Emprah2508 Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 Is worth getting one I see them being used frequently in BATREPS to varying degrees of success the S2 ap2 haberdashery looks cool but for an a non named HQ he looks a bit pricey what are your thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 He makes an awsome target for casting Quickening on himself. Perils are less of a problem for psychic vehicles than flesh-and-blood casters. He also works well in a vehicle-heavy list although AV13+ spam is not quite as effective as it was under 5th edition. The question is how best to use him? He is tough but not very fast (unless you are lucky enough to generate Wings for him) so he will need a way to get into battle. That means either a drop pod or a Storm Raven. Personally I would like my expensive Psyker on the board and casting early so I woudl opt for a drop pod as a you can guarantee a Turn 1 arrival unlike a Raven. A single Dread dropping in near the enemy won't last long, even a Libby Dread so make sure he has something else podding in at the same time. Drop him 12" or so ahead of your deployment zone so that your faster elements can catch up and support him during the movement phase. Many of the Sanguinary powers work well with a Libby Dread, here is a quick break down. Quickening: +D3 attacks and initiative on a model that strikes at S10 AP2? Yes please! always worth taking this one. Fear of the Darkness, Blood Boil and Blood Lance: Good powers as he is tough enough to get near the enemy units and cast them. The Drop Pod is particularly handy for lining up Blood Lance. Shield of Sanguinius: A 5++ on an AV13 hull helps keep him alive. Wings of Sanguinius: Handy if you need to redeploy nearby infantry, Can be used after deep striking to help pull his buddies up the field with him. You can also pull some sneaky tricks if you feel like it. The Daemonology disciples are normally pretty risky due to the perils of miscasting but a micast on a Libby dread is just a 50% chance of a glancing hit. You can actually use this guy as a summoning engine and then have a nearby Techmarine repair any nuisance damage from miscasts. Fluffy? Heck, no, you filthy heretic! ;) Fun? Blood Angels spawning Blood Letters? Blood for the Emperor! Skulls for the Golden Throne! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emprah2508 Posted April 2, 2015 Author Share Posted April 2, 2015 I might put him in a raven that way he can assault on the turn he gets out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 I might put him in a raven that way he can assault on the turn he gets out The risk is that you are not getting any use out of him until Turn 3 at the earliest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emprah2508 Posted April 2, 2015 Author Share Posted April 2, 2015 But if you put him straight on the field he we most likely be destroyed by the end of turn 2 or if your opponent focus there fire on it the end of turn 1 will see it dead or damaged Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InquisitorBlack Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 Wings won't work on him, just thought I'd correct that. I don't rate him, but I haven't used him recently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 Wings won't work on him, just thought I'd correct that. I don't rate him, but I haven't used him recently. No, but if he is ahead of the advance then there is nothing to stop him using it to bring another squad up to his position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deschenus Maximus Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 You can also pull some sneaky tricks if you feel like it. The Daemonology disciples are normally pretty risky due to the perils of miscasting but a micast on a Libby dread is just a 50% chance of a glancing hit. You can actually use this guy as a summoning engine and then have a nearby Techmarine repair any nuisance damage from miscasts. Fluffy? Heck, no, you filthy heretic! Fun? Blood Angels spawning Blood Letters? Blood for the Emperor! Skulls for the Golden Throne! That... is just brilliant! Good thinking brother! But if you put him straight on the field he we most likely be destroyed by the end of turn 2 or if your opponent focus there fire on it the end of turn 1 will see it dead or damaged If you put a Raven into hovermode to let the dread assault, you will likely lose THAT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emprah2508 Posted April 2, 2015 Author Share Posted April 2, 2015 You can also pull some sneaky tricks if you feel like it. The Daemonology disciples are normally pretty risky due to the perils of miscasting but a micast on a Libby dread is just a 50% chance of a glancing hit. You can actually use this guy as a summoning engine and then have a nearby Techmarine repair any nuisance damage from miscasts. Fluffy? Heck, no, you filthy heretic! Fun? Blood Angels spawning Blood Letters? Blood for the Emperor! Skulls for the Golden Throne! That... is just brilliant! Good thinking brother! But if you put him straight on the field he we most likely be destroyed by the end of turn 2 or if your opponent focus there fire on it the end of turn 1 will see it dead or damaged If you put a Raven into hovermode to let the dread assault, you will likely lose THAT. I mainly play against orks and my opponent has no anti tank/fflyer in his collection Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deschenus Maximus Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 No antitank whatsoever? Geez... he must get buttwhoopings on a regular basis... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSauce Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 The librarian dread excels at taking out really tough MCs and really tough multi-wound models with S10, AP2, and Force (and a decent number of attacks). If you're careful with your positioning you can usually keep the stormraven from being assaulted on the turn it drops off the dread, and that's how they usually die. Armor 12 with 4+ jink is pretty tough to take down at range, especially if you focus on his anti-tank fire with your first turns of shooting (including when the stormraven arrives). The big issue is that you have a lot of your hard hitters off the table for a couple of turns minimum, but that's something I've learned to live with. I like to imagine my ground troops furiously radioing in for help from their battle-brothers in the sky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LutherMax Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 4+ Jink? Explain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quixus Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 If you put a Raven into hovermode to let the dread assault, you will likely lose THAT.Too bad the Librarian cannot take a Magna Grapple to disembark from a zooming Stormraven without scattering/taking dangerous terrain tests. