Considering "Marrying" a Knight to Chaos

[Prot]

So aside from the Khorne Choo-choo at a whopping amount of points, I only see the Knight as a probability.

 

Now I have a few reasons to ask this right now as I have 2 Knights (including the new Warden) and I haven't started assembly. Personally I have a few armies I can join them to, but is it worth doing this with Chaos?

 

I've never fielded a Knight myself, but just happened to be finishing a game up and passed by a chaos guy using a Knight. Of course it was tucked in a far corner of the table considering the ally rules.

 

Is this a good idea? Is there a better idea?

 

I'm coming to a point with Relic units from forgeworld and now Knights that I need to decide where these things belong. Before closing the door on putting them with my CSM, I wanted to hear what your thoughts/experiences are on this?

[Scribe]

If I was to play a LoW in my Chaos List, i would be a Knight, with the restrictions and all, we have no better option, even from FW.

 

I will be doing this actually, it just depends on what I want to end up on, likely the shooty version, since Chaos shooting sucks.

[Lucio]

I'm planning on combining a Lord of Skulls with an Imperial Knight kit to give me a choice between fielding it as a Knight, or as the Lord of Skulls

[Warsmith Aznable]

One Eye Open kicks in at 6 inches, so I don't think it's a big deal. The Knight pretty much just runs forward, attracts enemy fire, dominates a designated section of the table for a couple of rounds, takes out a high value target or two, and then explodes behind enemy lines hopefully taking out at least what killed it but maybe more stuff too.

 

I like them.

[the jeske]

 

Personally I have a few armies I can join them to, but is it worth doing this with Chaos?

depends on the definition of worth. In general a knight is chaos only source of viable anti knight. It also deals with some deathstar/counter unit issues we can't deal point efficient[to make an example 2 maulers will be a lot less good then a knight. but it is mostly because of all the good rules like stomp etc].

[Kaldoth]

Knights are definitely worth it. In this new "mega star" edition of 40k we play, large nasty units are the norm, and that's the way its going to be. GW, for whatever reason, doesn't want to throw Chaos a bone when it comes to competitive play, so when it comes to anti Knight, the best option is another Knight. And honestly, the One Eye Open rule isn't that hard to work around. You might even consider it fluffy, as Chaos or Mercenary Knights would all be distrusting anyway ;)

 

Cheers,

 

-Kal

[Iron-Daemon Forge]

I've enjoy ally the Knight with my Iron Warriors.  Gaming wise it will be a bullet magnet & just keep it away from fearless unit you should be fine, pick your target, don't get bog down in combat.

I also think just haveing a balance in game, having the Knight support with it's guns, then pick the right combat.  Just for me personal I do use the Knight a bit more aggressive, same time I've seen people hold the Knight back for to long near table edge & in the end loss it from being pick off.

Just for me, if it on it last hull point I try get the Knight as close to my oppent army as much as possible & to try get as much damage done from the blast.

 

I've not really had issue rule wise on the allies side of thing to be honsty.  My Iron Warriors usely be on one flank & the knight on another (12 inch away), support each other where it needed.

 

Model & painting wise, there a really great model.  One my favrout models & I think general look cool.  I'm currently trying think conversion idea for my 4th Chaos Knight, just unsure which Knight to go for right now with the codex release today.

[Trevak Dal]

If I was to play a LoW in my Chaos List, i would be a Knight, with the restrictions and all, we have no better option, even from FW.

 

I will be doing this actually, it just depends on what I want to end up on, likely the shooty version, since Chaos shooting sucks.

Indeed.  But dang if we could ally in a Traitor primarch from 30k though (and they granted you guys their army buffing rules if applicable...)

[Khornestar]

I've been wondering about the same recently. With this new release, IK are even more tempting. 

 

For me, the thing is figuring out which would support a Khorne Daemonkin list best. From the Forge World knights I love the Acheron. One day I will definitely pick one up. In the mean time, I wonder about the new shooty knight (Crusader?) and how well that would work out. But then, that's like 450 points or so that I'm not spending on my other stuff (D-Thirsters, Spawn, Dogs, Bikes, Maulers, etc.) so I'm not sure what the right balance will be. 

 

Plus they're so damn expensive, and I have a million other projects to finish first, but since when is that a reason not to buy more crack?

[Warsmith Aznable]

Having had a look at the new codex tonight, I definitely think that a Knight Gallant is how I want to kit out my future Chaos Knight. That's the dual melee weapon Knight, and I think that fits my idea of "run out in front and see what happens." If I really want shooting ability then a carapace weapon and/or chest meltagun upgrades are fine, because the Gallant has the cheapest base cost.

 

At least that's what I'm leaning toward right now. I want to test this.

[Strazhakov]

I wouldn't give up hope for Chaos aligned Knights in the not so distant future. Considering how well the Knights are selling GW would be stupid not to.

Until then I personally will refrain from allying in a loyalist one. Just doesn't feel right to me even though they would probably help my list a lot atm.

[Zhukov]

Yes, it can be very good. I find it opens up more list options simply because a Knight covers some areas regarding listbuilding. It makes you able to leave Maulerfiends at home for example in favour of other units. I posted a tournament report in which I use 1 along with my CSM some weeks ago in case you forgot, maybe look it up again for a clear example of how it can work.

[Bearingtheword]

I love the look of them, so I initially decided to convert one and utilize it as a counts as defiler. I am seriously considering changing that though and using them as allies, even with the One Eye Open restrictions. They are such great looking models!

~BtW

[Prot]

I remember the batrep, I just wanted a good sampling of what people have done.

