Prot Posted April 17, 2015 Share Posted April 17, 2015 Lately I've been getting really decent with my Grey Knights. It's made me re-evalluate my Dark Angels. I look at Dark Angels as probably my most 'challenging' army. I admit if I start winning too often, I get bored. I'm not saying the Grey Knights are easy.... not at all. I never allied and don't do anything beyond a Nemesis Strike Force, but the army did show me some angles on Terminators, and of course they are small model count. This week I have made a dominant Ravenwing list starring Sammael and multiple bikes, but it is backed by a touch of greenwing and admittedly some fun stuff. I'm not posting the list in the review section because quite frankly I know it is flawed, but I'm doing an experiment. It's my belief that if I make this list flexible enough I'll be able to tackle some of the stuff I've been seeing lately. I hope to do a batrep on this, and as you probably know from my last several batreps I've been brutally honest about my failings. The reality is most people here have moved away from marine based armies. When I face one, I relish it, but unfortunately it has become Xenos spam land. Lots of bodies, Orks, DE, Nids, even Astra...etc, etc. The theme is consistent... MSU, and spammy shooting. I've decided to stay with an elite style list because I think it's what I'm good at.... but we'll see how it goes, and I'm posting this to force myself to revisit this and post the results. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epher Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 Good luck on the battle field! Looking forward to the battle reports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pigshead Posted April 18, 2015 Share Posted April 18, 2015 I'm very interested to see where this post leads and what your findings are. I steered away from Dark Angels for a while, playing with my Astra Squatarium, but last week I had three games with Dark Angels and lost all three, it made me incredibly frustrated considering I had been winning most of my games prior to this, and even when I lost with the squats I felt like it was a hard fought game. I've been trying to find a way to re-vitalize my Dark Angels this last few days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prot Posted April 18, 2015 Author Share Posted April 18, 2015 Thanks guys. Well if I was going to pull out the Dark Angels again after a little rest, I wanted to give myself a decent chance at success and for me that meant going with the familiar which is basing my list around the Ravenwing. I faced an opponent I actually played about 2 weeks ago with my Grey Knights. We had a fairly close game last go around with us being fairly close in maelstrom point until about turn 5 where he had almost nothing left, and I then finally got good cards, and closed off with a lot of points. This time around he was still playing his Dark Eldar which give all my power armoured armies problems... big problems because he spams the crap out of me with poision and although his little boats/big boats are all paper, they often get 3+ jink. The poison is always an issue because your paying points for a toughness advantage that is pretty much non-existent. I can just give you a quick run down of what happened as I did not take pics.... + We play Dawn of War Maelstrom (3 cards per turn Maelstrom) + I did not have first turn and took a very conservative deployment. He spread out along his long edge, and I took a very defensive stance knowing how well his army shoots, and how fast it is. For the first time against this guy, 2 things happened - he did not get nightfight, and I stole first turn! + I had my cluster o' bikes scout up, the Deathwing Knights deepstrike in... he was so far back I didn't even bother with the beacon and just went in old school. + By turn one I had put a considerable amount of bike firepower and razorback/attackbike/whirlwind firepower into him and he actually jinked most of it early on... he was fairly happy with his losses at that time considering I had Black Knights, and the command squad in his face early. + He retaliates, but he largely ignores Sammael's squad of 6 bikers feeling they aren't any real threat. He lays heavily into Black Knights, and my Ravenwing Command squad, killing a few total but it would have been FAR worse had it not been for the Shroud, and my Fortitude Banner (I got 2 FnP saves out of that opening volley which is good for me.) + Here's the funny part... he assaults me! But the scary thing is he had... Incubi? With his warlord and they smash into the Deathwing Knights... I had no idea these guys were in the boat right next to where I deepstrike... he adds they strike at AP2 at initiative! Ouch. He assaults my RW Command Squad with .... bikes which have a brutal ability for Hammer of Wrath. And a third assault happens: Witches on my Black Knight squad. He makes all 3 assaults.... there is jinking everywhere, and the outcome is totally the opposite of what I thought.... the Incubi rushed in as mentioned and did horrible! We have a challenge the Deathwing Knights smoke most of the squad and take no casualties! Insane really as he just hit terribly and even worse with my 5 toughness he had a lot of trouble wounding.... I got off really lucky there and once it was my turn, it was like potato mashers going through fresh potatoes... run eldar run.... Unfortunately where I thought I'd do well, I did not... witches came in and killed a bike, but I only could kill one witch back.... the jetbikes slammed into my command squad, the Fortitude banner comes in big time, but I still lose a guy, and don't kill any in return, but pass leadership.... A pivotal moment happens... we both try to Hit and Run from the same combat, I pass, he fails (he rolls a 6 on intiative 5! haha Silly dark eldar.) Both my squads hit and run successfully leaving witches, and jetbikes exposed.... + Turn 2 is devastating. BTW in my turn 1 I get 4 points, he has zero. My turn 2 those units that were in cc are getting the ol' RW grenade in the melon, then insta killed without FnP rolls by my bikes. + Sammael is incredibly lethargic... he is stuck in close combat with his 6 bikes, but the black knights are earning their piece, taking down witches, etc. I realize he's been picking me off on the far eastern side of the board with 3 boats, and lances.... I have 2 points sitting there on an objective I need to get to, but my Razorback, Nephilim (YES I TOOK ONE!), Attack bike, Typhoon, and Whirlwind all do nothing! They maybe stripped a hull point off of one of the three boats. His jink was good that turn..... + His turn 2 is better, my termies hid in ruins after potato mashing the Incubi and getting Slay the pasty faced, pointy eared jerk face. I am somewhat lucky I feel to be up 5-1 because