Hybrid Guard Tactics (a new and possibly improved concept)

[Frater Cornelius]

AV14 is an issue, that is true. I could load up the Platoon with LCs. Together with S7 spam that I have they should put a dent in a Knight. But if I am facing AdLance, I will be boned, that is true. Light Mech is the flavour of the month right now though, so I am getting ready to counter that. Guard is criminally underplayed as most high end players here play SM variants, Necrons and Eldar and the no.1 ranked player in Germany is Dark Eldar. That is why AV14 does not really concern me when writing lists.

 

The reason why I am so reluctant to include Pask, the alpha strike is pretty vicious these days and a few good shots will end that unit, which is 425pts and Warlord. However, anti tank is indeed a concern. Thanks for pointing that out.

 

Here are two lists with the setups above:

No Pask:

Hidden Content

Yarrick

 

Primaris - ML2

Enginseer

Enginseer

 

10 Vets - 2 Plasmas, Heavy Flamer, Grenadiers

+ Chimera, Dozer

10 Vets - 2 Plasmas, Heavy Flamer, Grenadiers

+ Chimera, Dozer

 

PCS - 3 Flamers, Vox

+ Chimera, Dozer

IS 1 - Vox, AC

+ Taurox

IS 1 - Vox, AC

+ Taurox

IS 1 - Vox, AC

+ Taurox

 

Hellhound - Heavy Flamer, Dozer

 

2x Wyvern

 

LR Punisher - full HB, Dozer

LR Executioner - Plasma sponsons, Dozer

 

Aegis Line - Quad Gun

 

1850

 

Pask:

Hidden Content

Yarrick

LR Punisher - full HB, Dozer, Pask

LR Executioner - Plasma sponsons, Dozer

 

Primaris - ML2

Enginseer

Enginseer

 

10 Vets - 2 Plasmas, Heavy Flamer, Grenadiers

+ Chimera, Dozer

10 Vets - 2 Plasmas, Heavy Flamer, Grenadiers

+ Chimera, Dozer

 

PCS - 3 Flamers, Vox

+ Chimera, Dozer

IS 1 - Vox, AC

+ Taurox

IS 1 - Vox, AC

+ Taurox

IS 1 - Vox, AC

+ Taurox

 

Wyvern

Wyvern

Hydra

 

Aegis Line - Ammo Dump

 

1830 + 20pts for anything

 

Alternatively: Drop one Enginseer and the Hydra and add the Hellhound with HF, Dozer. That would be 1850, but no AA outside of Prescience Pask (which would be enough actually).

[librisrouge]

The first list is sound, given what you've said about your meta, but I can't help but wonder, why the hellhound? While it serves a nice role, your list is hardly lacking in anti-infantry firepower. Perhaps a devil dog would be a good balance for that list, adding some nice AP1 to the mix.

[Frater Cornelius]

Good point. For a moment, I forgot there where other variants :D Reworking lists now. Looks solid ;)

[Frater Cornelius]

Hidden Content

Yarrick

Primaris - ML2

Enginseer

Enginseer

10 Vets - 2 Plasmas, Heavy Flamer, Grenadiers, Bolter

+ Chimera, Dozer

10 Vets - 2 Plasmas, Heavy Flamer, Grenadiers, Bolter

+ Chimera, Dozer

PCS - 3 Flamers, Vox

+ Chimera, Dozer

IS 1 - Vox, AC

+ Taurox

IS 1 - Vox, AC

+ Taurox

IS 1 - Vox, AC

+ Taurox

Devil Dog - Multimelta, Dozer

2x Wyvern

LR Punisher - HB sponsons, Heavy Stubber, Dozer

LR Executioner - Plasma sponsons, Dozer, Relics

Aegis Line - Ammo Dump

1850

This is the next testing list. There are some minor questions left unanswered, mostly related to the Vet and Platoon load-out, the ADF upgrade and Enginseers. However, that can only be answered with sufficient play-testing. I do not need to test Knights, Pask or the Stormsword, since I know how they perform. This is a test run for other units and see whether if it works better that way

[librisrouge]

So, what I'm hearing is that we can expect some battle reports soon?

