RULES - Primarch and Legion

[Slips]

I'm fine with a 3++ Honestly.

[Big Bad Squig]

For the Warmaster, I think a 3++ is fine.  If he's not above par, then he's not doing his job right 

[Hesh Kadesh]

A 3++ rerollable could be rather brutal, so I wouldn't make it a 'select a power' instead being generated as normal. But yes, 3+ is fitting for the Warmaster. Edited January 26, 2016 by Hesh Kadesh

[simison]

Alright, I simply left out Alex's exception on his +1 Invul granting rule in Sires. I did add the Pariah exception, and moved the Warp Blast power over to the Psyker rules. Furthermore, I'm having the Warp Blast take up one of his slots so he can only roll for 2 more powers, which should help reduce the chances of Invisibility shenanigans.

 

Finally, I added a further limitation to Eye of Defense where it only happens after the first round of combat. At least, that was the intent, I'm not sure I worded it correctly. 

[Sigismund229]

The Crimson Lions special rules, unique wargear and first RoW as they stand atm. Partly this is so that people can see them all together and tell me if they seem overly powerful without needing to sift through the entire rules thread and partly so that I can keep it all together. 

 

Legion Special Rules

• Blood of the Lion: If a unit with LA(CL) is outnumbered in an assault then they gain A equal to the number by which they are outnumbered unless they are an independent character or walker. 
• Our destiny awaits!: When initiating a charge move, any squad with LA(CL) may roll three dice for the charge distance and choose the two highest results. 
• Blood debt: If the warlord of your army is killed, then all squads with LA(CL) may re roll to wound rolls of 1. Also, the squad which killed your armies warlord becomes an objective. If, by the end of the game, that squad has been destroyed, then you gain 1VP and if that squad has not been destroyed, your opponent gains 1VP. 

Unique Wargear

• Hoplon Shield: May be taken by any IC or sergeant for +15 points. Confers on them a 4++ invulnerable save. 

 

• Falcan blade: Among the sons of Mycenae, the falcanath is a common weapon. Weighted at the end of the blade, these weapons are designed to hack their way through shield walls and any armour their enemies may be wearing. ​May be taken by any IC or sergeant for +15 points. Has the following profile: S: user AP: 4 rending. 

 

• Behona: Derived from the war horns of Mycenae, the Behona is still carried into battle by the Crimson Lions, despite the antiquated nature of such an item. May be taken by any unupgraded member of a squad with LA(CL) for +25 points. If taken, it may be blown once every 3 turns and in the turn that it is blown, all squads within "12 may shoot rapid fire weapons or use fury of the legion and charge in the same turn. 

 

• Torc of Jurfik(Relic): When King Artorus of Jurfik was defeated by the V legion, his torc, that was traditionally the mark of a King of Jurfik, was taken up by his brother, Rolon,who was elected by the Thingar as the first legion master of the Blood Wolves. While Rolon is long since gone, his ashes interred aboard the Lupa Sanguis in the Hall of Heroes, the Torc endures and has become a symbol of the legions deeds and accomplishments. For a warrior to be awarded the right to wear it into battle is a great honour and one that only the hardiest of Mycenae's sons are given. May be given to any independent character for +50 points. Any model equipped with this Torc gains the Eternal Warrior, It Will Not Die and Adamantium Will special rules. If reduced to 0 Wounds or lower, then the bearer may roll a d6; on a 4+, the bearer remains alive with a single wound remaining. However, the Torc may not be used for the rest of the battle. 

​

• The Sword of Ages(Relic): Legend has it that the sword of ages was first wielded by the Lord of Dawn, founder of the Kingdom of Jurfik. Forged using magic and the power of the gods, the blade confers on its user all the martial skill of the past users, whose warrior souls still linger within its blade. Originally the sword of the Legion Master of the Blood Wolves, the Sword of Ages is now wielded by the finest champions of the III, warriors who have proved their worth on a hundred battlefields. May be given to any independent character for +60 points. Any model equipped with the Sword of Ages gains +1WS in challenges and Adamantium Will and Always Strikes First and uses a weapon with the following profile: S: +1S AP: 2 Rending, Instant Death.  

​

Rite of War (name to be decided)

 

Crimson Lions Unique Rite of War; X X
- Wall of Shields; Units made up entirely of models with the Legiones Astartes (Crimson Lions) special rule equipped with Boarding, Combat or Hoplon Shields gain the Counter Attack special rule, and reduce the strength of all overwatch shooting attacks made against them when they initiate a charge. 
- Fury of the Lion; Models with Boarding Shields gain Fury of the Legion special rule. Independent Characters with this special rule equipped with a Boarding Shield may also participate in a Fury of the Legion attack in exception to the normal rule.
- Hold the Wall; Enemy units suffering one or more casualties as a result of an overwatch attack from a model with the Legiones Astartes (Crimson Lions) special rule must immediately take a Leadership test. If failed, they count as having made a Disordered Charge. In addition, Legion Assault Squads entirely taking Combat Squads may instead upgrade to Hoplon Shields for +7pts per model. 
- Honour the Fallen; In Challenges, models with this special rule gain +1 Attack. While in a challenge, any morale tests taken by the same unit roll one additional dice for a Leadership test and discard the highest. In addition, if ever a Unit made up entirely of models with this rule is destroyed, a single unit also consisting entirely of models with this rule with one or more models within 18" of it and in Line of Sight gains +1 Ld and +1 Attack for the rest of the battle. A unit may never benefit from this bonus more than once.
Limitations
- Units made up entirely of models with the Legiones Astartes (Crimson Lions) special rule equipped with Combat, Boarding or Breaching Shields must pass a Leadership test when a charge is declared against them before any other actions are resolved. If this test is failed, they may not make overwatch attacks and enemies do not count as making a Disordered Charge as a result of charging Boarding Shields, as well as reducing their Initiative by 1. Note that any other cause that an enemy unit may have for making a Disordered Charge are still not ignored.
- Characters in detachments with this Rite of War may not decline challenges, and if the Warlord is killed, your opponent gains +D3 Victory Points.
- Detachments using this Rite of War may not include more Fast Attack units than they have non-compulsory Troop choices. 
- In missions which would normally have a random game length, the Crimson Lions player's opponent can opt to play to six full turns instead of the roll to end the game being made.

 

 

[Grifftofer]

Well I have a few things to say.

• Blood of the Lion: I am working from the idea that the rule says that if you are outnumbered by one model you get +1A, 2 models +2A... Is this right? If so then is this given per model (So every model would gain +X attacks) or per unit (So just +X attacks, but who gets to make them?)?
• Legion Rules: I can't see any downside to your rules really. The possibility of giving away 1VP is basically balanced by the fact you can also gain 1VP and they have to kill your Warlord first. Something like forcing Sweeping Advances towards nearest enemy unit or cannot go to ground would in my opinion be the least you need to add to make this not just a massive advantage.
• Behona: I would suggest making this an alternative for a Vexilla, so you can take either this or the  Vexilla. Otherwise as it is written you could take say 3 of these in every squad and get it's benefit every turn.
• The Sword of Ages: Always Strikes First isn't a rule in 40K/30K :P It existed in WFB, but would be absolutely broken if brought into 40K/30K in my opinion.
• I will also mention that in general I am against the use of the Eternal Warrior rule in 30K, but I won't dispute your other relic purely based on that opinion.

