Lord Asvaldir Posted March 1, 2015 Share Posted March 1, 2015 Thinking about R&H lists, and I just can't decide what's the best artillery unit with so many choices. Of course they don't all fill the same roll-basiliks and medusas fill a fairly different roll than heavy mortars and thudd guns, however there's still a lot of decisions to be made with vehicle carriage vs no carriage. Another choice I have to make, if you were taking a R&H allies detachment which artillery choice would you settle for? Way I see it, non vehicle artillery is the better choice. It's cheaper, and you can far more easily hide it behind cover, and in the end probably more durable because of that-yes T3 crew are not tough at all, but in cover and with up to 8 per gun in the case of heavy ordnance batteries, they are the better choice. But in the case of thudd gun/heavy mortar vs wyverns, that means no wyverns, and they really see to be our best low strength artillery being twin linked, but on the other hand I find thudd guns rather attractive-4 blasts per gun is just nasty. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304095-renegades-best-artillery-unit/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uprising Posted March 1, 2015 Share Posted March 1, 2015 Way I see it, non vehicle artillery is the better choice. It's cheaper, and you can far more easily hide it behind cover, and in the end probably more durable because of that-yes T3 crew are not tough at all, but in cover and with up to 8 per gun in the case of heavy ordnance batteries, they are the better choice. But in the case of thudd gun/heavy mortar vs wyverns, that means no wyverns, and they really see to be our best low strength artillery being twin linked, but on the other hand I find thudd guns rather attractive-4 blasts per gun is just nasty. I agree, R&H should have no av, leave it to IG to do tank saturation(They do it extremely better then us). Thudd guns is an excellent choice, but do you count Rapiers to be artillery? They fire 3 strength 9 ap 2(I think) ordnance, cheap, and are extremely hard to kill. Thats your best choice for heavy. Also Vrak 2nd ed gives us a new demi called ordnance tyrant. Basically thud and heavy mortars are troops, wyerns are elites, leaving room in your heavy for lazer rapiers. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304095-renegades-best-artillery-unit/#findComment-3965237 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Asvaldir Posted March 1, 2015 Author Share Posted March 1, 2015 Well, I certainly think we can do armor, just not as good as the imperials, and without any leman ruses for armor saturation I don't see wyverns and the like lasting too long. I tried a list this weekend where the only armor I used was 3 valkeries, must say I rather liked it, and with full crew for my medusas and thudd guns I had plenty of crewman to sacrifice to keep the guns safe. I would throw rapier destroyers into that category as well, I tried them out as well in the game and they were excellent. They fill a very different roll though, I wouldn't say I'd take them over thudd guns because they have a different task. I did see the ordnance tyrant, pretty cool but that would mean no grenadier squads which is something I really want in my list. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304095-renegades-best-artillery-unit/#findComment-3965365 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted March 14, 2015 Share Posted March 14, 2015 bombards are the best all-around artillery. earthshaker heavy artillery squads are the most cost-effective. Wyverns are the best anti-infantry. Rapiers are the best anti-tank. Mix and match. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304095-renegades-best-artillery-unit/#findComment-3976630 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lagrath Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 I am considering getting some Earthshaker squads. Only a little more than a heldrake for BS 3, 12 crew, and 3 guns with 4 wounds each. Each gun fires a large blast str 8 ap 3 shot that can also be fired indirectly if needed. These large blasts create difficult + dangerous terrain and can fire into combat using the ordnance tyrant. That DOES seem points effective. Has anyone used them in a game? I have played with a lot of wyverns and rapiers, and so I think 3 of these would go a long way to keep my opponents honest during Hammer and Anvil deployments and in cases where they hide transports behind terrain or out of range of my rapiers. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304095-renegades-best-artillery-unit/#findComment-3978009 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Median Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 I've played a couple of games against marines with 3 basilisks...it was utter carnage I felt kinda guilty by the end of the second game. OK OK I didn't feel guilty at all :-) I found that spamming cheap artillery is brutal especially with it being impossible for anything to hide on the board from the Earthshakers. The other thing to remember is if you use the purge formation even if you don't destroy the transport they have to take dangerous terrain checks, a thrown track is going to ruin any transports day. