Brother Heinrich Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 which one do you favor and why? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Memento Of Prospero Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Your average legionnaire has plenty of extra fast attack slots, and usually overcrowder heavy supports ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4054046 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Fire Raptor looks better, but I cannot after the Storm Eagle vouch for the kit. I've read its better, but the Storm Eagle almost broke my will to live... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4054049 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROBOcaster Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 I want to ask what slots do you have more of? I as Iron hands can only take 1 FA slot so I would use Primaris Lightning and my HS slots go to my tanks squadrons and sicaran battle tanks that outflank. I think it has some good antitank ability giving it Tank Hunter with 4 armourbane missiles puts it at 200 points so thats cool if you are lacking AT and can only take 1 FA slot. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4054052 Share on other sites More sharing options...
1ncarnadine Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Option the 3rd: If you haven't used your LoW slot you can take Avenger Strike Fighters :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4054064 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROBOcaster Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Option the 3rd: If you haven't used your LoW slot you can take Avenger Strike Fighters Go hard or go home! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4054068 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Heinrich Posted May 22, 2015 Author Share Posted May 22, 2015 Option the 3rd: If you haven't used your LoW slot you can take Avenger Strike Fighters Go hard or go home! You have my attention... Now reel me in. http://media.giphy.com/media/13c3oOzowp7pMA/giphy.gif Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4054127 Share on other sites More sharing options...
1ncarnadine Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Sub-orbital Strike Wing lets you take 1-3 flyers of up to 3 hull points as your LoW slot, as long as you still obey the 25% rule. That's not too difficult at 150 points before options. Then you get access to tank hunters and hellstrike missiles. Frees up your other slots, plus Avengers look awesome. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4054185 Share on other sites More sharing options...
norngahl Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Where do I find the rules for this?! Is it possible to mix it up, say 2 prmiaris and 1 fire raptor? Please some more input, never read about this rule! :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4054197 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fangbanger Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 It's at the front of the red book No you can't mix and match and a fire raptor us 4 hp Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4054208 Share on other sites More sharing options...
norngahl Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Found it, never noticed that, thank you! :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4054214 Share on other sites More sharing options...
coloroutofspace Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Fire Raptor if you intend to have only a single flyer on your list. And it looks cooler to me than a Lightning and way cooler than an awkward looking Avenger. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4054275 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Heinrich Posted May 22, 2015 Author Share Posted May 22, 2015 Still torn between the Primaris Lightning and the Fire Raptor. Here's a pros/cons list I've got going: Fire Raptor • Pros: - AV12 All sides - 4 HPs - Can hover - Machine Spirit - Avenger Bolt Cannon - Twin-linked, 4-shot autocannon batteries - Strafing Run comes stock - Cheaper than a kitted out Lightning • Cons: - The model is damn huge - Hellstrike missiles are ordinance and force you to snapfire other weapon systems - Possibly frustrating to build - Takes up heavy slot - Can't take out heavy vehicles like Raiders and Spartans - Can't target all weapons directly forward (not sure about this, but the arcs on the side batteries don't look like the extend all the way forwards) Primaris Lightning • Pros: - Cheap base cost - Tons of good anti-tank and anti-infantry weapons - Twin-linked Rad missile launchers!!! - Can be upgraded with both Strafing Run and Tank Hunter - BS4 base - Ignores crew shaken/stunned on 4+ - Gets 3++ jink from being Agile - Ramjet Diffraction grid reduces incoming fire -1Str from side and rear facing • Cons: - Lighter Armor than the Fire Raptor - Only 2 HPs - Weapon upgrades can make it more expensive than an upgraded Fire Raptor - Can't split fire between multiple targets - Not as good at killing infantry as the Fire Raptor Leaning towards the Lightning at the moment just because if you take the upgrades for Tank Hunters and Strafing Run in combination with a grip of Kraken Heavy penetrator missiles you're hitting on 2's, rolling 2d6 Armor Pen with re-rolls from str8 ap1. Damn near guaranteed penetrating hits on just about everything out there. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4054420 Share on other sites More sharing options...
1ncarnadine Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Still torn between the Primaris Lightning and the Fire Raptor. Here's a pros/cons list I've got going: Fire Raptor • Pros: - AV12 All sides - 4 HPs - Can hover - Machine Spirit - Avenger Bolt Cannon - Twin-linked, 4-shot autocannon batteries - Strafing Run comes stock - Cheaper than a kitted out Lightning • Cons: - The model is damn huge - Hellstrike missiles are ordinance and force you to snapfire other weapon systems - Possibly frustrating to build - Takes up heavy slot - Can't take out heavy vehicles like Raiders and Spartans - Can't target all weapons directly forward (not sure about this, but the arcs on the side batteries don't look like the extend all the way forwards) Primaris Lightning • Pros: - Cheap base cost - Tons of good anti-tank and anti-infantry weapons - Twin-linked Rad missile launchers!!! - Can be upgraded with both Strafing Run and Tank Hunter - BS4 base - Ignores crew shaken/stunned on 4+ - Gets 3++ jink from being Agile - Ramjet Diffraction grid reduces incoming fire -1Str from side and rear facing • Cons: - Lighter Armor than the Fire Raptor - Only 2 HPs - Weapon upgrades can make it more expensive than an upgraded Fire Raptor - Can't split fire between multiple targets - Not as good at killing infantry as the Fire Raptor Leaning towards the Lightning at the moment just because if you take the upgrades for Tank Hunters and Strafing Run in combination with a grip of Kraken Heavy penetrator missiles you're hitting on 2's, rolling 2d6 Armor Pen with re-rolls from str8 ap1. Damn near guaranteed penetrating hits on just about everything out there. Realistically between the two, since you're a Blood Angels player and at least a little assault oriented, you probably want the Lightning for safe heavy transport popping so you can control the pace of a game and get your charges off rather than letting yourself get assaulted. I think you also run some Vindicators right? Blasting open the transport and S10 AP2 pie-plating whatever falls out is a vicious combo in theory, a little more difficult in practice due to the things having such short range. I don't think the Fire Raptor offers you as much in the end, although it's a great generalist gunship to have around. Maybe some time in the future? Flyer-spam/Angel's Wrath does kind of sound like a BA thing. But yeah, I'd go for a Lightning. Bonus in that it's also a slightly cheaper kit :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4054461 Share on other sites More sharing options...