[Sigismund229]

Grifftofter,for Blood of the Lion I was thinking the squad as a whole would gain those A, wasn't quite sure which models would deliver them though so that's something I need to think about... 

For Blood debt, perhaps the units with that rule could never go to ground and could never make a shooting attack if they were within "6 of an enemy unit if it would prevent them from charging AND always need to attempt a sweeping advance towards the nearest enemy unit? 

Making the behona replace the vexilla seems reasonable. 

Woops, getting my warhammer's confused again XD

[Sigismund229]

Continuing with my re writing of all the Crimson Lions rules, next up is Hectarion his bodyguard, the Myramodons. Only Maridius and a yet to be decided special character to go...

P.S. Sorry for double posting but I'd rather keep the "raw" rules seperate from the changes I need to make to other rules.

 

Hectarion Mycenor, 500 points.

WS8 BS6 S6 T6 W6 I6 A6 LD10 SV2+/3+

Wargear: Primarch armour, Aros' blessing, Godstooth, the Lion Stone, the great Stone Lion pelt.

 

Godstooth. S: +1 AP: 2 Murderous strike, Rending, Fleshbane.

 

Hereah's Breath. R: Template S: 6 AP: 4 Rending.

 

Aros' blessing: The shield that Hectarion carries into battle, Aros' blessing confers a 3++ invulnerable save on him.

 

The Lion Stone: The traditional symbol of the King's of the Sakseath tribe of Mycenae, this stone embodies the pride and honour of Mycenae. Any Crimson Lions within "12 gain Fearless.

 

The great stone lion pelt: An eternal reminder of Hectarion's earliest achievement, this stone lion pelt reminds all the Lions that their father is watching their every move, causing them to charge into battle with ever greater fury and heedless of the dangers. Any squads with LA(CL) initiating a charge move within "6 of Hectarion may re roll failed charge distance rolls.

 

Special Rules: Furious Charge, Primarch, Sire of the Crimson Lions, Boundless Fury, Victory or death!, Pariah's bane, the Indomitable four.

 

Sire of the Crimson Lions: With Hectarion fighting alongside them, the Crimson Lions are near indefatigable, charging their enemies ranks with the same belligerence as the getae and if an enemy charges them, instead of meekly waiting for the charge to come to them, the Crimson Lions will leap forwards and counter charge their enemies, smashing their way into the enemy ranks using the bulk that their gene seed gave them to hammer their enemies into submission.

In an army containing Hectarion all squads with LA(CL) gain Counter attack and all squads with breacher shields gain Hammer of Wrath.

 

Boundless Fury: While most think the Bloodthirster shard to have been banished from Hectarion's mind long ago, they are wrong. The remnants of it still linger in the back of his mind, tormenting him and urging him to give in and to slaughter anything he comes across.

At the beginning of each game, Hectarion must take a LD test. If he passes then use him as normal. If he fails it then he loses -2LD and -1WS but gains +2A and all failed to hit rolls in the assault phase are instead directed at the squad Hectarion is attached to(if he is attached to a squad).

 

Victory or death!: Hectarions presence is a constant reminder to his warriors that retreat is not an option, they can only triumph or die and with their father taking to the field, death isn't an option.

Any squad within "12 of Hectarion that has LA(CL) and is retreating re groups automatically at the beginning of the next turn.

 

Pariah's bane: Pariah's cause Hectarion unimaginable pain, for while he is in their presence the bloodthirster within him is struggling for dominance with their pariah abilities. Because of this, Hectarion avoids contact with them and, if he is brought into combat with them, disembowels them as quickly as possible.

An army containing Hectarion may never contain a squad or character with the pariah special rule. If Hectarion is fighting a character or squad with the pariah special rule then he may re roll all to hit rolls of 1.

 

The indomitable four: Alexandros, Pionius, Hectarion and Dear'dd. The indomitable four. The closest of the primarchs, it has often been said that there is no foe that could stand against them if they strode the same battlefield together. Indeed, all these four compliment each others abilities so that when they take to the field together they create an unstoppable war machine that will scythe its way through anything sent against it.

If Hectarion is part of the same army as Alexandors Darshan von Salim, Pionius Santor or Dear'dd Nimkika then he automaticaly passes his LD test at the beginning of the game. If the other primarch is killed at any point during the game then Hectarion gains Rage and Hatred.

 

 

Myramodons, 550 points, 0-1

WS6 BS6 S4 T4 W2 I5 A2 LD9 SV2+/4+

Unit size: 5 Myramodons.

Wargear: Tartaros armour, Hoplon shield, Paragon blade, Stone Lion pelt.

 

Stone Lion pelt: Before he is fully accepted into the ranks of the Myramodons, a warrior must first hunt down and kill one of the massive stone lions that inhabit their home's mountains. The pelt of this animal is then often worn as a cloak and is a sign of the warriors prowess in battle. Upon the sight of the cloak and the warriors that wear it, the Crimson Lions take heart and re double their efforts. All Crimson Lions within "6 of a model wearing a stone lion pelt may re roll failed LD tests and to wound rolls of 1.

 

Special rules: Legiones Astartes(Crimson Lions), It will not die, Hammer of wrath, Counter attack, Sworn guard, the Ultimate Sacrifice.

 

Sworn Guard: Myramodons may only be taken in an army which includes Hectarion Mycenor and if included in your army Hectarion must be attached to the Myramodons. In the assault phase, the player may assign as up to half the attacks against Hectarion onto the Myramodons and they may re roll failed look out sir rolls.

 

The Ultimate Sacrifice: Myramodons do not have to make morale checks for losing models.

 

May take up to 5 more Myramodons for +45 points.

[Raktra]

I'd knock his attacks down to 5, seeing as the only Primarch to natively have A6 in the canon-verse is Fulgrim and his hyperspeedyness. Otherwise, cool stuff there.

[Hesh Kadesh]

Wow, Sigi, huge amount of work gone into this. Putting me to shame that I've not done more on mine! Sorry for the huge wall of text!

 

Quick edit I forgot to put in; under the Rite of War, Wall of Shields, I meant to write "reduce the strength of all overwatch shooting attacks made against them by -1 when they initiate a charge". 

