Artillery units and special rules (Chapter Tactics)

[Ovidius Incertus]

This came up in a recent game:

 

What is the interaction of special rules (e.g. Chapter Tactics) and the artillery piece itself, not the crew?

 

Specifically, in an Iron Hands Rapier battery, does the gun itself get It Will Not Die?

 

I would think not, because IH CT says a vehicle or character gets IWND, and the Rapier itself is neither.  Furthermore, in the Rapier's unit entry, it specifies that the crew has the CT special rule, but the gun itself only has Explosive Demise.

[Dam13n]

If the artillery piece has the Chapter Tactics special rule, then (depending on what the associated special rules are, and how they're worded) it may gain (some of) the benefits.

 

However, if the artillery piece does not have the Chapter Tactics special rule, then it is unlikely to gain the benefits they grant (again depending on the wording of those Chapter Tactics rules.  For example, a Chapter Tactic that provides a special rule that is worded "If a unit contains a model with this special rule...", would benefit the artillery piece by virtue of the crew having that special rule).

 

In the case of the Iron Hands, if the artillery piece had the Chapter Tactics special rule, then it could gain the 6+ Feel No Pain, but not It Will Not Die, as that is limited to Vehicles and Characters.  An artillery piece is neither of those unit types.

[Ovidius Incertus]

The IH CT specifies "a model in this detachment" for getting FNP 6+, though the Rapier entry in IA2 2ed doesn't give the gun(s) chapter tactics but does for the crew.  Not sure of the rules interaction here.  Would the codex wording override the more general IA wording?

 

Thanks for the confirmation about the IWND.

[Dam13n]

The Chapter Tactics rule (on page 77 of Codex: Space Marines) state that "All models benefit from the appropriate Chapter Tactics for their detachment's Chapter, providing they have the Chapter Tactics rule."

 

So the artillery piece, which lacks the Chapter Tactics rule, doesn't get the 6+ Feel no Pain (although the crew, which do have the Chapter Tactics rule, do).

[aekold]

In this similar vein, does a thunderfire cannon from a white scars detachment have hit and run?

[Dam13n]

The Techmarine crew does have the White Scars Chapter Tactic (which includes the Hit and Run USR).  As Hit and Run is a rule that begins "If a unit contains a model with this special rule..." the Thunderfire cannon does benefit from the rule, even though it doesn't have the White Scars Chapter Tactics itself.

 

It's all in the wording of the rules that the Chapter Tactics provide.

[shandwen]

The Techmarine crew does have the White Scars Chapter Tactic (which includes the Hit and Run USR). As Hit and Run is a rule that begins "If a unit contains a model with this special rule..." the Thunderfire cannon does benefit from the rule, even though it doesn't have the White Scars Chapter Tactics itself.

 

It's all in the wording of the rules that the Chapter Tactics provide.

It is quite funny to think of a cannon hit and running away from, well, anything.

[lhavoc]

ITC Tournament Rules 2015:

Vehicles with the Space Marines Faction in an Iron Hands detachment benefit from the Machine Empathy special rule even if they do not have the Chapter Tactics special rule.