[Frater Cornelius]

Thursday, Friday and Saturday. Three 1850 games, three tournament players who will be attending the Berlin Cup in October (I will not since I do not have a painted army as of yet and do not have the time to paint them in the given time span). Khorne Daemonkin, White Scars Battle Company and SW + SM respectively.

[Frater Cornelius]

Mother of God. That was something. I played 1.5 games against the WS Battle Company. I aborted the first game after T2, because I noticed that the list was fairly inefficient, but also because I made one critical mistake. I bubble wrapped my tanks and went to ground and the Grav spam immobilized and killed my Tauroxes, which I positioned in such a way that my other tanks could not get past. I lost all my movement for 2 turns, allowing him to get Domination and thus leading 11:3 by bottom of T2 (he started). Noticing that, we aborted and restarted. I optimized my list and his list... I created a monster. I think the way he ran the WS Battle Company in the second game one of the best ways of running it in terms of efficiency. And it felt like that, too. Here is a quick summary for the actual game.

 

My list:

Hidden Content

Yarrick

Primaris - ML2

 

10 Vets - 2 Plasmas, Heavy Flamer, Grenadiers, Bolter

+ Chimera, Dozer

10 Vets - 2 Plasmas, Heavy Flamer, Grenadiers, Bolter

+ Chimera, Dozer

 

PCS - 3 Flamers, Vox

+ Chimera, Dozer

IS 1 - Vox, AC, Plasma

+ Taurox

IS 1 - Vox, AC, Plasma

+ Taurox

IS 1 - Vox, AC, Plasma

+ Taurox

 

Devil Dog - Multimelta, Dozer

 

2x Wyvern

 

LR Executioner - Plasma sponsons, Dozer

LR Executioner - Plasma sponsons, Dozer, Relics

 

Aegis Line - Ammo Dump

 

1850

 

His list:

Hidden Content

Battle Company

Khan - Bike

Chaplain - Bike

 

Command - Bikes, 4 Grav, Apoth

 

4x 5 Tacs - Grav Cannon, Rhino, Dozer

2x 5 Tacs - Melta, Combi-Melta, Pod

 

2x 5 Devs - 2 Grav Cannons, Rhino

 

2x 5 Bikes - 2 Grav

 

Anti-Air Formation

2x Stalker

1x Hunter

 

1850pts

 

http://i.imgur.com/iJT83D5.jpg

 

We played Tactical Escalation and I had first turn without hm seizing, which was my saving grace. He scouted with everything.

My T1 was fairly good. I blew up two Rhinos, glanced one to death and managed to Pen two more. One Dev Squad died, the other failed Ld check inside the Rhino. Another Tac Squad got pinned. I managed to move as many tanks as I could onto objectives. Fairly relaxed.

His T1 ended my relaxation and replaced it with ultimate concentration. Even with quite heavy losses he managed to come back big time. His Melta Pod exploded my Devil Dog. Then he proceeded to kill two Tauroxes and Immobilize two Chimeras (PCS and Vets). Basically, half my army lost its mobility due to Grav.

 

T2 was very bad. I lost one Plasma Vet to overheating and one other whiffed all shots. I made the mistake of disembarking so that I could get ignore cover from the order. While it was a solid idea, he saved 6(!) FnP rolls from the Platoon and Vet Plasmas and the AC, then lost one wound to some Laser shots. The other Vets completely whiffed on their ignore cover Plasmas and only killed one of 5 bikes. The Plasmacutioners ate some more tacs, which was tasty and the Wyvern killed the Melta Tacs.

His respond was not kind. I lost an entire Vet Squad to the Bike Command, lost all Chimeras safe one, which died a few turns later when scoring a distant objectives (at least it got the job done). The last Taurox also died. He charged the other Vets as well, but they killed 2 bikes in overwatch and one in melee, forcing it to flee.