 

I'm of the agreement with Grifft. The first one has a lot of accounting to do with it, and a lot of exceptions and wordiness that would slow things down trying to work it out. Also, on the scale of balance, getting bonus attacks when you can have Breachers with +1 Attack, Counter Attack, and the Sergeant getting +1 Attack in a challenge is pretty heavy going. With the Hoplon Shield providing the ability for a 4++ in CC without preventing an additional attack also (basically, the important part of the Iron Halo) you can have things like Aishetari with 1 Attack base, additional close combat weapon, +1 Attack from having seen another unit die, counter attack, and challenge on the sergeant, giving the unit essentially 4 attacks, 6 on the sergeant. After an overwatch of possible Shred and Rend. A unit of 10 is rather extreme, and assuming say 5 get charged, allowing for 5 pile in's (including the Sergeant who then challenges, that's 36 attacks, on the defence. If they're charged by say 20 Tacticals, and ignore the Overwatch for ease of maths, that's outnumbered by 10; or in other words, another attack per model - or 46 Attacks per unit. Even at 275pts for a unit of Aishetari, to have 46 attacks is HUGE, especially when it's Rending.

 

Destiny Awaits, I'm a little unsure on. You already have a ton of CC bonuses, and it's the best bit of Fleet, basically (Fleet lets you reroll any dice during Run/Charge, yours says effectively reroll the lowest). It's not purely the same as Fleet, however, as bad rolling on two dice still leaves you short, but that's a 3/8 chance of happening, so still good odds. The other side is that you do give up your defensive bonuses though; Defensive Grenades and Counter Attack. That said, I think that it's just too much - after all, Assault Squads are already pretty good, and are getting a drop in costs in the Legiones Astartes Crusade Army List redux apparently. 

 

Blood Debt; not only do you get bonuses if your warlord fights in a challenge, but you get bonuses for if he dies too? On top of the bonuses for already losing the character, as well as Bonus VP's for killing something you should be killing anyway? I get what you're trying to do with this, but I don't think the mechanics are the right way to encourage it, sorry!

 

How about this;

 

Legiones Astartes (Crimson Lions); Units with this special group may always attempt to regroup regardless of casualties.

Blood of the Lion; All models with this special rule gain the Zealot rule when outnumbered by enemies in an assault. When working out the outnumbering, models with the Bulky, Very Bulky or Extremely Bulky special rules use the number of models that they count as for the purposes of transport capacity. Walkers and Monstrous Creatures count as 3 models for this purpose, while Gargantuan Creatures and Super Heavy Creatures are ignored, as they are simply to big to worry about. 

Destiny Awaits; Models with this special rule ignore the penalties Hardened Armour inflicts on distances rolled for Charges, Sweeping Advances and Run moves. In addition, once per battle at the start of a friendly assault phase, declare you are using this rule. All friendly units in an army containing one or more models with this special rule gains the Fleet special rule for the rest of the phase.

Blood Debt; Choose one Independent Character without the Support Officer special rule in any Crimson Lion Detachment to be the Warband Leader. If the Warlord has this special rule, then the warlord must be nominated the Warband Leader. The Warband Leader must always Issue and Accept Challenges if able to, even if there are other models eligible (or required for that matter) to accept. If the Warband Leader is killed in a challenge, your opponent gains an additional Victory Point if the challenger survives the battle.

 

Legion Specific Restriction; Unsullied Lines; Crimson Lions prefer to stand their ground, and fight as one immense shieldwall, crushing all in front of them with shield boss and chainaxe. Deploying by Drop Pod into the fray is often seen as unwieldy and allows weak points in the line through which an enemy can flow around, and only do so through necessity. If taken as a Primary Detachment, no models with the Drop Pod Assault special rule may deploy in the first turn. Rather than choosing half and automatically deploying them in the first turn, all such models must be rolled for and come on from Deep Strike Reserve as normal (usually from the second turn onwards).

 

Again, I apologise if this isn't the intention, I've tried to keep it close to your original idea. I've limited the charge to a 1/turn, to give the idea of like a final charge. Basically, I had this in my head while I was writing (still the coolest thing in any movie ever); although probably minus the squats?

 

 

The Zealot is okay, without just handing out free attacks. If outnumbered (see above), you get the ability to reroll misses during the first round, but if you're dragged back to it in ongoing combats, although you don't get the Hatred rerolls, you DO get the double edged sword that is Zealot; i.e, no choose to fail Morale Checks. Because it's limited to combat, it's not as bad, because at the end of the day; 

 

 

2:09 for when they fight in the shade. Included the rest for some good shieldwall porn. 

 

The penalty for losing the VP I've kept, but toned it down slightly. Considering the bonuses that your guys can get, it shouldn't be too hard to have a Character who can handle himself in a challenge (a Praetor, with a potential 2+/4++, 8 AP2 attacks 4 base, +1 Digi Weapons, Counter Attack, +1 for losing friendly unit in Line of Sight, and fighting in a challenge, possible rerolling misses with Zealot, to then give rerolls to hit makes him brutal. That he can also pick up Eternal Warrior, It Will Not Die, and the ability to regen a single wound with the Torc of Jurfik (love the name, by the way) on his 3 wound base makes him incredible, as well as a possible T5 if a Rix is included, especially as they are in a Boarding Shield squad taken away the enemies bonus charge attack. I didn't want to then give them a reroll to wound, especially with a Paragon Blade. That, and there's no saying that that unit would even survive the phase, which would remove the VP's even if the opponent went for it. That said; if the opponent was to go for the Warlord, and you ran the Rite of War - it's 4-6 VP's up for grabs for your opponent.

 

As a comparison to said theoretical Praetor, Hennasohn has 5-6 WS7, S7, I7 and AP2 rerolling Invulnerables at his most optimal, but can be shut down by Psykers or Pariahs, and has to give up attacks to get bonuses to his 5++ Invulnerable. He does have other abilities, admittedly, but for combat focus, that is where he stands.

 

As for the other limitation; this was because I didn't feel that there were enough penalties to offset the bonuses (and you have a lot of nested bonuses which bounce of one another). It's not a huge one, in that the legion gets benefits without needing to "resort" to drop pod tactics, but rather one in which the legion attempts to ignore typical drop pod tactics in favour of forming the shield wall, so uses them in the same manner as any other legion would use a Deep Strike vehicle. Of course, in an emergency, when sent to help an ally, they may deploy in Drop Pods as a matter of urgency, hence I've not prevented penalties to an allied detachment running Drop Podded vehicles.

 

Again, I hope this is acceptable, I love what you're doing with your legion. 

 

Hoplon Shields are 15pts for a 4++ for 15pts; an Iron Halo does this for 25pts, and are fairly rare. Perhaps just make it a 5++, improving to a 4++ against attacks with the melee special rule? Does it affect handing in anyway, like a Storm Shield/Boarding Shield? Considering it's the 4++ in CC it's being chosen for, and doesn't have any downsides, giving a straight 4++ out to everyone for 10pts less (remember Iron Hands get only a +1 to saves to a maximum 3++, but have to pay +15pts for it) is very cheap. Perhaps allow any Character who is equipped with a Boarding Shield to replace the Boarding Shield with a Hoplon Shield for free, and those who have it as an option may instead take one for the same cost. 

