Zhukov Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Rending for Warp Talons! Does it not even state in their fluff entry that they rend things apart with their supernatural talons? Either way, it would make them a lot less useless. Even at half of their current point cost I would not take them at the moment due to their super specialised nature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 I would take them at half their points cost. Holy heck, at 15 points a model they'd be ludicrous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhukov Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 I would take them at half their points cost. Holy heck, at 15 points a model they'd be ludicrous. I think they are very comparable to Flayed Ones at that point but overall still being worse. I think it would be still very hard to justify taking them instead of Spawn or Bikes. It is not that they would not be efficient at 15 points a piece, they would be great value, but still incredibly limited with a high opportunity cost. What do you think? You would actually put them into all-comers lists? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenith Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 ATSKNF I see as representing post-heresy brain washing regimens, and chaos marines either never had that (heresy vets) or have already broken free of it (post heresy guys). Further, chaos marines are a more limited resource than loyalists, so abandoning a battle in order to 'live to fight another day' makes sense to me. I would like some other army-wide rule to distinguish chaos marine units, something automatic as opposed to options which are generally overpriced. Something like: 'Chaos Marine: units with this rule have stubborn and hatred: armies of the imperium'. Seems to me that would fit with all chaos marines pre or post heresy. All hate the loyalists for representing what they've lost, and for suborning their potential to the will of week terran lords. All are stubborn in their pride, else they would not have fallen to begin with. Plus, both are rules that apply only to melee, and as such would emphasize the overall melee leaning of the faction without outright forcing the matter. Of course, the veteran upgrade would have to go away (perhaps represented instead by distinct units - chosen, terminators, and cult units wold be 'veterans' and other units wouldn't be) or be changed (perhaps represented instead by a new system of veteran skills). Honestly, though, messing around with the army-wide rules as a whole feels out of scope with this thread's purposes. 3rd and 4th editions had a veteran skills table in the Chaos Armory that allowed different units or characters to purchase these skills to show they were more like a veteran unit. Havocs with tank hunter or a lord on a bike with skilled rider....... Kind of like Imperial fist devastators with tank hunter, or white scar bikers... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cap'm Heckus Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Flamers on mutilators and take away S&P and give them "daemon of..". They are pointless as they are now. Rending on chainswords and make them standard on berserkers. Let berserkers take flamers. Squadrons for preds, mailers, demolishers, and demos. FNP and daemon engine rules on helbrutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paradigm Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Make Votlw = Stubborn, and able to regroup as normal regardless of squad size. It should be free. I know this is cheating, but it's the one rule that needs an overhaul and would dramatically change csm overnight as a faction. It isn't atsknf and it shouldn't be, but csm are still space marines of one stripe or another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plaguecaster Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 Not really a rule but imagine if all units in the CSM dex could be given a squad based dirge cater. not only would it make us more deadly in assaults especially against units loaded up with grav or template weapons but it would fit perfectly fluffwise. I mean if there was a speaker mouted on a vehicle which stopped your enemy shooting them chaos marines could easily mount something on themselves which would fufill the same function (like a screaming skull or Daemonic speaker like the word bearers novel has to lessen the resolve of the enemy) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khornestar Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 Not really a rule but imagine if all units in the CSM dex could be given a squad based dirge cater. not only would it make us more deadly in assaults especially against units loaded up with grav or template weapons but it would fit perfectly fluffwise. I mean if there was a speaker mouted on a vehicle which stopped your enemy shooting them chaos marines could easily mount something on themselves which would fufill the same function (like a screaming skull or Daemonic speaker like the word bearers novel has to lessen the resolve of the enemy) Yes, some sort of Icon perhaps? I like this one a lot. Much in the way Tau are the masters of shooting overwatch, it would be great if CSM were the masters of negating it. I guess we still are, with dirge casters, but on the unit themselves, not a stupid wet cardboard transport they can't charge out of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carrack Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 Evil Bastards: any CSM unit or vehicle may fire into units locked in close combat, hits are distributed randomly. Might make cultist more useful, or give you options when you know one of your units isn't going to survive another turn of assault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WangoFett Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 Dirge caster option to helbrutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaliGn Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 Redo the warp talons so they lose the blind chance but always count as having assault grenades on the charge. Discords would be cool options to take, they could have different effects for marines and cultists, so maybe it would negate overwatch for marines but make cultists fearless. Oh and give helbrutes havoc launchers again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aspiringchaoschampion Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 Give plague zombies the optiom of being able to actually use ranged weapons and mutate like how the zbies do in resident evil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeatGrinder Posted May 24, 2015 Share Posted May 24, 2015 Give plague zombies the optiom of being able to actually use ranged weapons and mutate like how the zbies do in resident evil Give plague zombies the ability to infect models they kill, causing them to raise as more zombies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aspiringchaoschampion Posted May 24, 2015 Share Posted May 24, 2015 Give plague zombies the optiom of being able to actually use ranged weapons and mutate like how the zbies do in resident evil Give plague zombies the ability to infect models they kill, causing them to raise as more zombies. That too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel the Viking Posted May 24, 2015 Share Posted May 24, 2015 Ah God, so many possibilities. Making all the CSM special characters eternal warrior would be up there or giving them all the Sigil instead of the Aura. I think them not having it is really dumb. Assault grenades on Warp Talons is a given as is rhino assault vehicles. In light of all of those possibilities I think i'd have to go with... 1. changing daemonic possession so it doesn't have the chance to eat your own guys. 2. giving it a power of the machine spirit but instead naming it to something like, power of dark malevolence whereby it allows you to fire one extra weapon as if stationary like PotMS but that one weapon must be fired at the closest enemy target. I personally think that rules that actively work against you are not rules worth considering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted May 24, 2015 Share Posted May 24, 2015 Give plague zombies the optiom of being able to actually use ranged weapons and mutate like how the zbies do in resident evil Give plague zombies the ability to infect models they kill, causing them to raise as more zombies. The IA13 zombies have this rule already! [Edit]: Not one word was spelled correct, darn hangover... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slayer le Boucher Posted May 24, 2015 Share Posted May 24, 2015 [Edit]: Not one word was spelled correct, darn hangover... Know that feel bro... http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/673/YDfnsW.jpg http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x600q90/661/62mt3M.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwinOcted Posted May 24, 2015 Share Posted May 24, 2015 I would change Daemonic Possession to ; 30pts, the vehicle gains the Daemon and Daemonic Resilience (ignore stunned/shaken on a 2+). You shouldn't have to pay points to downgrade yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khornestar Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 I would change Daemonic Possession to ; 30pts, the vehicle gains the Daemon and Daemonic Resilience (ignore stunned/shaken on a 2+). You shouldn't have to pay points to downgrade yourself. Yeah imagine that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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