 

The rest of the game as basically a cat and mouse game. The surviving vets were denying the objective he needed to score thrice. Yarrick was the sole survivor when the CS and Khan charged the blob. He did kill Khan though and finished off all other forces in the near vicinity in melee. One Plasmacutioner died to Grav, the other got immobilized. The Psyker managed to hide. The Wyvern died in melee.

 

Game ended on T5. I had 2 Vets, the Psyker, a damaged Plasmacutioner and Yarrick left. He had 2 Grav Devs, 4 Tacs, 2 Stalkers and a Hunter left. I won 17:7, which is a Crushing Victory (me 20 scoring points, he 0 scoring points) in the German tournament system. But man, it was a Pyrrhic victory. I have never been so tense during a game.

 

But, here is what I have learned. Playing IG is tough. It is not as forgiving as SM or the Xenos and by far not as forgiving as the Battle Company. I made a massive amount of errors with positioning and target priority as well as shooting order in those games. While I know the concepts, the execution was hampered by my forced stumbling over each other. I need to practice that.

Second, never underestimate the opponent. That almost cost me the game. Lastly, the Punisher without Pask is inferior to a Plasmacutioner, if you ask me. I preferred the second list. And finally, I know how to edit the list for further use. I need those Inquisition Skulls. Without them, the game would have been strictly in my favour, due to him losing one shooting phase (lack of a scout move) and they help a lot of all the Blasts I have in the list. Coteaz would also be a slamming addition due to the 'I have been expecting you' rule for the blob and the seizing-insurance. And finally, the Wyverns, as crazy as it sounds, will be dropped. The Plasmacutioners do their job far better in today's meta. I will most likely replace them with another Devil Dog or even Banewolf. I need more aggressive mech.

 

Well, that was the story so far.

 

Edit: I found the match-up to be extremely difficult. He ignores my AV, immobilized me reliably and stops my mobility and he has loads and loads of redundancy and OS spam. Very tough and I only won by the skin of teeth and luck in drawing objectives. Could have gone the other way very easily.

[librisrouge]

But, here is what I have learned. Playing IG is tough. It is not as forgiving as SM or the Xenos and by far not as forgiving as the Battle Company.

We need that immortalized somewhere. Being a guardsman means taking the tough path and liking it.

 

Glad to see you pulled it off and that you're already thinking of ways to improve your force. Neat to see inquisition getting some love. I've been tempted a few times to drop my armored sentinel from my list and fit in 50 points of inquisitor (skulls and such) but I've never found the set I'd want and I don't want to drop more stuff. Perhaps someday.

[Frater Cornelius]

Since I am running 2 Plasmacutioners, the Skulls are well worth. I will be dropping the Wyvern for a Banewolf to make my list more aggressive, but if the list develops further and includes more pie plates, then the skulls are worth even more, regardless if the enemy scouts. But 34pts to stop scouts and get only 1D6 scatter on Plasmacutioners is worth it on its own.

 

Here is the new and improved list that will be going up against Khorne Daemonkin tomorrow:

Hidden Content

Yarrick

 

10 Vets - 2 Plasmas, Heavy Flamer, Grenadiers

+ Chimera, Dozer

10 Vets - 2 Plasmas, Heavy Flamer, Grenadiers

+ Chimera, Dozer

 

PCS - 3 Flamers, Vox

+ Chimera, Dozer

IS 1 - Vox, AC, Plasma

+ Taurox

IS 1 - Vox, AC, Plasma

+ Taurox

IS 1 - Vox, AC, Plasma

+ Taurox

 

Devil Dog - Multimelta, Dozer

Banewolf - Heavy Flamer, Dozer

 

LR Executioner - Plasma sponsons, Dozer

LR Executioner - Plasma sponsons, Dozer

 

Aegis Line - Ammo Dump

 

Coteaz

INQ with 3 Skulls

 

1849

 

 

The improvement here is a guarantee that I will not get seized on very often, deep strike insurance, stopping scouts and helping the Plasmacutioners, all while having the same psychic potential as with a ML2 psyker. Better even due to Ld10. The INQ can also join a Vet Squad and buff them to Ld10 for orders.