 

In regards to the equipment; I agree with Grifft in regards to the Behona in for making it a replacement option for a Vexilla (ie, "any model upgraded to be equipped with a Legion Vexilla may exchange their Vexilla for a Behona for an additional 15pts). The once every three turns sounds like a bit of paperwork that's not really necessary, maybe just 1/battle? Can I point out that Fury of the Legion doesn't penalise an assault either, just the Rapid Fire of Bolters is what kills a charge. It's worth bearing in mind that Iron Warriors Hammer of Olympia lets them do just that, but they have to make a Disordered Charge to do that (giving up charge bonuses in exchange for an additional BS4 S4 AP5 isn't very good. I'm still not sure to this day WHY the Hammer of Olympia calls out the Fury of the Legion in particular. I don't otherwise have a problem with it.

 

The Falcan Blades; these are fine. AP4 and Rending.. A Charnabal Sabre is an equivalent; perhaps open up the option to Command Squads as well. "Any Character or model with the Chosen Warriors special rule may replace their Close Combat Weapon/Chainsword with a Falcan Blade, for +15pts per model." 

 

Sword of Ages; I get that this is a relic, but given that you have 8 attacks (see above for how this is possible), to now give said 8 Attack, Eternal Warrior, IWND, T5, *4 Wound 2+/4++/5+ FNP Save model with Zealot WS7, and Instant Death, along with ASF (assuming you mean strikes at I10) is just a bit too broken. Now, admittedly, such a model costs 245pts (added on a meltabomb for good measure, and doesn't include the cost of the Rix or the Primus Medicae), this is something which can easily take on anything that's essentially not-Abaddon. I think even Sigismund would have a hard time fighting him, and this is rather your generic Praetor build. Certainly no other generic build can take him. It's not as though he'd be bad even on his own. At 180pts for a Paragon Blade, Powerfist, Hoplon Shield, Digital Weapons, Meltabombs, he's actually got another attack, so can get 9 Attacks, either at Initiative AP2, or Unwieldy S8 AP2.

 

I'm not sure that on top of all the benefits given to the Legion for CC, that then giving them another Weapon is the best way forwards, and I'm a bit surprised that the Sword was the chosen blade. If you were to take a weapon, Instant Death with the number of attacks available to you is pretty much a No-go, I think. I'd suggest the Helfrost rule from the Space Wolves, but I've already claimed that mechanic (model wounded takes a Toughness Test or die; Sorry!). I'm a little unsure as to where to go for a weapon, as I think it should be a side-grade.

 

Again, I don't want to completely ruin your idea of a weapon, but what about a special kind of Falcan Blade? A Rending Power Sword, with +1WS is roughly 25pts (15+5 for Rending, +5 for +1WS). This gives you Weapon Skill 7, with a S4 AP3 Rending Weapon. To wound is the (purposefully) avoided mechanic, which is why I don't have an issue with suggesting "Shred"; this means that it's mechanically better at causing wounds, and has an increased chance of causing Shred. (+10pts; Lightning Claw gets it for 5pts only boost because it's Specialist). So we're on 35pts. For the final 5-10pts, what about having it Rend on a 5+? Incidentally, is "Lord of Dawn" intended to be a play on words of "Dorn/Dawn" and be a Chainsword? If I was to keep it to 40pts, I'd probably make it so that only attacks made by the weapon gain +1 Weapon Skill, rather than modify the profile. I'm unsure as how to include the extra initiative, as it can be a big thing, but as he already has a high initiative and people higher than that are literally preternatural extraordinary creatures - to use the example of Hennasohn again, he uses his telekinetic powers to impede enemies and strike at range representing higher initiative - and potentially Zealot, so giving further bonuses aren't going to do too much to him. Still +1 Initiative on an AP3 weapon isn't so bad, even if it does Shred and Rend on a 5+, it's not IDing, unlike a Paragon Blade.

 

So; 

 

"Sword of Ages; Range; - Strength: As User, AP 3; Type: Melee, Tear, Darting Strike, Shred

 

Tear; Attacks made by a weapon with this rule have the Rending special rule, with the exception that it Rends on a 5+, rather than a 6+ as normal.

Darting Strike; The wielder of this blade gains +1 Initiative. In addition, their attacks count as being made as if their weapon skill was one higher than normal. This does not affect the attacks of an enemy."

 

It's not a strict upgrade, but it's a decent side-grade. It could also help against the likes of Morro or Wraith Pionus.

 

Hectarion; (I did say sorry for the Wall of text!)

 

I'm kind of alright with the 6 attacks; although I'd remove Fleshbane, personally - sorry to use Morro again as the example, but that was meant to represent his gribbliness and hundreds of tentacle attacks finding their way in and poisoning things. I don't think a Poisoned 2+ would fit either. S7 AP2 is more than enough for most purposes, and Rending has no use (you already have AP2, and wound all things on a 6+ minimum anyway). I'd possibly throw on Shred, but then there are other options. As other options, Raktra gains the ability to multiply damage, (on a 5+, deals 2 wounds), and with 5 S8 AP2 attacks, 7 on the charge, he's doing a lot of damage. 

 

Something as "simple" as a S+1, AP2, Murderous Strike, Shred is utterly lethal. Maybe, if you do want to have a unique special rule, you could maybe throw on the limitation that wounds caused by attacks on a 6 may not be regained by IWND or saved by FNP; this could put a stickler in Morro's and Pionus' resilience. Call it something like "Grievous Wounds". . That said, I'd possibly consider dropping his Initiative to 5. I know he's not "slow", but of the Primarchs, I feel he has more in common with the likes of Vulkan, or Ferrus Manus for his attacks, as opposed to someone more lithe, like Lorgar, while Horus is the literal God of War.

 

if those changes are made, his attack line would look like;

 

7 S8 AP2 Attacks, rerolling failed to wounds, with any rolls of 6 ignoring Feel No Pain, and not allowing IWND to be made. 

 

Hereah's Breath. Please tell me this is a shotgun. Because yes. Yes. It's a decent ranged weapon without being too much. 

 

Ares' Shield; Hmm. 3++, on top of everything, I'm not entirely sold on. A 4++ is more than tough with a T6/W6 IWND. 

 

Lion Stone; The 12" Fearless Bubble; again, if the changes are made as posited above for the Blood of the Lion part of LA(CL), it's not such a problem, as you have pseudo Fearless with Zealot when outnumbered anyway.

 

Stone Lion Pelt; See, you get rerolls to charge here :) (see earlier for "Destiny Awaits"). If the changes to Destiny Awaits wasn't made, this special rule would be near worthless. 

 

Sire of the Crimson Lions; I like it. It helps make other Rites of War more attractive to the Lions.

