m0nolith Posted August 16, 2015 Share Posted August 16, 2015 I have a problem. From what I understand if you want to hide transfer sheet outlines you should cover them with matte varnish. The problem I have is that im painting some marines bronze, and if i cover that spot with matte varnish its going to reduce or maybe even completely remove the shine that the bronze armour gives. I thought about spraying it with matte varnish first and then with gloss, but that would make it just too shiny. My question is: Is there a way to hide decal outlines without having to use matte varnish? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/312450-decals-matte-varnish-and-metal-colours/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slips Posted August 16, 2015 Share Posted August 16, 2015 I have a problem. From what I understand if you want to hide transfer sheet outlines you should cover them with matte varnish. The problem I have is that im painting some marines bronze, and if i cover that spot with matte varnish its going to reduce or maybe even completely remove the shine that the bronze armour gives. I thought about spraying it with matte varnish first and then with gloss, but that would make it just too shiny. My question is: Is there a way to hide decal outlines without having to use matte varnish? Matte Varnish the outlines, go over it again with the bronze scheme? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/312450-decals-matte-varnish-and-metal-colours/#findComment-4147905 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaedes Nex Posted August 16, 2015 Share Posted August 16, 2015 There is no way to hide decal outlines without varnish. The way you do it is not with matte, that will ruin your decal and model. You use gloss. The glossier the better. Gloss varnish reduces the surface tension and gives a slick surface for the decal to stick completely and perfectly flat with. This is especially important for round surfaces like marine shoulders. Gloss up the surface, apply the decal, preferably with a decal softening liquid, like Micro Set and Micro Sol. When it's dry, gloss again to seal it in and eliminate the outline of the decal. From there you can use satin varnish to get rid of the gloss without killing your metallic shine. Gloss before is what helps decals apply smoothly, gloss after is what eliminates the outline, decal softening liquid is what makes the decal look painted on. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/312450-decals-matte-varnish-and-metal-colours/#findComment-4147914 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother-Chaplain Kage Posted August 16, 2015 Share Posted August 16, 2015 Kaedes Nex nailed the procedure. The only way to have the areas you gloss and then matte to kill the shine later not look different from the rest of the model is to do the whole thing in gloss for the decal stage and then matte after. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/312450-decals-matte-varnish-and-metal-colours/#findComment-4147918 Share on other sites More sharing options...
old git Posted August 16, 2015 Share Posted August 16, 2015 The carrier film edge around the decal is noticeable because of minute air pockets trapped under it because of the roughness of the underlying surface, brush strokes etc. To (mostly) eliminate this a coat or two of gloss varnish applied to the area where the decal is going to be will smooth out the surface. Also you can use microsol and microset. Microsol is applied to the surface where the decal will be before the decal is applied. Then place the decal and apply another coat of microsol. Microsol softens the carrier film allowing the decal to follow the shape of the surface better. Once dried you can then matte varnish the model. I've used matte varnish on metal finishes before and in my experience the metallic effect isn't lost that much, certainly not enough to worry about. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/312450-decals-matte-varnish-and-metal-colours/#findComment-4148132 Share on other sites More sharing options...
m0nolith Posted August 16, 2015 Author Share Posted August 16, 2015 There is no way to hide decal outlines without varnish. The way you do it is not with matte, that will ruin your decal and model. You use gloss. The glossier the better. Gloss varnish reduces the surface tension and gives a slick surface for the decal to stick completely and perfectly flat with. This is especially important for round surfaces like marine shoulders. Gloss up the surface, apply the decal, preferably with a decal softening liquid, like Micro Set and Micro Sol. When it's dry, gloss again to seal it in and eliminate the outline of the decal. From there you can use satin varnish to get rid of the gloss without killing your metallic shine. Gloss before is what helps decals apply smoothly, gloss after is what eliminates the outline, decal softening liquid is what makes the decal look painted on. Ok, ill give it a shot. I have all three, so ill try one with a matte (after a gloss coat, then the decal, and another gloss coat), and Ill try one with satin and ill see which works for me better. I dont have Micro set or Micro sol, but I do have Vallejo Decal fix and Decal medium which I assume is the same thing. The only mistake I made is on some torsos I already added the green patina thats a trait of the Minotaurs marines. With a satin finish im assuming that even the petina will shine. I probably should have added the Nihilakh Oxide after the satin or matte varnish. Ill update you guys with the results. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/312450-decals-matte-varnish-and-metal-colours/#findComment-4148297 Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrangeBob Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 This may be a dumb question, but do you apply the decal to the glossed area while it is still wet or wait for it to dry? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/312450-decals-matte-varnish-and-metal-colours/#findComment-4150161 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarbonBased Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Wait for the gloss to dry. Then apply the decal. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/312450-decals-matte-varnish-and-metal-colours/#findComment-4150172 Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrangeBob Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Thanks CarbonBased. This is great info. I've gotten decals down pretty well over the years, but this added step could make the process even better! Cannot wait to try it out. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/312450-decals-matte-varnish-and-metal-colours/#findComment-4150185 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firepower Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 There is no way to hide decal outlines without varnish. The way you do it is not with matte, that will ruin your decal and model. Hm. Even after the preemptive gloss and post-decal gloss? In general I mean, not just on a metallic paint. I always use matte on my models, and if I think about using decals one day, I'd like to know in advance if they would conflict with my tastes for a matte finish. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/312450-decals-matte-varnish-and-metal-colours/#findComment-4150187 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarbonBased Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 There is no way to hide decal outlines without varnish. The way you do it is not with matte, that will ruin your decal and model. Hm. Even after the preemptive gloss and post-decal gloss? In general I mean, not just on a metallic paint. I always use matte on my models, and if I think about using decals one day, I'd like to know in advance if they would conflict with my tastes for a matte finish. This decal is put on over gloss, then hit with satin varnish for a more matte finish. I use MicroSol. http://i.imgur.com/vSuG0VT.jpg http://i.imgur.com/8VpM3OH.jpg Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/312450-decals-matte-varnish-and-metal-colours/#findComment-4150198 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firepower Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Yes, but what about a matte varnish? Also, yay orange :tu: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/312450-decals-matte-varnish-and-metal-colours/#findComment-4150213 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarbonBased Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 I don't know if I have any matte varnish. If so, I'll do a test tonight. Orange Forever! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/312450-decals-matte-varnish-and-metal-colours/#findComment-4150227 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hexagon Sun Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Once you've glossed over the decal and the varnish has dried, feel free to add any kind of varnish you like over the top as it won't interfere with the decal or previous gloss coat at all. All of the Dark Angels in the below photo had gloss -> decal -> gloss -> matt and you can't see any of the decal edges. http://i1147.photobucket.com/albums/o551/hexagonsun1/Dark%20Angels/Tacticals/tactical_1_final.jpg Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/312450-decals-matte-varnish-and-metal-colours/#findComment-4150347 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firepower Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Good to know. I would've been surprised if matte varnish could somehow mess up the decal even through a topcoat of gloss. :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/312450-decals-matte-varnish-and-metal-colours/#findComment-4150353 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaedes Nex Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 There is no way to hide decal outlines without varnish. The way you do it is not with matte, that will ruin your decal and model. Hm. Even after the preemptive gloss and post-decal gloss? In general I mean, not just on a metallic paint. I always use matte on my models, and if I think about using decals one day, I'd like to know in advance if they would conflict with my tastes for a matte finish. Matte varnish is fine if the decal has already been applied and dried. I only mentioned it because decals should always be applied gloss first, then decal, then gloss again. This combined with decal solutions is what makes the outlines and silvering invisible. You can obviously use matte afterwards at your preference, as the decal is dried and locked in by the gloss at that point. Just thought it was worth mentioning since OP and others were talking a lot about matte but didn't mention their decal application methods. Definitely don't want people to be using matte varnish to prep surfaces for decals. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/312450-decals-matte-varnish-and-metal-colours/#findComment-4150476 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koremu Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 Somebody should write this thread's advice up into a tutorial. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/312450-decals-matte-varnish-and-metal-colours/#findComment-4150652 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kisada Posted August 28, 2015 Share Posted August 28, 2015 I've started to use micro set and micro sol (bought off ebay for about ~$7 for the set). I also use future floor polish. Once I'm ready to put the decal on I first paint the area with future floor polish. This is the same as gloss varnish but costs so much less. It levels out the area so that the decal will have a smooth even area to adhere to. http://www.swannysmodels.com/TheCompleteFuture.html - link to tips on what Future floor polish is good for in modeling Then you use the micro set. Wet the decal, while waiting for it to slip from the paper you paint the area with some micro set. Then place the decal, soak up any excess. When it's a little dry you can brush on some more micro set. I have been following this up with the micro sol (usually the next day). Micro sol is supposed to help the decal really melt into the model and create a painted on look. I then follow this up with another layer of Future floor polish to protect the decal from damage. It's hard to tell in this picture but the decals are completely smooth and go with the curve of the shoulder pad with minimal to no decal outlines left (at least in my opinion) http://i.imgur.com/opSS9Ds.jpg?1 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/312450-decals-matte-varnish-and-metal-colours/#findComment-4157728 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlodVargarna Posted August 28, 2015 Share Posted August 28, 2015 I'm going to try your technique of waiting overnight between micro-set and micro-sol. I'm too impatient and apply micro sol right away. It works but it's probaby smarter to wait overnight. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/312450-decals-matte-varnish-and-metal-colours/#findComment-4157921 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.