The Platoon is still up for inspection. They are a lot of fire and did useful stuff, but they also feel a little ineffectual. I did a lot of positioning mistakes and I do not want to drop them for more Vets. I will continue to test them out with different weapons.

[WarriorFish]

Being a guardsman means taking the tough path, liking it and still winning.

Fixed that for you

New Marines are a solid codex, dangerous with grav spam as before. The only positive here is it's less efficient on cheaper vehicles but you're still losing vital elements of your army so it is of little benefit. Pyrrhic victories are our speciality though as nobody dies attrition like the Guard - you came out with a convincing win which is the important part. Keep the reports coming and good luck :tu:

[Frater Cornelius]

Any thoughts about the new and improved version?

[WarriorFish]

Tourney is high stakes, so can be rock/paper/scissors sometimes such that worrying any one thing in particular could be a fool's errand but it looks solid enought to me. Got some capability there though I always prefer to see a bit more melta/heavier AT but I'm sure that single point can find a home, even if it's a bolter on the PCS lieutenant :)

[Frater Cornelius]

Well, the Wyvern are less match-up dependent. The meta is dominated by good saves and people know how to space their models, but the actual problem was that I was way to defensive. I need more offensive tanks for the pressure. The Banewolf is fast and counter bike armies, which is solid gold.

[WarriorFish]

I love my Banewolf (yet to get both on the table) it'll be a great counter to bikers :tu:

[Frater Cornelius]

Oh man. Two games today. One pretty average Khorne Daemonkin player whose list I optimized and the WS Battle Company player from last time. In short, draw on the first and loss on the second. Yeah, a draw and a loss. My winning streak of approximately a year has been broken. Well, technically the streak is still on, since I usually only count SM. Still, very humbling and disturbing.

 

Against the KDK I whiffed a few rolls, but he kept rolling more 5s and 6s for saves than all other together. It was the same brand of dice that two other players use whose rolls are also above average. But strangely enough, they lose their power once I touch them. I could not kill enough dogs before he caged me in, thus I was not able to keep him away from objectives. I came close to tabling him, but it was still a draw.

 

The Battle Company game was a disaster. I rolled pretty good while he rolled average. I even had skulls to block his scout move and he lost one shooting phase. Still it was not enough. He just has 6 Rhinos standing at the 12" mark, scouts at the back and he unloads 40 Grav Cannons shots and over 20 Grav Gun shots per turn. Even a retard could play that list. I got lucky and disabling his shooting though pinning, crew stunned and all that. But T2 all my tanks got immobilized or killed and I could not keep up with the massed Grav spam. So retarded.

 

But, here is the root of the problem and the reason why I think that IG will never be a good army, even if they redo it. They lack output. When I compare them to my PA lists, I would have tabled the Daemonkin by T3. Here they failed to score first blood on my first turn after he had his (he managed to steal initiative despite Coteaz). I struggle opening more than 1-2 Rhinos a turn or kill more than 3 SM per unit to get to the Grav. I have no spare bodies for scoring duties because I lack output. It is simple as that. IG shooting is too weak to matter. Yeah, they have quantity, but loads of crap is still crap. S3 matters jack in today's meta of T4-T6 and 3+ saves and their BS3 makes their Chimeras and Tauroxes bad compared to to the shooting of the basic infantry of other books.

Now, the only good thing were the dual Executioners. Without them, I could have quit right away. They were literally the only thing keeping me in. That is two tanks trying to pull the weight of an entire army. Not bad, but not enough.

 

Anyway, here is the problem. I have had enough of a mood swing today that I felt I needed to apologize to the opponent (luckily, it did not show so much), so I may be ranting here, but the point still stand. IG have no meaningful output to compete in the meta outside of their BB variant, but guess what is banned in the upcoming tournament everyone is preparing for...