 

Boundless Fury; I like it, although limiting it to the beginning of each game is a bit hit or miss. Perhaps include it to work in any turn in which he has not killed a model in CC. Gaining +2 attacks on top of the 6 you've already got though...

 

How about this? Dropping Hectarions base statline to WS7, I5, A5, losing Furious Charge. Starting from start of his second turn, at the start of each movement phase in which Hectarion failed to kill any enemy model in an assault, roll a Leadership test. If this test is passed, there is no effect. If this effect is failed, however, for the rest of the battle, the Bloodthirster is unleased, and Hectarion gains +1 Weapon Skill, Initiative, Attack and gains Furious Charge, but his Leadership is reduced by 2, and he must Sweep and Charge if able to. It lets you drop his cost somewhat, maybe 60pts to maybe nearer 440?. He's still more than lethal, and not much can stand up to him for longer than a single round even without going zerker mode. I don't think even Angron goes all out Daemon Weapon levels of insane. I know he's not got a Greater Daemon knitted with his soul. Maybe giving the enemy a single VP if he fails the test and the mission is a draw (and he's still alive) as the Lions have to give up the victories they have already made in order to try and contain and enraged Primarch?

 

Victory or Death; all within 12" are fearless anyway, so no need for this to happen.

 

Pariah's Bane; I like it; although perhaps conversely they force any rolls of 6 to be rerolled, because they throw off the aim of Hectarion during the insanity. Maybe they force a further -1 to Boundless Fury's Leadership Test?

 

Indomitable Four; I like this; although it would need changing if following suggestions as above.

 

Myramadons.

 

I've got to say that even Primarch's Bodyguards, at WS6, BS6 I5 are way OTT, even at 550pts; they'll either never be taken, or be so good so as to make them worth it that they're broken. Granting additional bonuses to wound here is a little powerful as well. With these, you literally have rerolls and bonuses available in every single phase of the game.

 

I can't give any comments over these, as I'd completely end up gutting them, and removing pretty much everything. My suggestion for these would be to give him a special Terminator Command Squad which allows him to reroll failed Leadership Tests for the purposes of Boundless Fury. 

 

The Firekeepers have a similar unit, the Triakonta, or "The Thirty",

 

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/309945-brotherhood-of-the-lost-fire-keepers/

 

I think that these are more in line with an elite Bodyguard. Yours are essentially nearly Praetor level guys. I'm sorry to say this but your guys need really toning down to match the rest of the setting. 

 

If you were to take something like Firedrakes as the baseline (275), then give them all Paragon Blades (Thunder Hammers equivalent - 50), then swap to Tartaros, but give them a Hoplon (call it 10pts, if you just have it as a 4++ in CC), then we're at 375 already. The Stat increases have absolutely no necessity in setting. Literally, there are maybe 50-60 people in the entire Imperium with that Weapon Skill level. It's the same as Lorgar, and it takes the best Telekine in the legions to get WS7 to use his sword with his mind. I think that WS6 is just too far along that. When you look at the other Legion Terminators we have, Triakonta, and the Iron Bear's Totem Guard (IIRC? Might have their name wrong, sorry Redd!). The Triakonta are what I imagined to be among the best "legion" fighters to be outside of that there are command points.

 

With respect, if we have a look at the Justaerin, Deathshroud, Phoenix Terminators, Red Butchers, Gorgons, Firedrakes, Lernaeans, and even Fulmentarus and Siege Tyrants as some examples, there are some which stand themselves out; the new Justaerin, Firedrakes and Deathshroud most notably, because of their two wounds. Red Butchers too, but they're less honour guard, and more semi-servitor berzerkers in a suit of armour. Firekeeper Triakonta are more along those lines, but the Myramodon's are magnitudes greater and it just doesn't rub right.

 

Firedrakes with Paragon Blades would be awesome enough, without all the need or the rest of it. And I'd also consider dropping the points values. One thing that I've found is that point balance is a rough thing, and it shouldn't really stray too far from the norm or else they'll just be forgotten; look at what happened to the Old Justaerin.

[Sigismund229]

Hesh&Raktra thanks for the input! I'm not brilliant at writing balanced rules(I tend to get carried away and go OTT) and I also tend to stick to fairly basic rules(extra attacks etc.) so help with making the rules more imaginative, less wordy and less broken is always appreciated.

 

Blood of the Lion: My idea was not +1 attack for every CL model but rather +1 attack for each model they're outnumbered by for the squad as a whole. However, I now realise I had no real idea how those attacks would be distributed amongst the squad so I'll drop my varient and go with yours Hesh.

Destiny Awaits: This rule was meant to represent that kind of charge, this one inspired "They may outnumber us but by the Emperor we'll give them the fight of their lives. To Victory or Hados' halls brothers!" charge. Letting them ignore the bad effects of void hardened armour on charges and gaining fleet once per game is nice, I like it(thumbs up)(although, as a side note, I now can't get the image of Crimson Lions doing that LotR charge roaring "For Frodo" out of my mind...)

Blood debt: This rule is a good representation of my idea. My original thought was that the CL would re double their efforts if their commander dies(honour must be satisfied after all) but yours embodies that principal without going overboard with it and as you mention, the Lions characters can handle themselves in challenges anyway without the rest of the army gaining any more bonuses from challenges(As a side note, I also like that this rule embodies a Mycenaean tribal chieftan being honour bound to accept a challenge and not let another fight his battles for him).

Unsullied Lines: HOW DID I NOT THINK OF THIS!!!!

As for the opponent getting a tonne of VP's from killing the CL warlord, that's intentional. Its like throwing down the gauntlet and saying "Come get some if you think you're hard enough".

Hoplon shield: It's primarily meant for cc so yeah its 5++ at range and 4++ in cc(I gotta stop forgetting to put what these shields are at range). As far as pricing goes, I could just raise it to +25pts? Should put me off putting it on every single sarge in the army.

 

Behona: Woops. Replace FotL with Rapid fire then? As this is meant to give CL the chance to hit like a tonne of bricks one turn but not much more than that(with the 1per 3 turns I was operating on the idea that most games end by turn 6).

Sword of Ages: Now that analyses deffo puts it inti context. Yikes. Some serious nerfing needs to be done. How about this?

Sword of Ages

R:- S: user AP: 2 melee, accumulated wisdom, grevious wound(thanks for the idea!)

Accumulated wisdom: The wielder of this blade gains +1WS in the first turn of any duel.

Grevious wounds: Wounds inflicted by the Sword of Ages on a 6 count as having Instant Death.

Better?

 

For Hec I see where you're coming from about Godstooth. So no rending or Fleshbane. Perhaps something like so:

S: +1 AP:2 melee, Murderous Strike, Shred. ?

Sorry, Hereah's Breath is a flamer made for Hec by the Terrewat clans. Let the world burn!

Ares' shield right. I'll peg it back to where it was originally.