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304095-renegades-best-artillery-unit/#findComment-3978036 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenebris Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 I do attest for the validity of the three Basilisks and Wyverns. They have helped me a lot in the Doubles tournament. The sheer weight of fire from the two squadrons was staggering, deadly even when combined with the Lascannons spread across the rest of my buddy's army. Initially I was skeptical since my club favors quite ruthless armies, much in Deep Strike or otherwise quite aggressive but my buddy was easily able to keep his artillery safe due to the sheer number of bodies it was bubble warped with. The volume of fire was a surprise for me and the quality of it even more so. I think that an average R&H list should always have those two squadrons, a Basilisk and a Wyvern one, paired with as many Laser Rapiers that one can put in the army list. On a side note this makes an army very static so a need for fast and mobile elements to capture objectives and contend the mid field is mandatory, that or a solid Daemon/CSM counterattack element. I have played a Khorne list and it was quite a synergy with the R&H artillery train. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304095-renegades-best-artillery-unit/#findComment-3978607 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lagrath Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 I've been running an Unending Tide detachment with a The Purge detachment (plus some CSM). Currently in 1850 I have my 90 recycling guys and 40 zombies, plus 9 rapier laser destroyers and 4 wyverns, plus my CSM stuff. I am considering dropping my 90 guys and moving to an Ordnance Tyrant with an autocannon in the squad, with 4 wyverns, 12 rapier laser destroyers, and 3 basilisk artillery squads, behind an aegis line with quad gun (still in The Purge to put deadly/difficult terrain everywhere). I would still have 40 zombies, 3 maulerfiends, 1 fire raptor, 1 sorcerer, and 2 deep striking mutilators in the list. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304095-renegades-best-artillery-unit/#findComment-3978613 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lagrath Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Actually I just had a great idea: lvl 3 sorc, balestar of mammon. Put him with 3 earthshaker artillery....give the squad twin linked and hopefully ignore cover, maybe a 4++. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304095-renegades-best-artillery-unit/#findComment-3978684 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Asvaldir Posted March 18, 2015 Author Share Posted March 18, 2015 I'm wondering though are wyverns really better than thudd guns? I've never used them and my main concern is that they are vehicles vs artillery pieces, and hence more vulnerable. I just think it's much easier to keep an artillery piece with full crew alive. Also always debating between basalisks and medusas-s10 ap2 is sweet, but basaliks do have a pretty hefty range bonus. Sorc with artillery giving them rerolls sounds nasty. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304095-renegades-best-artillery-unit/#findComment-3980404 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 yes, ignore cover and shred make wvyerns exponentially better at shredding infantry behind cover. for protection, use some cover yourself, a simple ADL and bubblewrap infantry will suffice. Don't forget you can also ally in chaos cyclotrathe pattern conversion beamer reapiers, which put medusae to shame. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304095-renegades-best-artillery-unit/#findComment-3980420 Share on other sites More sharing options...
K0rtmer Posted April 25, 2015 Share Posted April 25, 2015 Has anybody ever tried the Minotaur? I'm not sure if I can ever be bothered to shell out 90 pounds for the model, but since I saw it's a twin-linked 7" blast at S9 AP3 ... on an AV14 HP6 platform ... I don't know. I can't get it out of my head. Has anybody? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304095-renegades-best-artillery-unit/#findComment-4019971 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Asvaldir Posted April 25, 2015 Author Share Posted April 25, 2015 There's one glaring problem with the minotaur, and that's no direct fire allowed, meaning you can never shoot at targets closer than 24". Just because of that I don't think I would ever use it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304095-renegades-best-artillery-unit/#findComment-4020182 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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