 

I have no idea how to build IG now. They do not have the conveniences of mobile transports like Pods and they do not have Scout moves and they lack the output. I am beat. No idea what to do and frankly, I slowly but surely stop caring about 40k altogether. If playing 40k means to play :cuss like Battle Companies or Xenos, then I am out.

[WarriorFish]

A loss is merely a step to the next level of experience and skill. He who never loses is never forced to study his army in great detail, and such a man will struggle to improve. So none of this complaining like a xenos in the barracks soldier! You pick up that lasgun and ram it down the enemy's throat if you must... revenge is the sweetest of dishes after all

Sounds like you had a bit of bad rolling, such things happen and if you're not in the best of moods then you make mistakes and miss opportunities. A Battle Company list with grav out the wazoo is surely one of the top builds right now too. Certainly not the frame of mind to be deciding anything about what you're doing next! So go and relax, and when you feel better analyse the battle once more with a fresh mind. I'm sure you'll have new ideas then

[Frater Cornelius]

With 35 degrees Celsius outside I have trouble remembering my birthday. Tactics are beyond me right now. Also, do not mind my complaning. It never stomps me from going on. I just need to vent once in a while.

 

I am eager to tackle the problem, but I am sort of lost now.

Here is the thing: the lack of quality firepower. This means I can not keep the opponent in check and thus I am unable to delegate forces to forward scoring duties since I am preoccupied trying to get the upper hand. I do not buy the bad rolling excuse. Or do you mean to tell me what I got one year of a lucky streak and now that I play IG it is gone.

 

Look at the other books. Tau have Markerlights to boost BS. Eldar have Guide, which is very easy to pull off. SM have Doctrines. SW and KDK have quality melee and easy access to melee re-rolls. IG lack those things. We do not have a way of getting reliable re-rolls and regular S3 fire means nothing. Compare that to the massed S6-7 or Grav the other books bring and you begin to understand the problem. We also pay premium for better AV and rules on tanks, which is all useless in the face of Grav. That gun ignores so many rules, you might as well not bother. Doctrines and Amp remove the luck factor, they ignore AV and T as well as armour. They so not need to move and just spam away.

 

So, unless you can tell me how IG can open 3 Rhinos and disable around halt his Grav on top of his bikes before the entire army gets immobilized, I am all ears. This is one of the few times my list building foo has failed me.

[WarriorFish]

No win or loss isn't down to the dice in some way ;) The Guard codex is a little old and middle tier; you know you're going to get tough match ups and that you're going to be the underdog sometimes. Against such eliteness and anti-vehicle/elite the obvious answer is to respond with numbers. Perhaps some more Guardsmen instead of Taurox could help buy your tanks more time? What about swapping your FA for something else, such as some more Russ or infantry?

 

The numbers game is one we can do well, and often it's out best response to what the enemy can do too.

[librisrouge]

The answer to grav is the answer to all of IG's problems in my opinion: infantry and artillery.

 

Let them grav a basilisk battery, wounding on re-rollable +5s. Whoop de do.

 

Slaughtered a squad of guardsmen? Don't care, have twenty more. Charged into a squad of conscripts? Hope you like sticking around all game because you aren't going anywhere. Think your armor will protect you? From S10 AP1 armorbane medusa rounds? Good luck chump. Playing the same number game? Thank god for thudd guns.

 

WWI tactics are where IG shine right now...if you're willing to paint 200+ models.

[Frater Cornelius]

After using my secret weapon for leveling out when I am salty, listening to Gregorian Chants, I can definitely say I lost because of me and me alone. Playing SM has conditioned me to ignore so many things on the battle field. Tomorrow I will play again and fix those. I will also come up with a list, so that others may benefit from it ;)

[Frater Cornelius]

On a side-note. I want to talk about the Vet and Platoon load-out. While I generally prefer Plasmas, I notice that my Vets tend to fry themselves every so often. A Melta is also rather short-ranged. Still, I feel that I lack some anti-tank. Melta Vets seem rather slow. Still, do you think it is a good idea? Or is the higher rate of fire and range of the Plasma worth more when opening light transports and deal with Jetbikes, Bikes and MEQ?