Boundless Fury. Hmm, I like it for the most part but I'd kinda like to keep Hec's WS at 8 for challenges, so perhaps replace Victory or Death with that? Fits with the legion(breachers and challenges ftw!) and gives him a boost representing him giving his all in combat.

Pariah's bane: I don't like the idea of him needing to re roll 6s although I do like the reduced LD.

 

Myramodons. Need to be re written. How about them like so?:

Myramodon stat line(no sergeant as Hec is their sergeant)

WS5 BS5 S4 T4 W2 I4 A2 LD9 SV2+/4+

Wargear: Hoplon shield, paragon blade, tartaros armour, stone lion pelt.

 

Stone Lion pelt: Modifies Look ou sir! Rolls by 1?

 

Special rules: Sworn guard, Chosen companions, To the jaws of hell.

Chosen Companions: For as long as Hectarion is attached to a unit of Myramodons he may re roll failed Boundless Fury rolls.

 

To the jaws of hell: For as long as Hectarion is accompanied by the Myramodons they re group automaticaly.

225 points for the first 3 and then +45 points for each extra.

[Sigismund229]

More characters(nearly finished...just one more RoW to go...come on Siggy you can do this...)

Maridius "Iron-arm", Lord of the Hypaspists. 275 points.

WS6 BS5 S4 T5 W3 I4 A3 LD10 SV2+/5+

Wargear: Artificier void hardened armour, bionics, Soul Reaver, volkite charger.

 

Soul Reaver: Ever since the primarch's discovery, Maridius has gone into battle wielding Soul Reaver, a two handed broadsword given to him by Hectarion himself. It is said that Soul Reaver not only cuts into your body but also your soul.

S: +1S AP: 2 Murderous Strike, Soul Blaze, Two handed.

 

Special Rules: Adamantium Will, Feel No Pain, Eternal Warrior, Hatred(Grave Stalkers), Lord of the Hypaspists, King of battle, It wont keep me down, LA(CL)

 

Lord of the Hypaspists: If Maridius is your warlord then Aishetari and Veteran Squads become compulsory troops choices and all Elites choices become scoring units.

 

King of battle: On the first round of any combat, the squad Maridius is attached to may use his WS in place od their own.

 

It wont keep me down: Maridius has suffered many wounds in his time that, by all conventional reasoning, should have killed him. Battling on through these injuries he kept fighting through sheer force of will.

If Maridius is reduced to 0 wounds then he may elect to take a LD test. If he passes then he continues fighting with 1W remaining at -1I.

 

If you wish, for 300 points Maridius may be accompanied by the Hirt.

Hirt Chief

WS4 BS4 S4 T4 W2 I4 A2 LD9 SV3+/4+

Hirt

WS4 BS4 S4 T4 W1 I4 A1 LD8 SV3+/4+

Wargear: Void hardened armour, Hoplon Shield, Falcan blade, Frag&Krak grenades, The Blood Wolf(Standard bearer only).

Unit size: 1 Hirt Chief, 1 Standard bearer, 3 Hirt.

 

The Blood Wolf: The legendary war standard of the III legion, the Blood Wolf embodies the pride and honour of the III. Hanging from it are the heads of Kalaggan, Tyrant of Ursh and the Ivraxian Tech-Lords as well as a hundred other foes. Any veteran of the III would gladly give their lives to see the Blood Wolf stay in III legion hands.

Veterans and Aishetari within "6 of the model holding the Blood Wolf don't make LD tests for suffering 25% casualties.

 

Special Rules: LA(CL).

 

For my other character I'm incredibly torn. I'm currently toying with the idea of a Sperothai(CL who never grew up and so still fight with the getae but have a larger arsenal and use rad grenades, unlike every other member of the III legion) character with the following profile:

 

Lughaian "Black-tongue", 200 points.

WS5 BS3 S4 T4 W3 I5 A3 LD8 SV3+/6+

Wargear: Power armour, jump pack, Twin volkite calivers, Thara&Brota, frag&krak grenades, rad grenades, phosphex bombs.

 

Thara&Brota: Lughaian's twin falcan blades, Thara&Brota have been modified by Lughaian to better suit his goals and he will use every dirty trick in the book if he thinks it will give him a better chance in combat...

S: user AP: 4 Poison(3+), Murderous Strike, Shred.

 

Special Rules: Outflank, Fearless, Hit&Run,Rampage, Chain fire, Irresponsible, Hand of Destiny, Head hunter, LA(CL)

 

Irresponsible: Responsibility, leadership and duty. These three things are utterly alien concepts to Lughaian. Ever since his induction into the legion he has sought to do nothing but wreak havoc on his enemies for no other reason than the amusement it brings him. While this means he is shunned by his elder bretheren, it makes him a rallying point for the young getae, eager for glory and battle and not particularly discriminant about who they fight.

Any army containing Lughaian may take getae as a non-compulsory troops choice. However, the squad Lughaian is attached to may never use his own LD in place of their own and Lughaian may never be your armies warlord.

 

Hand of destiny: None can say why, but despite his reckless exploits, Lughaian has never been seriously harmed by any bolt or blade. Even his own rad weapons seem to have little effect on him. It would seem some supernatural being is saving Lughaian for some special purpose. Although this doesn't stop him trying to prove such whispers wrong...

Lughaian has a 6++ invulnerable save.

 

Head Hunter: During most battles, Lughaian will confine his activities to hunting down and killing the enemy command one by one, even if only to see the look of horror on their faces as he sinks his falcan blades into their chests.

In combat with an HQ or Lord of War, Lughaian gains +1A and instead of the normal 1VP for Slay the Warlord, if Lughaian kills the enemy warlord then you gain +D3 VP's.

Edited February 15, 2016 by Sigismund229

[Athrawes]

I've been giving a lot of thought towards Rites of War for the Lightning Bearers. I wanted some that would be powerful, thematic and fun to play. 

 

Rite of War: Destined Assault

A hallmark of the Lightning Bearers Way of warfare was rapid assaults, planned using the Precognative talents of the Legions Celestial Orders. Before battle is ever joined, Skilled Battle-Scryers could pinpoint specific targets whose capture or elimination could alter the outcome of the wider conflict, in essence Identifying the precise fulcrum around which a battle and victory could be wrested.

 

Effects

• An army using this Rite of War may begin rolling for Reserves starting on turn 1, including flyers.
• An army using this Rite of War adds +1 to the Roll to decide who goes first or to seize the Initiative at the beginning of the game

Restrictions

 

• You may Not take Fortifications
• You may not Take an allied force Detachment
•  Using the Destined Assault Rite of war drastically changes the victory conditions for a game in which it is used. In addition to any other means determining victory conditions for a mission (whether they be killpoints, tactical objectives, Victory points, ect.) At the beginning of the game, at the same time that warlord traits and psychic powers are rolled for The Lightning Bearers Player must select D3 additional Objects from the 'Predestined Objective' list below. If the Objective is achieved, The Lightning Bearers player earns an additional victory point, in addition to any claimed as part of the mission. if no 'Predestined Objectives' are achieved, The Lightning Bearers may not achieve victory in the battle, regardless of any other factors.

