside of bolter range means that you have two very expensive missile launchers. You can do that much cheaper with a Land speeder or a devastator squad.

[appiah4]

 

I'd definatly prefer CML if marching due to the range.

Being outside of bolter range means that you have two very expensive missile launchers. You can do that much cheaper with a Land speeder or a devastator squad.

 

 

Or even better, Dreadnought.  If you will field tactical terminators, you want them next to what they can actually hurt: Infantry anr Armor.  Give them the Heavy Flamer and a Chainfist, either Pod or 'port them next to juicy targets of opportunity.  Flame away the infantry, charge the AV and rip it apart.  For just two Assault Cannons or Cyclone MLs, the Storm Bolters are completely wasted.  This unit isn't optimal for dealing with anything but GEQ and Armor, arm them accordingly.

[Remtek]

I'd definatly prefer CML if marching due to the range.

Being outside of bolter range means that you have two very expensive missile launchers. You can do that much cheaper with a Land speeder or a devastator squad.

This is a loadout discussion for tactical terminators, you could throw a dart at any codex and find a better unit then tactical terminators...

[Quixus]

This is a loadout discussion for tactical terminators, you could throw a dart at any codex and find a better unit then tactical terminators...

Yeah I know, the point was that the CML does not synergize well with the storm bolters because of the longer range of the CML.

[shandwen]

Any of the three ranged upgrades are acceptable, but change how to use the squad. I do have to say at least one chainfist is manditory (in my eyes).

[toaae]

This is a loadout discussion for tactical terminators, you could throw a dart at any codex and find a better unit then tactical terminators...

Yeah I know, the point was that the CML does not synergize well with the storm bolters because of the longer range of the CML.

It synergizes well inside of 24". The extra range doesn't take anything away from it or the storm bolters. Sure, it's a waste of the SBs to use the CMLs over 24", but you aren't penalized at all for always selecting a target that the bolters can also hit.

For me, the CML is a clear winner. If it didn't let you keep your storm bolter, I may reconsider. But it does, so I'm going to go with it. Two S8 AP3 shots when fighting marines or light vehicles, two S4 templates when fighting little hordes, and always two S4 shots. Bonus, gives the squad the ability to reach out and at least try to hit something if they somehow find themselves more than 24" from an enemy.

[Xenith]

 

 

Cyclone was great when you could take 2 weapons in a 5 man squad.

When was that?

 

 

3rd Ed.  Back then Terminators had no Invulnerable save.. they got it later on through Chapter Approved (the game had evolved into something you could say was 3.5E; kind of like how 6E grew into something different with Escalation and Fliers).

 

 

Almost. Early 3rd ed terms were one weapon only, but got their invun 6 months or so into 3rd with a Chapter approved. 

 

The 4th edition codex brought in 2 heavy weapons per 5 men, and terminator command squads, along with drop pods (rules which survived in the black templar codex until it was superceded). This combined with assault cannons going to 4 shots instead of 3, and the addition of rending to the rules, and rending being on a 6 to hit is an auto wound with no save, a 6 to damamge adds another D6 to the AP roll, meant that 5 man TDA squads with 2x, 20pt assault cannons were devastating, with an assault cannon generally being much, much better at killing tanks than lascannons.

 

They dialled back the rules for rending in 5th ed, and removed the 2 heavies in 5 man squads rule, which pretty much killed off that build. 5th did change CML to 2 shots, which saw this gain popularity in deathwing armies.

 

I'll throw in and add that in decent numbers, the cyclone is great. Just missiles are a bit lacklustre this edition. Maybe in 10 men with the imperial fist doctrine for rerolling bolter shots, they become deadly.

[Remtek]

 

 

I'll throw in and add that in decent numbers, the cyclone is great. Just missiles are a bit lacklustre this edition. Maybe in 10 men with the imperial fist doctrine for rerolling bolter shots, they become deadly.

 

 

I think its mostly due to the price increase on ML and reduction of LC that has been changed for all marine dexes now. CML remains unchanged. Really wish the assault cannon was twinlinked for termies and that CML had tank hunter or something similar. Considering how short games are loosing a round or two with shooting for termies really hurts assault cannon. 

[appiah4]

 

 

 

Cyclone was great when you could take 2 weapons in a 5 man squad.

When was that?

 

 

3rd Ed.  Back then Terminators had no Invulnerable save.. they got it later on through Chapter Approved (the game had evolved into something you could say was 3.5E; kind of like how 6E grew into something different with Escalation and Fliers).

 

 

Almost. Early 3rd ed terms were one weapon only, but got their invun 6 months or so into 3rd with a Chapter approved. 

 

The 4th edition codex brought in 2 heavy weapons per 5 men, and terminator command squads, along with drop pods (rules which survived in the black templar codex until it was superceded). This combined with assault cannons going to 4 shots instead of 3, and the addition of rending to the rules, and rending being on a 6 to hit is an auto wound with no save, a 6 to damamge adds another D6 to the AP roll, meant that 5 man TDA squads with 2x, 20pt assault cannons were devastating, with an assault cannon generally being much, much better at killing tanks than lascannons.

 

They dialled back the rules for rending in 5th ed, and removed the 2 heavies in 5 man squads rule, which pretty much killed off that build. 5th did change CML to 2 shots, which saw this gain popularity in deathwing armies.

 

I'll throw in and add that in decent numbers, the cyclone is great. Just missiles are a bit lacklustre this edition. Maybe in 10 men with the imperial fist doctrine for rerolling bolter shots, they become deadly.

 

 

Touche.  Memory burps are more frequent beyond a certain age :)

[Jolemai]

Yes, the assault cannon synergises well with the storm bolter but it is limited to a 24" range. With 1/2 cyclone missile launchers you have 2/4 krak/frag missiles with 48" range and the best bit, the model can also fire it's storm bolter.

 

Therefore, we have a dual roll unit that can fire 20 storm bolter shots and two frag missiles within 24" and can still engage anti-tank/personnel outside of that.

 

As I said earlier, your mileage may vary. Or to use another cliche, it's horses for courses ;)

[TheSauce]

Can an infantry model fire two weapons? I thought only monstrous creatures/walkers/other special rules could allow you to fire more than one weapon.

 

That said, I think the CML is the clear winner. I think tactical terminators should be on the field the whole game, moving upfield while laying down supporting fire and keeping an eye out for anything they can charge and destroy.

 

I ran a full 10 man squad with 2 CML and an attached priest in my last game, and they were a great center for my army. Definitely expensive and not "optimal," but also totally rule of cool. I mean, they have missile launchers STRAPPED TO THEIR BACKS. That's pretty awesome in my book.

[Jolemai]

Check the rules for the cyclone :)