 

As for the Platoon, I notice that I waste a lot of shots by trying to maximize the AC to bust a transport. I feel that is wrong. I want my Platoon to be more mobile. Should I still include the AC for Coteaz Interceptor and first turn long ranged dakka? Or focus on mobile weapons like Flamers or Plasmas to bring the plain while slogging forward. I dislike staying back too much. Think the AC are still worth it?

 

And finally, heavy weapons on Vets. While I like them mobile, do you think adding an ML or AC is worth to increase T1 firepower and ability to bust heavier targets from afar? It adds to their flexibility and range. While 2 Plasmas, 1 Heavy Flamer and 1 ML is quite expensive, I might reconsider the Special Weapon choice.

 

Let me know what you think. I want the Vets to bust heavier targets and delete high priority targets, be they MEQ, transports or fat dudes. They need to get into position and get orders to smoke something. I want to Platoon to advance and primarily focus on killing dudes and only occasionally helping with tanks. I can always deploy the AC forward and keep it stationary while the rest moves and help with the shoot + run order.

But above all else, I want long-ranged pressure T1 to weaken the opponent, before engaging in primarily close-ranged fire-fights, which are inevitable (SM) or preferred (Eldar) when looking at most lists and Heavy Weapons are not that expensive and still more survivable than HWS.

 

Thoughts?

[librisrouge]

On a side-note. I want to talk about the Vet and Platoon load-out. While I generally prefer Plasmas, I notice that my Vets tend to fry themselves every so often. A Melta is also rather short-ranged. Still, I feel that I lack some anti-tank. Melta Vets seem rather slow. Still, do you think it is a good idea? Or is the higher rate of fire and range of the Plasma worth more when opening light transports and deal with Jetbikes, Bikes and MEQ?

I have found that a Tank Commander (and buddy) of two Exterminators armed with heavy bolters (for more dakka) is great for those units that are hard to deny saves to because they're fairly accurate, can operate at long range, and cause enough wounds to force some saves to fail. Plus, its a great fit for my Steel Host tank commander. Plasmas are a bit too expensive, short ranged, and dangerous for transport killing duty imo. Save them for frying +3 and +2 saves.

 

As for the Platoon, I notice that I waste a lot of shots by trying to maximize the AC to bust a transport. I feel that is wrong. I want my Platoon to be more mobile. Should I still include the AC for Coteaz Interceptor and first turn long ranged dakka? Or focus on mobile weapons like Flamers or Plasmas to bring the plain while slogging forward. I dislike staying back too much. Think the AC are still worth it?

I hate to say it but you might just need to decided if you're wanting movement or not. IG is cheap enough that we shouldn't try doing both because we can buy whole squads by being points efficient.

 

And finally, heavy weapons on Vets. While I like them mobile, do you think adding an ML or AC is worth to increase T1 firepower and ability to bust heavier targets from afar? It adds to their flexibility and range. While 2 Plasmas, 1 Heavy Flamer and 1 ML is quite expensive, I might reconsider the Special Weapon choice.

See above: mobile or not, don't try to be the jack of all trades. For what its worth, the plasmagun is a great in between option in the sense that it can do most things well.

 

Let me know what you think. I want the Vets to bust heavier targets and delete high priority targets, be they MEQ, transports or fat dudes. They need to get into position and get orders to smoke something. I want to Platoon to advance and primarily focus on killing dudes and only occasionally helping with tanks. I can always deploy the AC forward and keep it stationary while the rest moves and help with the shoot + run order. A great order for giving static platoon blobs limited mobility.