Predestined Objectives

 

Slay Fated Enemy Hero: After deployment, nominate an enemy Hero, this may be their armies warlord or a Character that counts as an HQ selection.. To claim this Objective, you must kill that nominated Hero by the End of the Game. 

 

Halt rampaging War Machine: After deployment, nominate an vehicle with more than 5 hull points. To claim this Objective, you must Destroy this war machine before the end of the game.

 

Protect sites of Import: During Deployment, you opponent must nominate 3 terrain pieces within their deployment zone at least 12" apart from one another. To claim this Objective you must end the game with a scoring unit within 6" of one of these sites.

 

Delay enemy Advance: To claim this objective, you must keep your opponent from successfully achieving the Linebreaker Objective.

 

 

 

 

++++

 

 

This the current draft of the Rite, I'd love to get your thoughts, on whether it seems balanced, fluffy, or fun. Additionally, I'd love to hear if you have any Ideas for more Predestined Objectives.

Edited February 18, 2016 by Athrawes

[Slips]

I see the Knight Errants rule struck your fancy, eh :P?

 

Did you think about imposing any restrictions on an army using this RoW? Like making it Assault/Speed based? Ambush Based?

[Sigismund229]

I've been giving a lot of thought towards Rites of War for the Lightning Bearers. I wanted some that would be powerful, thematic and fun to play.

Rite of War: Destined Assault

A hallmark of the Lightning Bearers Way of warfare was rapid assaults, planned using the Precognative talents of the Legions Celestial Orders. Before battle is ever joined, Skilled Battle-Scryers could pinpoint specific targets whose capture or elimination could alter the outcome of the wider conflict, in essence Identifying the precise fulcrum around which a battle and victory could be wrested.

Effects

• An army using this Rite of War may begin rolling for Reserves starting on turn 1, including flyers.
• An army using this Rite of War adds +1 to the Roll to decide who goes first or to seize the Initiative at the beginning of the game

Restrictions

• You may Not take Fortifications
• You may not Take an allied force Detachment
• Using the Destined Assault Rite of war drastically changes the victory conditions for a game in which it is used. In addition to any other means determining victory conditions for a mission (whether they be killpoints, tactical objectives, Victory points, ect.) At the beginning of the game, at the same time that warlord traits and psychic powers are rolled for The Lightning Bearers Player must select D3 additional Objects from the 'Predestined Objective' list below. If the Objective is achieved, The Lightning Bearers player earns an additional victory point, in addition to any claimed as part of the mission. if no 'Predestined Objectives' are achieved, The Lightning Bearers may not achieve victory in the battle, regardless of any other factors.

Predestined Objectives

Slay Fated Enemy Hero: After deployment, nominate an enemy Hero, this may be their armies warlord or a Character that counts as an HQ selection.. To claim this Objective, you must kill that nominated Hero by the End of the Game.

Destroy deadly War machine: After deployment, nominate an vehicle with more than 5 hull points. To claim this Objective, you must Destroy this war machine before the end of the game.

Protect sites of Import: During Deployment, you opponent must nominate 3 terrain pieces within their deployment zone at least 12" apart from one another. To claim this Objective you must end the game with a scoring unit within 6" of one of these sites.

Delay enemy Advance: To claim this objective, you must keep your opponent from successfully achieving the Linebreaker Objective.

 

 

 

++++

 

This the current draft of the Rite, I'd love to get your thoughts, on whether it seems balanced, fluffy, or fun. Additionally, I'd love to hear if you have any Ideas for more Predestined Objectives.

If I'm honest, it seems a bit underwhelming for the Arch traitors legion and the first legion to be found as well as one of the most succesful(although that is deffinately better than going overboard like I often do :) ). At the momCorrect me if I'm wrong, but aren't a lot of Lightning Bearers pyskers with powers of pre cognition to some degree?(forgive me it's been a long time since I read your legions fluff)

 

If so, then perhaps include a couple of benefits to try and bring that across on the tabletop? I mean, getting reserves for turn 1 and getting them faster is cool and all but(to my eyes at least) seems a bit under powered compared to what some other legions get. If you would allow me, I'd suggest something like this:

 

Rite of War, Destined Assault

Effects

• When squads using this Rite of War are required to roll on the Deep Strike mishap table, add +1 to your roll.
• An army using this Rite of War may begin rolling for Reserves starting on turn 1, including flyers.
• An army using this Rite of War adds +1 to the Roll to decide who goes first or to seize the Initiative at the beginning of the game
• An army using this Rite of War takes away 1 from their opponents reserve rolls.
• Squads in an army using this Rite of War that are arriving from reserve gain Outflank.
• Squads in an army using this Rite of War that are making an attack in close combat may re roll to hits rolls of 1.

Limitations

• An army using this Rite of War must take at least 1 Librarian as an HQ choice.
• You may Not take Fortifications
• You may not Take an allied force Detachment
• Using the Destined Assault Rite of war drastically changes the victory conditions for a game in which it is used. In addition to any other means determining victory conditions for a mission (whether they be killpoints, tactical objectives, Victory points, ect.) At the beginning of the game, at the same time that warlord traits and psychic powers are rolled for The Lightning Bearers Player must select D3 additional Objects from the 'Predestined Objective' list below. If the Objective is achieved, The Lightning Bearers player earns an additional victory point, in addition to any claimed as part of the mission. if no 'Predestined Objectives' are achieved, The Lightning Bearers may not achieve victory in the battle, regardless of any other factors.

By adding outflank, you make Lightning Bearers reserves more dangerous and represent the Lightning Bearers using their powers of pre cognition to predict where it will best benefit them to attack. I added in the re rolling 1s in cc as it makes them a bit more dangerous and represents them being able to "see" how their enemies will react to certain attacks and doing the opposite or something. The having to have 1 librarian I suggest as it helps emphasise them being a pysker heavy legion. Edited February 17, 2016 by Sigismund229

[Sigismund229]

So, I'm still trying to decide upon my legion's 2nd unique character and an idea I had was to have the Lord of the Inroiar, as that would open the way for very un-breachery III legion armies(as at present they do breachers and characters who are beasts in challenges but are average at everything else) plus the Inroiar would provide a loyalist counterpart to the Berzerkers of Uran. 

 

A notoriously unstable and violent individual, Catraitos was selected to join the III legion at a young age after one of the Alauri witnessed him carving a path through warriors of years greater experience in a berserk fury. While at first Catraitos appeared to have mastered his anger, it re surface while fighting the Qarith and Catraitos, far too easily enraged and enticed into breaking the wall to fight alongside his brothers of the shield, was soon assigned to the Inroiar. From then on, he rose rapidly through the ranks, as few commanders of the Inroiar last long and, where in other units it was thought a dangerous flaw, amongst the Inroiar his phenomenal rage was a blessing. Always at the vanguard of III legion campaigns alongside his bloody brothers, Catraitos is like a force of nature, killing all before him.  

