cassian dracos Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 I would like to know what the most cost effective consuls are, the possible best consuls. I understand that they all have their ups and downs, and their uses. but I would like to know out of gamers experience using them which ones stand out more and which of them not so much. for example, the primus medicae seems like a slightly buffed apothecary is he worth the points. Is the moritat still a viable choice and is the praevian as awesome as he sounds on paper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
v6v77 Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 I would like to know what the most cost effective consuls are, the possible best consuls. I understand that they all have their ups and downs, and their uses. but I would like to know out of gamers experience using them which ones stand out more and which of them not so much. for example, the primus medicae seems like a slightly buffed apothecary is he worth the points. Is the moritat still a viable choice and is the praevian as awesome as he sounds on paper. Best one hands down is the master of signal Then probably the forge lord for sheer versatility Primus medicae for making terminators absolutly indestructable. After that i have no idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m_r_parker Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 One point on the Master of Signals, he was errata'd earlier so that he's no longer counted as a Compulsory HQ. http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Downloads/Product/PDF/H/Horus_Heresy_7th_Ed_FAQ_Dec_2014.pdf Despite this, he's still one of the best out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cassian dracos Posted June 30, 2015 Author Share Posted June 30, 2015 what is the best feature of the master of the signals, why is he the best in your opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
v6v77 Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 what is the best feature of the master of the signals, why is he the best in your opinion.Before the nerf His orbital bombard was brilliant and his +1bs to a unit within 6 if he doesnt fire is good too. (Especially on heavy weapons). After the nerf The same but you have to be able to afford another compulsory hq. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xera32 Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 Master of signal can boost the BS of a unit (usually support or heavy support) by 1, making that unit 16% more deadly, and has a nasty artillery strike to force the enemy to spread out.I personally think the praevian is the best, he can add to a legion the most useful tool, reliable AT. A few castellax with darkfire cannons is exactly what every legion needs to deal with spartans and typhons, while also being immune to the ways most people would counter the enemy AT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cassian dracos Posted June 30, 2015 Author Share Posted June 30, 2015 I was just going to ask about the praevian. on paper he is probably my favourite, giving you access to the only good troop choice in the mechanicum and giving them your legions special rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brofist Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 For me its the Chaplain. As I play games around ~1850 a consul that doesn't fill in a mandatory HQ requirement isn't a serious consideration for me. It just costs too much to bring them in addition to the mandatory HQ, a bodyguard, and a way to move them around. I'd rather ally in SA/IA/or admech for those points. I like Chaplains because they are really cost effective, buff their squad, and bring fearless. He doesn't fit into every list, but I run him a lot. The weakest consul is probably the emperors champion as a Praetor is just a few points more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 The Primus Holds a Special Place in my heart... That said, he is the only way to give a Squad that cannot normally take an Apothecary FNP - outside of Psychic Powers -, such as: Assault Squads, Various Legion Squads, Terminators, etc. Since they're so expensive, its nice to have an additional cushion to potentially damped any damage. In practice? They'll usually get shot at by things that Ignore FNP because they're so High-Priority. It'll be your job to make sure they dont. Moritat: Whats more fun than the Theoretical Possibility of Infinite Shots thus causing Infinite Wounds and Forcing Infinite Saves? You and your buddies sanity, thats what. Practically, though, due to the randomness of Dice, he's either going to shoot something clear off the board and thus die in the ensuing return fire (or not) or Whiff So hard that even the slap of a limp, wet noodle to the face would cause more Harm. And if you want him to have the opportunity to vape more than one squad before being vaped? Makes him an even bigger target. If only he