Lord Kallozar Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 Hi all, Was just wondering why people seem to think that the Cleaved warband are a "caring" and "humane" chaos warband.... I've seen no evidence to support this at all and it's confused me. Can anyone help clear this up for me? Cheers. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev. Tiberius Jackhammer Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 Never run into that belief before - all I've read referring to the Cleaved is that their armour constantly oozes foul blood and they were summoned through a ritual one time. Nurglitch forces are sometimes described as jolly or brotherly, but they express this affection through spreading disease, so I'm not sure if I'd call 'em humane. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4041252 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaeron Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 That isn't something I've heard of - would be interested in a source if you have one! :) The Cleaved themselves have a very nice scheme - it must be said. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4041255 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenith Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 Can you cite this claim? I've never heard of it before (despite having a small Cleaved force). The Cleaved have very little information about them other than they are basically Rubric Marines, but with Nurgle Goo inside, rather than dust. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4041256 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 I would encourage everyone to look at their entry in the current Codex. Mine is in storage so I can't say the exact words, but there was mention that they are willing to come to the aid of mortal cults on the verge of destruction. So not humane by our standards, but for Chaos Marines? These guys are Mother Theresa. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4041263 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaeron Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 Kol, I can't find anything on p16 in their entry - any idea where it might be? Will keep looking though. I've got the bit about being summoned by the Insurrectionists, is this it? But they're still traitors, as it's against Mordians? I don't think I can find any other direct references to compassion, or anything like that currently. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4041277 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 Yeah, it's a little two-bit throwaway line. Like I said, not really "humane" but the fact they're actually willing to answer puts them leagues above the normal Chaos Marines who'd only barge in if they get something out of it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4041287 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Kallozar Posted May 13, 2015 Author Share Posted May 13, 2015 Just bits here and there what people generally say about them. Kol is a perfect example of what I'm referring to: saying that they come to the aid of mortals near death.... Where has this info come from coz I've never seen it anywhere? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4041292 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaeron Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 Kallozar, p16 in the current Codex has the bit I mentioned above - I can see what Kol means totally in terms of their action, in this instance, but couldn't really see this as humane or anything like that. Just seems that they do (occasionally) answer calls for help - although still from Traitorous forces. I'd be interested to read more fluff in future about them! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4041297 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forté Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 Likely because Nurgle cares about preserving all life. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4041308 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Kallozar Posted May 13, 2015 Author Share Posted May 13, 2015 So can I ask you guys what ALL the current fluff references are for the cleaved please, would be most helpful and appreciated Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4041402 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forté Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 Not too much as far as I'm aware. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4041457 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaeron Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 In terms of current, you're looking basically at the Chaos Codex, and potentially Legion of the Damned by Rob Sanders, which from memory mentions them in passing (I had to check that though!). Others may be able to direct you to other references elsewhere. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4041521 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 That's pretty much it. That one little throwaway in the current Codex, the still current throwaway from the previous Codex about them never feeling pain and leaking fluids and then another little throwaway that they had some members in the Cholercaust. That's it. Three throwaway tidbits. If there's anymore, I have not personally been exposed to it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4041546 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uprising Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 pg 16 "Call with all your soul, little one. Call and we shall answer." and them porting in to save a cult may lead others to believe they are a friendly bunch. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4041554 Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted May 14, 2015 Share Posted May 14, 2015 Yeah, it's a little two-bit throwaway line. Like I said, not really "humane" but the fact they're actually willing to answer puts them leagues above the normal Chaos Marines who'd only barge in if they get something out of it. But they do, the more dudes die in one place the larger the chance of spreading a disease. And being nurgle that is what they do. Khârn comes to help any chaos cult too, even when they fight against each other.Then if they aren't fast enough to sending him somewhere else, he goes after the ones that are left. That doesn't make him more humane. Nurgle dudes kill less offten, then followers of other gods. But that is because their gods domain is stagnation. They want people to be sick, not die and be done with it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4041839 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenith Posted May 14, 2015 Share Posted May 14, 2015 Yes...making sure your servants don't die isn't really...humane. It's just looking after your property. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4041996 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted May 14, 2015 Share Posted May 14, 2015 Except 1.)Khârn kills his servants. Actually, Khârn is like a twitchy little rabbit that just annihilates anything that rustles in the breeze. "Look, it's a leaf! Kill it with fire and death and carnage!" 2.)Plague zombies. Like seriously, you can not tell Nurgle is only interested in keeping his servants alive when almost every disease he makes traps the soul within the body and keeps it anchored in the living realms. 3.)We don't know what alignment the Cleaved are. We assume Nurgle, because of the feel no pain and leaking fluids. But they also had members in the Cholercaust, which is a Khorne only event. So Undivided seems more likely than any one specific alignment. 4.)That's kind of the point. "Call and we shall answer." There isn't really a prerequisite of serving the Cleaved, or at least not one mentioned. So it's really up in the air just what exact kind of thought process goes in there. So, as I've said previously although not quote as bluntly, there is the suggestion that they are willing to help cults most Chaos Marines wouldn't but it's all conjecture based on a throwaway line. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4042028 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Kallozar Posted May 15, 2015 Author Share Posted May 15, 2015 They are all fair comments guys, thanks for clearing things up :) Just one last question, where does it state that the cleaved have sealed armour? Coz it doesn't say that in the current codex. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4042804 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenith Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 Previous codex, I think. That was the first instance of their existence. I dont think their armour is sealed, per se, just that it constantly oozed Nurgle Goo. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4042908 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noctus Cornix Posted May 15, 2015 Share Posted May 15, 2015 "Call with all your soul, little one. Call and we shall answer." There is something strangely benevolent about this statement, a sense of tone in the word choice that evokes something almost paternal. Rarely do we hear of Chaos Space Marines coming to the aid of others without some self-centered payment or ulterior motive in mind. Was there another motive to saving the people of the rebelling planet? We don't know, but it doesn't say exactly why, something that is rarely left out, which keeps us in the realm of possibility. Is there any fixated fact that the Cleaved are a warband of actually rather benevolent warriors who fight to protect people? While it can be inferred, no we don't, but I was actually one of the first people who pointed it out of the board when the codex came out with that concept in mind and I have stuck with it sense then. And, to be frank, its not exactly unreasonable. Now let's look at what we know about the cleaved. We have the excerpt from the most recent codex along with a few images of them in the 4th edition codex, one of which showed them with an icon of Nurgle and a small host of plaguebearers with them. While there has never been any official linking to them as a purely Nurgle worshipping Warband, we can atleast make a strong guess that they lean towards the Grandfather atleast. When it comes to Nurgle, I adore him above all other Chaos Gods. Why? Well, because above any other, he has an aspect to him that is more balanced than his kin. He is the God of decay. And yet, he is also the God of life, the eternal cycle of life and death, health and sickness. He's not some raving psychopath like Khorne or a scheming deviant like Tzeentch. He is, in his own twisted form, a loving and benevolent God who bestows upon his children mortality and immortality in its own form. Nurgle loves his children. That's not really something that can be contested. But let's look at what we have for most representations of Nurgle worhsippers in 40k. Plague Marines, most of which come from the Death Guard. The Death Guard are denoted as bitter and twisted souls who have, in all intents and purposes, lost their way millenia ago. Their primarch Mortarion, for all his sullen and grave outlook, was intent on protecting mankind, and this extended to his sons. They wished to protect mankind, though eventually they would twist into what they are now and lash out at the world in their own self-loathing of what they've become. However, there is shred of connection here towards the Death Guard and Nurgle, a sense of purpose and affection towards humanity that may have been lost by most, but may not have been entirely snuffed out. So, how do I play to the fluff of my Cleaved? They are a small warband of former Death Guard, those who seek to find a purpose once more in what the once believed in. They search to protect those innocent or those oppressed and sentenced to annihilation, with no search for payment or a greater scheme. They represent a benevolent aspect of Nurgle that is not commonly exposed or looked at, and for that, I love them. So, is it really an actual thing, no, not quite... But I do it anyway. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/307572-confusion-about-the-cleaved/#findComment-4043499 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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