 

Catraitos, Lord of the Inroiar, Warden of the vanguard. 200 points. 

WS4 BS4  S4  T4  W2  I4  A3 LD9 SV3++

Wargear: Power armour, Chain axe, hand flamer, Frag&Krak grenades, Rad grenades. 

Special rules: Rage, Rampage, Hammer of Wrath, Furious Charge, Counter attack, Hatred, Lord of the Inroiar* 

 

Options:

May replace his chain axe with the Ripper for +15 points. The Ripper is a weapon with the following profile 

R- S:+1 AP:3 Melee, Rending, Fleshbane. 

 

May be accompanied by the Reavers of Marggan for +300 points. 

Reavers of Marggan. 

WS4 BS4 S4 T4 W1 I4 A2 LD9 SV3++

Wargear: Power armour, hand flamer, power fist, frag&krak grenades, rad grenades. 

Special rules: Hammer of Wrath, Rage, Counter attack. 

Unit size: 10 Reavers of Marggan. 

 

*Lord of the Inroiar: Now here's where I ran into trouble with this guy. I had two idea's for this rule, the first was that if he was the warlord it would enable you to take a RoW unique to armies in which he's the warlord called Bloody Assault, the second was that if he was the armies warlord then you could take a new unit, Inroiar, unique to armies in which he's the warlord. 

 

For the RoW idea, I was thinking smthn along the lines of: 

Bloody Assault

Bonuses: 

• All squads who may take chainswords may instead take chain axes for the same prices. Squads already equipped with chainswords may change them to chain axes for free. Up to 1 model for every 5 models in a squad may replace their bolt pistol with a hand flamer for +5 points. 
• Units in an army using this RoW gain Hatred(everything) and Counter Attack. 
• Units in an army using this RoW may re roll failed sweeping advances. 
• Assault squads may swap their jump packs for a drop pod for +50 points. 
• Units in an army using this RoW who take casualties from a shooting attack do not have to make a morale check for suffering 25% casualties. 

Negative effects

• All squads in an army using this RoW must attempt to make a sweeping advance if at all possible. 
• All squads in an army using this RoW may never make Fury of the Legion attacks or rapid fire weapons if there is an enemy within "10
• If a squad using this RoW is within "10 of an enemy squad in the assault phase, they must attempt to assault it. 
• Squads using this RoW may never use the LD value of a squad not using this RoW. 
• Squads using this RoW may never volountarily fail LD checks. 
• An army using this RoW may never take Heavy Support squads, Veteran squads or Aishetari. 
• When making overwatch attacks against a squad using this RoW, your opponent may re roll 1s. 
• If, by the end of the game, you have lost more squads than you have destroyed and you're using this RoW, then you lose the game automaticaly. However, if you have destroyed more squads than you lost then you gain +D3 VPs. 

Second idea was this

Inroiar assault squad, 250 points. 

WS4 BS4 S4 T4 W1 I4 A2 LD8 SV3++

Wargear: Power armour, chain axe, bolt pistol, frag&krak grenades. 

Unit size: 5 Inroiar. 

Special rules: Hatred(everything), Hammer of Wrath, Rage, Furious Charge.  

Options: 

May take up to 15 more Inroiar for +10 points each. 

 

One in every 5 may take: 

Hand flamer +5 points

Falcan blade +5 points. 

Plasma pistol +15 points.

Power fist +15 points.

Power maul +15 points. 

[Praefectus Invictus]

Catraitos seems like a really cool and formidable character, but why such a low WS? Is it only his bloodlust that makes him formidable? Even if it is maybe put in a rule where he gets +1 WS in the first round of combat (or something like that) to represent the ferocious strength and rage pouring out from him. The Reavers seem pretty good, I'd consider scaling them back to 275-280 points though, as 300 seems a bit steep. You could also give them the option to take other weapons, like power axes, mauls and swords. The ROW looks good. For the Inroiar, I think that they could use a major points drop, like 75-100 points. At the moment they are priced well over terminators, and I don't think they give enough for that cost. Scale them back to 175, give them the option of taking a pod, rhino or LR and I think it's a pretty good unit.

[Slips]

Make him a Lemartes / Malakim Phoros analogue? IE The more damage he takes, the harder he hits back / the more resilient he becomes?

 

So give him 3 wounds and when he loses his first wound, he gains a 5+ FNP or +1 (to a max of 3+) to an existing FNP. If he loses a 2nd wound, he gains Fearless.

 

Or something to that effect. Maybe even tie in Rage + Rampage + Counter-Attack into the Mechanic.

[Doctor Perils]

Good character, fluffy rules (don't forget legiones astartes crimson lions X) )

 

A unit of ten handflamer guys seems a bit weird though as a bodyguard unit though. It might be more intereating to say that they are simply command squad who have a hand flamer instead of a bolt pistol and have rad grenades for +10/model or something.

 

I think a lot of rites of war here seem to use too many bonus and drawbacks: forge world's ones generally don't have more than three and three, here you have 5/6 and 8 !

[Kelborn]

The moment you realize that a handflamer is a miniature flamer in form of a pistol instead of:

 

http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/8/86/JangoFlamethrower-AOTC.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20091103234118

 

Back to topic:

 

Although I'm not familiar with the rules and how they work out, I do like it.

 

Back to non-topic:

 

A bodyguard unit with those wrist flamers would be cool. Carrying melee weapons and glove attached flame throwers...havoc would be unleashed! :D

[Slips]

So, Deathshroud Terminators, essentially? :p

[Kelborn]

Oh did they have hand attached flamers? woops

Don't like Mortarion's Death Guard at all, so....

 

Imagine a bodyguard, using melee weapons, hand attached flamers and JUMP PACKS! And Capes! Using Drop Pods which opens in the air. While their frames fall down as huge projectiles, crushing everything beneath them, the Astartes use their jump packs to land between the survivors, unleashing hell!

And those Pods would be called "Hellrider".

 

And if that's not enough, they do have PONYS as squad markings!

 

Now, that should be new! ;P

Edited February 26, 2016 by Kelborn

[MikhalLeNoir]

Or luth de oganach who have wrist mounted handflamers and a dual saber.

Or ashen circle who have those fancy underarm wrist mounted flamers.

 

Seems that handflamers are prettynpopular these days;)

Edited February 26, 2016 by MikhalLeNoir

[Raktra]

And the ones I have built into the Godbreakers' ceramite drills...

 

Goddammit, I'm part of the problem.

[MikhalLeNoir]

Yeah..me too... Maybe I change it to wrist mounted melter or plasmas?

 

Where is our creativity?