But above all else, I want long-ranged pressure T1 to weaken the opponent, before engaging in primarily close-ranged fire-fights, which are inevitable (SM) or preferred (Eldar) when looking at most lists and Heavy Weapons are not that expensive and still more survivable than HWS.

Seems to me like you should look into dismounted troops with lascannons. Maybe plasmaguns as well. You can increase their accuracy with Prescience and then give them Ignores Cover via orders. It also makes a great place for Coteaz to hang out, helping them to stick around in melee and allowing him to swing a time or four with his fancy hammer. Dense enough men will also give your tanks some cover. You can even still take some transports and have them advance empty; they do have Objective Secured after all.

[Frater Cornelius]

Mobility on a Platoon is not much of an issue, if you ask me. Deploy the AC as far to the front as you deem safe, then during each movement phase the AC stay put while the dudes move forward. That way you will have two turns of full dakka until they would need to move, if they need to move at all because sometimes the enemy comes to me. I see your points with Vets. I like them mobile, so Plasma + HF it is.

 

While it breaks my heart, I might look at the CCS again as opposed to Yarrick. He is great, but the CCS bring too many goodies. Here is a draft:

Hidden Content

Company Command Squad - 2 Plasmas, Heavy Flamer, Vox, Kurovs Aquila, 4+ saves on everyone

+ Chimera, Dozer

 

Ministorum Priest - Plasma

 

10 Vets - 2 Plasmas, Heavy Flamer, Grenadiers, Bolter

+ Chimera, Dozer

10 Vets - 2 Plasmas, Heavy Flamer, Grenadiers, Bolter

+ Chimera, Dozer

 

PCS - 2 Flamers, 1 Heavy Flamer, Vox, Bolter

+ Chimera, Dozer

 

IS 1 - Vox, AC, Plasma

IS 2 - AC, Plasma

IS 3 - AC, Plasma

 

2x Wyvern

 

Coteaz

INQ with 3 Skulls

 

1310

 

The CCS can keep up with Vets far better than Yarrick and adds firepower and another transport. Coteaz and Priest join the Platoon blob. The Inquisitor has the option of buying TDA with Hammer and Psycannon for 55pts premium so that the Platoon has even more S7 and a solid option for the Split Fire option. Moving the platoon as described above, they take the center while the Vets + CCS overwhelm one flank with loads of PE Plasma fire. The PE bubble can also be easily kept in range of the Platoon, given its size and the Prescience of Coteaz.

Between that setup and the Wyvern, I think I have all kinds of infantry and light mech covered. The remaining 540pts (or 485 if the TDA INQ is a good idea) to add dedicated tank busters and armour saturation or other very hard hitting ground pounders that kill close to everything. The main criteria is long range.

 

Also, worth adding Grenades, MB or melee weapons into the Platoon?

 

I am a bit insecure about the CCS, as it is a very high profile target and a smart opponent will work hard to remove it. I am not sure how well I can hide it but still use the PE bubble effectively. I suppose I can live without it, but losing 248pts just like that isn't all that great.

 

Thoughts on what to add, the TDA INQ and the general idea?

[librisrouge]

I like that alot, perhaps because its closish to things I've used before. Put those two Executioners you love so much in there (the benefit greatly from the PE bubble), upgrade the Inquisitor (TDA, psyker, or both) and give it a try. The Priest is a great idea. I once used one and a TDA inquisitor and they tanked so many wounds in melee with a re-rollable 2+ save as the blob chewed through enemies like they were going out of style.

[Frater Cornelius]

So, a Vendetta and two Plasmacutioners are 540pts. However, I do not think I need more Plasma in here. What I am lacking is a bit of ground-pounding. So, after adding the Vendetta, how about a Manticore or Basilisks instead of LR variants? Or Vendetta not worth it? Also, any alternatives to the Executioners? Or do you think some more AP2 pie plates will help?

Also, what about melee gear on the Platoon?

Coteaz has a 2+, so the re-rollable 2+ in melee is accounted for