could take Dual Archeotech Pistols :( - The Plasma Nerf was to be expected though. Vaping a Primarch and Bodyguard on his own? Yeeeeeaaahhhh.... Also has Scout stock, a nice bonus especially when JP equipped with a Destroyer Guard. Praevian: He Brings a retinue of Big Stompy Robots? Who doesnt love that? Practically: Very Expensive brick-of-a-unit that can +/- be countered by shoving an Achilles in front of them (mostly due to Ferromantic Invulnerability). While they are a tough unit, if you cant roll 5+ Invulnerable saves all that well, the wounds will start to pile up. Whats more is that every lost Castellax is a serious reduction in power. A unit of <3 is nowhere near as threatening as 5. A well placed Suicide Plasma/Melta Squad going all in on them can probably kneecap the unit from the get-go (something I did with an accompanying Achilles do decent effect - wiped the whole unit off the table by T5 and prevented them from messing with Siggy and my Templar; they only killed 2 Contemptors and 8 Seekers throughout the whole game) Librarian: Space Marine + Pskyer = Awesome. In game though? If you so much as forget the psychic phase (it can happen) you'll feel it. However, if the dice are in your favor and you get the right powers, he can be an invaluable addition to your army. Though this does mean he turns into a big target. Ex: Roll Endurance on a Multi-wound squad (Red Butchers, for example) and you've got a 4+ FNP & Eternal Warrior Unit. Ouch. That S8+ Wont be instagibbing them this turn! Vigilator: Oft overlooked as an inferior Option, if you're making a gunline army, hes pretty good. Having Sniper Stock and Specialist Ammunition (Though you've still got to buy a Bolter for 2pts? What? And dont have access to Combi-Weapons? Double What?), means that he can Rapid Fire Tempest Bolts (S3, mind you) and always wound on a 4+ and make them Ap2 on 6s to wound. Short Range, but hey, its a nice Bonus especially if the enemy is clumped up. Also having Scout Stock with the option of swapping to Recon armor for Infiltrate and MtC (take artificer, really..) means he can give a unit he joins that little bump in mobility. Sabotage is decent. Nice to have, nothing Spectacular. D6 S5 Ap6 Hits? I mean, cool, might cause some pre-game casualties but, thats about it.... Hes also not bad in CC having decent wargear choices (albeit more restricted) and still having a Consul Statline. Siege Breaker: I mean, yeah. Wrecker and Tank Hunters on himself and TH only being Conferred to HWS? Not the greatest. If you're loaded up on Medusas though, spamming and laying down 5" Phosphex Templates can be pretty good. Though, even then, the Medusas S10 Shot is probably better every time. Re-reading his rule, he confers Tank Hunters to any Heavy Weapon Shooting Attacks of Infantry Squads he joins. I interpret that as a Weapon Having the "Heavy" Profile gains tank hunter if hes in the unit. If Tyrants dont already have Tank Hunters.... :> You could also give Larneans w/ Conversion Beamers Tank Hunters too. Its a lot less restrictive as I previously thought (if this interpretation is correct) though its still pretty underwhelming. ...At least if he's an IF SB, with a Sol Glove he can dish out S8 Ap1 Thank Hunter CC attacks @_@ He also has a Nuncio-Vox (not like the MoS or Forge Lord cant take one /sarcasm) and can Take Phosphex Bombs. Slap a Destroyer Squad to him and you can dish out 2 phosphex Bombs a turn! Woooooooooooo........ At least he's got no wargear restrictions. Take him mostly for fluff reasons... Thats my take on these, anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cassian dracos Posted July 1, 2015 Author Share Posted July 1, 2015 That is a lot of information and feedback, more than I was expecting. However you made one small mistake and that is that the vigilator gets a bolter w/ specialist ammo for free as part of his wargear, but the lack of a combi weapon is annoying. The only consuls I have little information now is the forge lord, delegatus, saboteur and the dark apostle. They are not for my legion but you know what they say, know your enemy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xera32 Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 Delgatus is just to run a cheap RoW HQ, very useful in ZM. Apostle is a chaplain +1. saboteur is weird in he can be amazing, or terrible, give hime a combi melta, jump pack and try to pop a vehicle or 2 before going down. He pairs well with dynat so the auto pen has a chance to explode a vehicle (or a decent chance at stopping a flyer for a turn). Forgelord is for when you want to give rad grenades to a deathstar, or take some mechanicum units (but the praevian arguable does this better), getting thallax into your list for their mobility and marine killing effectiveness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cassian dracos Posted July 1, 2015 Author Share Posted July 1, 2015 · Hidden by Flint13, July 1, 2015 - No reason given Hidden by Flint13, July 1, 2015 - No reason given I know that this is kind of off topic but I hate the thallax, in fact the only mechanicum troop I like is the castellax. the thallax are meant to be a ranged unit but there guns can only do minor damage to light/medium vehicles, they are very expensive in the points and are durable but they do not provide nearly enough bang for your buck. the way I would run them would make them a fast attack choice and even then I would choose the terrifying ursarax, that treats power armour like tissue paper. Link to comment