 

I had a game at the store, bought the Knight codex, and have a Warden coming in the mail, as well as an older Knight (used). Not sure where they're going yet.

 

I really think there should be provision for a trusted Ally with a "Chaos" Knight. 

 

What happens if you get in close combat and you're Knight is within the same combat? Or near by? How does this play out? (I've never allied non-battle brothers).

 

What variant of Knight is best with your typical chaos? Would you bother with the power gauntlet? Hurling looks so fun though. :)

 

I do know my Chaos shoulder cannon of choice would be the AA turret with interceptor (even just to make the other guy Jink). Chaos just really doesn't have good anti-air... so I'm pretty sure that's my turret of choice.

 

I don't know about the rest though.

[the jeske]

play him the same way gav dex DPs were played. Pick stuff they suppose to do on the table[like counter another knight or kill unit X] and treat anything they do on top of it as a bonus. Also always expect them to die[same as gav dex DPs].

[Zhukov]

What happens if you get in close combat and you're Knight is within the same combat? Or near by? How does this play out? (I've never allied non-battle brothers).

What variant of Knight is best with your typical chaos? Would you bother with the power gauntlet? Hurling looks so fun though.

I do know my Chaos shoulder cannon of choice would be the AA turret with interceptor (even just to make the other guy Jink). Chaos just really doesn't have good anti-air... so I'm pretty sure that's my turret of choice.

Nothing happens, you work out the combat as any other multiple combat. Assault Result is determining the wounds inflicted by all units on each side, so it doesnt matter that your units treat eachother as enemies, they are still on the same side. As for the One Eye Open rule: It does not effect your ability to fight in Close Combat. If you can, after getting out of CC, consolidate apart from eachother so that there is 6 inch between the units again for the start of your next movement phase.

In any case, I try to avoid having to test for One Eye Open at almost any cost, having your Knight do nothing for a turn can lose you the game after all.

A variant which shoots well! Stomp is better CC than the Reaper. However, if you opt to go for a 2 ranged weapon variant, then you cant kill other Knight in CC and you get more vulnerable too against Dreadknights and the like. Basicly; the Reaper sword can counter tough models which strike at I4 or lower. So it depends a bit on the list whether you want a variant with the Reaper or not. Battlecanon, thermal and avenger are all good, pick what you like most, I guess I favour the gatling cannon, 3 assault cannons with ap3 and increased range is really really solid.

The Gauntlet is terrible and I dont think I even need to explain why It also works so rarely that I even doubt it is fun in practise.

I dont really care about AA with Chaos (or any army for that matter actually) so I doubt Id ever take the AA gun, I dont really like making the Knight more expensive either, his defense doesnt go up with it. Basicly, some things counter the Knight and the more points you put into it, the more such counters will hurt you. The guns are well priced on the other hand, which makes you win games bigger when people cannot deal with your Knight fast enough.

[Prot]

I know the Gauntlet is over priced. I know it's actually a negative because I believe it causes I1 in close combat....it just looks so darn cool.

 

I imagine for Chaos the pure shooty variant would be best. I do like the AA / interceptor though.... I was just reading through my Knight codex and all variants seemingly can take any shoulder harness. This opens up some possibilities but I want to see if I can magnetize it because although I like to experiment, the points might not pay off... I'd have to see.

 

After facing off against the new Wraithknight,I'd have to say I think I'd stay away from it (in cc) as it has FnP which is really annoying... I wasn't sure if the fact it can't be ID'd means you can't deny its FnP save, but I let my opponent take it all the time regardless because I think that's how it works. Anyway, I think a shooty knight is probably the way to go (but I still have to try it.)

[Khornestar]

I think I'm just gonna go with the Acheron because it's the coolest and my favorite. Maybe in the future I'll expand to the others, but probably not. I'll just take a couple of vengeance batteries with battle cannons if I need some shooting.

 

*edit*

No, no I won't. After reading the erratum for Stronghold Assault the Vengeance batteries are close to useless on their own.

[Scribe]

I'm torn. Avenger + Missiles? maybe?

[Zhukov]

After facing off against the new Wraithknight,I'd have to say I think I'd stay away from it (in cc) as it has FnP which is really annoying... I wasn't sure if the fact it can't be ID'd means you can't deny its FnP save, but I let my opponent take it all the time regardless because I think that's how it works.

No, that is not how it works my friend, it reads under FnP in the rulebook: "Feel No Pain saves may not be taken against Destroyer Attacks (pg 163) or against unsaved Wounds that have the Instant Death special rule."

Eternal Warrior; Gargantuan Creature or whatever does not change this, since the attacks itself still have the Insant Death special rule.

[Prot]

D'oh!!!

 

I kept giving him FnP.... ouch... lol. I misinterpreted the rule and it's my fault really I gave him the benefit of the doubt and was too lazy to look it up. We thought it had to be insta-death during the fight, not just have the 'ID' rule.

 

Well that's good to know and would have saved me a world of hurt! 

 

Well this is interesting, because if my Knight joins Chaos, he will be probably mostly shooting... the Melta blast still looks tempting, and Chaos is 'okay' in CC, but I feel mine are worse at shooting for effectiveness.

 

That new Gatling cannon looks like a lot of fun with rending too.... I can't decide really. I know I'll try to magnetize the top turret so I can go with missiles/AA/ or nothing.... (Hopefully the kit allows for magnetizing, it's in the mail, I don't have it yet.)

[Bearingtheword]

If they kept the carapace the same, there's  hole in the top that a magnet could be mounted into but you may not even need to. They way it appears now, is that it will have a mounting peg that drops into the hole....

~BtW