hivey Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 ive been wondering the same, which i should take. fire raptor, lightning, or xiphon. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4054505 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fangbanger Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 I think generally it comes down to what you are missing in your army. If tanks are a problem, the interceptor sounds pretty :cussing good at taking it down. Infantry and light vehicles, fire raptor for the win howevere the raptor seems like it is a more durable solution Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4054515 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Heinrich Posted May 23, 2015 Author Share Posted May 23, 2015 Thinking I'm gonna run a Primaris Lightning dressed to kill with Servitor Crew, Ground Targeting Auguries, 4x Kraken Penetrator Missiles, 2x Sunfire Missiles, the TLLC in the nose, and the Ramjet Diffraction Grid. So zipping around with BS5, Tank Hunter, 3++ Jink, -1Str to shots on the sides and rear, with the ability to seriously screw up armor and drop a couple big plate MEQ killers should the need arise. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4054521 Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionofjudah Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 I have a raptor and in my list I'm lacking in some heavy AT busting ability. The Lightning can one shot pop a spartan with its krakens where the raptor will maybe glance at best... I'm thinking about adding a lightning to my list as well as the raptor:)... I had the old lightning and sold it as I didn't really like the aesthetics of it- the primaris though is lovely:) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4054539 Share on other sites More sharing options...
coloroutofspace Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 The obvious solution would be to get both :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4054897 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 No one likes the Xiphon? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4054914 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Reinhard Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 Very expensve for a 2hp 11 armor model, even if it has improved jinking. Also it has a different niche than the other proposed aircraft? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4055211 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 Very expensve for a 2hp 11 armor model, even if it has improved jinking. Also it has a different niche than the other proposed aircraft? Yeah, I feel that the Xiphon is there to come in after other flyers, blow them out of the sky and fly off the board; rinse and repeat but maybe with other targets if there are no more flyers. The Fire Raptor is there to come in and shoot up the board and do so for as long as possible. And the Primaris Lightning is the most flexible the three choices due to its wider range of gear. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4055222 Share on other sites More sharing options...
1ncarnadine Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 Very expensve for a 2hp 11 armor model, even if it has improved jinking. Also it has a different niche than the other proposed aircraft? Yeah, I feel that the Xiphon is there to come in after other flyers, blow them out of the sky and fly off the board; rinse and repeat but maybe with other targets if there are no more flyers. The Fire Raptor is there to come in and shoot up the board and do so for as long as possible. And the Primaris Lightning is the most flexible the three choices due to its wider range of gear. ^All this. The Xiphon has a niche as the aircraft-killing aircraft, and it can do that pretty well. If you routinely play against someone who runs tons of Storm Eagles/Fire Raptors or some kind of flying circus like that and are having trouble with it, a Xiphon (or Xiphon/Deredeo tag-team) could wreck their day and make them rethink their approach. Otherwise, the rotary launcher and single TL lascannon just don't cut it vs AV14 on the ground. Maybe if your opponents are fielding lots of non-Sicaran non-AV14 armour? But the Fire Raptor can still deal with these targets and importantly has the firepower to also deal with other types of targets with the Avenger cannon and HBs/ACs and is still more durable for a similar points cost. I think they actually priced the Xiphon along similar lines to the Fire Raptor because it has the potential to quickly knock out a Fire Raptor and make back its points instantly, again pointing to using it as a flyer counter more than anything else. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4055230 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Reinhard Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 Believe it comes with two TL lascannons, but still pretty much inclined to agree Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4055325 Share on other sites More sharing options...
coloroutofspace Posted May 23, 2015 Share Posted May 23, 2015 Very expensve for a 2hp 11 armor model, even if it has improved jinking. Also it has a different niche than the other proposed aircraft? Yeah, I feel that the Xiphon is there to come in after other flyers, blow them out of the sky and fly off the board; rinse and repeat but maybe with other targets if there are no more flyers. The Fire Raptor is there to come in and shoot up the board and do so for as long as possible. And the Primaris Lightning is the most flexible the three choices due to its wider range of gear. And that's the truth about it all. A single Lightning is too fragile. But if you distribute the wargear between two Lightnings, it starts to make sense. But... to do that you need slots. So take two as a single LoW slot in smaller games, where the 25% limit is not enough to field a superheavy or a Primarch. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/308018-fire-raptor-or-primaris-lightning/#findComment-4055754 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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