xera32 Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 · Hidden by Flint13, July 1, 2015 - No reason given Hidden by Flint13, July 1, 2015 - No reason given Djinn sight is really good, and it is a very mobile unit that can carry melta bombs. Don't forget that with jetpacks they can kite and avoid being shot by JSJ out of sight. Link to comment
cassian dracos Posted July 1, 2015 Author Share Posted July 1, 2015 · Hidden by Flint13, July 1, 2015 - No reason given Hidden by Flint13, July 1, 2015 - No reason given yes they may be a jet pack unit with melta bombs, but they are more points than a terminator each( if I am remembering right) and don't even have a 3+ save. the amount of ap 4 that is so widely distributed around in the most commonly used units and tactics in 30k means they will get torn to shreds, jet pack or not. Link to comment
Dono1979 Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 A neat little trick with the Master of Signals for an Imperial Fist player is to buff a Heavy Support Squad which is behind an Aegis Line which has been upgraded to have an Ammo Dump (reroll 1's for all models within 2"). It turns the unit into a Stubborn, BS5, Twin Linked, Tank Hunting unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 A neat little trick with the Master of Signals for an Imperial Fist player is to buff a Heavy Support Squad which is behind an Aegis Line which has been upgraded to have an Ammo Dump (reroll 1's for all models within 2"). It turns the unit into a Stubborn, BS5, Twin Linked, Tank Hunting unit. Or to make Seekers firing Bolters BS 7 For the Lulz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cassian dracos Posted July 2, 2015 Author Share Posted July 2, 2015 How BS 7? 4 basic +1 for being a fist using a bolter and +1 for a master of signal, that only makes BS 6. And that really is a luls thing, it is not worth making a BS 5 unit BS 6 when you could make another unit from BS 4 to BS 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reyner Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Seekers are BS5 so that's how he gets the BS7 :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cassian dracos Posted July 2, 2015 Author Share Posted July 2, 2015 They are! I overlooked that sorry. I'm an imperial fists player so I normally don't even look at the fast attack section tbh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xera32 Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Actually turning BS5 into BS6 is really useful in 1 situation, Gets hot. A combi plasma equipped squad of seekers shooting their non PE target will suffer gets hot 1 in 6 times, if you bump them to BS6 you change that to 1 in 36. I plan to do this for Mor Dethyan equipped with plasma so they can save the fatal strike for after the plasma shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cassian dracos Posted July 2, 2015 Author Share Posted July 2, 2015 I hadn't thought of that, that might actually allow me to use plasma for once. I dislike weapons like plasma that can kill my own units. just by firing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Komrk Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 Recently, if I even run a Consul, I've been using the Primus Medicae. Thinking about putting one on a jet bike for that T5 2+ Armor FNP 5+ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cassian dracos Posted July 3, 2015 Author Share Posted July 3, 2015 The only problem is the support HQ rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 The best is hands down the Forge Lord. He is a beast: has access to the best war-gear, can actually be the mandatory HQ, is useful to repair vehicles, decent in cc and unlocks the various Automata for your list. I run one with my assault unit in a Landraider - he repairs the vehicle and Rad Grenades shift the combat in my favour whether or not I'm the one who assaults! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flint13 Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Same here. For 120pts my XII legion command squad gets rad grenades, a powerfist and two more 2+/4++ wounds and can make sure the super choppy Praetor doesn't get locked in a challenge. Plus being able to bring in automata or Thallax is never a bad option to have open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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