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LutherMax Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 If you put a Raven into hovermode to let the dread assault, you will likely lose THAT.Too bad the Librarian cannot take a Magna Grapple to disembark from a zooming Stormraven without scattering/taking dangerous terrain tests. Magna grapple does that?! Still can't charge that turn though :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deschenus Maximus Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 If you put a Raven into hovermode to let the dread assault, you will likely lose THAT.Too bad the Librarian cannot take a Magna Grapple to disembark from a zooming Stormraven without scattering/taking dangerous terrain tests. Magna grapple doesn't stop you from scattering, so even if they could have them, it wouldn't fix the whole issue, unfortunately. Would still be nice if they could take them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LutherMax Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 If you put a Raven into hovermode to let the dread assault, you will likely lose THAT. Too bad the Librarian cannot take a Magna Grapple to disembark from a zooming Stormraven without scattering/taking dangerous terrain tests. Magna grapple doesn't stop you from scattering, so even if they could have them, it wouldn't fix the whole issue, unfortunately. Would still be nice if they could take them. Unless... You put a locator beacon on the Raven... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deschenus Maximus Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 If you put a Raven into hovermode to let the dread assault, you will likely lose THAT.Too bad the Librarian cannot take a Magna Grapple to disembark from a zooming Stormraven without scattering/taking dangerous terrain tests. Magna grapple doesn't stop you from scattering, so even if they could have them, it wouldn't fix the whole issue, unfortunately. Would still be nice if they could take them. Unless... You put a locator beacon on the Raven... Go read the description of the LB in the BA book. GW fixed that "loophole" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LutherMax Posted April 2, 2015 Share Posted April 2, 2015 Hmm... So you're still looking at turn 3. Unless... Skyshield landing pad! OR, zoom the Raven to within 6" of a drop pod that landed turn 1 with a locator beacon ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deschenus Maximus Posted April 3, 2015 Share Posted April 3, 2015 OR, zoom the Raven to within 6" of a drop pod that landed turn 1 with a locator beacon Again, wouldn't help. Your dread paradropping isn't coming in from Deep Strike reserve, so the LB doesn't work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quixus Posted April 3, 2015 Share Posted April 3, 2015 If you put a Raven into hovermode to let the dread assault, you will likely lose THAT.Too bad the Librarian cannot take a Magna Grapple to disembark from a zooming Stormraven without scattering/taking dangerous terrain tests. Magna grapple does that?! Still can't charge that turn though My bad. The magna grapple does not reduce scatter, it only obviates the need for a dangerous terrain test by giving the dread move through cover. Disembarkation without scatter would be caused by disembarking within 12" of two teleport homers or 6" within a locator beacon the Stormraven might have. OR, zoom the Raven to within 6" of a drop pod that landed turn 1 with a locator beacon Again, wouldn't help. Your dread paradropping isn't coming in from Deep Strike reserve, so the LB doesn't work. Not quite. Skies of fury disembarkation uses the deep strike rules. The first two sentences of the deep strike rule are: In order for a unit to be able to Deep Strike, all models in the unit must have the Deep Strike special rule and the unit must start the game in Reserve. When placing the unit in Reserve, you must tell your opponent that it will be arriving by Deep Strike (sometimes called Deep Strike Reserve).So a dread using skies of fury, counts as coming from the deep strike reserves. Otherwise he would not be using (all of) the deep strike rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LutherMax Posted April 3, 2015 Share Posted April 3, 2015 Actually this is a bit ambiguous. The Skies of Fury rule says: Nominate any point over which the Stormraven moved that turn and deploy the squad as if it were Deep Striking onto that point. It doesn't say that Skies of Fury imparts the Deep Strike special rule. So I think Deschenus Maximus is right, a locator beacon cannot be used in this case. Either way, you still wouldn't be able to charge into combat that turn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emprah2508 Posted April 3, 2015 Author Share Posted April 3, 2015 Actually this is a bit ambiguous. The Skies of Fury rule says: Nominate any point over which the Stormraven moved that turn and deploy the squad as if it were Deep Striking onto that point. It doesn't say that Skies of Fury imparts the Deep Strike special rule. So I think Deschenus Maximus is right, a locator beacon cannot be used in this case. Either way, you still wouldn't be able to charge into combat that turn. At our local GW were aloud to use the locator beacon with skies of fury And as if using deepstrike means using deepstrike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deschenus Maximus Posted April 3, 2015 Share Posted April 3, 2015 The important words that relate to this issue are "deploy as if it were Deep Striking." What that mean is use the rules for Deep Strike starting with the first bullet point of the "Arriving by Deep Strike" paragraph (which follows the following words: "and then deploy them as follows:"). I think if GW intended for us to continue using LBs like we used to do, they wouldn't have changed the wording of the LB to explicitly state arriving from Deep Strike Reserves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LutherMax Posted April 3, 2015 Share Posted April 3, 2015 I agree, but the other important words are "as if it were" suggesting that the unit is not in fact deep striking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vel'Cona Posted April 3, 2015 Share Posted April 3, 2015 I think it's silly the Librarian Dreadnought can't be your Warlord. I mean, he's supposed to be an ancient, revered psychic master and all that. I think there would be some cool combos if this were possible. As is, he sort of requires you to take another HQ (making him kind of a tax on your list) unless you want a Sergeant to be your Warlord or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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