his cards have him getting 2 points for an objective I have Sammael and Troop bikers on ! This is huge, because he wants that objective, and I know it... and I have ObSec squating on them doing oil changes to bikes that have eldar bodyparts clogging up the spokes.... I"m not going anywhere soon. + 1 of 3 of his reserves only come in. But it is the bomber, we debate whether he can bomb into close combat (He wants to kill Sammael and the 6 bikers engaged in multiple of his units which have fallen out of boats.) We say 'no' as this would be unusual but truthfully I never use the Dark Talon so I have no idea what he can bomb, it just felt weird to say he could intentionally drop it into close combat. But... he had a better target anyway... the deathwing Knights! The bomb scatters 5" but at St8 AP2, ouch.... He wounds 5 of my 7 knights... I make... get this: 3 rolls of 3 exactly. Stormshield ftw. 2 die, putting me at 5 left. + Turn 3, the Nephilim... yea that's right... the Nephilim turns, moves 18" and goes after the bomber. The bomber jinks the single penetrate I get from the Vulcan Mega Bolter... .fails the jink! It's a 6, Vector Locked, immobilzation roll... of 1... it crashes, right on Sam's head. Wow. Nice kill for the Nephilim, and potentially the first ever aerial kill for my Nephifail since 6th edition causing me to dub the pilot, "Ace of Caliban"... lol + That bomber failing jink was a trend this turn. He had been VERY good at jink, and so was I but my jinks with Skilled rider + Shroud were an advantage. He was now failing them.... they became junk saves, and his luck caught up with him. He was rolling quite bad for 'hitting' but until now his jinks were good. This turn I went full out, abandoning the Shroud and making a push before his other reserves could come in... + Remnant RW Command squad (2 guys, Champion and Fortitude Banner) took on a boat and occupents in CC netting me two more points on that eastern edge I mentioned earlier. The Black Knights did likewise. Sammael split off killing some dudes, the troop bikes blew up a Ravager, and took on some other dudes. The Deathwing Knights charged through the ruins and potato mashed a boat.... it was ugly. The DE were getting pulverized now and my opponent could not answer at this point in the game so he conceded in turn 3. It was a really fun game for both of us, with a great combination of close combat, shooting and some trickery around the objectives. It was an overwhelming win for me, and my opponent felt my Dark Angels were much stronger than my Grey Knights which was kind of funny, but I do see how he'd think so in this particular game because of my speed and resilience. (He could circle most of my Grey Knights and just throw stones at me and there was very little I could do about it.) In this game he said he couldn't evade me, and it was true. The game was made in the deployment (so many are though) and after my scout move, he was starting to worry already seeing the range close. He did surprise me with his close combat abilities. It reminded me how bad the bikes are, and without Hit and Run, I confess this could have been actually quite different. But I plan for hit and run, and use it often. It's part of the plan. Anyway, that was a longer run down than I planned. It was a really fun game... if his reserves had come in, who knows what would have happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solrac Posted April 20, 2015 Share Posted April 20, 2015 Great write up Prot! My friend who plays Dark Eldar is the same. One turn he will make all his hits and jink saves then everything bites the dust. Incubi are a scary unit but don't have a lot of attacks or grenades so if you had know they were there it would have been an easy counter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaplain Lucifer Posted April 20, 2015 Share Posted April 20, 2015 Great write up. It just confirms that RW are the strongest wing. ;) Did you consider replacing Nephi for Dark Talon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prot Posted April 20, 2015 Author Share Posted April 20, 2015 Great write up Prot! My friend who plays Dark Eldar is the same. One turn he will make all his hits and jink saves then everything bites the dust. Incubi are a scary unit but don't have a lot of attacks or grenades so if you had know they were there it would have been an easy counter. - Isn't it the way with those pointy eared xenos? The funny thing to me is that GW kind of tells us that having 'real' armour, 3+ saves, and toughness is valuable. And we pay for it. But while xenos in 7th quite often have worse base stat lines, they usually find their gravy somewhere else. In this case all these cheap boats jinking in the early stages had me really wondering.... But this time I was prepared, and had to be patient to where I knew my time would come but until then, stay within the Shroud range. (I hadn't used the Shroud in months to be honest because of all the 'ignore cover' stuff out there now, but at its points, I thought what the heck.) - Incubi.... yea that caught me off guard. Wow was I lucky there. But they obviously do need to hit hard, because I could see after going first, his failure to wound was a high price to pay. Great write up. It just confirms that RW are the strongest wing. Did you consider replacing Nephi for Dark Talon? - Thanks. I would definitely try the Dark Talon. I don't own one, but I may proxy it in the future. The truth is in this particular list, I'm looking for more anti -horde so it would fit in for fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnakeChisler Posted April 20, 2015 Share Posted April 20, 2015 I've been using the Dark Talon recently and been surprised at how effective it can be, even when not loaded up next to the Banner o' Spam its no slouch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prot Posted April 20, 2015 Author Share Posted April 20, 2015 I guess it can't really 'hover' though can it? It's an awkward description in the rulebook. How has the bomb been working? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnakeChisler Posted April 20, 2015 Share Posted April 20, 2015 Ahh cool been playing against Cron & Tau a lot Big thing is the blind blast, both necrons and tau are initiative 2 and passing over a squad and nerfing their combat ability means there gonna break when the ravenwing command hits them. Its a bit pricey but your using it like the grenade launcher to soften up enemy + buff friends Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lokil Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 Please play more games and pass on your knowledge! I am in the middle of finals and cannot play myself... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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